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“BITTER” DOUBLE STANDARDS: WHAT’S the Matter with PENNSYLVANIA?

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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 05:38 AM
Original message
“BITTER” DOUBLE STANDARDS: WHAT’S the Matter with PENNSYLVANIA?
Edited on Sun Apr-13-08 06:18 AM by FrenchieCat
is the same thing as “WHAT’S the Matter with KANSAS”

When Senator Obama was speaking in San Francisco about folks in small town Pennsylvania, he wasn't saying anything new nor anything unheard of. He was talking about some of the same issues raised in the best selling Book, “What’s the Matter with Kansas”, by Thomas Frank. http://www.tcfrank.com/wmk.html

In fact, Barack Obama discussed that very book with Charlie Rose back in 2004.
Here’s the portion when he specifically addresses the topic at hand and the book;
What’s the matter with Kansas?: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a88wMPAWc90

For quite some time, Democratic politicians have attempted to understand why voters who don’t have health coverage and might wish to have it, would not vote for the candidate offering it as part of his campaign pledge, but would vote a the congressional candidate promoting tax cuts for the rich simply because he/she was pro-life. Or why they might vote for a Free Trade candidate because the candidate was pro second amendment or supported an amendment prohibiting the burning of the American flag.

Sen. Obama was simply explaining why the financially hard pressed often time vote on their wedge issues (and yes, that would be God, Guns, and Gays....doh!), instead of their best own economic interest. Barack, a candidate for President, may not have stated his thoughts in the most artful way possible, which he conceded, but it does appear that a wave of epic proportion involving those who would want to be offended have quickly made their voices heard. Obvious to any political observer, The Clinton and McCain Campaigns and the so ever willing media started fanning the flames of objection of Barack Obama’s utterances sooner than immediate, in quick accord.

The serious concern that I have with this intensely focused over-the-top “outrage” on this subject, is that, in essence, Obama is being judged as not worthy enough to speak on the state of our politics as it specifically relates to that group of voters, even though, he just happens to be running for President. Perhaps he should have gotten permission first--But more disturbing still, is that perhaps Barack’s real problem in reference to talking honestly about this often time discussed political subject is that some do not see him as being of the “ilk” of those he is talking about. It is possible that some do not consider him to have enough in common with that part of America, although his mother hailed from rural Kansas, and hence, half of his gene pool is of that “ilk”? Possibly. Could it be that because Sen. Obama is ½ Black, he is not afforded the ability to comment on those he might lead under an Obama administration according to those who set the rules; the true elitists?

Ironically, White politicians, pollsters, pundits and anyone and his/her mother have been seen commenting on the Black vote, the Hispanic vote, the Gay vote, the educated vote, the youth vote, the male and female vote for the last 3 months, in a manner that has not always been preapproved. At such times, the voters are efficiently segmented, dissected and analyzed, and long and short hypothesis are clinically formulated as to why those folks might have voted as they did. In some rare instance, campaign pollsters are given microphones in order to announce to the entire world ahead of time who will be voting for whom.

It is sad to say, that it appears that when it comes to a Black man, no matter that he could claim some of the same roots as those of whom he speaks of, he is simply not allowed that luxury, in particular if his chosen words appear unartful on their face.

But the fact that some would go as far as to say that this “endangers” his candidacy, and attempt to call this (another media produced) “challenge” for Candidate Obama, I must call them on that notion.

These people making such claims are in fact, the elitist playing Molehill politics with our nation. In their eagerness to shape our public opinion on these elections, they are the most obnoctious as they bring us their pile-on high drama manufactured political episodes. They are the reason that Wedge politics is alive and well and striving in America today. They are the reasons that we, the people, have become the cynics that result in only 55% of Americans participating in our political process. Are the “Rural Small town Voters” really “code” for White moderate swing voters that no-one except for White people can discuss? Emoting political correctness does serve a noble purpose at times, but after all that has been said about race, sex and creed in this election, I find this to be happening now most ridiculous!



What's The Matter With Kansas?


What's the matter with America? What explains the dysfunction at the dark heart of our politics?
Over the last thirty-five years the Republicans have transformed themselves from an aristocratic minority into the nation's dominant political party, a brawling, beer-drinking buddy of the working man. The strategy by which they have won this triumph is instantly familiar and yet so bizarre it's sometimes hard to believe it's actually happened
<>
for the last three decades seems more like a panorama of madness and delusion worthy of Hieronymous Bosch: of sturdy patriots reciting the Pledge while they resolutely strangle their own life chances; of small farmers proudly voting themselves off the land; of devoted family men carefully seeing to it that their children will never be able to afford college or proper health care; of hardened blue-collar workers in midwestern burgs cheering as they deliver up a landslide for a candidate whose policies will end their way of life, will transform their region into a "rust belt," will strike people like them blows from which they will never recover.




http://www.tcfrank.com/wmk.html


Meaning of Wedge Issue-
A wedge issue is a social or political issue, often of a divisive or otherwise controversial nature, which splits apart or creates a "wedge" in the support base of one political group. Wedge issues can be advertised, publicly aired, and otherwise emphasized by an opposing political group, in an attempt to weaken the unity of the divided group, or to entice voters in the divided group to give their support to the opposing group. The use of wedge issues gives rise to wedge politics.

1. Political parties are usually fairly diverse groups though they will always try to project a united front.
A wedge issue may often be a point of internal dissent within the opposing party, which that party tries to suppress or ignore talking about because it divides "the base." Such issues are typically a cultural or populist issue, relating to matters such as crime, national security, sexuality (e.g. gay marriage), or race.

Another party may exploit this dissent by publicly supporting the issue, and in effect align itself with the dissenting faction of the opposing party.

A wedge issue, when wielded against another party, is intended to bring about such things as:
A debate, often vitriolic, within the opposing party, giving the public a perception of disarray.
The defection of supporters of the opposing party's minority faction to the other party (or independent parties) if they lose the debate.
The legitimising of sentiment which, while perhaps popularly held, is usually considered inappropriate or politically incorrect; criticisms from the opposition then make it appear beholden to special interests or fringe ideology.
In an extreme case, a wedge issue might contribute to the actual fracture of the opposing party as another party spins off, taking voters with it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wedge_issue



Further recommended reading:

Ex-Clinton advisor: Bill and Co. have said the same things as Obama
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/188673.php

Immigration Shaping Up as Wedge Issue
http://news.newamericamedia.org/news/view_article.html?article_id=4808c9d5b7ddf55c8de0f1f116993647&from=rss

The Persuadable Voter: Wedge Issues in Presidential Campaigns
http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~hillygus/HillygusShields8-20.pdf

Remember when *all* of us hated the use of wedge issues in elections?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5476242&mesg_id=5476242



and for your viewing pleasure:

Video of What Obama Really Said on April 6 in SF
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x117848

What Consistent Obama said 4 years ago on the Charlie Rose show; the same thing!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a88wMPAWc90





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fjc Donating Member (700 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 05:45 AM
Response to Original message
1. "In fact, Barack Obama discussed that very book with Charlie Rose back in 2004. "
Edited on Sun Apr-13-08 05:45 AM by fjc
Well, there you have it. The "uppity nigger" reads books. :scared:
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 05:54 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. They might as well call him that....because that is what they mean.....
really sad to say.

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fjc Donating Member (700 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 05:56 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. That is exactly what they mean.
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 05:47 AM
Response to Original message
2. I seem to recall hillary commenting on this subject...


The god,guns,gays wedge issue voting...
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 05:53 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Yes, but obviously, she's been given permission.....or she
never needed to ask.
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TragedyandHope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:04 AM
Response to Original message
6. Deer Hunting With Jesus
Here's a book that was recommended in another thread.



http://www.joebageant.com/joe/2006/08/joe_bageants_bo.html">Deer Hunting With Jesus by Joe Bageant

Bageant mixes a reporter's keen analysis, a storyteller's color, and a native son's love of his roots in this absorbing dissection of America's working poor. Returning to his hometown of Winchester, Virginia, after 30 years of life among the elite journalistic class, Bageant sought to answer the question of why the working poor vote for Republicans in apparent opposition to their own interests. On a broader level, he examines issues of economic class distinctions as he drills below the middle-class claims of his hometown.

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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:09 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Thanks! Yep.....books have been written on the subject,
but yet we are to act like Obama was caught in bed with a minor! :eyes:
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:11 AM
Response to Original message
8. On Thursday Hillary told NPR there was a double standard, but couldn't say what that standard was!
Edited on Sun Apr-13-08 06:12 AM by Major Hogwash
Just like she couldn't answer the question about her hubbie collecting $800,000 for giving speeches about free trade to Colombia when she supposedly *wink wink* is against it!!

Let's see her cackle her way out of that one during the upcoming debate with Obama!
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:27 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. I remember that! Maybe this is what she was talking about......
how she's allowed to say anything,
and anything that Obama says might end his campaign, according to those who decide such things, aka, the elitists.
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:38 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. I'm not overly concerned about her feelings anymore.
Edited on Sun Apr-13-08 06:39 AM by Major Hogwash
Since she has decided to lie about everything.

Her claim to be pro-gun as well as a hunter is atrocious.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:35 AM
Response to Original message
10. Folks will not be voting for Hillary in November by the droves.....and it will be due to this
fucked up shit.

We will be losing this election......the election that was supposed to be historical. Well it will make history alright.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:44 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. They already aren't voting for her in droves. Maybe she could
negative votes.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:48 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Oh, and lest not forget the governor who basically let everyone know
that many Penn voters would not be voting for a Black candidate. Was that denounced and derided, or was that accepted as "Conventional Wisdom". See, some folks get away with anything....while others are lynched at the slightest, hence the double standard.

She loses either way.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #13
18. If Obama behaved toward Clinton the way she has behaved
he'd be run out of the race. I have no doubt in my mind.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #18
29. Neither do I!
He would be a footnote in election history as we speak!
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FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:50 AM
Response to Original message
14. Well said, FrenchieCat
I took it the same way and even thought of the same book when I heard it. Barack's only mistake was saying it in a way that could be exploited by his political enemies. He could have chosen his words more carefully, but if he constantly tried to speak in only the safest terms, he'd be just another lifeless politician.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:56 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. It's that double standard that some want to deny that gets me......
You'd think that they'd found him in bed with a dead girl! :eyes:
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 06:58 AM
Response to Original message
16. There's a big difference between reading a book & a candidate making a speech.
IF Barack had written the book "What's the Matter with Kansas", clips from THAT book would be making the headlines.

I think the one thing you aren't understanding is that lots of rural Americans value their religious beliefs & their guns a lot more than they want health care and who gets tax cuts. It's really not that much different that when some Dems state they don't care how great a candidate is, if they're pro life they'd never vote for them, or any of the other single issue voters in the country. Some people will not look at 2 or 3 possible candidates and check to seer which one MOSTLY has their interests at heart.

Ya know, so many people are all upset about the opinion of these rural voters (that's the issue today) but they're forgetting something much broader. Dems NEVER get the rural vote for a variety of reasons. My husband's family is from rural Pa. (Center County). They have ALWAYS been staunch Pubs and would never even entertain the idea of conssidering anyone else than the Pub candidate no matter who he/she is, and they've been that way since I met my husband in 1961! They of course KNOW I've corrupted hubby over the years, but I never talk politics with any of them because to do so only starts a vicious fight!
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 07:04 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. Like I said in the Op....during this primary, Rural voters really just means
White middle Americans, period.

I understand "valuing"...but it has been quite some time since I've heard of any candidate of either party campaigning in rural Penn announcing that he/she would be taking Guns away.

As for the Pro-life, maybe that was the wrong example, because I can't really argue if someone believes that strongly, even believes more strongly than having health care, that women shouldn't have the right to choose......that they are wrong.

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FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 07:23 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. I think it really depends on what part of the rural areas you look at.
I live outside of a tiny town (population 478) in the heart of "flyover country". It seems to me that the people who live in the rural small towns, they are heavily republican. But the farmers, ranchers, and goofballs like me who just want to live in the country seem to be largely democrats. I could be dead wrong about that, but that's my perception.
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 07:50 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. That may be right. I have no idea how we would find out if it;'s
mostly Pub spin and a minority that is just louder than than the average "Joe", or if there really ARE fewer Dems in "flyover country".
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FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. Well, don't get me wrong, the rural areas are more republican as a whole
I'm just drawing a distinction between different types of rural community. You've got people who actually live "in town" where the roads are paved, the lots are small, and the post office, town hall, church and Kum & Go are all within walking distance. These people are largely republican (though I did see a handful of Hilary signs when we were trick-or-treating).

But then there's the type of rural where I live. Where an acre is a small yard. Where your closest neighbor is a quarter-mile down a gravel road. Where there's 100 acres of corn across the road from you. Where even a guy like me, a transplanted life-long city boy, is building a chicken coop. These people seem more democratically inclined. I even saw my neighbors at our caucus.

The town people far outnumber us though, just by virtue of being more densely packed. Personally, I have no idea why you would live in a rural town. If you're going to have neighbors right next to you, you may as well live in the burbs where at least you can buy a hamburger without driving half an hour one-way to the nearest town with a restaurant.
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. the farmers, hunters were also Republican where we were
It was generally the large towns that were more Democrat.
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Bensthename Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 07:59 AM
Response to Original message
22. Are some PA really bitter or is Obama lying? Read here:
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Inspired Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 08:07 AM
Response to Original message
23. Perfect post, FrenchieCat.
You explained it very well. Obama speaks the truth on this. I guess when the message makes people feel uncomfortable it is easier to kill the messenger.
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BumRushDaShow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 08:18 AM
Response to Original message
25. The Clintons, the repukes, and the media still can't get over the fact that
Obama is winning. Almost EVERY article and analysis spends an inordinate amount of time, not praising those who have orchestrated his campaign strategy or how well he has stirred the public out of their stupor and lethargy, nor will they reemphasize his lead and the states that he has now put in play for the Democratic Party itself... but rather, they:

1.) Generate, discuss, and pontificate, ad nauseum, on scenarios for how Clinton can win.
2.) Generate, discuss, and pontificate, ad nauseum, on scenarios for how Obama can lose.

It totally boggles the mind. :crazy: They are dripping with bitterness in their "How dare he!" reporting.

Ironically, it takes thousands of netroots blog and discussion posts that are the reverse of the above to trigger some sort of brief hiatus on the nonsense. And only then, with a big delay, will the media reluctantly add these scenarios in their stories, but only as an aside or footnote. And when called on it, they will sometimes even do a token story - maybe once a week, whether written or on television, basically following some reporting quota for actually dealing with the reality of the math, and then they are back to the Clinton bias and a Walt Disney World Fantasy Land.
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tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 08:41 AM
Response to Original message
26. Great Book. I recognized what he was talking about immediately.
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 10:53 AM
Response to Original message
27. This popped on Google News, and I immediately recognized the author
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #27
28. Thanks!
:hi:
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kevinmc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
30. PA. White women begin to turn away from Clinton
LEVITTOWN, Pa. — Like many women over 50, Paula Houwen was eager to vote for Hillary Clinton for president.

"I was impressed when she was first lady. She wasn't the country's trophy wife," the 56-year-old suburban Philadelphia pharmacist recalled.

Today, though, Houwen's no longer a Clinton fan.

"I do not like the way Hillary Clinton has run her campaign," she said.

Clinton's strongest core of support — white women — is beginning to erode in Pennsylvania, the site of the critical April 22 Democratic presidential primary, and a loss here could effectively end her White House run.

A Quinnipiac University survey taken April 3-6 in Pennsylvania found that Clinton's support fell 6 percentage points in a week among white women. Nationally, a Lifetime Networks poll of women found that 26 percent said they liked Clinton less now than in January, while only 15 percent said they liked her more.

"These are Democratic women who waited all their lives for a woman president, but Hillary is not turning them on," said polling analyst Clay Richards.

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/33411.html






Paid for by
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Cali_Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 04:01 PM
Response to Original message
31. kick
:kick:
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Scurrilous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-13-08 05:17 PM
Response to Original message
32. K & R
Edited on Sun Apr-13-08 05:18 PM by Scurrilous
:thumbsup:
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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-14-08 02:51 AM
Response to Original message
33. Thx, FrenchieCat. That first video link of Charlie Rose is a must-view. n/t
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2rth2pwr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-14-08 03:03 AM
Response to Original message
34. "The answer to `What's the matter with Kansas' is not that there's something the matter with Kansas,
"There's something the matter with Democrats who

can't make a connection with voters whose economic interests are closely tied to what the Democratic Party stands for."

http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/04/hillary_chief_strategist_geoff.php
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