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Listening to Reverend Wright this morning, I think he was a breath of fresh air

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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 09:30 AM
Original message
Listening to Reverend Wright this morning, I think he was a breath of fresh air
I didn't hear his speech last night, the one on the Bill Moyers show, but after listening to his speech this morning in its entirety, I came away with the impression that it's a shame that Obama was kind of "forced" into "distancing" himself from his pastor for the reasons Reverend Wright stated (political electability purposes). Personally, I wouldn't have a problem if Obama re-attached himself to Reverend Wright and even went back to his church, and I say this as a Hillary supporter.

How REFRESHING to hear such a high-profile figure as Jeremiah Wright go after the REAL hypocritical fucks of this country as he did when he PASTED both Cheney (6 deferments) and Bush (going to war over a lie)....and to see this man NOT back down from what is right.

Reverend Wright didn't back down from his beliefs in a self-serving manner like almost all our politicians do when confronted with adversity. Ya know, in a way Reverend Wright reminds me of one of the few politicians in this country who has the guts to say it like it REALLY is, Dennis Kucinich. If more of our own high profile Democrats had the guts that Rev Wright and Kucinich do, we'd never lose another election and the world would be a far better place.

Oh, and what a character this Reverend Wright is. He had me laughing more than once with his mannerisms up there on stage, how he mocked the hypocrites in the media and in our Government, and how he carried himself in general. I'd have a beer with him any day of the week!
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Iwasthere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
1. Me too
Funny guy. But also a GREAT paster!
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Wind Dancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
2. He is an amazing man.
Edited on Mon Apr-28-08 10:30 AM by FrustratedDemInNC
I'm sick of the "so-called liberals" trashing this fine person for telling the truth. It's about time somebody started a public discussion about the racism that still exists in this country. He's been ruthlessly attacked by the media and MOST people so why shouldn't he defend himself?





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Gus Gusterson Donating Member (9 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #2
35. Friendly Fire
My problem with Wright is not in what he has to say but in his presentation. How the hell can such a smart guy be so clueless about public perception? I plan on voting for Obama but Wright is destroying him. Like the offensively cocky George W. Bush when his approval ratings climb into the 40's, Wright came across as dismissive, arrogant and ultimately indifferent about how his demeanor might affect Obama. I liked and applauded the Moyers interview and his speech last night,but todays appearance at the press club has filled both the Clinton and GOP arsenal. Barack Obama may have suffered a lethal round of friendly fire today. What a shame.
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book_worm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
3. He didn't leave Rev. Wright's church. Rev. Wright retired. Obama is still a member.
I'm glad to see you have a positive impression. I wonder if Hillary will still say that if she were a member of Wright's church she would have left.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #3
26. Whatever, but the entire fiasco is a shame
I'm glad to see you have a positive impression. I wonder if Hillary will still say that if she were a member of Wright's church she would have left.


IMO, neither candidate handled the Wright fiasco in anything other than a politically motivated manner, geared toward doing what's best to getting either of them elected. Both are pretty self-serving, but what else is new.
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busymom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 09:50 AM
Response to Original message
4. a breath of fresh air?
The man is off his rocker. He is crazy and...an attention whore. Someone needs to keep him locked up until Obama is elected in November!
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Wind Dancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 09:52 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. The more things change............
:crazy:
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Do YOU believe that HIV was created by the US Gov. to kill blacks?
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GarbagemanLB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Wow, so one statement is enough to call him crazy and dismiss his entire career?
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. Do YOU believe it?
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Bensthename Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #8
36. What was Wright's response to that question?
I heard the question asked. I was curious what his answer would be, but my wife called at the same time and did not get to hear his response..
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busymom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:06 AM
Original message
uh...no
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
10. I didn't think you did, busymom.

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Wind Dancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. Is that the only thing you heard?
Ever heard of the "Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment?"

"For forty years between 1932 and 1972, the U.S. Public Health Service (PHS) conducted an experiment on 399 black men in the late stages of syphilis. These men, for the most part illiterate sharecroppers from one of the poorest counties in Alabama, were never told what disease they were suffering from or of its seriousness. Informed that they were being treated for “bad blood,” their doctors had no intention of curing them of syphilis at all.

The data for the experiment was to be collected from autopsies of the men, and they were thus deliberately left to degenerate under the ravages of tertiary syphilis—which can include tumors, heart disease, paralysis, blindness, insanity, and death. “As I see it,” one of the doctors involved explained, “we have no further interest in these patients until they die.”"
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. That is all the "voters" will hear.... that is the point.
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Wind Dancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #14
19. Well..............
I blame that on media sound bites and will continue to defend Reverend Wright.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #19
25. Blame you you want...doesn't matter.
Edited on Mon Apr-28-08 10:20 AM by MNDemNY
The drip-drip-drip will continue. It does not matter what you or I think, WE are not typical voters. It's all about the masses in a GE. You can't just blame, or wish it away.And "defending" the reverend is NOT a good tack to take.
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Wind Dancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #25
31. I defend the truth! n/t
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:26 AM
Response to Reply #31
32. Good for you, but it doesn't help Obama.
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busymom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #14
20. exactly.....
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Doityourself Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #12
21. There's plenty more out there ..Tuskegee is just the tip of the iceberg..he directed people to
real reading material...
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #6
13. Are you CERTAIN it wasn't? And anthrax powder isn't made at Gov. labs, either, eh?
Edited on Mon Apr-28-08 10:11 AM by blm
.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. I'm not "CERTAIN" that you are not a typing lizard, either.
Edited on Mon Apr-28-08 10:14 AM by MNDemNY
The truth is not the dig here....it's the perception. All of this will further damage Obama, to deny this is naive.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #15
22. I'm not for pushing the theory at all. I just don't put much past the fascists.
Many of these same people thought blowing up a rocket with John Glenn inside would give them the cover they needed to invade Cuba.

To BELIEVE that they WOULDN'T concoct a bio-weapon like AIDS is foolish at this point.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #22
29. The point is this statement will not go over well with the masses in a GE.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. Yes, I'm certain
We know of HIV existing decades before science even knew what a retrovirus was.
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merh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #6
23. Can you believe our government sponsored and funded studies that allowed
black men affected with syphilis to go untreated while telling them they were being treated for their blood ailments?

Is it doubtful that the HIV was created by our gov to kill blacks but knowing about the Tuskegee studies can't you understand the reason for the suspicion?
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #6
37. How could anyone think such a thing?

1931 - Dr. Cornelius Rhoads, under the auspices of the Rockefeller Institute for Medical Investigations, infects human subjects with cancer cells. He later goes on to establish the U.S. Army Biological Warfare facilities in Maryland, Utah, and Panama, and is named to the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission. While there, he begins a series of radiation exposure experiments on American soldiers and civilian hospital patients.

1932 - The Tuskegee Syphilis Study begins. 200 black men diagnosed with syphilis are never told of their illness, are denied treatment, and instead are used as human guinea pigs in order to follow the progression and symptoms of the disease. They all subsequently die from syphilis, their families never told that they could have been treated.

1935 - The Pellagra Incident. After millions of individuals die from Pellagra over a span of two decades, the U.S. Public Health Service finally acts to stem the disease. The director of the agency admits it had known for at least 20 years that Pellagra is caused by a niacin deficiency but failed to act since most of the deaths occurred within poverty-stricken black populations.

1940 - Four hundred prisoners in Chicago are infected with Malaria in order to study the effects of new and experimental drugs to combat the disease. Nazi doctors later on trial at Nuremberg cite this American study to defend their own actions during the Holocaust.

1942 - Chemical Warfare Services begins mustard gas experiments on approximately 4,000 servicemen. The experiments continue until 1945 and made use of Seventh Day Adventists who chose to become human guinea pigs rather than serve on active duty.

1943 - In response to Japan's full-scale germ warfare program, the U.S. begins research on biological weapons at Fort Detrick, MD.

1944 - U.S. Navy uses human subjects to test gas masks and clothing. Individuals were locked in a gas chamber and exposed to mustard gas and lewisite.

1945 - Project Paperclip is initiated. The U.S. State Department, Army intelligence, and the CIA recruit Nazi scientists and offer them immunity and secret identities in exchange for work on top secret government projects in the United States.

1945 - "Program F" is implemented by the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission (AEC). This is the most extensive U.S. study of the health effects of fluoride, which was the key chemical component in atomic bomb production. One of the most toxic chemicals known to man, fluoride, it is found, causes marked adverse effects to the central nervous system but much of the information is squelched in the name of national security because of fear that lawsuits would undermine full-scale production of atomic bombs.

1946 - Patients in VA hospitals are used as guinea pigs for medical experiments. In order to allay suspicions, the order is given to change the word "experiments" to "investigations" or "observations" whenever reporting a medical study performed in one of the nation's veteran's hospitals.

1947 - Colonel E.E. Kirkpatrick of the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission issues a secret document (Document 07075001, January 8, 1947) stating that the agency will begin administering intravenous doses of radioactive substances to human subjects.

1947 - The CIA begins its study of LSD as a potential weapon for use by American intelligence. Human subjects (both civilian and military) are used with and without their knowledge.

1950 - Department of Defense begins plans to detonate nuclear weapons in desert areas and monitor downwind residents for medical problems and mortality rates.

1950 - In an experiment to determine how susceptible an American city would be to biological attack, the U.S. Navy sprays a cloud of bacteria from ships over San Francisco. Monitoring devices are situated throughout the city in order to test the extent of infection. Many residents become ill with pneumonia-like symptoms.

1951 - Department of Defense begins open air tests using disease-producing bacteria and viruses. Tests last through 1969 and there is concern that people in the surrounding areas have been exposed.

1953 - U.S. military releases clouds of zinc cadmium sulfide gas over Winnipeg, St. Louis, Minneapolis, Fort Wayne, the Monocacy River Valley in Maryland, and Leesburg, Virginia. Their intent is to determine how efficiently they could disperse chemical agents.

1953 - Joint Army-Navy-CIA experiments are conducted in which tens of thousands of people in New York and San Francisco are exposed to the airborne germs Serratia marcescens and Bacillus glogigii.

1953 - CIA initiates Project MKULTRA. This is an eleven year research program designed to produce and test drugs and biological agents that would be used for mind control and behavior modification. Six of the subprojects involved testing the agents on unwitting human beings.

1955 - The CIA, in an experiment to test its ability to infect human populations with biological agents, releases a bacteria withdrawn from the Army's biological warfare arsenal over Tampa Bay, Fl.

1956 - U.S. military releases mosquitoes infected with Yellow Fever over Savannah, Ga and Avon Park, Fl. Following each test, Army agents posing as public health officials test victims for effects.

1960 - The Army Assistant Chief-of-Staff for Intelligence (ACSI) authorizes field testing of LSD in Europe and the Far East. Testing of the European population is code named Project THIRD CHANCE; testing of the Asian population is code named Project DERBY HAT.

1965 - Project CIA and Department of Defense begin Project MKSEARCH, a program to develop a capability to manipulate human behavior through the use of mind-altering drugs.

1965 - Prisoners at the Holmesburg State Prison in Philadelphia are subjected to dioxin, the highly toxic chemical component of Agent Orange used in Viet Nam. The men are later studied for development of cancer, which indicates that Agent Orange had been a suspected carcinogen all along.

1966 - CIA initiates Project MKOFTEN, a program to test the toxicological effects of certain drugs on humans and animals.

1966 - U.S. Army dispenses Bacillus subtilis variant niger throughout the New York City subway system. More than a million civilians are exposed when army scientists drop lightbulbs filled with the bacteria onto ventilation grates.

1967 - CIA and Department of Defense implement Project MKNAOMI, successor to MKULTRA and designed to maintain, stockpile and test biological and chemical weapons.

1968 - CIA experiments with the possibility of poisoning drinking water by injecting chemicals into the water supply of the FDA in Washington, D.C.

1969 - Dr. Robert MacMahan of the Department of Defense requests from congress $10 million to develop, within 5 to 10 years, a synthetic biological agent to which no natural immunity exists.

1970 - Funding for the synthetic biological agent is obtained under H.R. 15090. The project, under the supervision of the CIA, is carried out by the Special Operations Division at Fort Detrick, the army's top secret biological weapons facility. Speculation is raised that molecular biology techniques are used to produce AIDS-like retroviruses.

1970 - United States intensifies its development of "ethnic weapons" (Military Review, Nov., 1970), designed to selectively target and eliminate specific ethnic groups who are susceptible due to genetic differences and variations in DNA.

1975 - The virus section of Fort Detrick's Center for Biological Warfare Research is renamed the Fredrick Cancer Research Facilities and placed under the supervision of the National Cancer Institute (NCI) . It is here that a special virus cancer program is initiated by the U.S. Navy, purportedly to develop cancer-causing viruses. It is also here that retrovirologists isolate a virus to which no immunity exists. It is later named HTLV (Human T-cell Leukemia Virus).

1977 - Senate hearings on Health and Scientific Research confirm that 239 populated areas had been contaminated with biological agents between 1949 and 1969. Some of the areas included San Francisco, Washington, D.C., Key West, Panama City, Minneapolis, and St. Louis.

1978 - Experimental Hepatitis B vaccine trials, conducted by the CDC, begin in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco. Ads for research subjects specifically ask for promiscuous homosexual men.

1981 - First cases of AIDS are confirmed in homosexual men in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco, triggering speculation that AIDS may have been introduced via the Hepatitis B vaccine.

1985 - According to the journal Science (227:173-177), HTLV and VISNA, a fatal sheep virus, are very similar, indicating a close taxonomic and evolutionary relationship.

1986 - According to the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (83:4007-4011), HIV and VISNA are highly similar and share all structural elements, except for a small segment which is nearly identical to HTLV. This leads to speculation that HTLV and VISNA may have been linked to produce a new retrovirus to which no natural immunity exists.

1986 - A report to Congress reveals that the U.S. Government's current generation of biological agents includes: modified viruses, naturally occurring toxins, and agents that are altered through genetic engineering to change immunological character and prevent treatment by all existing vaccines.

1987 - Department of Defense admits that, despite a treaty banning research and development of biological agents, it continues to operate research facilities at 127 facilities and universities around the nation.

1990 - More than 1500 six-month old black and Hispanic babies in Los Angeles are given an "experimental" measles vaccine that had never been licensed for use in the United States. CDC later admits that parents were never informed that the vaccine being injected to their children was experimental.

1994 - With a technique called "gene tracking," Dr. Garth Nicolson at the MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, TX discovers that many returning Desert Storm veterans are infected with an altered strain of Mycoplasma incognitus, a microbe commonly used in the production of biological weapons. Incorporated into its molecular structure is 40 percent of the HIV protein coat, indicating that it had been man-made.

1994 - Senator John D. Rockefeller issues a report revealing that for at least 50 years the Department of Defense has used hundreds of thousands of military personnel in human experiments and for intentional exposure to dangerous substances. Materials included mustard and nerve gas, ionizing radiation, psychochemicals, hallucinogens, and drugs used during the Gulf War.

1995 - U.S. Government admits that it had offered Japanese war criminals and scientists who had performed human medical experiments salaries and immunity from prosecution in exchange for data on biological warfare research.

1995 - Dr. Garth Nicolson, uncovers evidence that the biological agents used during the Gulf War had been manufactured in Houston, TX and Boca Raton, Fl and tested on prisoners in the Texas Department of Corrections.

1996 - Department of Defense admits that Desert Storm soldiers were exposed to chemical agents.

1997 - Eighty-eight members of Congress sign a letter demanding an investigation into bioweapons use & Gulf War Syndrome.
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Wind Dancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #37
39. Thanks for posting this valuable information.
Edited on Mon Apr-28-08 10:48 AM by FrustratedDemInNC
How silly of the Rev. Wright to suspect or condemn the actions of our government. :sarcasm:
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #39
43. Didn't mention this one...
Dark Alliance: The CIA, The Contras, and the Crack Cocaine Explosion
By Gary Webb
http://www.uhuh.com/bbks/darkalli.htm
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Wind Dancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #43
44. Oh yes!
Gary Webb was incredibly courageous to expose these criminals - it's a shame it cost him his life. What a tragic ending!
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #44
46. and Steve Kangas...
Steve Kangas was found dead on the 39th floor of his enemy's doorstep at 11:30 PM on February 8 1999. In the bathroom of the offices of Richard Mellon Scaife, 2000 miles from home, -- in Pittsburgh PA. Shot (twice?) in the head. Due to obstructions of justice, local police investigating the wrong circumstances quickly ruled it a suicide.


A Timeline of CIA Atrocities

By Steve Kangas

The following timeline describes just a few of the hundreds of atrocities and crimes committed by the CIA. (1)

CIA operations follow the same recurring script. First, American business interests abroad are threatened by a popular or democratically elected leader. The people support their leader because he intends to conduct land reform, strengthen unions, redistribute wealth, nationalize foreign-owned industry, and regulate business to protect workers, consumers and the environment. So, on behalf of American business, and often with their help, the CIA mobilizes the opposition. First it identifies right-wing groups within the country (usually the military), and offers them a deal: "We'll put you in power if you maintain a favorable business climate for us." The Agency then hires, trains and works with them to overthrow the existing government (usually a democracy). It uses every trick in the book: propaganda, stuffed ballot boxes, purchased elections, extortion, blackmail, sexual intrigue, false stories about opponents in the local media, infiltration and disruption of opposing political parties, kidnapping, beating, torture, intimidation, economic sabotage, death squads and even assassination. These efforts culminate in a military coup, which installs a right-wing dictator. The CIA trains the dictator’s security apparatus to crack down on the traditional enemies of big business, using interrogation, torture and murder. The victims are said to be "communists," but almost always they are just peasants, liberals, moderates, labor union leaders, political opponents and advocates of free speech and democracy. Widespread human rights abuses follow.

This scenario has been repeated so many times that the CIA actually teaches it in a special school, the notorious "School of the Americas." (It opened in Panama but later moved to Fort Benning, Georgia.) Critics have nicknamed it the "School of the Dictators" and "School of the Assassins." Here, the CIA trains Latin American military officers how to conduct coups, including the use of interrogation, torture and murder.

The Association for Responsible Dissent estimates that by 1987, 6 million people had died as a result of CIA covert operations. (2) Former State Department official William Blum correctly calls this an "American Holocaust."


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Wind Dancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #46
48. The list is never ending............
Isn't it nice of Hillary to accept the endorsement of Richard Mellon Scaife all the while attacking the Rev. Wright? Scaife is truly a bastion of liberal causes. :sarcasm:

One of my very favorites - Smedley Butler

The Business Plot (also known as the Plot Against FDR or the White House Putsch) was a political conspiracy in 1933 where several wealthy businessmen and corporations planned to overthrow the presidency of Franklin D. Roosevelt.

Details of the plot came to light in early 1934, when retired Marine Corps Major General Smedley Butler testified before the McCormack-Dickstein Congressional Committee.<1> In his testimony, Butler claimed that a group of men had approached him as part of a plot to overthrow Roosevelt in a military coup. One of the alleged plotters, Gerald MacGuire, vehemently denied any such plot. In their final report, the Congressional committee supported Butler's allegations of the existence of the plot,<2> but no prosecutions or further investigations followed, and the matter was mostly forgotten.

Major General Butler claimed that the American Liberty League was the plot's primary source of funding. The main backers were the Du Pont family, as well as leaders of U.S. Steel, General Motors, Standard Oil, Chase National Bank, and Goodyear Tire and Rubber Company. The 2007 BBC radio documentary The White House Coup<3> alleged that Prescott Bush, father and grandfather to the 41st and 43rd US Presidents respectively, was also connected with the plot.<3>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_Plot

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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #48
49. It is amazing how much I have learned...
since Al Gore invented the internets!! Shocking how ignorant I was, and continue to be regarding my country, its leaders, and its policies.
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annm4peace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #37
55. thank you, I need this for a republican friend.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #6
50. whoops. Delete
Edited on Mon Apr-28-08 01:24 PM by stillcool47
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #4
45. I'm afraid thats not gonna happen..
Wright let it slip, he's going to be Obama's VP!
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grassfed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #4
56. yeah, he's an atrocious cliche, a grotesque malevolent buffoon
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54anickel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
9. The major point that is being missed in this Wright business is media
manipulation of the masses. Whether a person is of your camp and feels this was a peek at the real Rev Wright or of the opinion of another poster that this is just a media sponsored love fest for Obama, the real issue is the propaganda power these media conglomerations now have over the population. I feel like I've been watching on old rerun of To Tell the Truth - "Will the real Reverend Wright please stand up?" I personally didn't have any issues with anything reportedly said by Wright, then again I average about one hour of TV viewing a month so I'm sure I missed the full effect. I mainly caught glimpses here and on You Tube.

I think the question to be asked - especially by those who have been swayed from the devil incarnate image of Wright - is how did I ever get that image of him in the first place? I'd like to see a real, public discussion about media ownership - yeah right, like that's ever going to get fair coverage now. I'm not naive here, I know the government has always used the public air waves and their influence on the media to sway the public opinion. But the government has become the exclusive advocate of Corporate America, they are becoming one and the same. We are simply the present age peasants that do the labor and pay the taxes to keep ourselves in line for their betterment and protection under the guise of our own protection and betterment.

Do I sound bitter to you? :P
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
11. Thank goodness we have some common ground.
:hi:

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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #11
28. Yup
When push comes to shove, hopefully we'll all be thinking of how horrible another Republican administration would be, and forgetting about spewing vitriol toward the other Democrat in a Primary race, both of whom are fighting their asses off for the nomination.

:hi:
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:28 AM
Response to Reply #28
33. One more thing,
Dennis Kucinich rules! :D



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Doityourself Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
17. Agreed. He was truthful and funny too. When he did the bird pose and then did the salute..funny
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #17
30. I loved it everytime he did that
You're right. He was as truthful as he was funny.

For the first half of his speech I kept waiting for him to lay it on, and in the end he didn't disappoint. Nice to see someone stand up for what he knows is right instead of seeing all these politicians backing away from the truth for political self gain and fear of being politically incorrect.
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BeyondGeography Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:16 AM
Response to Original message
18. A fine post, Snake
K&R...now let's turn this whole Penguin thing around.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #18
34. Thanks
Rangers gotta get their PP working. You could sense the outcome of that game shortly after the game was half over.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
24. I think you prove that one can appreciate him regardless of who one supports.
For me Wright has been one of the best things, if not THE best thing, about this whole campaign so far, and I'm damn far from being a religious person. He's fascinating, thoughtful, and worth listening to, even if one comes away with some disagreements. He asks us to think, and my liking him is totally independent of my feelings for either candidate.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:20 AM
Response to Original message
27. Errr, ummm, argh! Recommend!
I absolutely agree, buddy, but it was so difficult recommending a post of yours! :rofl:

He is quite a character, Rev. Wright is. I hope to find the riff he did last night on music and how it translates to different groups. He was hysterical, but so spot on!

I'm grateful you see the good in him, and I thank you! :thumbsup:
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #27
38. lol
your trigger finger must've felt weightless when you went to hit the recommend button! :evilgrin:

I'm grateful you see the good in him, and I thank you!


No problem. When I see the guy, I can't help but like him. Plus he makes me laugh, which is an extra bonus.
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JimGinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
40. What Have You Done With mtnsnake & How Did You Get His Password!
K&R
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dchill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 11:02 AM
Response to Original message
41. I agree that Wright is all right...
but I think it's plain that no one who is running for elective office should have to defend or renounce the pastor at their church. Either that, or EVERYONE who is running should have to do the same. We are NOT seeing the sermons of Pastor Hagee or the sermons of whomever is or was pastor of the church that Clinton now attends/did attend if she does indeed attend any church at the present - several "questions" right there. But that didn't stop her from making some political hay out of the Obama/Wright controversy:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/03/25/pastor-of-clintons-forme_n_93418.html

On Tuesday, Sen. Hillary Clinton re-stoked the flames of the controversy surrounding Sen. Barack Obama's former pastor, saying she would have long ago distanced herself from Rev. Jeremiah Wright if she had attended his church.

"He would not have been my pastor," Clinton told a gathering of the campaign press corps, repeating a line she used earlier in the day on a Pittsburgh radio program. "You don't choose your family, but you choose what church you want to attend."

But the pastor at the church that Clinton did once attend has recently expressed public support for Wright. He's even proclaimed it a "grave injustice" to make a judgment on Wright based off of "two
or three sound bites," and criticized those who would "use a few of quotes to polarize."


All this "news" coverage about the former pastor of the church of one of the candidates, and "surprisingly" - the black candidate! - despite this little clause in that seemingly irrelevant document called the Constitution of the United States of America:

The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution; but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.


I am white, but if I were black, would I be less suspicious that there's something racist about the whole Wright affair?

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anonymous171 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 11:14 AM
Response to Original message
42. This is sarcastic right?
If it isn't, then I agree with you! :hi::toast:
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #42
47. Not in the least.
I liked everything about his speech this morning. I especially liked it when he really got warmed up for the latter part of it and also how he handled the question and answer period afterwards. I even liked how confident and "in your face" he was. His mannerisms, facial expressions, & body language ROCKED. I'm sick of politicians always caving in to the demands of the media, including ALL of our 2008 candidates, and it was a sheer pleasure watching Reverend Wright thumb his nose in the media's faces as he spoke the truth and didn't back down from it just because they wanted him to.

then I agree with you!


Yup :hi: :toast:

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beachmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 01:33 PM
Response to Original message
51. I was actually thinking Hillary supporters would like Wright. He is very interesting.
I can't totally agree with you here:


If more of our own high profile Democrats had the guts that Rev Wright and Kucinich do, we'd never lose another election and the world would be a far better place.

Preachers talk differently and actually don't speak in political terms. They speak in moral terms and theological terms. That is why his sermon on "God Damn America" is to me not offensive at all, whereas if some Lefty started ranting and said it, it would be inappropriate. Wright was talking in theological terms, and the theme that "governments fail", and it made perfect sense in the clip Moyers showed (I recommend that show, too) in theological terms. He was not really talking in a political sense.

The truth is that Rev. Wright paints in red. He has the freedom and luxury to do so. Obama, or any other major politician in this country, can only take it to purple at most, because they are politicians, not preachers. Wright drove that home on Moyers: he said he does not talk politics with Obama, and that he is a preacher and Obama is a politician, and they cannot talk any other way than what their field calls for. Obama did not abandon his preacher -- he said he was like a father to him and he could no soon as disown him as he could disown the African American community.

Nice post, Snakester.

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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #51
52. I agree
with the difference you're pointing out between luxuries that preachers have and politicians don't, but in the long run I don't think it's the way for us to go with this political doublespeak that most of our politicians are always so good at. At some point I honestly believe that we Democrats are going to have to make the decision to become more like Reverend Wright in the sense that we are going to have say exactly what we stand for and not back down an iota from it, no matter what the political consequences and no matter how the media spins it. If we stuck to our guns like Wright does, I think the voters would be far more impressed with us than the way we do it now where we're always trying to cover for our core beliefs as if there's something wrong with us...when it's them (the media and Republicans), not us, who's got it all wrong. It might hurt us in the short run, but for sake of the future, it's going to have to be done at some point or we're never going to get anywhere.

Yes, Rev Wright can paint in red, but he is under intense scrutiny right now because of the media, and under these circumstances I give the man all the credit in the world for not backing down one bit. And he SHOULD stick to his guns because he's right. BTW, I love how he even led them on for the first half of his speech this morning, almost acting like a lamb, before tearing into their asses but good.

I've never heard him yet where I can honestly say I disagree with anything he's saying. I haven't heard all his soundbites, and I'm sure there's some things I probably wouldn't like, but so far he's nothing but a breath of fresh air in every major sense of the expression.

I wish people like him had way more influence on our politics or at least on our Democrats.

Nice post, Snakester


Thanks :)




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sloppyjoe25s Donating Member (664 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
53. AMEN TO THAT BROTHER!
His speech as learned, erudite, on-point and informed.

Regarless of if you agree with every word or not - you can't dismiss Rev. Wright if you have half a brain.

I'm VERY glad he spoke up and spoke out with passion - and in long term it will HELP Obama not hurt him.

Makes the Characiture of the MSM harder to be used by the Re-Thugs in the GE.

Lesson - don't sit in the fuckin corner - come out an hit em in the FUCKIN FACE!
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FedoraLV Donating Member (226 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-28-08 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
54. k & r/nt
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