CNN Poll shows America disapproves of the black church 2-1

[sampsonblk]

http://www.cnn.com/

Sad, but not surprising. Rev Wright gives a speech that could have been delivered at any of a thousand black churches across this nation, and two-thirds of the people say he is divisive. Then I say they better never come to my church then!

Its only an online poll. But it definitely reflects my experiences in this country. This is a complete national repudiation of black people as a whole.

[Bullet1987]

1. How was it worded?

[skooooo]

2. The good thing coming out of this..

..is at least people are being exposed to ideas and messages they haven't heard before. Wake up America!

[IndianaJones]

3. and this is so surprising. nt.

[skooooo]

4. Your post is misleading.. the question is about Wright, not the church.

[sampsonblk]

Wright's speech was about the church, not himself. America disapproves.-nt

[skooooo]

33. Can't make the rules up as you go along...

Have to go with the text of the question.

[anigbrowl]

53. Haven't you ever heard of an eye-catching headline?

I don't really expect the headline to be a paragon of accuracy - it can be used by the poster to express an opinion, satirical, or whatever. The content of the OP is what's important, and that's accurate and informative. Perhaps you should not get so caught up in superficialities.

[Renaissance Man]

5. It's not surprising!

Slave masters disapproved of the Black Church.

People who burned black churches disapproved of the Black Church.

Now, America disapproves of the Black Church.

[Leopolds Ghost]

62. America is a different place than the one you remember. People no longer burn black churches.

Now, they go into media and politics.

While they wait for the next crisis to offer a chance to refocus
group solidarity against their percieved enemy.

Whereupon burning black churches will begin again.

It is the cycle of human cultural pathologies -- the ones that
DON'T get constantly criticised on the nightly news.

Call it "the pathology of the middle class in this country",
call it "an entitlement mentality", call it bad grammar on
the part of your average white student, who can't get a job
in the offshore factory of his choice as a result. But the
problem will continue to be ignored because it is politically
correct to coddle racists in this country.

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

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[sampsonblk]

12. Wright's speech was about the church. Watch your language.-nt

[berni_mccoy]

16. The POLL was about Rev. Wright.

[sampsonblk]

18. No

Rev Wright gave two speeches, primarily about the black church. After that, CNN asks how do you feel about Rev Wright? Well what are people to base their choice on? All they saw was him talking about the black church. And he is a prominent black clergyman, nationally known and respected among black churchgoers.

If his speech makes you think he is divisive, then it follows that the black church in general is divisive. If there's something wrong with Wright, there is something wrong with virtually all black pastors and the people who listen to them.

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

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[brentspeak]

46. I call B.S.

I've been to lots of black church services, and most of them didn't have pastors who preached their sermons like Rev.Wright. Your broad brush that Wright = black pastors is bogus.

[sampsonblk]

55. Do the people who populate those churches agree with me, or you?

Of course every church and every pastor is unique. But there is such a thing as the black church. And Rev Wright is one of the most successful black church leaders. But you already know that. I am trying to be open-mnded, but I can't see where you are coming from.

Are you saying that Rev Wright is atypical?

[brentspeak]

58. The black pastors I've seen give sermons

...were as animated and passionate as Rev. Wright, but after that the similarities end. Mostly, whenever the sermons veered from the topic God and Jesus, the issues discussed were social issues affecting urban black residents: gangs, poverty, drugs, etc.

[sampsonblk]

59. No political issues and no controversy? Never?

As you obviously know, the most important source of political leadership in the black community has always been the church. That has often caused controversy among those who have no interest in having our political issues addressed. Nothing new here.

[KoKo]

7. CNN Poll......Means nothing...and since it means nothing it's not a repudiation

of Black People. It's CNN stirring up shit...to make news pretending they care about "race" when it's all about dissing a Dem Candidate. It's what they do.

[Eurobabe]

19. Chicken Noodle News is just that

Does anyone think these stupid online polls mean a goddamn thing?? :shrug:

[Doityourself]

25. agreed

[Metric System]

8. Your post proves why Wright is so divisive and problematic. He's turned all of this into an attack

on the black church and that is very troubling.

[sampsonblk]

14. He hasn't turned anything. That's what it is. Wright is typical of the black church-nt

[spooky3]

64. not according to many black commentators, including Obama supporter Eugene Robinson in today's WaPo

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/28/AR2008042802102.html

[EFerrari]

29. That's backward. The black church was attacked.

Trinity was attacked.

And it should be very troubling.

[gristy]

9. the black church? what black church?

did you forget to engage your brain before posting?

[MNDemNY]

10. Ask the good Rev. Wright.

[Lilith Velkor]

54. There is only one black church, and Rev. Wright is the only preacher in it

What, you didn't get the memo?

:sarcasm:

[Hoof Hearted]

56. Only he can speak for it and any attack on him is an attack on THE black church.

got it.

[Lilith Velkor]

57. And black people, because they all attend the same church

You read it here first. :crazy:

[wowimthere]

11. Who gives a shit about a poll CNN gives... You trust them to give you the honest Truth?

[redqueen]

13. This is sickening.

First the Bush administration gives its tacit approval to racism, and things get worse.

Now we have to watch it happen to THIS party, too?

[sampsonblk]

15. Name one racist thing Rev Wright said. Just one-nt

[EFerrari]

26. It's the other way around. The racism swirling in the culture

is being projected onto him.

He has been great.

[redqueen]

28. Exactly.

And by not condemning it immediately... what has the Clinton campaign done? What has the Dem party done?

Enabled it.

:puke:

[EFerrari]

31. That's right. And frankly, I'm disgusted by threads and posts

to this forum that continue to insult Wright and to blame him for racism being enabled at the highest levels of this party.

[redqueen]

27. I'm talking about the Clinton campaign... the hammering on Wright while Hagee gets a pass.

It was bad enough watching the Bush administration condone this shit for years.

Now... now it's this party...

[sampsonblk]

61. I agree with you on that. -nt

[spooky3]

65. the Clinton campaign has said next to nothing - your complaint should be directed at the media...

They are the ones hyping the story while giving relatively little attention to McCain and Hagee.

See mediamatters.org

[redqueen]

68. She hasn't said "next to nothing".

She has gone on record hopping on board with the GOP slime machine on this talking point.

[spooky3]

70. where's your link?

[redqueen]

71. Here's one.

Pastor Of Clinton's Former Church: Don't Use Wright To Polarize
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/03/25/pastor-of-clintons-forme_n_93418.html

On Tuesday, Sen. Hillary Clinton re-stoked the flames of the controversy surrounding Sen. Barack Obama's former pastor, saying she would have long ago distanced herself from Rev. Jeremiah Wright if she had attended his church.

"He would not have been my pastor," Clinton told a gathering of the campaign press corps, repeating a line she used earlier in the day on a Pittsburgh radio program. "You don't choose your family, but you choose what church you want to attend."




Want more?

[spooky3]

75. thanks, but dredging up something more than a month old doesn't

really provide evidence that she's said anything about Wright's last three public appearances.

Her March statements are simple and straightforward - hardly "hammering" as you've characterized them.

The media have been far worse about fanning the flames of these recent appearances well beyond what they deserve.

[redqueen]

77. Oh so timing is important?

When did she last say it?

"I would not have stayed in that church under those circumstances," Clinton said. "But I regret the efforts by Republicans to politicize this matter."

When was that quote from? Hmm?


"Hammering" is what you're going to focus on, to try to spin away her covering herself in slime?

[formernaderite]

17. i'm an atheist that said

i've been in many churches and sat through many sermons....I pretty much hate charismatic ministries...Wright included. It's going to be a turn off to many people just based on his hyperbole. Just a fact of preference.

[Moochy]

20. Hey maybe those people should not go to his church!

You know those poll respondents who were planning their trip to Reverend Wright's Church... but because of CNN's reporting were able to realize that Wright is "just too loud" and "he's just too angry to be my black friend."

[Bluebear]

22. "This is a complete national repudiation of black people as a whole." An ONLINE poll?

Please, even you know better than that.

[rucky]

23. Then don't go to one.

I'm starting to feel the suck.

[otohara]

24. America Is Fucked Up

CNN is even more fucked up to post such a divisive question.

[Bluebear]

30. Also, you are totally misrepresenting the poll, which asks about WRIGHT, not "the black church"

I went to your poll that "proves" America hates black people. The question is

Which is closer to your view of the Rev. Jeremiah Wright?
Descriptive
Divisive

Why are you trying to stir things up here instead of trying to make things better? Is this similar to when you told us to keep gays out of the military?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=5444620

Patterns emerge, and you're is becoming one of a disruptor, sir.

[skooooo]

34. The OP doesn't care about misrepresenting the poll.

Evidentally he/she has an axe to grind that justifies changing the meaning of the text of the question asked.

[sampsonblk]

39. In my OP, I clearly explained the poll. My post was my interpretation of the poll

"Rev Wright gives a speech...and two-thirds of the people say he is divisive."

You did see that part, didn't you?

[sampsonblk]

38. I think we have already established your IQ. - nt

[Bluebear]

41. My IQ is 138, thank you.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is stupid. Only a sociopath thinks that.

[Buddyblazon]

32. It's not "the black church"......

It's the United Church of Christ...the Church I grew up in...with a mostly white congregation.

And it doesn't even use the words "black church".

WTF is wrong with you? Don't try to "Nancy Grace" shit for shock value.

Apologize now.

[Bluebear]

69. 'WTF is wrong with you?' - there's not enough bandwidth.

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

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[backscatter712]

36. The poll ain't worth bupkus.

Because people here go "DU THIS POLL!" and Freepers go on their sites and say "FREEP THIS POLL!" In other words, there are large groups of people attempting to bias the poll.

It's not a scientific sample, it's vulnerable to attempts to bias it.

It ain't worth shit.

[Obamanaut]

37. That isn't the poll I just looked at. It didn't mention church, or

disapproval/approval, but it did ask if I thought the Rev is descriptive or divisive. I think descriptive, because of the way he can weave his words to form a fairly accurate picture.

[sampsonblk]

40. I guess I didn't make my point very well

My point was that if 2/3 of the people think Rev Wright's speech was divisive, that is a repudiation of the black church. Because we are what he is. He absolutely spoke for black churchgoers today. Absolutely.

[Indenturedebtor]

42. Well they weren't just speaking for the speech he gave today

And he is divisive. He's not singing Kubaya is he? I don't think that this poll was a repudiation of anything/anyone, nor was it scientific enough to make generalizations about.

Hell even with "scientific" polling about the primaries/GE without a large enough sample you can get some pretty funny numbers.

[geek_sabre]

43. All blacks go to the same church??

I was raised Catholic, in a predominately black Catholic church. He doesn't speak for this black churchgoer.

[sampsonblk]

49. Then you already know what I mean-nt

[newmajority]

44. CNN is owned by AOL. And AOL polls are always heavily Freeped.

And this one was Hillbotted, on top of that.

[brentspeak]

45. Er, uh, the poll was about Wright, not "the black church"

[anigbrowl]

52. Funny - that's what the OP said too! I smell a conspiracy!! .nt

[intheflow]

47. Yes, we'll enslave them and force our Bible on them.

But how dare they interpret it through their own lenses! :sarcasm:

[RichardRay]

48. Can we get a general agreement to give just as much credence...

to online polls as they actually deserve?

0

As in, None. Zilch. Zip. Naught. Jack.

They are noise. If there is any information in the noise it is indistinguishable from the noise. If you didn't take enough statistics to know why, then check with someone who did.

Please, don't perpetuate the myth by quoting them.

[Cha]

50. Especially fookin' cnn-pravda

central online polls!

[sampsonblk]

60. I only mentioned it because it reflects my experience

Of course we will have to wwait and see, but I think when real polls come out, they will be close to the same numbers as this online one.

[Name removed]

51. Deleted sub-thread

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[2rth2pwr]

63. ..that any attack on him is an attack on the AA church and its traditions -- is just wrong.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/04/wright_throws_obama_under_the.html

The reality of the African-American church, of course, is as diverse as the African-American community. I grew up in the Methodist church with pastors -- often active on the front lines of the civil rights movement -- whose sermons were rarely exciting enough to elicit more than a muttered "Amen." They were excitement itself, however, compared to the dry lectures delivered by the priest at the Catholic church around the corner. And what I heard every Sunday was nothing at all like the Bible-thumping, hellfire-and-damnation perorations that filled my Baptist friends with the Holy Ghost -- and even less like the spellbinding, singsong, jump-and-shout sermonizing that raised the roofs of Pentecostal sanctuaries across town.

Wright claims to represent all these traditions and more, but he does not. He also claims universality for the political aspect of his ministry. It is true that the black church, writ large, has been an instrument of social and political change. But most black churches are far less political than Wright's -- and many concern themselves exclusively with salvation.

I point all this out not to say that one tradition is better than another; as Wright said, different doesn't mean deficient. But what Wright did was try to frame the issue in such a way that to question him or anything he has ever said was to question the long, storied tradition of African-American religion.

Historically and theologically, he was inflating his importance in a pride-goeth-before-the-fall kind of way. Politically, by surfacing now, he was throwing Barack Obama under the bus.

Sadly, it's time for Obama to return the favor.

[sampsonblk]

66. This is a worthy subject, but this may not be the place to discuss it-nt

[Blue_Roses]

67. this is a very race baiting thread...

and you know it.

[beachmom]

72. The Black Church? What the hell is that? That is like having a poll about The White Church.

CNN sucks.

[spooky3]

76. they didn't ask about "The Black Church" - see this post for the exact wording

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5716382&mesg_id=5716881

[barack the house]

73. It is really but this just one topic and not about Obama and there is a long way to go...

Don't get bitter getcalling. But polite as you can imainge if you were getting calls.

[Orsino]

74. And 99% of those disapproving did so because of MSM sound bites.

Pathetic.

[Name removed]

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