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Which of these 4 Obama statements is not a lie

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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:52 PM
Original message
Poll question: Which of these 4 Obama statements is not a lie
Obama has given 4 different explanations for his non-reaction to the Rev Wright's "God Damn America" in 30 days - are any of them true?

In order said:

1. There was nothing that controversial in what he said.

2. I wasn't sitting in the pews when he said it (with variations that I just heard about his views).

3. In the speech he says it was reprehensible but I can't disavow him anymore than I can my grandmother.

4. If he hadn't retired as the pastor I would have left the church.

In reading above, as with all things Obama, he tries to leave an impression of a position but does not always clearly state that position so as to keep his options open should it prove unpopular and he needs to deny that the impression is what he meant. In the 4 statements please consider the impression he is trying to convey - and if that impression is compatible with the impression being sold by the other statements.


This fellow is already recorded with the 4 above - and those recordings will be played in the fall.
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anonymous171 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:53 PM
Response to Original message
1. Where's the "I don't care" option?
Be sure to wipe up after Pastorbating. :)
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Champion Jack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:57 PM
Original message
LOL!
What's that smell?
The stench of desperation is overwhelming!
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kid a Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:55 PM
Response to Original message
2. push ...push....push that poop nugget out
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:55 PM
Response to Original message
3. Hillary lied repeatedly about everything from Bosnia to NAFTA to SCHIP to a lot of other stuff.
Stop projecting.

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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:55 PM
Response to Original message
4. You're sooooo clever. Another "when did you stop beating your wife?" trick question! nt
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AllentownJake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
5. Ah..
Pastorbating again...they have an entire forum devoted to this at hillaryclintonforum.net if your interested in the echo chamber.
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anonymous171 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Seriously?
:rofl:
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AllentownJake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Yep here are some of the Gems over there.
BO - Wright, Race, Religion

BO - Bittergate & Elitism

BO - Michelle Obama

BO - Inconsistencies, Untruths, Flip-Flops

BO - Rezko, Special Interests

BO - Obamaism & Cultism

There's about 6 more but I had to get out of the shit pipe.

They have more threads for Obama issues than they do for Clinton.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. That's their hit list?
I wonder if they go in order, when they get their orders.
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AllentownJake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. I seriously fear for these people
When she concedes...the gnashing of teeth over there will not be pretty...
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
6. He was daydreaming of being POTUS while in church.
Please don't hold him responsible for not paying attention. :sarcasm:
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mckeown1128 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #6
33. So your with Hannity and Rush in your interpretation of this faux scandal? nt
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MercutioATC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
7. I hear his dry cleaner secretly plays Dungeons & Dragons, too...
1) You're paraphrasing Obama's statements.

2) None of these is a "lie"...you may doubt them, but unless you can prove otherwise, they're just statements.

3) Wright isn't even an issue now to Republican white evangelicals. Why do you think anybody wil care about this in the fall?
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dkf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 05:58 PM
Response to Original message
9. You are assuming that the "God Damn America" is what he was referring to.
Really you shouldn't assume that.
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blogslut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:01 PM
Response to Original message
10. none of the above
Have fun with your push poll.
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mwb970 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:02 PM
Response to Original message
12. Which thread in GD-P is the most worthless right now?
I know! I know!
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Lucky 13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:02 PM
Response to Original message
13. You guys beat a dead horse better than anybody I know.
You're spinning your wheels.
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Warren Stupidity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:04 PM
Response to Original message
14. Pastorbating reduces cancer risk!
According to the beeb anyway. Good for you. Keep it up!
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DrFunkenstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:06 PM
Response to Original message
15. How's The Clinton Campaign Doing These Days?
Yawn.
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sushi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:08 PM
Response to Original message
18. All politicians tell lies!
Obama has banned his pastor for now, but if he wins, Jeremiah Wright will be a regular WH visitor.
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bowens43 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
19. I chose , as nearly all Americans do , 'who gives a fuck'
seriously, if the is the best you hillbots can do can honestly say hillary deserves to be president?
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davidpdx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 08:42 PM
Response to Original message
20. Welcome to my ignore list
you feckless thug
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Condem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
21. #5
Papau really knows his shit.
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 08:46 PM
Response to Original message
22. False premises lead to false conclusions.
All the wishing in the world won't change that.

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grantcart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 08:51 PM
Response to Original message
23. Which of these 4 statements applies to you
1) I have a strange dislexic condition that causes me to see percentages in reverse.

2) I really like Obama and know that Clinton will endorse him soon - just want to have some fun until then.

3) I hate Obama and hope that Clinton does as much damage as possible so that we can tank in 08 and run again in 12?

4) My personal life is filled with such unending personal bitterness and disappointment that trying to tar Obama with the Republican tactics of 'guilt by association' gives me momentary relief but when I sober up my regret will cause me even higher levels of bitterness?
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Shae Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. You forgot " 5. All of the above."
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mythyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
24. beware 5 fallacies in one little poll: but be strong! Reason can see the true hero through....
(note: reposted from the last time i saw a silly bitter Hiltonite tried to bait a poll this blatantly; some of the info may not coincide exactly, but the spirit is the same...)

...

the OP intends neither dialogue nor objectivity here. not trying to reason; rather trying to set up people to fall into accusing hands. this poll is a conspicuous attempt at both political and character entrapment. not just the candidate's character, but your's oh reader.

Don't take my word for it. DUers, review the following fallacies and tell me they don't ALL apply to this thread. I've provided links to a basic site on logic, though I encourage you to delve more deeply into these. they will help defend you against an "opponent" who's trying to set you up for defeat rather than engage you in a responsible, conscientious way:

the first phases are not full-blown fallacies yet, but what logicians call "logical Boobytraps" aka "preemptive strikes" set up where the "debater" will only allow his previously-set-up negative conclusions to result from your answer:

1) the loaded gun/words: The fallacy is committed either when an arguer attempts to use loaded words in place of an argument, or when an arguee makes an evaluation based on the colorful language in which an argument is clothed, rather than on the merits of the argument itself.

remember how this got to you::: "we don't want the loaded gun to come in the form of a mushroom cloud"

beware the sirens, weary traveler. their song is enticing but will dash you against the jagged crags of bigotry and spite over the true harmony of the sound mind's eye.


2) Poisoning the Well: "To poison the well is to commit a preemptive ad hominem strike against an argumentative opponent. As with regular ad hominems, the well may be poisoned in either an abusive or circumstantial way..... Anyone bold enough to enter a debate which begins with a well-poisoning either steps into an insult, or an attack upon one's personal integrity. As with standard ad hominems, the debate is likely to cease to be about its nominal topic and become a debate about the arguer. However, what sets Poisoning the Well apart from the standard Ad Hominem is the fact that the poisoning is done before the opponent has a chance to make a case."

don't drink the waters young one-- your thirst will be quenched by taking the high road to the firmament of reason.

but beware, more traps await you:

...

but only now the tribulations do begin to beset you. square circles will distract the peer of sound reason unless you reflect on the true light of authentic understanding. watch out for forms drawn in words! first you must confront and defeat:


3) the straw man: "Imagine a fight in which one of the combatants sets up a man of straw, attacks it, then proclaims victory. All the while, the real opponent stands by untouched."

beware! images distract. only by looking beneath the sheen of bombast and hyperbole can you see the true form beneath the riddler's mask. if you fall prey and duel this phantom, behind you, in your blind spot, you will miss the true form standing tall and apart, not misrepresented as our trickster OP has tried to distract you,

continue on, and be vigilant, of clear and sound mind. you will need your concentration when the darts begin flying:


4) Texas Sharpshooter Fallacy: (so exquisite, we provide a full citation): "The Texas sharpshooter is a fabled marksman who fires his gun randomly at the side of a barn, then paints a bullseye around the spot where the most bullet holes cluster.... This fallacy occurs when someone jumps to the conclusion that a cluster in some data must be the result of a cause, usually one that it is clustered around. There are two reasons why this is fallacious: {a.} The cluster may well be the result of chance, in which case it was not caused by anything. {2.} Even if the cluster is not the result of chance, there are other possible reasons for the clustering, other than the cause chosen.... At best, the occurrence of a cluster in the data is the basis not for a causal conclusion, but for the formation of a causal hypothesis which needs to be tested. Patterns in data can be useful for forming hypotheses, but they are not themselves sufficient evidence of a causal connection. In short, correlation is not causation."

so, careful warrior, you must needs keep all your wits about to dodge the salvo of fire and brimstone screaming at you. equilibrize your mind to harmonize the actual tones of their screeching. To do this, you will need to use the power of recognition. Are these clusters one, or legion? Repeat to yourself: Are these clusters one or legion. Transform the interrogative into indication. Think. Reflect. Correlation, or.causation?

when you have solved this riddle continue on. Remember, my end is my beginning. you can exit this maze by reasoning your way through the loaded question(aire) of the loaded words you confronted as you first began this journey:


5) The Loaded Question: in the guise of a loaded questionaire: "A question with a false, disputed, or question-begging presupposition."

going further: "A 'loaded question', like a loaded gun, is a dangerous thing. A loaded question is a question with a false or questionable presupposition, and it is "loaded" with that presumption. The question "Have you stopped beating your wife?" presupposes that you have beaten your wife prior to its asking, as well as that you have a wife. If you are unmarried, or have never beaten your wife, then the question is loaded. Since this example is a yes/no question, there are only the following two direct answers: {1.} "Yes, I have stopped beating my wife", which entails "I was beating my wife." {2.} "No, I haven't stopped beating my wife", which entails "I am still beating my wife."

if you take the trickster's bait, and answer the above thread, you have but one reply to that first, ballistic question. Wright not simply has an influence on Obama, but is THE influence. Wright by extension = Obama. You have fallen into the trap. All of Wright's belief, through baiting and presupposition, have been grafted onto Obama. your mind begins to falter, and the drone of ignorance and bigotry set it.

Breathe. Relax. Remain steady. You can avoid the entire labyrinthe and the minotaur's within who would devour you alive by simply not entering. The true noble warrior thinks, reasons, considers, evaluates, and most acutely and essentially of all, judges in an objective, independent, and responsible, ethical way. When wavering remember these precepts of the hero's journey, and may they guide thee well
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #24
29. Besides Obama is entitled to the nomination and if he doesn't get it -its CHEATING & I WALK
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mythyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. very thoughtful articulate and civically and logically responbsible rebuttal
Edited on Sun Apr-20-08 03:54 PM by mythyc
= :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

also it's spelled <it's>, with an apostrophe. responsible thinkers usually check their simple grammar ;)
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
25. How disgusting of you to keep triying to tar two good men. n/t
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GoldieAZ49 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 10:18 PM
Response to Original message
26. All lies
he hasn't been honest about himself from the beginning, we just didn't know it until the end.

The media didn't do its job.

Had we seen who he is in January he would have been gone before Super Tuesday.

Now we get President McCain.
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Condem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. Hey, Goldie
Are you for Clinton?
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mudesi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
30. LOL! Rev. Wright again?
Get with the times.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. yeah Obama thought it was behind him--but it is NOT.
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 03:44 PM
Response to Original message
34. Other: Rob is a dingbat.
Edited on Sun Apr-20-08 03:49 PM by AtomicKitten
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 03:45 PM
Response to Original message
35. The importance of this question deserves a massive shrug.
Politicians lie. They've been doing it since the first caveman decided he wanted to be boss.
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jackson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 03:49 PM
Response to Original message
36. St. Obama has never lied
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