EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:32 PM
Original message |
Please explain to me why MSNBC and Olbermann are seen as sexist by some Hillary supporters. |
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I really want to know exactly what has been said or reported that qualifies as misogynistic. Please, no bashing Hillary Clinton or her supporters in this thread. I just want to understand their perspective. Thanks!
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Lerkfish
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:34 PM
Response to Original message |
1. not trying to be snarky, but anyone who does not support clinton is automatically seen as sexist. |
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and I would also like to understand why that perception persists.
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hisownpetard
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
2. That certainly seems to be the pattern. |
DJ13
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
14. anyone who does not support clinton is automatically seen as sexist |
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Yep, and they cry sexism as a defensive reaction borne from an inability to recognize that Hillary isnt a very well liked person for various reasons.
It just HAS to be because she's a woman.
:eyes:
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Texas Hill Country
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:35 PM
Response to Original message |
3. i dont think Olbermann is... he just slants towards Obama... Matthews definitely is IMO |
EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
5. So you think the slant is sexist? I mean, do you think they are being unfairly critical because |
leftofcool
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
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I have no problem if they support Obama. Nothing wrong at all with that, but there have been some really nasty sexist statements from that station, mostly from Tweety
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EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
17. Like what, exactly. Someone mentioned Tweety calling Hillary Clinton "babe" which does seem |
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out of line, especially calling a 60 year old Senator "babe."
Anything else? I've always like Olberman and in these last few weeks, I've been really out of the loop. I haven't watched him or MSNBC at all because I have been volunteering almost every spare moment. I even forgot my girlfriend's birthday because I've been so busy (I am LAME)!
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leftofcool
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #17 |
24. I haven't noticed it from Keith |
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but I don't watch him all the time. I have heard Abrams say a couple of things. You best get your butt to the nearest florist!
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BzaDem
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #17 |
29. Media Matters: Matthews' sexist displays go beyond Clinton |
EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #29 |
Hepburn
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #29 |
63. Well, I agree that some of it is out of line.... |
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...but not all of it...nor is all of it sexist in my eyes.
Why exactly would it be sexist to tell someone that he or she is good looking? I rather think of that as a compliment ~~ assuming there is no sexually offensive implication to it and it is done sincerely and not over-done.
Haven't you ever met someone and said something complimentary to that person? My best male pal...he has the most beautiful, huge blue-green eyes..and the first time I met him, I complimented him on his eyes. So, was I being sexist? :shrug:
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Texas Hill Country
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #17 |
leftofcool
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #44 |
47. Damn! It's worse than I thought. |
EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:03 PM
Response to Reply #47 |
49. Yuck. What a toad Chris Matthews is. Thanks for the links! |
Hepburn
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
58. An example of of this? |
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I sincerely would like to see where some are seeing this in great amount because I am not.
Thanks...:hi:
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Texas Hill Country
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
11. no, Olbermann and his slant aren't really sexist, he just like Obama more... Matthews, well... |
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he is, IMO, undeniable sexist.
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RaleighNCDUer
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
32. THC differentiated between Olberman and Tweety -- |
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why are you saying "they"?
I think that Olberman admires Obama and his campaign. I think that Tweety despises Hillary.
There is a difference.
And I agree, Olberman is NOT sexist - Tweety is. You can't conflate the two.
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WillYourVoteBCounted
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
6. Matthews is just a creep - about alot of things |
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I don't know if its sexism or not, he's just an obnoxious jerk.
And I am an Obama supporter.
But tweety gives me the creeps.
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Hepburn
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #6 |
66. Yeah, I would agree with that... |
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...and I also support Obama. Tweety is just a mega jerk. I don't think it has that much to do with being sexist ~~ it is more like poor people skills with him.
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stahbrett
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
31. Did his pro-Obama slant start only after Obama took the insurmountable delegate lead? |
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I am not a regular viewer of his program, so I don't know... was Olbermann always pro-Obama this entire election, or only went it became apparent that Hillary had very little chance of winning the nomination without destroying the Democratic party?
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Hepburn
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
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Can you give specific examples of sexist remarks?
And this is addressed not just to you, but to anyone ~~ Hillary supporter or not ~~ who thinks that Matthews or anyone else on MSNBC made sexist remarks to or about Hillary.
I truly am curious as to what some see as being sexist.
TIA...:hi:
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leftofcool
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:36 PM
Response to Original message |
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Here is one example........Tweety has called her "babe" several times. She should be addressed as Senator Clinton or Hillary or just Clinton. I will let someome else chime in here on others. I will say this, they have toned down that sexist rhetoric some because several of them got in trouble. I heard through the grapevine that Keith, Tweety and a couple of others got dressed down pretty good.
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Lerkfish
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
7. well, he also called Obama "less than macho" due to his bowling score. |
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so it seems he is rude to both candidates.
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leftofcool
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
13. I will agree with you on that |
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but, you also need to recognize that calling a female senator "babe" is highly sexist. He was rude to Obama and that was unfair of him, I will agree
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Lerkfish
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #13 |
33. of course, I thought it was implicit in what I said that I recognized that |
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when I said "both" candidates.
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EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
9. I'm glad they put that in check. Calling a Senator "babe" seems inappropriate. |
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Then again, I sometimes call my girlfriends and my partner "babe". Maybe its in the context.
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leftofcool
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #9 |
16. Yea, but she is your GF. You probably also call her sweetheart |
EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #16 |
23. Actually, I have some names for her that are downright embarrassing...like "pooh" because of |
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Winnie the Pooh. I have no idea why I started saying it, but its stuck and I've said it in front of our friends. They just rolled their eyes.
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leftofcool
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #23 |
25. Nuthin wrong with that.........your friends are just jealous |
provis99
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #23 |
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Not really sure I can see Hillary Clinton as a snuggy-bear though.
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NYCGirl
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
12. So what did Olbermann say that was so sexist? NT |
LSparkle
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:39 PM
Response to Original message |
10. Tweety is a sexist pig but Olbermann is not |
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When I saw those signs calling KO the "worst" (worse than Matthews or David Shuster), it proved that this isn't about sexism, but about Olbermann's daring to call the Clinton campaign on some of its less- honorable tactics.
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Texas Hill Country
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
15. but the prob is that he doesnt hold obama to the same standard... dont think its sexism tho |
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Edited on Fri Apr-11-08 03:41 PM by Texas Hill Country
just unbalanced advocacy...
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bobbert
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #15 |
21. but they claimed olberman was misogynistic |
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He is not required to hold the 2 candidates to the same standard, but that doesn't mean his reason for not doing so is sexism
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Skidmore
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #15 |
22. So, we're looking for "fair and balanced", eh? |
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That would be found on that other channel that is blocked in my house.
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Skidmore
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
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This whole every criticism is sexist schtick is getting tedious.
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LisaM
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:42 PM
Response to Original message |
18. One person (here) brought up an excellent example re: Olbermann |
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Which I had not even noticed myself (this is how insidious it is), which was his relentless reporting on the scandals involving Britney Spears and Paris Hilton. Day after day, in which he claimed he didn't WANT to report on it (but did anyway) of nubile young socialites and their pranks. It's just one of those things that later makes you go "hmmmm"? I mean, isn't their footage of a shirtless Matthew McConaghy all over the place, drunk, and doing things? How come he didn't show THAT? LOLOL.
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leftofcool
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
NYCGirl
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
27. BTW, he hasn't done "Keeping Tabs" for months...and you must've missed |
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his endless showing of drunk Hasselhoff and Nick Nolte.
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AllentownJake
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
28. So the Britney train wreck is an example |
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Of Sexism in the media...
Damn..I just thought people liked to watch the rich and famous hit the wall.
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LisaM
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #28 |
37. No.......not what I said at all. |
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Actually, Britney hasn't been in trouble lateley, and I haven't seen Paris Hilton in the spotlight recently, either. I just pointed out that he got a lot of mileage out of young, good-looking women in trouble but you didn't seem him posting endless video of young good-looking MEN in trouble.
I stopped watching him when his top five stories were consistently anti-Hillary, so it's true I haven't seen him in a while.
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AllentownJake
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #37 |
40. He got a lot of milage |
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Out of Michael Jackson...that's where puppet theatre started.
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LisaM
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:56 PM
Response to Reply #40 |
42. LOL. I didn't say he ONLY showed video of young Hollywood women |
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But he did seem to revel in the salacious details, all the while saying he didn't want to report on it!
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EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
41. Well, to me, that stuff is just sad. Those women were hypersexualized by the media at such a |
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young age and now they are breaking down, right before the smiling eyes of the public. She's so obviously mentally ill or having post-partum depression. Its gross and it shouldn't be on Olbermann. Was he covering it in some sort of "cultural commentary" way? I see your point, though, I have seen coverage of Keifer Sutherland drunk and jumping into Christmas trees.
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VotesForWomen
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
46. noticed that too; guys like him seem to love to make fun of and demean women, when there are certain |
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certainly just as many men they could be making fun of.
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PoliticalAmazon
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
56. If McConahghy would have been in the news like Spears/Hilton, he would have been on... |
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...Olberman's show.
Again, we get this faux misogyny. These young women are in the news A LOT, especially Spears, and Spears does some pretty amazing things. Young male celebrities simply aren't in the news that much.
So do you want KO to make up stuff about young male celebrities? Focus on them even though they aren't in the news?
It's like complaining because KO reports on HRC's negative stuff more than he does on Obama. Well, HELL, HRC torpedoes her own campaign nearly every day, and the stuff she has done wrong have been doozies.
So do you want KO to make up stuff about Obama?
I'm sick of this faux victim-hood. It makes me nauseous that anyone would get off on being a victim, and HRC and her victim squad need to realize that they taint us all with their antics.
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Asgaya Dihi
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
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It might be something he goes along with but then again it wasn't too long ago that Donahue was being told how many guests and of what political persuasions he had to have on his show for "balance", eventually he lost his job trying to resist the pressure. It is the same MSNBC that did that and the two cases were all over the media in general at the time.
Could Keith have supported the coverage? Sure, but it could be like he said as well. Stories his producers make him cover. It's not like we don't have solid precedent for it from the same network already. Mathews there's a good case for but I'm don't think so with Keith, I think he just doesn't like the campaign. He wouldn't be alone there, he's just more vocal than most. I've had the same complaints with him about the Bush and other coverage as well. Works great for preaching to the choir but the anger isn't much use in bringing anyone else into it and it'll put some of them off. He's got valid complaints most of the time, just gets a bit excitable over it and could speak to a broader audience if he was more calm.
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Hepburn
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
67. How exactly is that sexist? |
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More like tabloid shit...and boring, IMO.
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jillan
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:42 PM
Response to Original message |
20. Are you trying to start something here? |
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The reason people are protesting at msnbc today is not about sexism. (yes I know there were a couple of signs that said that)
Ya know - many Hillary supporters have been called racist because they don't support Obama.
It goes both ways.
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EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #20 |
34. Nope. Not trying to start anything other than a discussion about this some of my fellow |
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Democrats' opinions about MSNBC. Like I said, I've really been out of the loop and I want to know what I missed.
And I don't think all people who aren't supporting Obama are racists, but I'm sure there are some. Just like I know that there will be some people who don't vote for Hillary Clinton because they are sexist. Shit, one of my aunts voted for George W Bush twice because (drumroll please) she thinks he's CUTE!! There will always be stupid people supporting a candidate for a stupid reason.
Still, I am curious about the misogyny in the media that some are discussing on DU today.
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ellacott
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #20 |
36. But it WAS pushed as a demonstration against the mysogyny of MSNBC |
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That's what their announcements said.
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cbayer
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #36 |
54. I can't find that in their announcements. |
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It appears that is was about media bias and hate speech. The word misogyny does not appear anywhere that I can find.
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Catherine Vincent
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:47 PM
Response to Original message |
30. He's always been a little bit sexist. |
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He made some comments about the women that stars in "Sex in the City". I don't remember what it was but it was pretty tacky.
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TomInTib
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #30 |
39. It was about that dumb-ass commercial with Terrell Owens (NFL player). |
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Owens caught nine kinds of hell about it, but no one said a word about the towel-dropping chick except KO.
I didn't read his remarks as sexist. But, then, I am a guy.
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McCamy Taylor
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:51 PM
Response to Original message |
35. Olbermann and Wolf trading dumb blond comments. Joking that a female |
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blond supporter of John McCain could not remember the seven digits in a phone number. That is sexism in anyone's book. I am female and I am a natural blond and almost anywhere I go I am the most intelligent person in the room ( more intelligent than KO by a long shot). All my life I have had people assume that I was as dumb as a bag of rocks because of how I look. Most of the time it does not matter, but since I am a physician and sometimes there is disagreement among doctors about what course to follow, it can be a matter of life or death if some asshole male (or brunette female) doctor decides that he is smarter than I am because he is not a blond woman. I used to face this problem all the time in residency. People would almost kill my patients before they would listen to me. That is a bad way for them to learn that their prejudices are wrong.
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knixphan
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #35 |
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so there has to be a category created for non-blonde women who discriminate against their fairer-hared siters...(cause it can't be sexist)...folliclist?
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hisownpetard
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Fri Apr-11-08 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #35 |
71. "...almost anywhere I go I am the most intelligent person in the room ( more intelligent than |
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KO by a long shot)."
So - have you always been as modest as you are now, or would you consider that an acquired trait?
:puke:
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VotesForWomen
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Fri Apr-11-08 03:58 PM
Response to Original message |
43. it's that whole "balls-good, pussy-bad" attitude that he exudes. he wants to be a manly-man, and it |
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it's hard not to conclude that this is at least in part due to his low opinion of women.
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EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #43 |
53. Wait a minute...isn't Chris Matthews the guy who was talking about participating in a gay bashing? |
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Am I wrong about that?
Google is my friend, so I'll find out in a second.
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Huge Ego Sorry
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #53 |
59. Nope, that was the thankfully fired Tucker Carlson (sp?) n/t |
Dr Fate
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #43 |
61. "balls-good, pussy-bad"-LOL- is that a direct quote? |
alcibiades_mystery
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:00 PM
Response to Original message |
45. These Hillary supporters are either really good liars, or insane people |
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Yammering on about this and that. They're just trying to make everyone else as demoralized as they are. It's just sad now. Ignore them. They're being spiteful for the heck of it. That's the best case scenario. If they really believe it, then they're just crazy.
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EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #45 |
51. With all due respect, this is the kind of response I was hoping that I would not get. |
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I don't think these people are liars or insane. Otherwise, I wouldn't be asking their opinions. We need to have respect for one another.
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PoliticalAmazon
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #51 |
64. This is public message board. If you want certain opinions, perhaps a .... |
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private board of your own would be better? Just a suggestion...
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EmilyAnne
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Fri Apr-11-08 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #64 |
69. Of course anyone is free to post whatever they want. I just think that calling one another liars or |
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insane isn't helpful. It just shuts down communication. I'm sorry if I came off as rude or preachy.
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hisownpetard
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Fri Apr-11-08 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #45 |
72. Or: good liars *and* insane. The two are not mutually exclusive. (If you have any |
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doubts, allow me to introduce you to my ex... ).
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mrreowwr_kittty
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:05 PM
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50. I don't support Clinton but Matthews is a sexist pig. |
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The man is a walking harassment suit.
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PoliticalAmazon
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:35 PM
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55. I don't know why HRC and supporters cling to faux victim-hood, but it isn't flattering... |
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...and won't help Hillary Clinton win.
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Cali_Democrat
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:45 PM
Response to Original message |
60. Olbermann is sexist because he doesn't support Queen Hillary |
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How dare he question her in any way!! It's Hillary's turn to be president dammit!! Why can't Obama just wait his turn!!!
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Dr Fate
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Fri Apr-11-08 04:49 PM
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62. Said in fake English accent: "What's wrong with being sexy?" |
susanwy
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Fri Apr-11-08 05:13 PM
Response to Original message |
68. its a long video, but watch the first 3-4 min or so |
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it does include a set of clips that show many MSM media outlets sexists comments. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcdnlNZg2iMsusanwy will vote for what ever the dems throw up!
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Imagevision
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Fri Apr-11-08 07:07 PM
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70. simple, Olbermann doesn't support Billary, why else yo-yo?! |
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