Want to know the biggest reason why I "cling" to my guns?

[SIMPLYB1980]

http://www.blackwaterusa.com/


If these fuckers ever try to overthrow our government you might be glad that some of your rural Democratic friends have some firearms for you to borrow.

[Oreo]

1. Screw em

[SIMPLYB1980]

5. Scew you.

[BlooInBloo]

13. Check the HuffPo front page, oh-uninformed-one. If you can put your guns down long enough.

[GarbagemanLB]

2. I wonder what kind of piece Hillary Oakley carries.

[slackmaster]

37. She has the Secret Service to carry Uzis and MP-5s on her behalf

She doesn't need to carry a weapon.

[anonymous171]

3. In case of National Emergency, Clinton wants to confiscate guns.

So you'd be fucked.

[jody]

6. HC voted "yea" for the appropriations bill that included an amendment against confiscation. You

really do need to get your facts right.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

20. I believe this is the vote they were referring to

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=2&vote=00202

The Vitter Amendment: To prohibit the confiscation of a firearm during an emergency or major disaster if the possession of such firearm is not prohibited under Federal or State law.


There were 84 Yeas and 16 Nays. Clinton was one of the 16 Nays.

[jody]

24. Senate votes for Amdt. 4615 and its parent bill H.R. 5441 below. HC voted for the bill as amended.

Question: On the Amendment (Vitter Amdt. No. 4615, As Modified )

Question: On Passage of the Bill (H.R. 5441, As Amended )

[Lone_Star_Dem]

27. Yet first she voted against the amendment not to confiscate guns during an emergency

Which is what the poster was referring to. Not the fact that she voted for the bundled appropriations bill.

She can't have it both ways. Sorry.

The vote on the Vitter Amendment was a chance for her to make her views clear on the issue of firearm confiscation (such as what took place in New Orleans after Katrina) and she took advantage of the opportunity. As did all the rest who voted either yea or nay on the amendment.

[jody]

29. The facts are that HC voted for a bill, now law, that prohibits gun confiscation. n/t

[Lone_Star_Dem]

30. This is the stupid stuff that makes primary season such a joy around here

Don't use asinine backward logic on me. I know why she voted on the appropriations bill just the same as every other person on this board. And it wasn't because she had an immediate change of heart on firearm confiscations, but rather due to the rest of the content and the need for the fundings to go though. Pretending otherwise doesn't change anything, including the fact that she gets to carry this vote around her neck like an albatross.

Back when she cast this vote...long ago in a DU that once was...we were discussing at the time how this would be looked at poorly when/if she were to run for president. Now in the DU primary universe we are going to change history and distort facts to serve our lords. Lines have been drawn, sides have been taken and war has been declared! Whatever. Pardon me for not giving a damn whose toes this steps on, but it's still a fact that this will go against her in the GE.

[jody]

31. Facts are HC voted to prohibit confiscation of guns. n/t

[Lone_Star_Dem]

35. Moments after she specifically voted for confiscating firearms.

I wish you the best of luck with selling that to voters.

[jody]

38. That's HC's problem just as BO's support for banning handguns and semiautomatic guns is BO's problem

IMO the only way HC & BO can shed their gun-grabber image is to promise voters, "I will veto every bill that comes to me as president that infringes on the natural, inherent, inalienable right of law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms for self-defense."

[Lone_Star_Dem]

39. I can see the reasoning behind your solution to the issue

I can even agree with it. However, changing their stances won't matter all that much. Obama's stance on banning the sale and manufacture of handguns was in what? 1996 when he was a state legislator? Then he changed his stance some 4 years later on the issue and it would appear it's still an issue.

Right now with the Democrats who support gun rights Obama has a slight lead over Hillary. Which only means that for those for whom that's an issue they'll vote for Obama before Hillary if given a choice between the two. Which they won't be in the GE. The problem is it's not the Democrats we're needing to woo when it comes to this issue. It's the Independents who are pro-gun rights. Which is a horse of a completely different color. How do we bridge the gap between how they feel regarding gun rights and how the majority of our party feels regarding gun rights? Frankly, I don't think we do. Our candidates get stuck between the majority of Democrats who want sensible gun control and regulation legislation and those who fear that any further regulation would lead to an infringement on their rights. It's a touchy situation.

[jody]

40. BO was a board member of the Joyce Foundation and they offered him their presidency. Joyce funds

the Violence Policy Center and its goal is to ban all handguns.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

43. So you're agreeing that there's no reason for them to come out professing to be pro gun rights?

Or, are you back to our discussion being all about "mine is better than yours?"

[jody]

45. Keep reading and rereading my posts. My point is BO & HC are perceived as ant-gun and they need to

change their gun-grabber image to gain votes from independent voters who are also part of the 80 million gun owners.

[Oreo]

11. More here

http://www.huntersandshooters.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=212&Itemid=70

[jody]

25. HC voted "yea" for H.R. 5441 as amended by Amdt. 4615 n/t

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. Conspiracy theory driven paranoia?

Yeah, that's a wonderful reason to cling to guns.

[cliffordu]

9. Didn't Jefferon say that a government should fear the people,

not the other way around??

[SIMPLYB1980]

12. Yep.

"When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny."

[Oreo]

17. What do you say to this....

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=2&vote=00202

To prohibit the confiscation of a firearm during an emergency or major disaster if the possession of such firearm is not prohibited under Federal or State law.

Obama (D-IL), Yea
Clinton (D-NY), Nay

I'm looking forward to your excuse thoughts

[40ozDonkey]

18. Let's check back later!

And see how this plays out.

Also, :rofl:

[smiley_glad_hands]

42. Yes and he wanted a highly armed population with no standing army.

We have both btw.

[SIMPLYB1980]

10. Conspiracy huh.

http://www.expressmilwaukee.com/article-1479-blackwaterrss-terrifying-reach.html
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=14707922
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/091005A.shtml

[TomInTib]

7. And that's just one good reason.

I could probably think of a couple of dozen more.

[cliffordu]

8. Yep. I wondered why Bushie needed

ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND of the fuckers running around without oversight.

I'm thinking they will all be domestic "drug agents" here pretty soon.....


:puke:

[backscatter712]

14. As long as psychopaths like Bush and Cheney have power, I will never give up my guns.

If things get much worse in this country, we might need them.

We might have to use them and overthrow the corrupt, criminal gang that our government has become and restore our Constitution.

As long as that's an even remote possibility, I'm keeping my firearms.

As long as the possibility exists that Blackwater thugs or corrupt FBI goons might kick down my door, toss me into some dungeon and steal everything I've got, I'm gonna want the chance to shoot one of the bastards in the face.

Yeah. I'll shoot a law enforcement officer in the face with a twelve gauge slug if he tries to destroy my liberties. That's how fucking furious I am at this government. Bush's government is completely intolerable, and it's got to go, and I don't care if we throw them out with the ballot or the bullet.

[panader0]

15. I don't own a gun

I consider myself a pacifist, and though I am not a Christian, I admire Christ's pacifism. Thou shalt not kill is a good one too. I know I would give my life for some things, but take a life, no. I'm 57 and know that if you are looking for trouble, you can find it. If you are peaceful, you will find peace.

[tularetom]

16. I saw a "Penn & Teller explain Gun Control" video

Naturally they were against it. But there was a quote in there that I remembered.

"If you're threatened by a gang member, you can call the police. But what will you do if you're threatened by the police?"

I don't know where the quote originated. But I could not agree more.

But I'd change my avatar if I were you. That lady ain't a friend to gun owners no matter what she's saying now.

[LooseWilly]

19. This urbanite agrees completely... n/t

[mudesi]

21. SIGH

It never ceases to amaze me. This idiotic cowboy over-throwers of the tyrannical government fantasy that gun lovers have.

[knixphan]

22. lol

[Florida22ndDistrict]

33. re: SIGH

Most gun owners use their guns for target practice or hunting. I'm willing to bet that most of them also know someone who lived through the great depression and take peace of mind in the fact that they know how to acquire meat for their family in the event that our country faces economic decline. With two recessions occurring under the Bush administration's watch, rampant deficit spending, and a massive trade deficit that swells by the minute, maybe you should take that into consideration. Knowing a bit about guns/hunting and gardening doesn't hurt.

[bread_and_roses]

46. I 'm with you.

meant to add...don't I keep reading that most Americans support various forms of gun control? And didn't Gore and Kerry win? (I refuse to consider the '04 Ohio election as anything but an outright theft). But we keep hearing how Dems will lose because of guns....?

[Jed Dilligan]

23. I don't know

IED's seem to be more effective against those guys than small-arms fire...

:hide:

[L0oniX]

34. LOL ...so true. My Hi Point 9mm C9 +Comp wouldn't as effective for sure....

but it does give me and my wife a defense in my own childless home.

[mudesi]

26. And you JUST PROVED Obama right

You are so distraught by and mistrust your government that you cling to guns instead of supporting candidates that will stand up for your economic self interests.

This is exactly what Obama said, and you just admitted it.

[stillcool]

28. Is that how you choose a candidate?

based on fear that the 'liberals' will take away your guns?

[apocalypsehow]

32. That's one of our "pro-gun Democrats" in action alright: funny, they always seem to end up posting

the kind of bullshit that would make a freeper proud.

[PoliticalAmazon]

36. Urban Democrats have guns, too...we just don't build shrines for them. n/t

[smiley_glad_hands]

41. I support the 2nd Amendment and Obama. eom

[B Calm]

44. The right to own guns is a LIBERAL idea! Personal Freedom is also

a democratic idea!