BO on small towns: "..they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them..."

[truthpusher]

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0408/Obama_on_smalltown_PA_Clinging_religion_guns_xenophobia.html

Obama on small-town PA: Clinging religion, guns, xenophobia

Mayhill Fowler has more from Obama's remarks at a San Francisco fundraiser Sunday, and they include an attempt to explain the resentment in small-town Pennsylvania that won't be appreciated by some of the people whose votes Obama's seeking:

You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them...And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not.

And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.

[Symarip]

1. No fucking way.

It's like he misspoke or something. Read this, this is some really fucked up shit, too:

Thank you for visiting my website. Below is the statement I made on the Senate floor on October 10th to explain my decision and vote on the joint Congressional resolution on Iraq. I hope you will take the time to read it with as much care as I have given to making this difficult decision. I am deeply grateful to the thousands of New Yorkers who shared their views on this important issue, and will continue to do my very best in serving the interests of our state and nation.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

October 10, 2002

Floor Speech of Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton
on S.J. Res. 45, A Resolution to Authorize the Use of
United States Armed Forces Against Iraq
As Delivered

Today we are asked whether to give the President of the United States authority to use force in Iraq should diplomatic efforts fail to dismantle Saddam Hussein's chemical and biological weapons and his nuclear program.

I am honored to represent nearly 19 million New Yorkers, a thoughtful democracy of voices and opinions who make themselves heard on the great issues of our day especially this one. Many have contacted my office about this resolution, both in support of and in opposition to it, and I am grateful to all who have expressed an opinion.

I also greatly respect the differing opinions within this body. The debate they engender will aid our search for a wise, effective policy. Therefore, on no account should dissent be discouraged or disparaged. It is central to our freedom and to our progress, for on more than one occasion, history has proven our great dissenters to be right.

Now, I believe the facts that have brought us to this fateful vote are not in doubt. Saddam Hussein is a tyrant who has tortured and killed his own people, even his own family members, to maintain his iron grip on power. He used chemical weapons on Iraqi Kurds and on Iranians, killing over 20 thousand people. Unfortunately, during the 1980's, while he engaged in such horrific activity, he enjoyed the support of the American government, because he had oil and was seen as a counterweight to the Ayatollah Khomeini in Iran.

<snip>

http://clinton.senate.gov/speeches/iraq_101002.html

How do some people live with themselves????

[DemVet]

135. You couldn't find a valid argument, could you?

[leftofcool]

2. I understand what Obama is saying here

but the way it came across may not work well.

[NJSecularist]

3. I see what you are saying, but it won't effect Obama.

These small towns he is referring to, no Democrat would carry them. Kerry didn't in 2004, Gore didn't in 2000.

[ruggerson]

74. "affect"

if you use it as a verb

[nichomachus]

91. And -- the Democrats who are living in these town agree with him

I lived in a small town and his description is dead-on.

[riskpeace]

93. I'm not sure that is true.

And why write them off with this unfortunate comment?

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9500E3D71431F933A05750C0A96E9C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=3

In the summer of 2006, the Democratic pollster Joel Benenson was conducting surveys for the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee in the Eighth Congressional District of Indiana, working-class, conservative towns around Evansville and Terre Haute. Brad Ellsworth, a conservative Democratic sheriff who took pains to distance himself from the antiwar camp, had just been picked as the party's nominee against a six-term Republican incumbent named John Hostettler, a former power-plant engineer.

As the survey returns came in, Benenson noticed that one group was far more receptive to the Democratic position than he had expected: working-class evangelical voters, the lower-to-middle-income whites in small cities and small towns who had defected to the Republican Party under Reagan and not returned.

Ellsworth, running on those issues, would eventually win the race. Lower-middle-class evangelical voters are a small segment of the national electorate -- less than 10 percent. But for Benenson they seemed to augur a broader recalculation, the Reagan Democrats subsuming social concerns to economic ones, the populist sentiment in the country sliding from the Republicans to the Democrats and even firmly conservative districts suddenly thrown open to competition. In 2006, the Democrats won in those kinds of blue-collar districts not just in Terre Haute but also in the Appalachian Mountains of western North Carolina, in the old industrial towns in western Pennsylvania and in upstate New York. ''The map,'' Benenson told me, ''has already changed.''

[Texas Hill Country]

4. may not work well? OMG... that is insulting as hell!!!

[anigbrowl]

9. What's insulting about it? I know a lot of conservatives who think that way

It's not news to me that some people feel left out by economic and technological change and adopt a bunker mentality.

[girl gone mad]

97. Al Qaeda is proof of that.

Obama spoke truth to power. I appreciate the fact that he uses common sense, whether or not it's politically expedient.

[Hutzpa]

52. Gee...... you must have been earning

your money 1417 post since March 5th......:wow:


you have nothing else to do but criticize the Democratic

candidates.

Are you on some kind of mission?


:hi:

[Texas Hill Country]

61. i do just fine, dont you worry.

[OzarkDem]

8. He's saying he's a bigoted jerk

Who expects others to judge him fairly but doesn't hold himself to the same standard.

[uponit7771]

17. Only stupid people believe Obama hates his white self...

[OzarkDem]

21. Obama hates everyone apparently

unless they worship him. He's seriously twisted. If Bush had said something like this, everyone would be tearing their hair out.

[Deep13]

23. He loves both his halves!

His rural, white half and his foreign half!:-)

[Hutzpa]

53. .

:eyes:

[Texas Hill Country]

60. I am not saying he does, but have you actually read his books?

[villager]

5. and as an additional part of that analysis, they always get traduced into voting against their own

...interests, because they allow themselves to faked out with false issues...

[Syntheto]

31. So, people from small towns in the Midwest are...

also stupid, in your opinion?

[villager]

120. they are easily led to voting against their long term interests

You tell me why that is. I simply extrapolate from election data.

[Syntheto]

138. "Easily led" in one person's vernacular....

...would be considered "Stupid", "Naive", or the ever-popular "Sheeple" by any thinking person, and some folks might take exception to that kind of rhetorical pigeon-holing. We need candidates to address the concerns of all Americans, and not just those in the major US population centers. Mostly rural areas have concerns far different than city dwellers, and they don't feel as if their problems are even considered, except every election cycle. Bridge improvement, dams to create recreational lakes and hydro power, water rights as well as highway, secondary road, hunting and fishing and agricultural run-off legislation means more to people than "glamor" issues like gay marriage and security cameras on every block. Do city people really care about "flyover country", other than to chastise them in exasperation every four years for being stupid? Believe it or not, we all fly the flag out here. We want a Democrat, but one who shares our version and vision of America: with all it's flaws, it's still the best. Rhetoric hinting that we are all merely xenophobic rednecks with one hand on the bible and the other holding a gun is not going to go over well, especially when it's couched in terms that seem to be meant as an inside joke among urbanites, as if the rubes were too stupid to get it. If the candidates didn't need our support as well, why even bother?

[Forkboy]

6. Sounds like every small town I've been in.

[provis99]

10. No kidding. Sounds like he's just stating the obvious

What's all the fuss about?

[Tom Rinaldo]

67. The fact that we want people in those towns

voting Democratic. The fact that the Democratic Party has always been the non elitist party that defends the interests of working class people and thus historically has usually won the votes of working class people.

The fact that what is obvious usually tends to be a somewhat of a matter of opinion, and the opinion that really counts right now is the opinion of the voters in towns like that in an election year, and regardless little is usually ever gained by seemingly asserting some kind of moral, cultureal and/or intellectual superiority over those whose support one seeks.

I used the word "seemingly" intentionally. I am not trying to trash Obama here, just responding to your question.

[DrCory]

38. Nice display of prejudice.

N/T

[Forkboy]

39. Hey, I grew up in a small town, and that's exactly what it was like.

And it's exactly what the towns are STILL like.

Save it, Sparky.

[TheWraith]

66. I live in a small town right now.

And yeah, that's pretty much what it's like. Not everybody, of course, but enough. People hold on to things that'll make them feel better about themselves, and ideas that are outdated, but they were never disabused of.

[Tom Rinaldo]

70. I live in a small town now also

Fairly rural also. Many of the locals are pretty down to earth with few if any pretences. Not stylish, but gifted with as much basic common sense as any group of people you are ever likely to run into. Yeah some have biases that I am uncomfortable with. I could say the same regarding people who use this board.

[DeschutesRiver]

119. I do both

I live in two locations - outside of one small very rural town, and just outside of a big city. Both places have people who "cling" to idiotic narrow ideas, just different ones for the big city than those in the small rural ranching community.

We are both professionals, living a life very different than our peers, guess you could say we have a foot in two places with world views (without totally belonging to either) that are different than our own, and some of it we can work with, and some we will never agree with or of which we will be supportive.

That said, I think his comment was bad and very poorly timed. I won't vote for Hillary, and would like to vote for Obama; but would also be okay with McCain. I am disappointed to hear this - if this sort of poorly phrased dissing becomes his vote getter, then it will be something I will have to hold against him in the general election. Really, it is more along the lines of the stuff I dislike Hillary saying, and I wish he hadn't said it.

[DrCory]

133. So did I...

left it for the big city (here and abroad), got sick of, and went back.

And your statement is still prejudiced.

[misanthrope]

132. Knowing it and saying it are two different things...

...Most humans hate to hear the truth about themselves.

[OzarkDem]

7. Guess Obama's gonna lose PA

What a bitter, sick twisted person. He makes Bush look like the poster boy for mental health.

Apparently Obama knows the party's over and he's going to lose the next few states. His bitterness and anger are setting in.

[Sadie5]

12. Too bad he just now realized it

that he's losing after spending his time inflating polls and bringing to life race issues that were long ago put aside.

[babylonsister]

22. You have got to be kidding me. HE brought to life race issues

that were long ago put aside? How about merely out of sight? And sure, Obama wanted everyone to give him hell over Wright; he asked for it. :eyes: Open your eyes, would ya?

[OzarkDem]

29. Sitrring up hate instead of showing leadership

Playing divide and conquer while running a smear campaign against your opponent. Plent of that, but he's not interested in solving problems or improving peoples lives other than his own.

Obama becomes more like Bush every day. No more paranoid psychos in the WH.

[OzarkDem]

26. Yeah, sure

After spending millions of his corporate donors money to spread hate and divisiveness and empty rhetoric across PA.

He's toast.

[uponit7771]

14. You sound bitter

[Deep13]

19. Do yah think?!

:grr:

[OzarkDem]

32. No, shocked and embarrassed

that he's a member of the Democratic party.

[Deep13]

15. "His bitterness and anger are setting in."

Jesus! So we have been looking at his GOOD side?! :scared:

[OzarkDem]

36. Yes, I think so

I don't think the public has seen the real Obama yet.

OT, I hope someone takes this quote and replays it for all his superdelegates who represent small towns around the US.

[JoFerret]

16. I wouldn't go that far

...but the dismissiveness of the tone is not appealing. Condescending and patronizing stereotypical piffle.

Translation: Dumb rural white folks.

GOP use: Obama hates white people and is anti-American.

[cali]

24. you seriously need

help. you spew the sickest, most delusional and hateful bile of anyone on DU- and that was true even before the primary season.

[philk17088]

107. wth?

bitter? Sick?? Bush is better than Obama?
What planet are you currently occupying?
And the Clinton crowd says Obama supporters are toxic?

[Deep13]

11. Here's a description of someone: ...

arrogant without the background to justify it

religious extremist

homophobic

intolerant of dissenting views

villifies opponents and denigrates their character

a man of much anger who takes criticism personally

appeals to people on a personal level rather than based on his management ability

good at distracting attention from real issues with counter-accusations

Is this a description of Obama or Bush? If it can be either of them (and it can) then what would I find so damn impressive about Obama?

[uponit7771]

13. In context that sounds about righ, out of context it sounds ...well...

[IndianaJones]

18. please understand...he means white small towns. nt.

[Deep13]

28. Like mine back East in central MA.

Population 12k. Eight of them were Black or mixed. Of the five adults, three were Republicans.

[TahitiNut]

73. Really? SOLELY "white"? There aren't any "black small towns" in PA?

Just what is it that gives an entire town a 'color' (race) in your mind???

Wow. :eyes:

[DemGa]

20. This could do some serious damage to Obama

He's in effect saying: I understand why you are gun-loving, racist, xenophobic, overly-clinging to religion -- it's just a reaction to your bitterness.

Hope this one spreads far and wide -- and fast.

[jackson_dem]

44. Yes and it is even worse than what sunk Ed Koch

-snip-

He lost the primary. Koch may have contributed greatly to his own defeat by an impolitic interview with Playboy magazine, which his foes publicized and in which Koch referred to suburban life as "sterile" and rural life as "a joke" and made fun of pickup truck drivers, the very voters he needed to win the nomination.

[loyalsister]

25. I don't suppose there was anything else?

This looks like one of those things taken out of context without a larger picture of the question asked and the answer given, it is not reasonable to judge this too harshly.

[LisaM]

27. I am from a small town. I don't own a gun and I rarely go to church.

I spend many of my weekends in another small town that is extremely liberal and activist.

This is just plain insulting.

[Deep13]

33. Me too, except I never go to church and have a bunch of guns. nt

[GarbagemanLB]

34. Ah yes, an unbiased reaction!

[LisaM]

48. It is. I live in a large city now, but I am proud of my small-town roots.

My parents were from a large city, and we grew up in a small town because my father got a teaching job there. I have ties to both types of places, and I value both. My lifelong friends are from small towns, too, and none of them own guns, are xenophobic, and are overly religious.

[ej510]

45. This is true in most lower income communities.......

especially ehen people blame job loss on immigration. Even in innercities.

[Lannigan]

54. The damn knocks on PA's "stupid people" need to stop

Do you have any other arguments as to why Hillary will trounce ANY opponent in this state?

[jackson_dem]

30. Obama's unity theme: just words

This is more evidence of this.

[kaiden]

35. In 1900, my hometown in Kansas had the largest income per capita in the world.

80% of the population were millionaires. The money came from natural gas, mostly. Throughout the decades, the only industry allowed there was the cement plant. The town fathers just didn't want any "blue collar" folks around. We did have a small African American population. They -- and the Hispanics and Cherokee Indians who lived in my hometown -- all worked at the cement plant. There was one exception: there was a black M.D. Back in 1969, he bought property out by the country club. The bankers and oil men whose property his home would abut were absolutely aghast at the prospect of living next door to a negro. Now, mind you, this negro had more education than anybody else, but he was someone to be feared, someone who would make property values drop. And these people -- I can remember these people -- my parents' friends -- were nice to his face, but in the shadows, they trying to make sure his real estate bid would fail.

Barack Obama is correct.

[redqueen]

37. Doesn't worry me too much.

I live in a small mostly white and very red town... and the republicans I've talked to who lean Obama over McCain are more concerned with jobs than having their asses kissed.

They may be viewed as stupid, but money talks. Jobs matter. Trade deals matter.

[jackson_dem]

42. Google Ed Koch my friend

;)

[philk17088]

40. he's right

I am from one of these small towns. People do feel like that. They have been lied to so many times over it isn't even surprising anymore.

If anyone remembers when PA woo'ed Volkswagon to build a plant in New Stanton, you will know how they have been kicked to the curb but get back up again. VW got loans, rail sidings, all utlilties, a highway etc, to build Rabbits in PA. VW closed up just about the time the tax exemptions ran out. Leaving us to eat the costs of all the improvements. Every candidate talks the talk about jobs but never deliver. The churchs have sustained these people and the guns? they have always been a part of the culture here. Obama didn't insult me or my fellow Pennslyvanians, he made an accurate observation that has merit. You can all stop with your faux outrage and bluster over Sen. Obama's remarks, we are doing fine.

[democrattotheend]

49. Welcome to DU!

As a PA Obama supporter (I am guessing, from your comments), you are hereby obligated to keep the rest of us up to date on what's going on there. ;)

Very good points, btw. Hopefully this won't be taken out of context and blow up in his face. Keep us posted on how people react in your neck of the woods.

[MethuenProgressive]

41. What an asshole.

Michelle needs to call him and tell him to STFU.

[goclark]

134. Michelle needs to kiss him, the video is profound

Obama speaks for me.

I am bitter, middle class and I am bitter as hell.

[jody]

43. BO's snide remarks about gun owners destroys his recent efforts to cozy up to them. BO is a

political chameleon and will say anything to get votes and as he continues to talk, he reveals his duplicitous, hypocritical character.

BO was a board member of the Joyce Foundation that funds the Violence Policy Center and its major goal is to ban all handguns.

Joyce offered BO the position as its president.

Would an anti-abortion group select a pro-abortion person for president? NO!

Would an anti-handgun group select a pro-handgun person for president? NO!

[futureliveshere]

46. Can we understand the difference between BIG PICTURE and personalizations here??

Obama is talking about the bigger picture here as to why a community an choose to become more inward looking, protectionistic and fearful of the future when there are fewer jobs to go around and higher prices. People naturally turn towards the comfort zone and resist change in such a scenario.

This is a PLAIN HARD TRUTH and he is being brave saying it. This is common psychology of a large population of people.

Grow up and don't take it personally.

[rodeodance]

51. I don't care to--not after the months of RW smears on Hillary by Obama folk!

[futureliveshere]

63. An eye for an eye will make the whole world BLIND --- Gandhi!!!

[kdpeters]

111. Thank you for admitting that. We already knew, but at least one of you admits it.

[ecstatic]

116. bingo... I'm amazed some seem to be taking offense

It may not apply to you personally but it damn sure applies to a lot of folks!

[Cali_Democrat]

47. He's ABSOLUTELY RIGHT

I love Obama. He almost always hits the nail on the head. Many small town folks do indeed cling to guns and religion. Many have antipathy towards people that don't look like them. These small-town folks won't vote for him anyway, so who cares.

[philk17088]

56. hold up

Don't write off small town folks so easily. We are a little more complex than all the "swells" think we are. We also have antipathy for those that do look like us. We also don't cling to guns, we look at guns as just another facet of our lives. Most of us are skeptical of those running for office. We have been courted and dumped a lot. DNC couldn't give 2 sh!ts about PA until our primary suddenly could change things. We do vote with our brains. How do you think we got rid of Santorum?

Those of you who are so upset about Sen Obama's remarks mustshed a lot of reptilian tears. Oh the outrage when it helps the grindstone on our axe!

[Cali_Democrat]

81. I definitely wasn't referring to all small town folks

But if you look at voting trends, many small town people typically vote Republican or they are Reagan Dems.

Look at the 2004 election results by county and you will see that this is the case.

[rodeodance]

50. i have always said his was arrogant--now he goes to Billionairs homes in SF and

talks down rural America.

Puke on you Mr. obama

[LisaM]

55. All the while taking their donations......

Or do all of his millions and millions of donations only come from cities?

[Nia Zuri]

58. Arrogant = uppity

Some folks cannot stand a confident, brilliant black person. Ok for Hillary to go to billionaires homes, huh?

[NJSecularist]

59. Puke on you, Mr. Obama?

Learn some manners. That is disgusting. What a disgrace.

[rodeodance]

75. pucky on Obama. I hope this quote gets plastered all across PA, IN, NC. etc etc

[MercutioATC]

82. So do I. It's the truth.

Obama doesn't censor his words much. He speaks the truth.

It might not be a particularly wise political strategy, but he speaks plainly about issues.

[rodeodance]

90. too bad. Hillary already did a slam dunk with it in PA

[MercutioATC]

95. Hillary needs to win every race from here on out by 28 points to catch Obama.

Sometimes speaking the truth offends some people...usually, as in this case, because they spin the meaning.

If that happens in PA, so be it. I'm more concerned with a candidate getting to the heart of an issue and speaking plainly about it than I am about being careful not to offend anybody.

He didn't call anybody a "bigot", as some here have tried to claim. He said that when people fall on hard times due to circumstances beyond their control, they often place blame...occasionally on the wrong shoulders.

That's completely true.

[Terran]

57. It's actually not very well phrased.

I know what he means and I don't see how any progressive here can deny the truth of it. But I don't think he meant to imply that people cling to religion "as a way to explain their frustrations". He meant that such people scapegoat immigrants, non-whites and/or trade (i.e., other nations), and that guns and religion are all they have that give them a sense of stability/security.

I'm hoping he wasn't misquoted. In all, it was not well stated. I don't think it's patronizing, but it's also not the kind of thing you say in front of the people you're discussing...kind of like talking about someone as if they're not there when they in fact are there.

And all the false outrage is soooooo to be expected. Get it out of your systems and move on.

[slackmaster]

62. That was an ill-advised remark

Maybe people in San Francisco would take it the way he intended, but this is 2008 and a public figure can't keep anything he or she utters from being immediately broadcast around the world and permanently recorded.

[UALRBSofL]

64. When will the Obama camp come out with damage control?

I expect a statement from Axelrod any time now.

[progressoid]

65. Read the whole thing...

... These qualities of hospitality, patriotism and endurance are exactly what Californians need to hear about Pennsylvanians. And when he spoke to a group of his wealthier Golden State backers at a San Francisco fund-raiser last Sunday, Barack Obama took a shot at explaining the yawning cultural gap that separates a Turkeyfoot from a Marin County. "You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them," Obama said. "And they fell through the Clinton Administration, and the Bush Administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."

Obama made a problematic judgment call in trying to explain working class culture to a much wealthier audience. He described blue collar Pennsylvanians with a series of what in the eyes of creamy Californians might be considered pure negatives: guns, clinging to religion, antipathy, xenophobia.

I'm not sure this is what at least this lot of Californians needed to hear about Pennsylvanians. Such phrases can reinforce negative stereotypes among Californians, who are a people in a state already surfeited with a smug sense of superiority and, as an ironic consequence, a parochialism and insularity at odds with the innovation, prosperity and openness for which California is rightly known. (Of course, this is a generalization, and as such does not fit everyone; but as a state characteristic I stand by it.) Californians might be better served by hearing that Pennsylvanians have a strong sense of their place in American history, for here California is wanting. California needs to hear that other Americans have gone through hard times and survived, humor intact. Since Barack Obama sees himself as the candidate best able to unify the country, these are the messages he needs to carry and his frank words about Pennsylvania may not have translated very clearly...

More: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mayhill-fowler/obama-no-surprise-that-ha_b_96188.html

(by the way, even though probably too blunt and analytical for politics, Obama is right)

[LisaM]

118. Pennsylvania is a great place. I've been there and loved it.

It's one of my favorite places. And no, Senator, it's NOT in the Midwest.

[scheming daemons]

127. I've lived in PA my entire 41 years of life.... everything west of the Allegheny mtns *IS* Midwest..

You're wrong.

[TLM]

129. I lived in PA....

and you clearly don't know what you're talking about.

[BadgerLaw2010]

140. There is no context that makes this less condescending.

The comments are "I know what's wrong with these people." As that is coming from an international background, Harvard-Harvard educated guy, that is absolutely condescending.

[DarienComp]

68. oh like that's not true.

:eyes:

[yardwork]

69. I'm from a small town in Ohio and I don't read Obama's comment as an insult.

He's absolutely right. Also, if you read the entire statement, and not just the bolded sentence, it's obvious that Obama is very sympathetic to small-towners whose "jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them..."

[aquarius dawning]

102. If you have been waiting around for 25 years to find a job, and you still haven't found one...

You are 100% unemployable for reasons that have nothing to do with the current employment climate. In my small Ohio town (which will vote overwhelmingly for McCain BTW), unemployment won't be the huge issue that Obama is hoping for and, as far as that goes, he doesn't have a monopoly on the job creation issue. Hillary is just as if not more capable of replacing jobs as Barack Obama.

[knixphan]

71. hmm...

DENTIST
'Looks like you have a cavity. We're going to have to fill that. Then you should brush and floss regularly.'

PATIENT
'WTF!?! You calling me a redneck? How dare you judge my dental hygiene!'

[ms liberty]

72. He's right. I live in a rural, small town in the south...

And he nails it.

What I'd like to see is an actual quotation of what he said immediately prior to the featured quote. By paraphrasing what he said, then quoting that particular phrase it makes his statement appear more controversial than it probably was in the context of what he was saying. So nice of politico to serve up some juicy perception-shaping with their gossip...er news, eh?

But what he said is valid and true, and pretty damn accurate.

[swishyfeet]

76. ZZZZzzzzzzzzz.......

This is a waste of time. Are the PA small-town folk REALLY going to get worked up over this? You've got to squeeze it pretty hard to wring out the anti-anything here.

I'm not sure hick-gate is the best play at the moment. Wait it out, I'm sure he'll mispronounce some river with a goofy Native American name... then you'll really be able to freak out and start calling for him to quit.

[knixphan]

78. agreed

'Sasqua-hallle-hanna-cootcha-latcheee-gate' will be a better call-to-arms.

[anonymous171]

77. The paragraph before that is the one that needs the media play.

[Missouri Girl]

79. First Timer

I've lurked here a long time and finally decided to post. So, here I jump...

I have to give credit here. This is not a racist or class-ist or prejudiced statement. I think it is very accurate. I live in rural Central Missouri and I think this is absolutely what happens. He's not slamming rural America, he's trying to get the coastal folks to understand why we are red states and why Repubs have had success in states like my state. Unfortunately. I am surrounded by folks who vote against their own best interests economically. Why?

What strikes me the most is how similar this is to that press conference scene in The American President, one of my all-time favorite movies. You know the scene where Michael Douglas has taken all the crud off of the Republican character (Riohard Dreyfuss) and he just lets loose?

"I've known Bob Rumson for years, and I've been operating under the assumption that the reason Bob devotes so much time and energy to shouting at the rain was that he simply didn't get it. Well, I was wrong. Bob's problem isn't that he doesn't get it. Bob's problem is that he can't sell it! We have serious problems to solve, and we need serious people to solve them. And whatever your particular problem is, I promise you, Bob Rumson is not the least bit interested in solving it. He is interested in two things and two things only: making you afraid of it and telling you who's to blame for it. That, ladies and gentlemen, is how you win elections. You gather a group of middle-aged, middle-class, middle-income voters who remember with longing an easier time, and you talk to them about family and American values and character. And wave an old photo of the President's girlfriend and you scream about patriotism and you tell them, she's to blame for their lot in life, and you go on television and you call her a w****."

That was one of my very favorite parts of this movie, for the same reason that I agree with his assessment. That is what is happening, maybe he just needed to go a step further and make that link to the Republican tactic.

A Baltimore Chronicle reporter apparently thought the same thing. If you google the movie and Obama, you will find the article (March 22nd). I'd post the link, but I don't remember if that is allowed.

[democrattotheend]

80. Welcome to DU!

And I think you are right, btw. Good comparison.

[LiveLiberally]

83. Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[PylesMalfunction]

85. Hi Missouri Girl!

Welcome to DU! :)

[TahitiNut]

86. I made the SAME movie comparison in my mind. Exactly!

There are too many politicians, particularly right-wingers, who exploit the "politics of scarcity" and point the finger of blame at some 'enemy' ... almost always a minority ... and collect the money and the votes and then do nothing to solve the problems. Indeed, they're IN BED WITH those who've created the problems by shipping jobs off-shore and wiping out the owner-operated small businesses that do the best job of keeping the wealth in the community.

Obama nailed it.

[knixphan]

92. I love you already. :)

[kdpeters]

113. NAILED IT!! Do stick around. Welcome.

[dchill]

130. Welcome to DU!

:thumbsup:

[baldguy]

84. Sounds like something taken out of context.

Google "they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them" and what hits do you get? -

Blogonaut: OBAMA INSULTS “SMALL TOWN” PA “CLING TO GUNS, FAIR TRADE”
http://blogonaut-blogonaut.blogspot.com/2008/04/obama-insults-small-town-pa-cling-to.html

Lucianne.com News Forum
http://www.lucianne.com/main.asp

Obama: Small-town USA Clinging to religion, guns, and xenophobia «
http://hayhurstforamerica.wordpress.com/2008/04/11/obama-small-town-usa-clinging-to-religion-guns-and-xenophobia/

The ramblings of a lonely Republican stranded in the People’s Republic of Mass
http://www.nerepublican.com/


Note that there's no direct like to the full text of the alleged speech by Obama. Smells like a RW hatchet job.

[Neshanic]

87. OK, Who has the "Obama/What He Really Meant" book?

Translation:

"They are a hardy bunch and in adversity have always have had a positive outlook on their communities and America!"

[Bluenorthwest]

88. I wonder why

He criticizes 'clinging to religion' in this context, but runs 'Faith and Family' tours in another, and that seems odd to me. In SC, relgion was a huge part of his campaign, and he hired Fundy anti-gay preachers and the whole thing. It seems he sees religion in some communities as a symptom of econonmic ills, but in others as a celebration of values.

How does that work?

[knixphan]

94. the operative verb is 'cling'

and the context is economic depression.

Nothing wrong with doing your hair,
but doing your hair while your house burns down around you - different context.

[Bluenorthwest]

96. So the poverty in South Carolina

does not count? The stats down there are not that great, and the people certainly no less provencial than other rural dwellers.
Are you saying in the South the religious people are well off enough to afford religious bigotry? Whereas in the North the religion is a problem, in the South it is fine?

[Bluenorthwest]

101. Some quick figures

Most recent figures for percentage of population living below the poverty line.
South Carolina, home of 'Faith and Family' comes in at number 10 out of 50, with 15.7% under the poverty line.

Pennsylvania, where they cling to religion, comes in at number 31 out of 50, with 11.7% under the poverty line.

Unemployment, South Carolina is number 5! With 6.5%, Pennsylvania is number 28, with 4.5%.

Now you were saying something about who gets to do their hair and who is clinging to religion, maybe you'd like to try again. Why is religion used and characterized so differently in different places in the Obama camapaign.

[matcom]

89. I agree 100%

small town 'Murica does NOTHING to help themselves

[MethuenProgressive]

98. BO: "You're all bitter rednecks, now vote for me!"

No wonder BO's dropped 10 points in PA to McCain.

[ecstatic]

117. Aren't you the one always posting threads about how whites in PA

will not vote for Obama?

[dchill]

131. One of these days...

it'll come to you.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

99. One traffic light in 580 square miles and 423 students in k-12 in my school district

it doesn't get much more rural than here and things rarely change and we like it.

40 minute drive to the nearest mcDonalds YAY!!!!

That's why I bought my house and 23 acres surrounded by forever wild state land here....to raise my children off the grid.


Obama keep your change

[anonymous171]

100. Elton John to the people of america: "...to hell with them!"

[Bluenorthwest]

104. Yeah, that is what he said

Jesus's lips man, try to stay on topic and when veering off the track, try to be accurate. To hell with misogynists, with which I agree. Also to hell with liars.

[Fox Mulder]

103. He's exactly right.

That's what the people are like here in my small town, and many of the surrounding small towns here in rural Minnesota.

[uponit7771]

105. I don't see what the issue is either.

[Fox Mulder]

106. You know how it goes...

the media will invent some sort of faux outrage for the day.

Same shit, different day.

[Straight Shooter]

108. It's the word "cling" that's going to rub people the wrong way.

Especially in reference to religion. People find solace in religion, it goes to the core of who they are, their very essence. To use the word "cling" belittles their deep-seated faith.

These people would hold fast to their religion whether times are good or bad, Obama. Big city, small town, makes no difference.

[kdpeters]

109. Without the faintest trace of irony. You guys are killing me.

It goes without saying the charge is bogus. I've been reading DU for five years and there has always been a high tolerance for select flavors of bigotry toward small town folks, southern folks, rural folks and others. You're telling me DU just now came full circle and started being consistent? The cherry on top is the OP's name. Just too much.

This small town southern man thanks you all for your concern.

[zulchzulu]

110. Now Obama can do the speech about NAFTA and how the Clintons were for it

This is actually very artful on Obama's part. He can now do a speech about NAFTA and how it has destroyed jobs in Pennsylvania...and gee, guess who signed it and guess who is LYING that she was against it.

:rofl:

Incoming, SS Clinton...

[Jacobin]

112. Horror of horrors. He spoke the truth intelligently

instead of blabbering some pandering claptrap. BURN HIM!!! BURN HIM!!

[oasis]

114. Small town peeps have only their God to give them solace. They need to

wake the fuck up and get on the Obama train.:woohoo:

[ecstatic]

115. Isn't this the same thing Dean was saying?

And what part of it is untrue? :shrug:

[Tom Rinaldo]

121. Nope

Dean was saying that Democrats can find some honest common ground with people who have a red neck life style, but he didn't claim that a red neck lifestyle was the result of bitterness or fear of strangers or a need to cling to something in order to feel alright. That is a big difference, and that is why this lands in a different way.

And it is untrue, all of it, because for starters it was a sweeping statement that implies all people living in those small towns fit that bill, and that is never remotely true, not by a country mile. I do not claim to know Obama so I won't say that he literally believes what it sounds like he believes about people in small towns, based on that one quote. I can't imagine that Obama actually thinks he was essentially describing all residents of those small towns. I think he was talking loosely trying to make some point and slipped into generalities. But they were very problematic generalities to slip into. Those words called entire communities flawed because of the limitations of their residents, with a very clear implication that people living in more cosmopolitan places aren't intrinsically flawed in similar ways.

Again, I think far more of Obama than to believe he feels disdainful of small town residents, whether or not he harbors any misconceptions about rural sociology. But Obama is in politics and let's just say I doubt comments like those will help him win votes in those types of communities.

[oasis]

137. Kudos for your thoughtful clarification and explanation.

:thumbsup:

[Blondiegrrl]

122. That description serves West Virginia very well too.

He makes an excellent point. Obviously, not EVERY SINGLE PERSON is a gun-toting Bible beater. But a disproportionate (compared to the rest of the U.S.) number are.

[sueragingroz]

123. looks like Hillary is gonna open up a big can of whoop-ass in PA!

I can't wait to see the polls over the weekend and into next week as this sinks in.

No speeches are gonna save him now.

[SoonerPride]

124. Fail.

Try this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow

[knixphan]

125. that's the beautiful thing about O

He's put the whoop-ass on you before you even realize the fight's over.

[scheming daemons]

126. So now... unvarnished truth causes faux outrage among Clintonistas....

Not hard to understand, really.... They've come to the point of NOT being offended by lies, that when they hear the TRUTH it offends them.


Everything Obama said is absolutely true. I live in "small town PA".


He's right... you Hillbots can't handle it.

[truthpusher]

128. .

[CatsDogsBabies]

136. I don't know why people are making a big deal of this

I grew up in small town western PA and left about 25 years ago (at the same time all the mills closed, but not because the mills closed). I am sure some people are really bitter and frustrated since nothing has replaced the living wage jobs from the height of the steel industry. I don't get what the big deal is - are we really suppose to believe these people who have never recovered from the economic downturn of the early 80s are all positive, cheery and happy-go-lucky? Why would they be? SOunds like saying they should be or are all positive is pretty dismissive. Sometimes when I think some of the topics on DU aren't really ones most people are focused on. I am sure people are concerned about the economy, but probably not as concerned about someone saying that people who have been left behind are frustrated and bitter. This is not a put down.

[Mezzo]

139. There will be other instances. I suggest we treat Obamatons as well as they treat Hillary. nt

[Arkana]

141. I fail to see the problem here.

People are angry. They get screwed time and time again by politicians who say they will help, and when their communities continue to deteriorate, wedge issues like religion, guns, xenophobia and others come in and rule the day.