Clark says he wouldn't be Dean's Cheney

[RamboLiberal]

http://www.boston.com/dailynews/002/politics/Clark_says_he_wouldn_t_be_Dean:.shtml

Retired General Wesley Clark said Friday he would not be ''Howard Dean's Dick Cheney'' if front-runner Dean wins the Democratic Party's presidential nomination.

Clark said he's running for president, not vice president.

''I'm not going to be Howard Dean's Dick Cheney,'' Clark told reporters. ''We've already tried that model of government. That's what's misled America thus far.''

Clark said President Bush was a former governor, inexperienced in foreign policy who surrounded himself with experienced advisers, like Cheney.

''He tried to reassure the American people by having a lot of highly experienced and competent advisers around,'' said Clark. ''And we see the results right now in our presence in Iraq and the alienation of people around the world.''

[Clark4Prez]

1. However

In the black-is-white world of politics, you actually stand a better chance of getting the nomination if you state you don't want it.

Now I realize that this sounds odd, I mean if you walk into the HR department and say "I am not interested in working here." They would take you at your word, in politics if you do the same thing, they offer you the job and a raise.

It's why I love politics so, it's ever so entertaining.

[slinkerwink]

2. that's completely irresponsible of Clark to link Dean to Cheney

:puke:

[Renew Deal]

5. I don't think you get what he is saying.

He was not "linking" them. He was giving an example about experience.

[windansea]

10. Dean linked himself

saying Cheney was a model VP

[Woodstock]

78. Quote/link please where Dean praised Cheney as a model VP

Before you go throwing around insinuations like that, you'll have to show some proof. I've followed Dean closely & never heard any such thing.

Dean detests Cheney. And has done nothing but blast both Bush and Cheney for how they have run the country.

[LiberalBushFan]

82. here you go

I must admit the Dean camp has done a fabulous job of keeping this on the lo-down/down-lo. http://www.gaypasg.org/Press%20Clippings/July%202002/Is%20It%202004%20Yet.htm

[windansea]

84. so who started the Cheney linkage again??

Who would be your model as a vice president?

Dick Cheney. It sounds like an odd thing to say because I don't agree with almost anything he says, but he's incredibly competent. He knows how government works.

[Woodstock]

85. As I suspected, it's out of context

Maybe they kept it on the low down because it isn't how he feels.

"Dick Cheney. It sounds like an odd thing to say because I don't agree with almost anything he says, but he's incredibly competent. He knows how government works."

The first thing - "I don't agree with almost anything he says."

The second thing - "He knows how government works."

Yes, both of those things jive with what I think Dean believes.

As for picking Cheney for the answer and "He's incredibly competent" remark, a poor choice of words on Dean's part.

And again, you've never heard him repeat them, because they were a poor choice of words and don't reflect what he feels.

God, do you really want to play the game of pulling out all of Clark's poor choice of words again? Didn't you see them before - Clark's praise of the Bush Admin. and his previous votes for Republicans were paraded around here ad nausem. And didn't Clark just suggest himself that Cheney is "highly competent" by his remarks?

Here's a suggestion for us all - let's just accept what the candidates really feel, rather than splitting hairs over isolated comments that we KNOW they don't believe.

Clark is a good guy and a Democrat who dislikes Bush/Cheney. Dean is a good guy and a Democrat who dislikes Bush/Cheney. Why, oh why, must we pretend these two statements are not true?

[LiberalBushFan]

87. How is it out of context?

It's Dean entire answer to the interviewer's question. In fact the only context that could be added is the question itself... "Who would be your model VP?"
Answering "who would be your model VP" with those words certainly contrasts your "Dean detests Cheney. And has done nothing but blast both Bush and Cheney for how they have run the country."
If I said "Hitler would be my model leader, even though I disagree with almost everything he says," even without the "inredibly competent" part, wouldn't you detect that I don't disagree with him as much as I really should?

In short, tell me what context I should take note of.

[Woodstock]

92. How is it out of context when Clark praised the Bush Admin?

Do you REALLY want me to drag all those quotes up again?

Come on, they've all said things they'd rather not have said, things that don't reflect what they believe.

Yes, to say Dean thinks Cheney is a "model VP" is out of context.

But please, don't let me interfere with your deliberate misunderstanding of someone who might be the only thing between you and 4 more years of Bush.

[LiberalBushFan]

94. We're talking about the Dean quote

bringing up Clark doesn't negate anything in the Dean quote.
Like I said, what's the context that "model VP" is out of that negates its apparent implications? You can't just call everything you don't like "out of context." "Out of context," in itself, is not a sufficient argument unless you explain why the context negates the argument.

The Clark quote has already been discussed in 100000000000 threads.

[windansea]

91. yikes!!

"And again, you've never heard him repeat them, because they were a poor choice of words and don't reflect what he feels."

I keep waiting for Howard to say what he means

I could care less how he "feels"

[Woodstock]

93. What he believes

And you've made it quite clear you don't care what anyone but Clark really believes. OK, have fun, don't let me stop you.

I like Clark, Dean, Kerry, and Edwards. The rest are OK, too. Not too thrilled with Lieberman, but he's not as bad as he's been painted, either.

I've tried to show you that all these men are human beings, good Democrats, and would be far, far better than Bush.

I've even tried to point out that the guy you are trying to character assasinate (Howard Dean) might well be the only thing standing between you and 4 more years of Bush. What on earth will you do if he's the nominee? Won't you feel a tad odd to back someone you painted a devil only a couple of weeks before? Wouldn't a little moderation now be wise?

SURELY you realize Clark has mispoke quite a number of times? Do you really think it's constructive to get in a knock down dragout over Clark's quotes praising the Bush Administration vs. Dean's? OK, but what a collossal waste of time.

[windansea]

95. you asked for a link for our "insinuations"

we gave it to you...and explained how Clark's comment was a very appropriate little slap down based on Dean's own comments...

Dean says
Cheney is a model VP
I need to plug the hole in my resume

Clark says " I'm not going to be Dean's Cheney"

Get it??

this was in response not just to you..but to the many posters in this thread trying to spin Clark's quote as praise for Cheney

The real reason for the anger you see is the dirty tricks campaign by Trippi (approved by Dean) to marginalize Clark's bid for Prez by:

First...they violated Clark's trust in supposedly private meeting "discussing" the VP slot by spreading the Dean/Clark rumor

When Clark responded to this obvious ploy by saying Dean had "dangled" the VP slot in said meeting...Trippi basically called Clark a liar.

Trippi and his little Dean approved tricks at marginalizing Clark's bid are obvious and will be exposed and stomped on...

PS don't take this personally :)

[Kathleen04]

12. Not linking..

Dean to Cheney.

He's trying to say that Dick Cheney was chosen as Bush's VP to cover some of Bush's weaknesses.

He's trying to say that people can't count on him to add foreign policy experience to Dean's ticket. In other words, people who want Clark on the ticket somewhere are going to have to vote for Clark.

[TorchTheWitch]

17. how?

that's completely irresponsible of Clark to link Dean to Cheney

How is it irresponsible to point out a pattern that exists?

hmmm...

Bush - former governor with no foreign policy experience surrounds himself with experienced foreign policy advisors like the VP

Dean - former governor with no foreign policy experience wants to surround himself with experienced foreign policy advisors like with a VP

Yep, looks like a pattern to me.


But wait... Clark said he didn't want to be Dean's Cheney.

hmmmm... looks like Clark linked himself to Cheney (and good on him to refuse to be another Cheney).

[dogman]

33. Wasn't he linking governors?

That was my take. He has to beat two governors with no FP experience. This is the reason he's running in the first place. It's to save this country for our grand-children.

[mbali]

58. So lets recap . . .

Dean says, "I need to plug that hole in the resume, and I'm going to do that with a running mate. There are plenty of really good people with an enormous amount of foreign policy experience that can fit that criteria."

Naturally, Clark is asked whether he would be willing to serve as Deans running mate if asked and he says, "I'm not going to be Howard Dean's Dick Cheney. We've already tried that model of government. That's what's misled America thus far."

And Clark's the bad guy for invoking Cheney?

Excuse me, but Dean himself raised the specter of a governor inexperienced in foreign policy "plugging the gap" by selecting a running mate with foreign policy experience. One's mind need not take an enormous leap of logic to think of Bush and Cheney - in fact, any clear-thinking individual with even a shred of knowledge about political history would naturally make the comparison that Dean invited.

[retyred]

62. I guess dean

has to get his dick elsewhere!


retyred in fla
“Good-Night Paul, Wherever You Are”
So I read this book

[BootinUp]

109. You hurt me

with that one! LOL!

[lurk_no_more]

112. What a visual

LOL, very, very crass, I like it!


” JAFO”

[schultzee]

115. Yes. And Clark should want to serve his country as VP because

he has much to offer. He and the others are just fragmenting our party.

[windansea]

3. why fill a donut hole

when you win the whole enchilada

[YellowDawgDemocrat]

7. Sorta stating the obvious

I don't think Clark would accept the VP slot with Dean either...it won't be offered.

[windansea]

97. correct n/t

[dajabr]

4. What an odd comparison...

Would Clark be bringing his own PNAC type cabal like Cheney did? I think Clark is missing the point he's trying to make. Badly.

[Renew Deal]

8. His point makes sense

I think. He is saying that Bush didn't have the experience so he added Cheney. Dean doesn't have the experience, and Clark isn't going to just be VP to solidify a weak candidate.

[dajabr]

13. Cheney is a unique case...

He came with some "ahem" baggage...

Unless Clark is being hand-picked by the oil industry to "guide" Dean's FP, and open the door for another more radical FP Policy than the current one, I don't see how the comparison is valid.

[Renew Deal]

16. You are going to deep with it.

I don't think he is. It's also the adding of Colin Powell and whatever other big names.

[dajabr]

18. He should use a different example to make his point...

Especially since the, "whatever other big names" includes:

* Vice President Dick Cheney, one of the PNAC founders, who served as Secretary of Defense for Bush Sr.;

* I. Lewis Libby, Cheney's top national security assistant;

* Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, also a founding member, along with four of his chief aides including;

* Deputy Secretary of Defense Paul Wolfowitz, arguably the ideological father of the group;

* Eliot Abrams, prominent member of Bush's National Security Council, who was pardoned by Bush Sr. in the Iran/Contra scandal;

* John Bolton, who serves as Undersecretary for Arms Control and International Security in the Bush administration;

* Richard Perle, former Reagan administration official and present chairman of the powerful Defense Policy Board;

* Randy Scheunemann, President of the Committee for the Liberation of Iraq, who was Trent Lott's national security aide and who served as an advisor to Rumsfeld on Iraq in 2001;

* Bruce Jackson, Chairman of PNAC, a position he took after serving for years as vice president of weapons manufacturer Lockheed-Martin, and who also headed the Republican Party Platform subcommittee for National Security and Foreign Policy during the 2000 campaign. His section of the 2000 GOP Platform explicitly called for the removal of Saddam Hussein;

http://www.truthout.org/cgi-bin/artman/exec/view.cgi?archive=1&num=53

Does Clark think he is "like" any of these people? Does he understand that NONE of the candidates would allow this type of craven group access to the corridors of power in a Democratic Administration?

Does he understand what he said?

[Donna Zen]

26. Why are posters blaming Clark?

Dean said he wanted a vp like Cheney. Dean said that, you know it, now live with it.

Clark says: I will not be Dean's Cheney. Thank god!

Is Dean ever responsible for anything he says or does according to his campaign.

[dajabr]

28. No, I don't know it...

But, I'd be more than happy to respond if you'd be a sweetheart and provide a link to the comments by Dean you are referring to.

I'm sure they make perfect sense when not taken out of context.

[QC]

41. Your faith is very touching. n/t

[dajabr]

111. I'm glad I could touch you in some way...

Whatever the fuck that means?

Nice drive by post. Still no link though...

[IndianaGreen]

11. It is an odd comparison, not to mention that it also a shot at Clinton

Clinton was also inexperienced in foreign affairs, so he had to bring people like Warren Christopher and Les Aspin into the Administration.

I hope that Clark is not starting to listen to some of those "experts" that counseled some of the other Democratic candidates to support IWR because the war was expected to be over and done with in a few weeks and it wouldn't be an issue in 2004.

[Gloria]

20. Clinton was not wholly inexperienced in foreign affairs...he worked at the

side of J. William Fullbright, studied foreign affairs at Georgetown and spent more study time overseas and traveling. His travel in Russia was turned into a campaign attack by Bush I, who was caught in the act of trying to look into records....

[IndianaGreen]

23. Clinton spent more time chasing tail overseas than studying

Big Dog never finished his studies in England. He was a wild and crazy guy!

[Skwmom]

38. Clark doesn't need the counsel of experts

The man IS an expert.

[IndianaGreen]

64. That's a ludicrous statement, and it sounds like bad propaganda

If Wes Clark, or any candidate or executive of any kind, were to go about saying that they don't need anyone's counsel because they alone possess expertise in a given topic, then I will show you a person that is self-deluded and that is about to fail big time.

Let's not start using ludicrous statements to defend Clark as some of Kerry's supporters have used to defend their candidate.

Washington is full to the gills with political "handlers" that sell their wares to all sort of candidates. Unfortunately they all suffer from the same disease, their world view is shaped by the prism of Washington politics. Look at how much more Al Gore's message resonated when he was freed from his Campaign 2000 "handlers" and began to speak from his heart against the abuses of the Bush regime and the rush to war.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

73. Clinton didn't "need" them except at the very beginning of his term

He has an exceptionally high IQ, was a Rhodes Scholar, and was a "wonk."

[Woodstock]

79. My point exactly - a bad move on Clark's part

I'd not even get close to the Cheney comparisons. It's too insulting to fellow Democrats, and too insulting to himself.

[floridaguy]

6. Wes Clark should be President - not VP

America is truly honored to have a man of this caliber offer to serve as President of the United States.

If we don't elect him, it will be our loss.

[IndianaGreen]

15. Clark is running for Prez; true, but...

while I think all candidates should ignore the media whenever they pester candidates with stupid questions such as "would you serve as VP on so-and-so's ticket," it is also unwise to be issuing Shermanesque statements this early on.

[robbedvoter]

32. Why should he be VP on a losing ticket?

He is in it to win, not to reassure you guys about your candidate's holes in his resume.

[IndianaGreen]

66. The voters are being played for suckers by the media

Remember when Ted Koppel asked Kucinich why he wouldn't end his "vanity" campaign so that the media could concentrate on the media-determined "horse-race"? Remember how the networks pulled their embeds from Dennis, Carol, and Al's campaigns?

We now have the same media peppering candidates with "will you be a VP on so-and-so's ticket" questions. Why do you think that is the case?

The voters are being played for suckers by the media. The media is telling us who the leading candidates are, based on polls that are largely based on the exposure candidates get in the media, and now they are telling us what the Democratic ticket ought to be.

Screw the media!

This is our primary process, not theirs!

What are we going to do when the media starts telling the Democratic nominee how to campaign against Bush?

Remember how the media badgered Gore for being "too mean" on Bush in 2000?

[Skwmom]

39. I dont' think we can just blame the media

for this one. Dean has been using this since day one, trying to derail Clark's candidacy.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

74. Bingo!!!

Classic "dirty trick."

[Renew Deal]

9. This is a nasty little slap at Dean and Bush.

Says they are both weak and unlearned.

[BeyondGeography]

14. He basically called Howard Bush Lite

without calling him Bush Lite. Subtlety, get it?

[xultar]

19. Clark is right, it doesn't work with a Vice President who has more

foregin policy experience than the President.

The President makes the last call, the buck stops with the President. If the President makes the call he should be the lead on the decision. Think about it. Condi Rice is running foreign policy? What is her experience? Dick, he is running some shadow government. Poor DA GWB is out there embarrasing himself in front of the whole world.

Clark is right. He's running for President and will not be a VeeP. I respect that.

I'm sure he's getting pressure to stand down and wait for a VeeP pick from Dean. I'm sure people are pressuring him very hard. They are telling him that he can't win. Dean has won the nomination.

Clark is doing the right thing.

[oasis]

21. Clark clearly doesn't see the wisdom of being first mate on the Titanic.

Take a hike doctor.

[MR. ELECTABLE]

22. I don't think the problem was the model of government

I think it was the fact that the model was filled with neoconservative sociopaths who don't care one way or another about any of the other countries on this planet, except perhaps Israel. But I suppose this point is lost of Clark who seems to have no real qualms with a lot of them.

Really I think Clark's strengths would be best suited for Secretary of Defense if anything, assuming he doesn't win the nomination. He really wouldn't be effective as the president of the US Senate, haveing never served there.

[KaraokeKarlton]

24. That's fine by me, I want Graham to be Dean's VP

Besides, a lot of the Greens that support Dean really dislike Clark and I think having him as the VP pick would actually hurt Dean's broad appeal.

[formernaderite]

116. agreed, alot of Greens dislike Clark

I'm a Dean supporter because he is a true democrat, not someone who was passed over by Rove and decided to get back at his party by jumping ship. I would really be upset with a Dean/Clark ticket. Frankly, I'd love to see Dean pick a woman as VP..but not a DLC type like Hillary.

[JI7]

25. do you think Clark is offended ?

do you think clark is offended at being seen or asked about vp rather than being treated as a presidential candidate ? i think this statement shows for sure he will NOT be vp for dean. but you never know.

[windansea]

27. I think Clark was pissed

when Trippi leaked the supposedly private meeting discussing it

this little slap is payback

[robbedvoter]

31. Let's recap what was said, shall we?

Dr. Dean all but called Gen. Wesley K. Clark dishonest, responding to his contention that Dr. Dean had offered him the No. 2 slot if he became the nominee, by saying, "I can tell you flat out I did not ask him to be my running mate."
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/25/politics/campaigns/25DEAN.html

****

[wtmusic]

29. So that means no Dean/Clark? Woulda been nice...

but so be it, you arrogant SOB.

[robbedvoter]

30. It's finally sinking in! Slowly, but it does.

The holes in the resumee will be plugged differently. Don't be so sad, Nader is available I hear.

[wtmusic]

34. Oh well...

better Nader than Cheney! ;-)

[IndianaGreen]

69. No need to get snippy!

Telling another Democratic voter to go to Nader just because you don't agree with their choice of candidate is rather offensive and childish. This is beneath you!

Don't say something today that you might regret in the Fall. I remind you of what happened after Al From and Joe Lieberman insulted the Democratic base with their vicious assault on liberalism and the antiwar movement.

[polpilot]

102. Either Clark, the newbie, is being given very bad advice leading to a

crushing defeat against Bush OR Clark/Clinton is in the mill.

Dean '04...

[LiberalBushFan]

35. why doesn't Dean just choose his "model VP"?

wouldn't that be sumthin, two presidential candidates running against each other with the same prospective VP?

[Woodstock]

81. see my post from above on the "model VP" remark

[burning bush]

36. Highly Competent? HIGHLY COMPETENT???

Did Clark mean to say "Highly Criminal"?

The entire mess we face in foreign affairs is not due to an incompetent President who relied on "Competent" advisors, it is due to an incompetent President who relied on advisors that were prone to offer fraudulent information, who were dedicated to a neoconservative mission that pitted the United States against world opinion, and who dreamed and plotted of building a new American Empire over the ashes of our cherished Republic.

It AMAZES me that Clark, at this point in time, STILL considers the Bush Gang "highly competent."

Thats reason enough for me to question Clark's judgement.

Would Clark surround himself with such a staff? Seems like he might.

[dogman]

37. Highly experienced and competent

Once again out of context. This is how Bush was selling his shortcomings, just like Dean will fill his self-admitted hole.

[burning bush]

42. OK..."Highly Experienced and Competent"

A slight misquote, but not at ALL out of context.

Clark is quoted as saying ...wel...you read it!

"He tried to reassure the American people by having a lot of highly experienced and competent advisers around," said Clark..

Obviously, Clark sees Bush's advisors as highly experienced and competent.

I was willing to ignore this when Clark was fundraising some time ago, but here he goes again, saying, essentially, the same thing he said about these doofs the first time.

I avoided criticizing Clark for that earlier remark. Now, however, I believe I should not have let it slip.

This is a great mark against Clarks claim of superior forein policy ability. Clark seems content with the same old PNAC neocon gang of thugs.

Who IS Wes Clark???

[QC]

44. {....yawn....}

I wish I could at least give you credit for trying, but this is as lame as the day is long.

Can you remember, back during the campaign, how the standard response to the "Bush is a lightweight" reservation was that the party was full of experts and that Bush would have them all around him giving advice? As Julius Caesar Watts said when introducing Bush, you don't have to be smart to be the president.

Do you happen to recall any of that? It was an important element of the Bush campaign--the implicit admission that well, OK, he's a dope and all, but he'll have a lot of smart people advising him.

I think we know how well that has worked.

[burning bush]

47. Yawn wide enough, we may get that foot out!

I love it when people condescend. Its so satisfying, because most people just don't have the polish to pull it off, and there is nothing quite so phony as a failed attempt at looking down ones nose.

If this were an isolated incident, I would never have brought it forward, but it isn't isolated.

In a speech he gave at a gop fundraiser on May 11, 2001, Clark is quoted as saying "...(I)f you look around the world, there's a lot of work to be done. And I'm very glad we've got the great team in office: men like Colin Powell, Don Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney, Condoleezza Rice, Paul O'Neill -- people I know very well -- our president, George W. Bush. We need them there..."

But Clark claims he come down a long road since then.

Unfortunately for him, the road hasn't been long enough, because he still seems to hold these PNACers in high regard.

Can YOU think of ANY situation, where you would praise the Bush Gang, even in passing? I can't

Just thinking about what they're doing to our country makes my skin itch. The fact that Clark was ok with them, and still is, is creepy as well

[QC]

60. It's hard not to be condescending

with those who obsessively post the same lame attacks over and over and over and over as though they're something new.

As I said before, and someone else also pointed out, the Bush campaign's spin was that Bush would be surrounded by competent and experienced advisors, so his own boundless ignorance didn't matter.

[burning bush]

88. Yeah yeah yeah, whatever

You keep saying this is the same old attack, but it's not.

The same old attack would be in response to Clark's ealier praise of the Bush Gang.

Now, however, Clark is repeating his Republican preferences. If either were isolated, then there wouldn't be much to it. Put them both together, and Clark is clarly building a track record, making references to how highly he respects the Bush possee.

Spin it away, call it lame, pretend it's been resolved, do whatever you want, but the fact remains that Clark has respect for these FASCISTS, and that is scary shit.

[dogman]

45. He not I

He's telling you Bushs spin not Clark. With the level of experience and competence let run amuck because of inexperienced leadership. He dealt with these people during GW1. He was able to observe from the outside as an analyst and came to the proper conclusions about the war and told those of us who were watching him. That is when the WH pressured CNN to muzzle him. He is a proven leader who believes in America run with Democratic principles but prepared to defend itself. That is what American people will vote for.

[bowens43]

57. Wow. He IS still praising the bushies.

I missed that , thanks for pointing it out. How could anyone want this guy on the ticket?

[KaraokeKarlton]

40. Well that's good because we sure don't need another Cheney

One is quite enough. Personally, upon reading this a second time I have to wonder why the hell Clark would compare himself to Cheney. It sort of implies that he is saying that he's similar to Cheney, and that's not something I'd really advocate him doing. :shrug:

[QC]

43. He's comparing Cheney's role to the one some want him to play,

plugging the big, gaping hole in someone else's resume.

[KaraokeKarlton]

70. That's not what it sounds like

And besides, Dean doesn't have a "big gaping hole" in his resume. Dean does have some foreign policy experience. Anyone can get foreign policy right if they have good listening skills, common sense, a sense of fairness for your fellow man and the willingness to put forth the effort. Dean has all those qualities. In fact, I wouldn't want anyone without those qualities handling foreign policy because we've all seen what happens when we have someone who doesn't. Dean has been to over 50 countries, all over the middle east, lived abroad for a year to attend school, has dealt with the Canadian government, Vietnam's government and when he led the National Governor's association he was very involved with the forming of policy opinions on every subject.

[Hoppin_Mad]

46. Am unnecessary cheap shot -eom-

[dogman]

48. Like saying there was no VP discussion.

[w4rma]

49. Is he ruling out Defense Secretary also? Every position under Dean? (n/t)

[mouse7]

51. Clark may not be legally allowed to be SecDef

There's a law that requires a SecDef or other high civilian Pentagon appointee that they must be out of the service for a certain number of years. It's to ensure that civilians continue to control the military.

[JI7]

61. can you give a link to that ?

i'm pretty sure clark can be defense sec just as he can be president who is the commander in cheif (leader of the armed forces)since he is a civilian now who is a veteran and not active military.

[mouse7]

96. US Code Title 10 Subtitle A Pt.1 Ch2 A Sec 113 (SecDef 10 years civilian)

Sec. 113. - Secretary of Defense


(a) There is a Secretary of Defense, who is the head of the Department of Defense, appointed from civilian life by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate. A person may not be appointed as Secretary of Defense within 10 years after relief from active duty as a commissioned officer of a regular component of an armed force.




http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/10/113.html

[mouse7]

50. More evidence that Clark may not be a team player

I would really like to hear more from this whole roster of candidates that they would do whatever was necesary to defeat Dumbya.

They don't have to say they want to be VPs. They just have to say they will do whatever is necessary to throw the neo-cons out of DC.

[moz4prez]

53. Clark isn't a poster on a message board

So he can't hide behind a cloak of anonymity. So, you see, he can't go aroound spouting platitudes about "kicking the neo-cons out of DC" . . . however he has revealed some damning information about Bush foreign policy . . . the seven states in five years plan, the phone call from a Canadian thinktank after 9/11 urging him to draw a valid connexion between the attacks on the twin towers and Saddam Hussein, and WH requests that he be canned.

[mouse7]

54. He can say "Do whatever it takes to defeat neo-conservatives"

We all know there are ways you have to formally phrase things in the spotlight, yet relate the same message. He should do that.

[moz4prez]

55. LINK?????

:crazy:

[retyred]

67. not being a team player?

From a dean supporter? Isn't this exactly what deans attraction is to his supporters?

If your looking for a team player your supporting the wrong guy.


retyred in fla
“Good-Night Paul, Wherever You Are”
So I read this book

[arewethereyet]

98. you have this very wrong

Dean is supposed to be an "outsider" as in outside of the mundane political world. I believe he does like to think of he and his supporters as a team.

The original point is that General Clark is thought of in military circles as not being a team player.

[drfemoe]

52. This is a dupe

so I will share again ..

Smells like a ploy
from the Cark camp to try to solidify his claim that he is in second place! He is now saying on his site that it is him or Dean. I don't think Gov Dean would have Clark on the ticket. I would lose a lot of respect for the good Gov if that happens.

Clark is just showing how ignorant he is about the process and 'meetings'. I'm surprised his handlers let him keep talking about this. Unless it's part of their ploy, they need to put a big red CLASSIFIED stamp on this nonsense.

[bowens43]

56. Good.

This coming from a man with absolutely NO experience. Talk about ridiculous. I'm glad he isn't considering the VP spot because I would difficult to vote for any ticket with Clark on it.

[HFishbine]

59. I guess it will be Edwards

Anybody have a link to the "prediction" thread?

[arewethereyet]

63. Edwards has already indicated he's not interested

funny how noone is interested in joining the Dean Team.

[HFishbine]

72. Watch

and learn.

[arewethereyet]

99. Edwards will not associate himself with a potential loser

there is no value in it. Look at the crap Lieberman took for "dragging Al Gore down".

If he thought that Dr Dean was a lead pipe cinch then maybe, but thats anything but the case at this juncture.

I'm watching and I agree with Edwards' position.

[HFishbine]

100. I Edwards would only climb aboard a "lead pipe cinch" ticket

That's a poor refelction on him indeed.

[arewethereyet]

101. if you say, but its the same with General Clark

or anyone else with ambition. Its the same reason Al Gore didn't run this time.

There is no longer any nobility in fighting the good fight, just winners and losers.

I happen to think its smart of him.

[newsguyatl]

65. hallelujah

music to my ears!!!

but i got news for ya mr. clark, i don't think you'd have to worry about that anyway, dean's NOT interested...

you will be invisible once again in just a couple of months, like you were before...

[retyred]

71. I'm sorry

It must have hurt alot, it's OK honest, look at it this way: chances are good that dean won't even have to worry his little head about who will plug that big hole he says he has, so being made lite of won't matter. Better now? /sarcasm


retyred in fla
“Good-Night Paul, Wherever You Are”
So I read this book

[Bucky]

68. But they're still friends, right?

I think my boy is starting to feel the pressure of the campaign. I think this comment was ill-advised. Or more likely not advised at all. Dean really did jerk him around at first and tactically Clark need to shoo away this kind of talk. But I think he used strategic bombing where evasive maneuvers were called for. Oh well. It's no biggie.

[drfemoe]

89. Sounds habitual ..

But I think he used strategic bombing where evasive maneuvers were called for.

I remember a train, a bridge, a hospital .. now his presidential campaign ... ah well

[glitch]

75. I would hope not - why would anyone want to be Cheney? nt

[Armstead]

76. Who would fill Clark's inexperience in domestic governance?

Clark criticiing Dean for wanting experts -- including an expert VP -- to provide foreign-policy depth to his administration is ridiculous.

First it sounds egotistical to say that a president or presidential candidate should rely on a team of experienced advisors. And Clark is going to have to find his own experts to fill out his own lack of experience in elected civilian governance, especially on domestic affairs. An "I can do it all" approach is too much like a dictatorship.

Secondly, it's not the fact of seeking to add epertise through others that i8s the problem. The real issue is WHO those experts are and what they believe in. Bush has been a disaster because he is listening to the wrong people -- not that he's listening to people.

[Woodstock]

77. Cheney was experienced in foreign policy?

You could have fooled me. Bilking money of people throughout the world through Halliburton doesn't equal foreign policy.

And does Clark really want to equate himself with Cheney? This was an ill-advised strategy. So he's saying Cheney should be pres? Or that Cheney = Clark in terms of competency? Both are a mistake. Cheney should not be pres & Clark should paint himself as better than Cheney in foreign policy.

Throwing mud around, one is bound to get some on oneself. Too bad the Dem candidates never seem to learn.

[MarkTwain]

80. I LOVE it....

... anything which brings out the Dean group with such ferocity obviously indicates that there is more than just a kernel of truth to the statement. Which there is, of course.

Support for Dean is, as I have always felt it to be, a mile deep but only a block or two wide.

Good going, General.

[Woodstock]

83. Could it be that it just jars with what we know about him?

Your logic is false.

If I were to post something Dean said about Clark, and you knew it was against what Clark stood for, and you posted as much, would that mean - by your logic - that you were lying?

For your humble information, I like both Dean and Clark (and Kerry and Edwards for that matter) and I'm posting here just because it doesn't sound like something Dean would say/do. That's all. No hidden motive. Also, I thought it was a disservice to Clark to compare himself to Cheney.

Kid stuff as usually in the primary forum. Where did Will Pitt's post go from yesterday, I wish that would be put up as a sticky on this forum.

[windansea]

90. kid stuff...LOL

Clark's comment was a very appropriate little slap down based on Dean's own comments...

Dean says
Cheney is a model VP
I need to plug the hole in my resume

Clark says " I'm not going to be Dean's Cheney"

PERFECT...

[lurk_no_more]

113. You can always judge how much truth

a comment has by the amount of DEANial it gets around here.

BTW: I like your DU handle, I loved "Letters From The Earth" and "The War Prayer"


” JAFO”

[Woodstock]

86. Dean accuses Cheney of war profiteering, from DFA on 11/11/03:

"According to a recent study by the Center for Public Integrity, more than 70 American companies and individuals have won up to $8 billion in contracts for work in postwar Iraq and Afghanistan over the last two years. Those companies donated more money to the presidential campaigns of George W. Bush--a little over $500,000--than to any other politician over the last dozen years.

"Kellogg, Brown & Root, the subsidiary of Halliburton--which Vice President Dick Cheney led prior to being chosen as Bush's running mate in August 2000--was the top recipient of federal contracts for the two countries, with more than $2.3 billion awarded to the company.

"We need to know how this money is being spent. We need to ask these questions for our veterans and more importantly for our troops in Iraq. Every penny wasted means only one thing: our troops will be there longer. Asking these questions is how we will most honor veterans."

[CWebster]

103. In other words...he is associating Dean with Bush

Wow, that is really dirty. It ain't like Dean was singing chimp's praises for his decisive action in Iraq---according to the General.

That clinches it for me. Clark just lost the remote chance.

[lurk_no_more]

114. Darn the luck....and to think...... you were almost there

That clinches it for me. Clark just lost the remote chance.

LOL....Me too....except with dean.


” JAFO”

[eileen_d]

104. People - it is not in Clark's interest to say otherwise!

I can't believe that people are calling Clark out for this. Why in the hell would ANY sane human being who is running for PRESIDENT make any statement about accepting a hypothetical VP position. It would be a stupid move on ANY candidate's part. Clark isn't stupid enough to fall into this trap.

Of course, Dean is so brilliant he talks to the press about "gaps" he needs to fill in his resume -- in obscure, unimportant areas such as national security, defense and foreign affairs. :eyes: Either Dean went into straigh-talk-overdrive with that gaffe, or he is begging Clark to accept a VP post before a single vote is counted. Ain't gonna happen on that timeline, doc.

Clark is running for PRESIDENT. If he stops running for president, then and only then will he consider a position in someone else's administration. Them's the facts.

[CWebster]

105. As opposed to Clark -

who has ZERO experience holding political office and wasn't even a Democrat until seconds ago in the scheme of things.

The speculation is generated by the media who sees Dean in the lead and sets up scenarios of possible combinations---similar to bets made about what Hillary is really up to. This crack from Clark was really uncalled for.

[Frederic Bastiat]

107. Well Dean has ZERO foreign policy experience

in a post-9/11 world! Good Luck!

[CWebster]

108. ...a post 911 world..

The line the Right uses as an excuse to impose their increasingly fascist agenda with military ambition and totalitarian domestic policy---so the loyal opposition should just jump on board? No thanks, I do not define foreign policy as a bombastic display of military muscle and representitives of the MIC as the ideal face to show to the world ESPECIALLY in a post 911 one.

[Frederic Bastiat]

106. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[ibegurpard]

110. The question is:

Who would be Clark's Cheney? It's not like he has a wealth of governing experience to bring to the table.

[9119495]

117. Who the hell said Dean was looking for a "Cheney?"

Dean probably wants an honest, committed public servant, with good ideas and plans for the future of America. He wants someone that will fight to preserve the democracy. Clark could be that guy--but not a Cheney.

[Clark Can WIN]

119. Deans model VP is Cheney, his own words

http://www.gaypasg.org/Press%20Clippings/July%202002/Is%20It%202004%20Yet.htm

Who would be your model as a vice president?

Dick Cheney. It sounds like an odd thing to say because I don't agree with almost anything he says, but he's incredibly competent. He knows how government works.

[Clark4VotingRights]

118. In other words.

Dean can't depend on Clark to "plug the hole" in his resume
and actually run his foreign policy.

[jpgpenn]

120. He's a wise man that Clark

:bounce:

[OKNancy]

121. On Meet the Press this morning

the statement by Clark should put an end to all this. He said he would not accept a VP "nomination"....from anyone.