Hillary is unelectable. Americans won't vote for an unlikable candidate.

[Frank Booth]

This is the subject that Clinton supporters always ignore. Everyone knows that if Hillary somehow got the nomination, she'd mobilize huge blocks of voters who still hate the Clintons from the '90s.

But what's worse is that many people who actually liked Bill Clinton as president can't stand Hillary. It's not because she's a woman (well, at least for most voters it's not). It's because she seems like a phony, angry, self-entitled jerk who will do and say anything to win the presidency, not because she cares so much about the country, but because she feels the presidency's owed to her, goddamnit.

Surprisingly, voters don't react well to this type of toxic personality. It's why she can't break 50% support among Democrats, even when she was the presumed candidate and has had all the institutional support behind her.

When is the last time we had a president with an unlikable personality? Probably Richard Nixon, and I'd bet that he's only one of very few. I know people here find Dubya detestable, but he pulls off that homespun, reformed drinker, family and church man, class clown thing really well. And to most people, John McCain is much more likable than Hillary.

Sure some people won't vote for Obama because he's black. This is America. What else would you expect? But I'd wager that the number of people who won't vote for Hillary simply because they just don't like her is much higher.

[liberaldem4ever]

1. Great post-I agree 100%

:kick:

[SeaLyons]

2. PA liked her!!!

The country hates the thought of 4 more years of Bush more than they dislike Hillary.

"She's likable enought".

Don't worry.

Hillary for President!!

[Frank Booth]

7. People who voted for her in Pennsylvania liked her.

But those people alone won't win her the state in the general election. Sure, a lot of people who voted for Obama would vote for Hillary in the GE. But a lot of them will not. And she's not getting any cross-over votes, and will get slaughtered by McCain in independents.

If she gets the nomination, the general election is going to be a debacle of Walter Mondale proportions.

[SeaLyons]

10. Nope, quite the opposite...

Hillary will kick McCain in the GE. Obama is one with the problem.

[Frank Booth]

12. Thanks for the stunning analysis to back up your argument.

Wishing it was true isn't going to make it happen.

Frankly, I'm worried that either candidate will lose to McCain. But I think Hillary would be a disaster.

Hillary's problem is that half the country can't stand her going in. And unlike Obama, who seems to benefit from increased exposure, the more people see of Hillary, the more they dislike her.

[SeaLyons]

21. ...

your analysis is not exactly in the stunning category.

She won PA. She will continue on that path, and she will win the White House. You can bookmark it!!

[RaleighNCDUer]

29. A heckuva win - dropping from a 25 point lead to a 9 point win.

THAT will do her well in the GE.

:sarcasm:

[SeaLyons]

30. Yup, it sure will...

A win is a win.

Go Hillary!!

[Terran]

16. 60% of the country

finds her untrustworthy. You think that's likely to help her win the GE?

[TahitiNut]

18. Everywhere in PA where Hillary led Obama will be voting McCain in November.

At this point, Hillary's campaign will be getting more contributions from Republicans than Democrats and Independents. She's a stalking horse for the GOP.

[SeaLyons]

23. Total crap....

I don't think PA wants 4 more years of Bush's war.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Frank Booth]

27. Yeah, but unfortunately people don't vote their interests.

This is a common problem our party has. We nominate people just because they're smart or qualified, when the country doesn't really care about these things.

The general election is in many ways a popularity contest. And Hillary's not winning any popularity contest.

[dkf]

28. No, they just want nuclear annihilation of Iran.

[TahitiNut]

33. The only "crap" ...

... is between your ears, sweetie. :shrug: Do your homework.

:hi:

[NaturalHigh]

3. "But what's worse is that many people who actually liked Bill Clinton as president ...

can't stand Hillary."

Count me in for that one. Unfortunately, Obama doesn't do much to inspire me either.

[janet118]

4. Nominating Clinton would be a sign . . .

that the Democratic Party has a death wish.

[democrattotheend]

5. You may be right. Who knows?

I think that in theory, getting a black man elected is harder than getting a white woman elected. But getting this black man elected might be easier than getting this white woman elected, because I think Obama is a lot more likeable and too many people just can't stand Hillary. It's not fair, and a lot of the animousity toward her is misguided, but it's there, and people I have talked to seem unlikely to change their minds.

It's hard to say who is more electable. I talk to people who say they are Democrats but might vote McCain if Obama is the nominee, and I meet independents and Republicans who say they'd never vote for Hillary but would consider voting for Obama. He seems to have more crossover appeal, but she seems to have a better hold on self-identified Democrats. It's likely that many of the people who would consider Obama over McCain might break for McCain in the end, but it's also likely that at least some of the Democrats who would consider defecting to McCain against Obama will fall in line once the issue differences between Obama and McCain get more attention.

So it's really hard to say who is more electable, and I think it is all going to depend on what mood the voters are in. If people dare to hope and are smart enough to move beyond the politics of fear and vote for the candidate who appeals to their dreams and presents an appealing vision, Obama is the candidate. If people are going to fall for the fear-mongering yet again, McCain will probably win, but maybe Clinton would have a better chance in that scenario, since she is more of a known quantity.

[Stop Cornyn]

6. Hillary assumes that she can raise her favorability ratings by 2012.

[redqueen]

8. ... and untrustworthy.

[HereSince1628]

9. Seems to me she wouldn't have made it this far without some people voting for her

[Frank Booth]

14. You're right. Some people will vote for her.

Somewhere around 25% of the voters in the country like Hillary. That's enough for her to do reasonably well in the Democratic primaries, but it's not even close to enough for the general election.

[HereSince1628]

25. IMO some people who don't like Sen Clinton vote for her anyway

And I think that there is evidence for that in 64+ year old women.

The numbers vary by poll but they're consideration of Clinton's honesty and negative campaigning is about the same as it is for everyone else.

Nonetheless they also break about 60% for Clinton. That requires some explaining that will be speculated on for a while by political historians.

[SoFlaJet]

11. What simply amazes me

is the fact that every single republican on TV wants Hillary Clinton. Why is that, could it be that they all woke up one day a couple of months ago and said, "hey we did do pretty well under the Clinton administration"? Or could it possibly be that they think she's the easiest one to beat?

[indimuse]

13. They JUST DID!

hahhaa... NICE TRY!

[Frank Booth]

17. Right. About half the Democratic voters in Pennsylvania did.

Will that be enough to win her the state in November?

Hillary has a strong base of dedicated supporters, who represent maybe 20% of the total voters in this country. She's going to have to fight for every vote beyond that. She'll get a lot of Obama voters, but she'll also lose a lot. She's not getting any Republican voters, and she'll get very few independents.

Basically, she's a general election disaster waiting to happen.

[WA98070]

15. This Progressive will not cast a vote for Hillary Clinton.

[leftstreet]

19. This progressive won't vote for McCain OR Hillary

:hi:

Hey, 98290 here!

[Frank Booth]

20. Just like a lot of progressives won't.

And if she can't even get progressive support, how's she going to win?

Do people honestly expect the independents and cross-over votes to save her?

[RaleighNCDUer]

31. Fortunately, you won't have to. nt

[Indenturedebtor]

22. Yes the country hates her

Aside from as you ay about 25% of voters people don't trust her, and her personality is about as endearing as a fart in a VW Bug.

I disliked her from the beginning of the primary, now I hate her. She cares more for herself than her policies, her party, or the American people. Slimeball.

I'd still vote for her slimy detestable self though because she would be hard pressed to veto any progressive legislation that made it through Congress, as she still has a D after her name.

[nichomachus]

24. If Hillary was really electable, this would have been over on Super Tuesday

[Growler]

32. I totally agree