Oh for the love of... People, Wright was talking about cultural differences, not genetic ones.

[Aloha Spirit]

If you want to read more about "different is not deficient," please check out Dr. Janice Hale's book:
http://www.amazon.com/Black-Children-Culture-Learning-Styles/dp/0801833833

[Swamp Rat]

1. They don't care.

All they see is an uppity.........

[ampad]

3. Geesh swamprat

How did you get the first reply before ignore did? I swear every thread I have read this morning on this Wright issue ignore has been the first to respond. Are they sitting in the lobby stalking these thread waiting to be the first to respond with their crap? I swear.

OP, I got most of them on ignore so I had no idea they were all over the board with that nonsense. It's not surprising that they would be all over DU today with their crap about the Rev. It's sad when you have to explain every little detail to them.

[Swamp Rat]

14. Yes, they are.

I believe some of them are paid to do this, by the Hillary Clinton campaign and neocon 501C's, while others are dittoheads sent by Rash Limpballs ("Operation Chaos").

Btw, I have very few on ignore, but apparently I cannot see the ignored person to which you refer. :D

[knixphan]

26. I had that same question!

[VenusRising]

6. It's so so sad that in 2008 this kind of thinking still exists.

It's tragic that you have to make that graphic, Swamp Rat.

:hug:

[TahitiNut]

9. You got it, my friend..

The temerity of a preacher who doesn't "know his place"! I'd attend Wright's church in a heartbeat if I lived in Chi-town. (I tried to find a way to see him in person yesterday, as he visited the city, but it wasn't in the cards.) The man's got integrity ... and I'll NEVER agree with ANYONE 100%. Who the hell would want to?

[cliffordu]

18. DING DING DING We have a winner!!!

Thanks, TahitiNut for expressing this. I am in complete agreement.

[knixphan]

28. ditto

[Swamp Rat]

61. I wish I lived close enough to join you

:pals:

After experiencing so much hatred being spread here today alone, I could use an uplifting sermon by Rev. Wright! O8)

[Coexist]

19. oooooh... nice graphic.

[Swamp Rat]

29. That pic is based on a photo from Rash Limball's website.

It was posted right after Rash Limpball's had an on-air, racist rant.

He's really down on the "halfrican," "magic negro" these days.

[cliffordu]

34. I'd love to run into Rush at the mall.

[BlooInBloo]

51. Yup.

[MNDemNY]

2. Left brained vs Right brained is cultural?? How so?

[Aloha Spirit]

5. Our brains develop as we grow, and brain development during childhood shapes the way we learn. I can

explain this in detail, but unfortunately I would have to charge you tuition.

[SeaLyons]

10. Left brain, right brain

is found in all, not just as a difference between how whites and blacks think and learn. Would you not agree?

[JoFerret]

15. So far as I have heard it is not race-based

But - enough of this crap. Wright is not a cognitive scientist. He is not running for office.
He has opinions that are not scientifically based. He is a minister.
That is not uncommon among ministers of all stripes, races and denominations.

[EmilyAnne]

55. Thank you JoFerret! I agree with you so much. Ministers are the people who come up with the

stuff about dinosaurs and people coexisting, about the earth being created in a literal 6 days, about Terry Schiavo being able to smile at her guests, and about condoms being passed out in Africa to prevent AIDS being a sin!

[TahitiNut]

16. Yes, but there ARE cultural predispositions. It's the ol' "nature vs. nurture" argument.

It SHOULD be sufficient to note that ALL children to better with a balanced and diverse teaching approach.

[IndependentDem]

58. "ALL children do better with a balanced and diverse teaching approach."

that is the point that so many people are missing. :banghead:

[KittyWampus]

11. so IIUC, our childhood environment influences our frame of reference and shapes the way

we process info and express ourselves?

SHOCKING!

[MNDemNY]

12. So, what is different about "black" culture, as opposed to "white" culture?

Or does what you speak of have more to do with economic environment then race? The Rev. seemed to be speaking directly to race. Doesn't really mesh with your synopsis, now does it?

[Aloha Spirit]

22. So you think black culture is a product of race? It's tricky making everything about race, isn't it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-C2b8XWJnfE

[MNDemNY]

24. My point is just the opposite.

Reading comprehension is tricky, isn't it?

[Aloha Spirit]

30. Race is a product of culture? Oh man. That's rich.

[MNDemNY]

33. No, zippy, culture is a product of environment.

[Aloha Spirit]

37. Black culture doesn't come from being economically disadvantaged. Wright was drawing a line from

black African culture to black American culture, and the only way you can presume that an economically disadvantaged environment created black culture is if you presume that black people are poor.

[MNDemNY]

39. You argument has come full circle, back to race.

Is it racial or environmental?

[Aloha Spirit]

40. I'm not saying anything comes from race. What the hell? Culture is sui generis, not a product of

race or environment. I would never attribute something to race. I don't support any argument that starts with race. We are all the same species and we all have allelotypic differences. And by the way, we are all related, and ALL humans have a common ancestor as recently as 2,000 years ago.

[MNDemNY]

43. 2000 years ago? Are you a creationist?

[Aloha Spirit]

45. Nope. "Most recent common ancestor" is a very interesting concept, here's the wiki link for starters

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Most_recent_common_ancestor#Time_estimates

[MNDemNY]

46. Got any "real" links, wiki is a joke.

[Aloha Spirit]

48. Yep, you can go to the library and look up Nature, it's a science journal. v431, n7008

[Aloha Spirit]

49. Here's an article about the Nature piece

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2004/09/040930122428.htm

[Aloha Spirit]

50. Hey.. did you have a chance to read the sciencedaily artice? Any thoughts? Curious. Cheers!

[polmaven]

59. It seems to me that it is not

that poster "making everything about race".

This forum has had very little that isn't about race for a couple of weeks now. Apparently, anyone who does not think Senator Obama is the Second Coming is a racist.

While I agree there is still a great deal of racism in this country...enough that I am embarrassed by it, I think there are very few, if any who post here at DU who are anywhere near being racist.

[backscatter712]

36. A lot of it is just plain culture.

Different language, different music, different teaching styles. That does a lot to shape a child's brain.

Things like music with a 4/4 beat emphasizing the 2 and 4 beats instead of the 1 and 3 beats.

Little things like that, added together have a huge effect on the way a kid develops.

[JoFerret]

13. Do you have good science

sources though?

[Aloha Spirit]

21. Of course I do.... any neuroscience text will do the trick.

[JoFerret]

35. Really?

Are you sure we are talking about the same thing?

[Aloha Spirit]

38. No I am not. What would you like me to reference?

[JoFerret]

62. Peer reviewed scientific brain research.

that's what I would like.

We are indulging more in essentialist theory and stereotyping and cultural speculation.
That is dangerous stuff.
Pseudo science is very dangerous.

[Aloha Spirit]

63. I'm glad to cite references, but what exactly would you like me to cite a reference for?

Honestly, I'm glad to do it. And I'm glad you asked!
But there are a lot of divergent things in this thread, so please be a little specific, thanks.
Cheers

[JoFerret]

64. Specifically: right brain/ left brain is race based

need more that that?

I.e. Children are right or left brain dominant by racial group

[Aloha Spirit]

65. Well, that's not something that I believe or have stated. Learning is not race-based as far as I

know. However, cultural values and norms that are transmitted through generations can and do emphasize different learning styles. I'll try to find a citation for that.

[Aloha Spirit]

66. Here are a couple

http://www.news.uiuc.edu/WebsandThumbs/Park,Denise/0507brain_b.jpg
http://www.citeulike.org/article/1431192


http://lloyd.emich.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0606d&L=edling&P=2019

[scheming daemons]

8. All are born with left AND right brained capacity..some cultures encourage use of one over the other

The environment a child grows up in nurtures either left or right brained dominance. All humans have the capacity for both.

It's not genetic, and it's not hardwired. Culture feeds how people think.

[cliffordu]

32. DING DING DING We have a winner!!!

Ah, a balanced comment among the dreck.

Thanks for this. I was getting ready to shoot my pastorbator 3000 again.

[cali]

4. his comment was not clear enough for you to draw

that conclusion. And even if that was his point, far more goes into why and how children learn than cultural influence. At best, it was poorly phrased, as was the comment about tonality.

[2rth2pwr]

7. What intigues me is that if it is culturally based, how do you direct

the proper instruction to the right students if you are not looking at race. Are teachers supposed to assume cultural leanings based on

appearance, or are there other markers that educators can use to determine the cultural basis that the child is inclined to model

his or her preferred learning modality on?

[Aloha Spirit]

17. Educators today are learning that both subject-oriented and object-oriented learning styles are

most effective when used together.

[TahitiNut]

20. Precisely.

:thumbsup:

[LWolf]

68. You offer instruction in a variety of formats,

and learning activities in a variety of formats. No "one-size-fits-all" instructional approaches, so that all of the different learning styles that appear in every classroom in the nation are given an opportunity to thrive.

Whether you are looking at research on "right/left" brain learning, Gardner's Multiple Intelligences, or other work that looks at learning styles, black kids won't be the only students in the room who need something different than traditional instruction.

The reasons WHY people learn differently are just that; plural. Whether it's because of the way the brain is wired, (and whether that is nature, nurture, or both,) or cultural differences, or differences in environment and experiences due to class differences, or.....some of all of the above and more, the bottom line is that people are not "one-size-fits-all" learners.

School, traditionally, IS a one-size-fits-all system, and that condition has greatly increased under NCLB. That IS what standardization is all about.

While educators KNOW that differentiated instruction is necessary, the system doesn't make it practical or workable, and even encourages misconceptions about differentiation.

About 6 years ago, I attended a district-required staff development. Organized as part of the district's "improvement plan" after a couple of schools didn't make AYP/API (CA's state system was in place for several years before NCLB) for a couple of years. Part of that plan was an adopted "scripted" curriculum approved by the overseers, and the publishers of that "scripted" curriculum were earnestly explaining how you CAN differentiate while you deliver the script.

They wanted us to show pictures while we read the script, and called that "differentiation." Not only is that NOT differentiation, it misleads any teacher who has had no formal training into believing that it IS.

[DemGa]

23. Now we can have "WWRM" What Wright Really Meant

I'd like to hear some straight talk from Obama and Wright - far too ambiguous. The constant need for clarification speeches is getting ridiculous.

[Aloha Spirit]

27. If people listened more closely the first time, I wouldn't be here trying to explain it.

[knixphan]

31. yep!

[chimpymustgo]

25. Rev. Wright is talking out of his ASS. He's a smart man, but very ignorant about this

particular subject. It's embarrassing.

[EmilyAnne]

56. True. How about that retirement, Wright? Its sad because he is taking on way more than he is

qualified to. Maybe the attacks on his character have stoked his ego and now he thinks he has a lot of answers that he clearly does not.

[Aloha Spirit]

41. Hey everybody, here is a link to Wrights NAACP dinner speech if you're interested.

http://www.hiphopmusic.com/2008/04/rev_wright_naacp_speech_video.html

[Scurrilous]

42. Kick

:kick:

[EFerrari]

44. I hope so, or, I'm the wrong color!

lol

:)

[Aloha Spirit]

47. I feel very deficient this morning.

So little melanin pigmentation. Need to get some sun.

[marshall]

52. Cultural differences become genetic differences over time

Some recent scholarship conjectures that the physical differences between men and women (men being larger and more muscular, women being smaller) comes from generations of self-selective breeding. Body types outside the accepted norm were less likely to reproduce, and over time what began as a product of behavior turned into a product of genetics.

[JoFerret]

53. How much time?

generally speaking.

[marshall]

54. Centruries, at least

It could translate to what Rev. Wright is talking about. Over the course of generations when a brain is used in one way by a group of people, the brain would begin to develop differently.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

57. He said "right brain" and "left brain" - that is something you are born with.

n/t

[Beregond2]

60. Exactly.

Why are people on this board so anxious to jump to stupid, unjustified conclusions about this man? It is as if they WANT him to be a problem, so they aid in spreading lies about what he says.

[grantcart]

67. Pedagogy of the Oppressed thats only 30 years old

were talking about mainstream slightly to the left academic work here folks