This thread is for people who want to talk about the issues and only the issues

[bluestateguy]

I'm talking about Iraq, health care, education, the economy, the environment and other extremely wonky boring policy issues.

Anything with the words Rev. Wright, or "gate" on the end of it will not be welcome in this thread.

OK, who wants to start?

[Lucky 13]

1. Anybody know where the Dems stand on ANWR?

What about protected lands, endangered species, etc? Any differences between the two?

I've been so focused on Iraq and the Economy, I have taken for granted their positions on the environment.

[flor de jasmim]

3. I seem to recall Obama saying he will have people look over every

signing statement (and, I presume, the other legislative changes which did not even go through Congress--so-called minor legislation) for damage which has been done. And call in Al Gore (at least as a consulant).

[bigbrother05]

2. I would like to know about Hillary's

Windfall Tax for the gasoline vacation

[Yossariant]

4. LOL! Obama fans got religion. NOW, all of a sudden, they wanna talk "issues."

:rofl:
Obama basic training

Volunteers told to share personal conversion stories with voters - not policy views.

"On the verge of a hectic few weeks leading to Super Tuesday, the crucial Feb. 5 multistate primary including California's, Mack wanted to drill home one of the campaign's key strategies: telling potential voters personal stories of political conversion.

She urged volunteers to hone their own stories of how they came to Obama – something they could compress into 30 seconds on the phone.

'Work on that, refine that, say it in the mirror,' she said. 'Get it down.

She told the volunteers that potential voters would no doubt confront them with policy questions. Mack's direction: DON'T GO THERE..."
http://www.sacbee.com/111/v-print/story/649427.html

[Moochy]

5. Kumbaya and shit

[bigbrother05]

9. I asked the question about the Windfall Tax

that Hillary is boasting, because Hillary supporters, are saying this is a step up.
Could you answer this question?

[featherman]

6. I love you for trying but... good luck with that!

[PBS Poll-435]

7. Economic Subsidies...

The State of NY has offered an extremely generous package for AMD (Advanced Micro Devices) to build a chip fab in Malta (just north of Albanny.)

This will cost the city/county/state about 1.2 billion. It seems like this is becoming the norm.

Is it really worth that kind of investment of the people's money?

[jasmine621]

8. Here is one issue about "change" and "bringing folks together."

I have not bought into the Obama mantra because it somehow just didn't feel right. Now I have figured it out, at least for me. Obama is not the first black presidential candidate to raise these issues. Jesse Jackson did this with the "Rainbow Coalition" back in the 80's. What's difference?
For me the difference is this: Jackson's coalition was about bringing the voiceless togehter. The poor, the women raising children alone, farmers, poor whites, blacks, browns, yellows... He too spoke of changing Washington...and remember "Keep hope alive?" The difference with Obama is that he is talking about bringing the have's together, not much about the "have-nots" He throws them in occassionally but basically his message is the middle class/upper class. He was a community organizer in Chicago (ask what that accomplished). My brother-in-law was a "community oraganizer." A mainly stepping stone to get your name into the public view for political purposes to further your political career. Obama is really not bringing anything new to the table. He is just setting the table for a different group. And that's ok. But that's what maeks me uncomfortable with him.

[Aloha Spirit]

12. Obama's community organizing helped register 125,000 new Democrats in Illinois. Big deal. It's not

like Carol Moseley-Braun got elected or Clinton won the state or anything.

[bluestateguy]

14. And the Clintons have been so grateful to him for that too

The Clintons will always be there for you...when they need you.

[bluestateguy]

10. Well, I see this thread is petering out

Better we should be yapping about a ex-pastor who is not running for any office.

[bluestateguy]

11. I will kick this thread until I turn purple in the face

I just cannot tolerate the Rev. Wright crap on this board that makes this board look like Fox News.

[PBS Poll-435]

13. You could reply to my response... :-)

It is a real issue.

:P

[Solon]

15. Whoever is going to be the next president will have to be dragged to the left...

on pretty much every issue. This is assuming its a Democrat in the White House, as such, issues we need to concentrate on:

Domestic Issues:

Health Care, pressure the President to support H.R. 676 and pull a fucking LBJ on Moderate Dems in Congress who haven't signed onto it yet. If this includes threats, arm twisting, bribes, whatever the fuck will get it done, it has to be done.

Employment/Poverty, pressure the President to push for a replacement of the federal minimum wage with a living wage based on census data of costs of living in all localities in the nation. Have this wage indexed with inflation as well.

Energy/Environment, pressure the President to increase funding for Amtrak, and pressure Congress to rebuild and improve our national rail system, and divide it between freight and passenger rail, so they no longer have to share the same track. Increase investment in alternative sources of electricity where it makes sense, along with electric, high speed, trains for regional and continental travel.

Foreign Policy/Military:

War on Terror, the next president will have to be honest and admit this was a farce perpetuated by both parties to prop themselves up. Turn it into an international law enforcement issue, and fully sign on and support the ICC so it can prosecute the criminals of 9/11 and other terrorist acts. Oh, and include Bush and Company for war crimes.(last one is pipe dream, but what a dream!)

War in Iraq, start a gradual withdrawal of troops immediately, eventually reducing the amount of troops to zero within a year. While this is going on, promise a carrot to the Iraqi government in the form of money to rebuild what was destroyed, and as reparations for the damage done. This will be done under only two conditions, the current government must demonstrate it can keep Iraq together, without oppressing any minorities, and all elections from here on out must be subjected to monitoring by international bodies who specialize in monitoring elections.

Military, guarantee that the GAO is going to fully examine Pentagon spending, in all departments, and guarantee that cost savings measures will take place, including cuts in wasteful military programs. Begin closing bases in most other nations on the planet, we simply can't afford to man all of them at this time.

Diplomacy/general Foreign Policy, stop the sabre-rattling that seems to be symptomatic of our foreign policy for most of this century. Especially against democratic nations just because they don't have our corporations best interests at heart. Open up diplomatic ties with Iran, North Korea, and Cuba, and end that damned embargo, once and for all. Start acting like a partner rather than a master of other nations.

ON EDIT:

Contractors in the Military, ban them, yes ALL of them, they waste money, we don't need to hire a fucking private company, at extraordinary cost, to feed our troops with spoiled food, fuck them, the military should be able to feed themselves. Make PMCs completely illegal for the Military to employ, and illegal to operate domestically in any form. Force these companies to offshore themselves if they want to continue being scumsucking Mercs.

I could go on, but these are the big ones, neither Democratic candidate is going to do any of this on their own, we'll have to threaten them ourselves to get it done.

[lwcon]

16. What makes this difficult...

... is that the two Dem candidates are extremely similar to each other on policy. Their voting records are practically identical.

So, the discussion naturally gravitates toward trust issues (and not just whose misrepresentations trouble you more, such as Hillary's Bosnia embellishments, or Obama's misstating the circumstances of his famous antiwar speech).

On the "meta" level, I am concerned that Obama keeps repeating rightwing dogwhistle language, including citing "socialized medicine" as a too-extreme lefty position (in "Audacity").

Even Obama uber-support Kos just came to this conclusion, noting:

"... Obama is susceptible to caving to right-wing bullying taunts and threats."

and

"His refusal to acknowledge the political reality may very well be his greatest weakness."

Both Hillary and Obama are "smart enough" on policy. But I trust that she better understands that any progress made in this country must be done over the, metaphorically, dead body of the VRWC.

___

The Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy, now at my new home: Correntewire.com

[2rth2pwr]

17. If you want to know where Obama stands on the issues, check his website.

[bluestateguy]

18. Kick

:kick:

[bluestateguy]

19. Kick

This thread WILL NOT SINK!

[Aloha Spirit]

20. ANWR is not worth the effort to extract. Obama agrees with me:

"I strongly reject drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge because it would irreversibly damage a protected national wildlife refuge without creating sufficient oil supplies to meaningfully affect the global market price or have a discernable impact on U.S. energy security.”

[Aloha Spirit]

22. Hillary also opposed Arctic wildlife drilling:

"The answer to our energy challenge does not lie under the plains of the Arctic Refuge, but in the minds that are ingenious in America ."

[cosmicsheep]

21. Here is an issue then...

Clinton voted FOR the war in Iraq. That is a pretty friggin big issue in my book.

[shugah]

23. here are some threads devoted to specific issues

Poverty: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5726562&mesg_id=5726562

Middle Class: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5721090

Education: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5720508

i'll post a few more eventually, but waiting for the wr***t thing to taper off. it's nearly impossible to get an issue in edgewise when there is something glittering in the sunlight over there *ooh! SHINY!*

:hi:

[bluestateguy]

24. Kick

nt

[bluestateguy]

25. This thread will NEVER DIE

NEVER!!!

[Jed Dilligan]

26. My issue is that the "issues" probably won't matter

when our economic and environmental chickens come home to roost.

The policy proposals put forth in this campaign will be laughable in the face of the crises at hand.

My main reason for supporting Obama is that he is the only person I trust to lead people in that kind of situation. The default reaction will be to kill each other. Clinton or McCain will only make that worse.

[bluestateguy]

27. This thread WILL. NOT. DIE.

Only issues!

[bluestateguy]

28. Issues

nt

[casus belli]

29. And so it begins...Issue-gate

Sorry, I just couldn't resist. :)