Dailykos Blogger: BREAKING: Source of deceptive NC robo-calls exposed

[Bigleaf]

Facing South has confirmed the source of the calls, and the mastermind is Women's Voices Women Vote, a D.C.-based nonprofit which aims to boost voting among "unmarried women voters."

What's more, Facing South has learned that the firestorm Women's Voices has ignited in North Carolina isn't the group's first brush with controversy. Women's Voices' questionable tactics have spawned thousands of voter complaints in at least 11 states and brought harsh condemnation from some election officials for their secrecy, misleading nature and likely violations of election law.

Yesterday, I placed a call to the Virginia State Police, which had investigated similar suspicious robo-calls before that Virginia's primaries last February. Their investigation concluded that the source of the calls was Women's Voices Women Vote.

Facing South then contacted Women's Voices, and staffer Sarah Johnson confirmed they were doing similar robo-calls in North Carolina; they later admitted that they were the ones behind the deceptive "Lamont Williams" calls.

Women's Voices Executive Director Joe Goode worked for Bill Clinton's election campaign in 1992 as a pollster; the group's website says he was intimately involved in "development and implementation of all polling and focus groups done for the presidential primary and general election campaigns" for Clinton.

Some have also questioned the ties between Women's Voices operatives and Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Hillary Clinton. Gardner, for example, contributed $2,500 to Clinton's HILLPAC on May 4, 2006, and in March 2005 she donated a total of $4,200 to Clinton, according to The Center for Responsive Politics' OpenSecrets.org. She has not contributed to the Obama campaign, according to the database.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/4/30/11055/6499/141/506343

[Adelante]

1. Good work!

:thumbsup:

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

202. NC Voters, PLEASE check your voter registration or EARLY VOTE

Anecdotal reports from around the state indicate that some voters, often who registered through the Department of Motor Vehicles, are discovering that they are NOT registered to vote.

Please urge all voters in North Carolina, regardless of where or how they registered - to check their voter registration status.

Voters can either look up their registration online if they have a computer, or call their County Board of Elections office. If the voter is not registered, they can still go to an early voting site in their county, and register and vote at the same time. Time is running out - early voting is the last chance to register in person and it ends May 3.

VOTERS: Make Sure You Are Registered to Vote and That Your Vote Counts -Check Your Registration at the State Board of Elections website Look to the left hand side for the "Voter registration button"

Call your County Election Director to check your voter registration if you do not have access to a computer. It is in the phone book. They will be happy to answer your questions.

You can still register and vote during "One Stop Absentee" (Early) Voting: Apr. 17 - May 3

The North Carolina State Board of Elections website now has up to date and easy to understand information for new and current voters. Find out how to register, where to vote, locations of early voting sites and more

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

205. This group also sent pre-filled registration forms to already registered voters

and this has bogged down our County BoEs and slowed down their ability
to process legitimate forms for voters who haven't been registered yet.

[crankychatter]

224. wow... that is NO small thing

at a critical time in the process

[Adelante]

249. Is this story getting NC press? nt

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

283. Its got legs in NC and Nationally

Do a google search. I am hoping for criminal charges or else a lawsuit
after the election.

See this:

(((((((((( The RBC Update: Vote suppression in North Carolina? ))))))))))

2008.04.30 16:02:22


------------------------------------------------------------------------

Looks that way. From a group whose "leadership team" used to
include Maggie Williams, her business partner, and the
direct-mail guy for the Clinton campaign.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://WWW.samefacts.com/archives/campaign_2008_/2008/04/vote_suppression_in_north_carolina.php

April 30, 2008
Vote suppression in North Carolina?
Posted by Mark Kleiman
Women's Voices, Women's Votes is a 501 c(3) nonprofit devoted to registering unmarried women to vote. It has lots of connections to the Clinton campaign; as of a year ago, the "leadership team" included Maggie Williams, her business partner Pat Griffin, and Hal Malchow, now the direct-mail honcho of the Clinton campaign.

WVWV paid for a bunch of robo-calls to black voters in North Carolina — men as well as women — in which someone identified only as "Lamont Williams" said that a voter registration packet was on its way to them and that they should sign it and mail it back to be registered to vote. The calls went out after the mail-in registration deadline, but before the deadline for one-stop registration and early voting; any voter who relied on the information in the call would wind up being disenfranchised for the upcoming primary. In addition, many of the recipients were already registered, and the calls were well-designed to cause them to doubt whether they could vote before receiving the promised package in the mail.

The calls came from an "ID blocked" number and included no reference to WVWV, which makes them illegal in North Carolina. WVWV has been caught doing similar things in black neighborhoods just before other primaries this year, including in Virginia.

So: Was this an amazing set of good-faith mistakes, or was it a series of attempts by people friendly to the Clinton campaign to suppress the black vote in order to benefit HRC against Obama?

Considering the illegal anonymity ("Lamont Williams" does not exist), the targeting of black neighborhoods rather than women (and the use of a streotypically "black" name for the caller), the unlikelihood that a well-funded, highly professional voter-registration group would not know about the registration deadlines and be unable to restrict its mailings to people not yet registered, the national pattern, and the amazingly lame response by WVWC after they were caught, what do you think?

Posted at 11:44 AM | TrackBack (0) | |

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

314. AP: Obama wants pro-Clinton group investigated

Obama wants pro-Clinton group investigated

By JIM KUHNHENN – 8 hours ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — Barack Obama's presidential campaign wants federal regulators to investigate fellow Democrats who are backing Hillary Rodham Clinton's candidacy, taking intraparty discord to a new level of confrontation.

Obama's campaign lawyer, Robert Bauer, filed a complaint Wednesday with the Federal Election Commission, accusing the pro-Clinton American Leadership Project of violating campaign finance laws by running ads against Obama. The group is spending $920,000 for an ad in Indiana questioning Obama's economic policies.

The group is largely financed by the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees and is run by Democratic operatives, many of them based in California and who have past connections to Clinton or her husband. Its organizers say they are abiding by the law and a 2007 Supreme Court ruling.

Bauer, in his complaint and in a teleconference with reporters, likened the group to organizations that had to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines for ad campaigns in the 2004 presidential election. Among them was the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, which attacked Democrat John Kerry's service in Vietnam and his subsequent anti-war stance.

"This organization is a Swift Boat wannabe and it's violating the law in exactly the same way," Bauer said.

...more at the link

[redqueen]

331. The timing of this could not be worse for her campaign.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

342. NC Media isn't mentioning Clinton ties, they keep trying to help her

anyone know how to get Olbermann to cover this?

[redqueen]

345. Of course not... and in one article I read WVWV was described as "nonpartisan".

Are they really?

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

344. firm in charge of voter outreach for WVWV is MSHC Partners...campaign owes MSHC $807,000

firm in charge of voter outreach for WVWV is MSHC Partners...campaign owes MSHC $807,000..

http://southernstudies.org/facingsouth/2008/04/same-firm-does-voter-contact-work-for.asp

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

206. Many of the recipients are African-American;

Many of the recipients are African-American;

There are other questions about Women's Voices' outreach efforts. Although the group purports to be targeting "unmarried women," their calls and mailings don't fit the profile. Kevin Farmer in Durham, who first recorded the call, is a white male. Many of the recipients are African-American; Rev. Nelson Johnson, who is a married, male and African-American, reported that his house was called four times by the mysterious "Lamont Williams."

And as Farmer asks, "Why are they using a guy for the calls if the target audience is single women?"

[Alcibiades]

267. Great job, Kevin!

He would be an odd person to target. I seriously doubt they just called him at random.

I recall I got a strange call from someone when I was volunteering at the Obama office a day or two after it opened, complaining about how "left-wing nutjobs" were taking over the Democratic party. The odd thing was, the fellow claimed to be a Democrat, appeared to be working from a list of talking points, and seemed to have as his only job the task of engaging whoever was on the phone for as long as possible. When I pointed out that he seemed to have no point oth3er than to tie up the phone lines, he hung up.

Strange stuff going on in Durham these days.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

208. Women's Voices Exec Director Joe Goode worked for Bill Clinton's election campaign in 1992

Women's Voices Executive Director Joe Goode worked for Bill Clinton's election campaign in 1992

Some have also questioned the ties between Women's Voices operatives and Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Hillary Clinton. Gardner, for example, contributed $2,500 to Clinton's HILLPAC on May 4, 2006, and in March 2005 she donated a total of $4,200 to Clinton, according to The Center for Responsive Politics' OpenSecrets.org. She has not contributed to the Obama campaign, according to the database.

Women's Voices Executive Director Joe Goode worked for Bill Clinton's election campaign in 1992 as a pollster; the group's website says he was intimately involved in "development and implementation of all polling and focus groups done for the presidential primary and general election campaigns" for Clinton.

Women's Voices board member John Podesta, former Chief of Staff for President Bill Clinton, donated $2,300 to Hillary Clinton on April 19, 2007, according to OpenSecrets.org. Podesta also donated $1,000 to Barack Obama in July 2004, but that was well before Obama announced his candidacy for president.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

242. We need plaintiffs who are disenfranchised by this:

A few voter advocacy groups are watching this in NC, but we will need plaintiffs,
people are go to vote and then are disenfranchised because of this women's group's action.

The reports will come through calls to this hotline:

Call 1-866- MY-VOTE-1
TO REPORT YOUR VOTING EXPERIENCE

[writes3000]

2. Surprise! Not. Gutter politics again. So disappointing. n/t

[PoliticalAmazon]

181. Hillary LOVES to wallow in pig-slop politics. n/t

[PretzelzRule]

305. Ain't that the truth

was channel surfing a little while ago, and stopped on Fox's O'Reilly Factor long enough to see Shilly sitting across from BillO, pastorbaiting, of course

:grr:

[cali]

3. Disgusting. Hilly needs to denounce and reject this

and ask her pals to cease this shit, or she's as guilty as they are.

[mythyc]

148. don't worry she wont she never does she's sparkly in her gutter trash

[ErinBerin84]

4. Wow, I was wrong.

I was hoping that it had been the Republicans.

[RoadRage]

13. Nope.. sadly the Repugs are playing this nicer then Hillary so far...

I'm not saying that won't change once we get this down to a nominee - but thus far McCain & Co is probably taking notes from Mrs. Clinton on how to run a gutter ball, sleazy no-holds-barred campaign. She's quite the teacher!

[ErinBerin84]

25. Yes, I find it especially disheartening that

it is a Womens' advocacy group.

[Jackpine Radical]

250. Not a Women's advocacy group...

a HILLARY advocacy group. The pretense allows them to do all kinds of things for Hill that they couldn't if they were more visibly connected to the candidate.

[roseBudd]

41. The GOP dare not stoop this low, they fear a Macaca moment

[SoCalDem]

And why waste precious GOP resources when Hillary's donors will pay for it all?

That's smart politics..:(

[crankychatter]

66. I need to see proof that Clinton Campaign paid for this

not that there is much doubt... too many other states

it's not a downticket NC candidate... not enough money

and too many locations

it's got to be expensive to pay an otherwise "reputable" firm to commit a felony... multiple felonies

I always charge a lot of money for felonies

;-P

[Melinda]

154. Hillary's campaign manger, Maggie Williams, is on Womens Voice Leadership team...

Close enough for ya?

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Women%27s_Voices._Women_Vote

[karynnj]

167. Woah - great work - that is close

The Clinton campaign should be asked to respond - and to remove Maggie Williams. They like shakeups anyway.

[catgirl]

219. Yes, and they're trying to cover that up!

[Hutzpa]

233. smoebody should save that before they remove it,

they might wanna cover up their mess.

wink wink

[EFerrari]

59. Unfortunately, this is exactly how they steal elections every time. n/t

[burythehatchet]

158. It was. Hillary did it.

[Shae]

298. I think Hilly switched parties

and forgot to tell us.

If it quacks like a duck . . .

[crankychatter]

5. I still need to know the precise nature of these calls

anyone know? got a link? transcript?

puh puh pleez?

[onenote]

10. see description in this thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5743783&mesg_id=5743783

[chill_wind]

64. TPM also has the story A tape of the call is availaible (links)

By Hook or By Crook
Does that group doing voter-suppression calls in North Carolina have ties to the Clinton campaign?

--Josh Marshall


http://talkingpointsmemo.com/







FACING SOUTH EXCLUSIVE: D.C. nonprofit aimed at women voters behind deceptive N.C. robo-calls {/b]

Long and disturbing full text here:


"(...)
The call is deceptive because the deadline has already passed for mail-in registrations for North Carolina's May 6 primary. Also, many who have received the calls -- like Kevin Farmer in Durham, who made a tape of the call that is available here -- are already registered. The call's suggestion that they're not registered has caused widespread confusion and drawn hundreds of complaints, including many from African-American voters who received the calls.

The calls are also probably illegal. Farmer and others have told Facing South the calls use a blocked phone number and provided no contact information -- a violation of North Carolina rules regulating "robo-calls" (N.C. General Statute 163-104(b)(1)c). N.C. Attorney General Roy Cooper further stated in a recent memo that the identifying information must be clear enough to allow the recipient to "complain or seek redress" -- something not included in the calls.

MORE: http://southernstudies.org/facingsouth/2008/04/facing-south-exclusive-dc-nonprofit.asp

[MH1]

16. please read the diary at dailykos.

it has some pretty detailed info about the nature of the calls.

[crankychatter]

47. got it, thank you.... and um.... HOLY CRAP!?!?!

un flipping believable

Hillary Clinton donors... Former Bill Clinton campaign employees

so. some "good" gets done from that office as well?

Well, they sure made up for that...

When will this be on MSNBC every newscast for a week?

[Adelante]

48. Some previous stories on this site

http://www.southernstudies.org/facingsouth/

[graycem]

6. I hope that this gets reported

in some of the fake news. Hope the Obama campaign is addressing this.

[ampad]

Disgusting

I'm glad they got the assholes. Kick and Rec.

[DevonRex]

7. Of course it was a Hillary group doing it. Thanks for the link. nt

[Ronnie]

135. "...a Hillary group..."?

What does that mean?

[Melinda]

169. How about HILLARY'S CAMPAIGN MANAGER?

Close enough for you?

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Women%27s_Voices._Women_Vote

Women's Voices Leadership Team: Maggie Williams

[Ronnie]

194. So, any group that Maggie Williams has anything to do with

is a Hillary group? Gotcha. Then that philosophy can be applied to Mr. Obama? Ooh, I like this game.

[Barrymores Ghost]

218. Wow. The depths of denial and sycophantic excuse-making that some are capable of...

...are simply mind-blowing.

[Tunkamerica]

271. so this is alright with you?

as someone in Durham I find this pretty distressing.

[bobbert]

289. Absolutely, if David Plouffe is on the leadership team for a nonprofit that commits a felony

please, by all means, trash Obama's campaign as much as you want. I would be delighted to see that :)

[ekwhite]

290. Go ahead - play that game

:grr: I'm sure I can come up with a few names she is associated with.

[frylock]

300. wake the fuck up

[Avalux]

8. No surprise there!

More evidence the Clintons will do anything to win.

[Eurobabe]

9. No big surprise. HRC is disgusting.

:thumbsdown: Hillary!!

[Hope And Change]

11. K & R!

:kick:

[myrna minx]

12. This makes me sick.

:-(

[Bread and Circus]

14. That's just sickening. Assholes.

[MadBadger]

15. Why is Joe running Women's Voices.

That just seems stupid to me that the executive director is a he.

[SoxFan]

34. Womens Voices. Mens Consulting Fees.

[Aloha Spirit]

65. catchy! nt

[Kaylee]

17. And people wonder why Hillary has lost the "Black" vote....

As a black woman, I formally tell Clinton...F U.

[elmerdem]

323. and as a white man,

I formally tell Clinton...F U.

[crankychatter]

18. Have any Clinton supporters come back to the light, in disgust yet?

cuz I have most of them on ignore and wouldn't know

[DJ13]

19. Any bets the MSM never bothers to cover this?

[scheming daemons]

20. I predict there won't be a SINGLE Hillbot responding in this thread....

...

[SoCalDem]

87. Found one..see below

demands that I prove it :)

[chill_wind]

21. Thank you for finding this. K&R n/t

[libnnc]

22. How will Hillbot explain away THAT shit?

Crooked bastards.

[northzax]

74. explain what?

the someone who donated money to her campaign appears to have committed a crime? she should return the donations, definately.

[libnnc]

82. will she return the cash?

AND denounce the illegal actions?

[northzax]

95. I would certainly hope so nt

[cui bono]

278. AND make sure that every affected voter gets registered and to the polls?

The damage may already have been done.

[libnnc]

279. exactly

[northzax]

347. well, it wouldn't have effected registration

since the calls started AFTER the registration deadline in North Carolina. Yet one more really odd thing about this whole thing.

[Melinda]

111. Bill Clinton's former WH Chief of Staff sits on the board of Womens Voices for God sake!

Political novice, are we? Do the research, read the information... follow the assosciations and the money. All roads lead to Clinton.

[alcibiades_mystery]

254. Depends on what the definition of "sits" is

:evilgrin:

[northzax]

319. ah, right

one thing is more important even than follow the money, and that is 'who benefits'? Care to explain why Hillary Clinton would want to suppress the female vote? A demographic she wins? Wouldn't this be like obama trying I suppress the hipster vote?

[redqueen]

332. Although they are trying to claim they targeted women...

it seems as if that, too, is a lie.

Tell me this... what makes you think it's reasonable to expect the truth from an organization that engages in that sort of crap?

[Spazito]

338. Why, if their intent is encourage the female vote, did they ....

target African American voters, both male and female, using a phony name and not identifying themselves?

Hmmmm, who would benefit from suppressing the African American vote?

[yourguide]

23. Now we need to go through hil's FEC records to see if we can find a connection.

Shady is as shady does.

[jefferson_dem]

24. ClintonInc is a disgrace to the Democratic Party

I'll be happy when we kick the lot of them to the curb.

[mckeown1128]

26. You beat me to it... sorry about the dupe... nt

[madfloridian]

27. Kick

and recommended.

[EFerrari]

28. The Clintons are lovely people who have always been good

to the black community. :puke:

[ej510]

30. Fuck her I'm done with her! Yeah the Clinton's love the black

community!

[myrna minx]

32. Just when I think I couldn't be more disappointed in them,

I'm horribly surprised. :-(

[Lucky 13]

52. I feel the same way. Just when you think they can't possibly go any lower....

... they go lower. Revolting.

Seriously, they are evil and they must be stopped.

I am TRYING to be a good Dem and tow the party line, "Whoever is the nominee will get my vote." But I just don't know. I just don't know if I can vote for a candidate that pulls this shit. My conscience is having a hard time with that concept and they aren't making it any easier on me.

[EFerrari]

57. There might be one good thing we can pull from this.

The database of voters being targeted.

They bought it from someone, right? So that means, Republican operatives will also be able to buy it.

If we could get our hands on it, we'll know whose vote we have to protect come November. :grr:

[Hutzpa]

217. Thats a trail thats need an attention

absolutely correct, there is someone out there who sold them the
database that they got the names from, thats who the party needs
to go after.

[eridani]

302. Bingo! Please send this to the Obama campaign n/t

[C_U_L8R]

29. Wake up Hillary fans, this is where your dollars are going

and the type of Presidency you are campaigning for.
Are you really okay with this sort of thing?

[LVjinx]

63. Did you read the article? They gave Hillary money, not the other way around.

[crankychatter]

73. good point and I agree there needs to be proof...

...but nobody commits felonies for free... not at this level

so don't hold your breath for Clinton's exoneration...

you'll turn blue

[C_U_L8R]

76. and they get their money (and marching orders) from where?

we all know how this game works.

[Ronnie]

137. What game would that be?

Degrees of separation?
Guilt by association?
Didn't you think that was unfair when people played these games with Obama? I did.

[C_U_L8R]

166. Let's find out. We'll see once they start squawking...

And squawk they will... or risk going to jail.
Somehow with Clinton staffers on their board, I don't
think they were campaigning for John McCain.

[Politicalboi]

255. So you disagree

On how Hillary is running her campaign? Because they have been running on "Guilt By Association".
I went to one of the links above and read this from someone's reply.

"You know, you can't choose your parents, but you can choose your husband... I know I wouldn't have stayed married to him for 30 years. Now of course, I'm only saying this because someone asked me directly what I thought. I mean I'm not offering up my opinion for political gain, or anything. I just think if you're going to be in a marriage, it should at least count for something. I think it sends the wrong signal to our children about the state of straight marriage in this country. But you know, she chose someone who was always a cheater... I mean, as far as I know... of course there could be no basis for that. Calling him a serial cheater and sexual abuser... is what some people are calling him. Of course I have no opinion on the matter. I was just responding to your direct question... you know what I mean..."

[Tunkamerica]

273. you just said earlier in the thread that you liked this game

implying that you would do this to Obama.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

31. They should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

However, I don't think Clinton is personally responsible for everything her supporters do. Unless she, or someone in her campaign, knew this was going on and said nothing, I don't think she is responsible. However, she should return the money from these assholes.

[mckeown1128]

40. How do you suppose this non-profit is funded...

hmmm?????

[SemiCharmedQuark]

61. Unless she supported them *after* she was aware of what they were doing

Or someone in her campaign knew of it, I don't think she can be blamed. Apparently this goes back a few months though. So who knows.

[mckeown1128]

77. My bet is on her "inner cirle of donors"...

the same ones that have threatened Dean, Peloci, and the DNC are behind this.

[americanstranger]

71. Who's to say that clinton is paying them to do this?

I mean, they're supporters and contributors, but these robo-calls are not cost-free.

Check the billing records from Clinton's campaign and see if this company's name - or the names of any of the principals - show up.

I'd bet money that they do show up, somewhere.

- as

[crankychatter]

86. usually the contractor takes the fall... plausible deniability

that's why they make the big bucks

there was a book about this... "How to rig an election: Confessions of a Republican Operative."

[redqueen]

33. Uh oh! Can't blame those calls on the other side now, can we?

Or... are we? ;)

[libnnc]

42. oh they'll twist themselves into a pretzel trying

no worries.

[crankychatter]

54. somebody paid for it... and we need to know who... and NOW

who and now

post haste

[Frustratedlady]

35. So, the Dems try to stay above board in their actions, but Hillary even screws that up?

We can hardly point our fingers at the Repugs, if we are doing the same kind of crap. All these years of building up evidence against the Repugs and she shows that we're no better than they are.

I am so angry at the Hillary camp, I can't see straight.

[leftofcool]

36. I am a Hillary supporter and she should indeed either

denounce this or make perfectly clear she has nothing to do with it.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

38. She should return their money also.

Again, unless she or someone in her campaign knew of this, I don't believe she should be blamed for rogue supporters.

[Barrymores Ghost]

225. How could she possibly claim the latter?

Her frickin' campaign manager is on the frickin' LEADERSHIP team!

[marions ghost]

270. yep otherwise

she can be tarred like Obama, with guilt by association...

Wondering if her campaign manager has swung into damage control yet. They KNOW this is 'out there.' Do they even care? Or are they so insulated and untouchable like the Bushies it just doesn't seem to matter much. Maybe Hill thinks that because she has survived everything they threw at her (& at Bill) that "this too shall pass"....just another day as a gladiator in the snake pit...

Just wondering what the Hillary camp might be thinking around about now.

[cbayer]

37. How in the world do you hold a candidate responsible

for things done by people who have no other connection to her other than donations?

How do y'all make that link? Is is OK to link every action by every person who has donated to Obama to Obama himself?

What is sleazy here is the way some members of DU will slam one candidate or the other without any basis in fact. Pathetic.

[Frustratedlady]

43. If it has been done in 24 states, Hillary would have known about it if her people were involved.

Time will tell.

[redqueen]

44. I hope you defend every GOP-backed Atwateresque stunt with the same passionate zeal.

I suspect you'll get all the support that opinion deserves.

[cbayer]

85. How do you get the idea that I defend this tactic?

I don't. It's despicable. Also, I believe it is a felony and that the people responsible are in very deep shit.

I just have the sense not to jump to conclusions about who is ultimately responsible without having adequate data. I didn't post my comment to get support. I posted it to challenge people.

[redqueen]

88. Ah, well if you look at the resposes... most are interested

in finding out if her campaign was aware, since this has happened in more than one state, and there have been thousands of complaints.

:hi:

[cbayer]

93. Agreed. But many are drawing the conclusion without the proof.

That's what I object to. I would object if it were the other way, as well.

:hi:

[redqueen]

99. Right on.

:)

[Melinda]

Hillary's Campaign Manger Maggie Williams is on Women's Voices Leadership Team

Is that a close enough connection? I'd say one can indeed draw a direct inference, if not presumption!

[cbayer]

191. It appears that she was at some time in the past.

I can't find anything linking her to that group now, but that doesn't mean there is not a link.

BTW, WCWC has issued an apology and explanation today. I doubt that anyone is interested in that.

[redqueen]

246. Considering how long this has been going on...

not to mention a previous police investigation... that "confusion" BS isn't exactly persuasive. At all.

[cbayer]

257. I can't do this anymore.

The mob mentality over this issue is just too strong. There is absolutely nothing I can say, no plea for reason, that will budge anyone. Conclusions, which may or may not turn out to be true, are being drawn based on very little actual data. I have thought about it and concluded that many strong Obama supporters are very hurt and upset by the events of the last 2 days. I also feel very, very sad about what has happened.

I am backing out of this debate. It just adds to the sadness I feel over the Obama-Wright issue. I do appreciate your having been civil in your interactions with me. I also hope that you are wrong about this issue.

[redqueen]

260. I appreciate your being a decent guy.

Period.

Peace... :hug:

[druidity33]

274. people

who are good at things like this will leave no "proof"...

and any "Fact" will be obfuscated.


:shrug:

[libnnc]

94. more than one state...thousands of complaints...

sounds like a coordinated effort. How could she not have been aware this was happening?

[redqueen]

101. The "plausible" in "plausible deniability" has been loosened a LOT

it seems. :P

[crankychatter]

184. I'm a little slow... but you got THAT right

how can she roller skate through this one?

her CAMPAIGN MANAGER for crying out loud...

I hear it's all over the net... ppl are blogging at ABC... everyWHERE

[redqueen]

196. Heh.

Let's see the M$M try to keep this one under wraps.

[Indenturedebtor]

Oh please

As though this would be at all inconsistent with her past actions. This is just par for the course. She's a slimey disgrace.

[cbayer]

90. Your hate is showing. nt.

[Indenturedebtor]

53. Oh please

As though this would be at all inconsistent with her past actions. This is just par for the course. She's a slimey disgrace.

[DJ13]

55. "How in the world do you hold a candidate responsible........

for things done by people who have no other connection to her other than donations?"


The same way the Clinton camp and the MSM have been holding Obama responsible for words of someone not directly connected to his campaign.

[cbayer]

100. I agree to some extent.

I have not personally done that.

[cali]

118. I'm sorry. that doesn't begin to cut it. The exec director

is a long time Clinton associate, but putting that aside, this story has been out there for over a week, and NO denunciation from hill. it's being done to benefit her, she should ask them to stop.

[cbayer]

131. Do you know that to be true?

The research I have done shows a weak link that does not equate to *long time associate*.

I first heard of the story yesterday and only heard of the connection today. I am interested in how she will address it.

[cali]

136. From the OP

"Women's Voices Executive Director Joe Goode worked for Bill Clinton's election campaign in 1992 as a pollster; the group's website says he was intimately involved in "development and implementation of all polling and focus groups done for the presidential primary and general election campaigns" for Clinton."

And according to info in the OP, this group has been engaged in this kind of shady stuff for quite some time.

I first saw the story about NC push polling about a week ago. v

[cbayer]

147. Right.

I read that and then did some further research. He was a member of a firm who did the polling for Clinton in 1992. That appears to be the only connection.

This is some pretty appalling stuff which I hope the Clinton camp will distance themselves from. If there is a connection, I will be very unhappy.

[Barrymores Ghost]

243. How about her CAMPAIGN MANAGER, who is on the flippin' WVWV Leadership team????

Or did you miss that part???

:banghead:

[Lucky 13]

39. Any Hillary supporters care to defend this one?

How can anyone stand to be associated with this anymore? It's just despicable.

[Ronnie]

161. "It's just dith-picable."

The people who did the deed.
The people on this thread who
blame it on Senator Clinton with
nothing but innuendo. Any lawyer
would laugh you out of her office.

[ekwhite]

309. Spinning like a whirling dervish, aren't you?

This group is obviously closely associated with the Clinton campaign through the prominent Clinton supporters in positions of power in this organization.

[Lucky 13]

335. Take some responsibility for your despicable candidate if you choose to still support her.

So here's what we know:

Her campaign manager is on the board of the organization.
The organization was caught doing illegal robocalls in other states previously, were told to stop, the campaign was made aware, and they continued.
The staff of the org. are Clinton donors.

What would it take for you to admit Hillary's campaign had some roll? Does Hillary have to do the outgoing message for the Robocall herself? Do you need Hillary's signature on the document authorizing it?

No, none of those things will happen because her surrogates insulate her from any DIRECT malfeasance. And you blinded Hillary supporters are in such DEEP DEEP denial you would never even allow your tiny little brains to consider the POSSIBILITY that her campaign was involved in this or any other misdeed. No, to you Hillary can do no wrong, perhaps because in your minds nothing is "wrong" if it brings her closer to the nomination. Another despicable way to think.

But make no mistake, she knew about this. It's going to come out and she's going to have to answer some serious questions. And yeah, it is despicable. And abhorrent. And morally reprehensible. And totally par for the course when it comes to Hillary and her thugs.

It is becoming harder and harder for me to say with conviction that I will vote for Hillary if she is the nominee. My conscience is having a hard time with the concept of pulling the lever for someone involved with something as serious as election fraud. Combine that with all the other shit she has manufactured in this campaign and it makes me downright sick to my stomach. She has the character and morals of a sewer rat and I don't want her anywhere NEAR the White House.

[redstate_democrat]

45. Okay so I formally announce

that I despise the Clintons. They have engaged in the worst kind of politics I've ever seen. They are targeting black voters to disenfranchise them. She will NEVER get the black vote back. FUCK HER.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

46. Let Me Guess: Really Stupid Reactionary People Will Claim Hillary Is Connected To This.

:eyes:

[redqueen]

60. How about: Really Pissed Off Dems Expect Hillary to Return Donations,

and Condemn the Group's Actions?

How about that?

:eyes: back atcha.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

70. Yup. I Was Right.

:crazy:

[redqueen]

75. So... I'm one of the ones you're calling "stupid"... thanks!

Check it out, whiners.

Another point in the "STFU whiner... it's not just Obama's supporters who are assholey" column. ;)

[Lucky 13]

69. A group, supporting Hillary, is doing robocalls giving black voters incorrect information.

That doesn't upset you? Are you not outraged? Do you not agree that this is WRONG?

At the very least, wouldn't you want Hillary to come out, denounce these calls, sever ties with the group, and possibly return the donations (if she has the money)?

Why are Hillary supporters never concerned about her connections to malfeasance? Doesn't it concern you as Americans, as Democrats? Do you honestly believe this was done with out ANY consultation with her campaign?

Believing that requires an AMAZING suspension of disbelief in my opinion.

These are REPUBLICAN tricks! We're supposed to be better than this!

OMC, help me understand.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

So Silly It's Hilarious!!!

I love how the mindless just get all in a tizzy and just immediately tie this to Hillary somehow. It's funny as hell!!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Lucky 13]

104. You didn't address anything in my previous post.

Seriously... help me understand.

[donheld]

203. Your right on and OMC knows it

He can be quite the little jack ass at times.

[cali]

124. stupid is as stupid does, dear.

And your posts in this thread are a splendid example of how it doesn't do very well.

Thanks for the illustration.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

130. Connecting This To Hillary Is Plain Dumb. I'm Laughin My Ass Off At It.

Seriously, could the accusations be any more stupid? Holy cow LOL

:rofl:

[cali]

138. but I'm not connecting it to Hillary, darlin'. Let me walk you through this

It's simple. This group is perpetrating illegal and slimy machinations. They are doing it to benefit Hillary. She is aware of this. (She couldn't possibly NOT be). She has an obligation to denounce and reject those tactics being carried out on her behalf.

Even a 6 year old should be able to grasp something that simple. But you....

:rofl:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

143. You Haven't, But Many Have. Makes Them Look Really Really Dumb.

And of course Hillary should denounce it, and of course she will. Any person with a modicum of critical thinking ability left knows she wouldn't condone this shit. Get a grip.

[redqueen]

144. The strawman method of message board debate - ignore the points

and mock the non-points.

You'd seem a lot more intelligent if you ignored the BS and addressed the actual substance.

[cali]

150. you're the one completely out of touch, hon.

She has not denounced it. it's been known for several days. She should already have denounced this group. duh.

[Lucky 13]

276. Really? Cause I am. Her campaign manager is on the board.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5753754&mesg_id=5753754

[Melinda]

174. Hillary's Campaign Mananger, Maggie Williams, is on Women's Voices Leadership Team...

Connection enough for ya?

[cali]

195. holy shit. make that into its own thread.

please.

[Lucky 13]

275. You may think it's silly, but as it turns out, her campaign manager is on their board.

No connection to Hillary? You're not going to be laughing tomorrow.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5753754&mesg_id=5753754

[Lerkfish]

110. all manner of vile and disgusting actions are okeydoke if the Goddess of Peace benefits.

basically

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

132. ROFLMAO!!!!

Oh I love it!!!! Yes, Hillary masterminded it all! You're a genius!!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[TheZug]

79. Read the article, genius.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

81. I Did, Waldo.

[TheZug]

Then you can see there are plenty of curious connections worth investigating.

[redqueen]

96. Apparently not!

:rofl:

[cali]

125. Mr. Self-titled brilliant shows

he's decidedly not.

:rofl:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

134. No, I Can Plainly See How Stupid The Theory Is On Its Face And How Irrational Some Have Become.

[redqueen]

146. Which "theory" is that? You seem to be studiously ignoring the issues

preferring only to poke fun at the silliness.

Why is that?

[TheZug]

151. Kindly provide counterevidence or a refutation--or is that beneath your genius?

[demwing]

121. How About - Really Delusional Reactionary People Will Minimize Actions That Cannot Be Defended?

How about that one?

Do you think this group acted in a vacuum? And you have the nerve to imply that other people are stupid?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

128. Yeah, But Mine Was Accurate.

Yours is just a wildly irrational defensive response with no basis in reality.

:rofl:

[demwing]

180. Laugh all you like - It doesn't make you look any more intelligent

Nor does your insistence that your opponents are irrational make you look sane.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

193. But Saying Otherwise Most Definitely DOES Make You Look Stupid.

:rofl:

[cali]

123. oh, for pity's sake. rub a couple of brain cells together and try and get

a spark. This is being done on Clinton's behalf. It's been done repeatedly. The organizers of this effort are people she knows. She should not remain silent about it. She should ask them to desist and publically denounce such illegal and ugly tactics. duh.

[KoKo]

142. John Podesta (founder of Center for American Progress) is on their Board...what does that say about

CAP's views on Voting Fraud....and why the Dems refuse to do anything about it in Congress... :puke:


American Progress
From SourceWatch
Jump to: navigation, search

The Center for American Progress is a Washington, DC-based liberal think tank created and led by John D. Podesta.

The Center publishes a daily emailed Progress Report, said by the National Review to be "The most aggressive, most energetic opposition research in politics."

According to a 2003 article in the New York Times, Podesta's "goal is to build an organization to rethink the very idea of liberalism, a reproduction in mirror image of the conservative think tanks that have dominated the country's political dialogue for a generation.

"Many such left-leaning ventures have been tried over the years and have failed to wield much influence, but Podesta's effort seems different, not only because of his considerable personal stature within the party but also because rage at the Bush administration has galvanized Democrats.

"'The rise of the machinery of ideas on the right has been impressive,' Podesta told the gathering , to nods of assent. 'People have noticed it, and we have talked about it. But we haven't really found the vehicles to compete with what's coming at us.'

"Going back to Barry Goldwater, Podesta said, conservatives 'built up institutions with a lot of influence, a lot of ideas. And they generated a lot of money to get out those ideas. It didn't happen by accident. And I think it's had a substantial effect on why we have a conservative party that controls the White House and the Congress and is making substantial efforts to control the judiciary.'

"Podesta laid out his plan for what he likes to call a think tank on steroids. Emulating those conservative institutions, he said, a message-oriented war room will send out a daily briefing to refute the positions and arguments of the right. An aggressive media department will book liberal thinkers on cable TV. There will be an edgy Web site (thinkprogress.org) and a policy shop to formulate strong positions on foreign and domestic issues. In addition, Podesta explained how he would recruit hundreds of fellows and scholars -- some in residence and others spread around the country -- to research and promote new progressive policy ideas. American Progress is slated to operate with a $10 million budget next year, raised from big donors like the financier George Soros.

"'The question I'm asked most often is, When are we getting our eight words?' Podesta said. Conservatives, he went on, 'have their eight words in a bumper sticker: Less government. Lower taxes. Less welfare. And so on. Where's our eight-word bumper sticker? Well, it's harder for us, because we believe in a lot more things.' The Center for American Progress, Podesta said, was concerned with articulating these principles carefully, over time, rather than rushing out an agenda to help win an election in 2004. 'We're trying to build an idea base for the longer term,' he said, to bring about 'an enduring progressive majority.'"

[disndat]

280. Elizabeth Edwards is on the board

of a group called, "Center for American Progress Action Fund," a group reported to be headed by John Podesta, who used to be on Clinton's WH staff. If this is the same group that E. Edwards belongs, no wonder she endorsed Hilliar's health plan over Obama's. Hmmm. Maybe a DUer might be able to confirm or refute this.

[disndat]

333. The E.E. connection

I found this in Google:
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/thefix/2008/04/elizabeth_edwards_joins_center.html

[haymakeragain]

160. Too bad you ain't never been right.

Your sweeping declarations are the only "silly" thing that I can see. Wrong again.

[JuniperLea]

229. It will be spun that direction on dKos, no doubt...

It's getting pretty pithy over there... I stopped reading...

[mmonk]

49. whoops

No surprise.

[cliffordu]

50. HOW DARE YOU ACCUSE THE LION OF TUZLA OF DOING THIS???

The Goddess of Peace is all about the children. And trade. And flatbed debates.

[C_U_L8R]

68. I suppose you want an apology.

bwahahaha.
what malevolent clowns these clintoonians be.

[cliffordu]

84. At least they're fucking consistent.....

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[SoxFan]

103. "The Lion of Tuzla"

Memo to self: remember to steal this line.

[cliffordu]

108. Go right ahead - everyone should be using it. Tuzla

(I'm also adding the word "tuzla" to every post from now until it's over.)

You'd be surprised at how that drives certain flamebaiters nuts.

IT says EVERYTHING that needs to be said....

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Alii]

315. Lioness?

[City Lights]

51. How not shocking.

Whatever it takes!

:mad:

[nsd]

56. The Clinton campaign has to clarify their relationship with this group immediately.

Even though I support Obama, I rather doubt that they coordinated this -- you don't have to be a lawyer to realize it's illegal. Even so, they have to make that clear. This isn't some bullshit "gate" story -- this is a big deal.

[ErinBerin84]

62. I support Obama and I agree.

I don't neccessarily think that the Clinton campaign is connected to this (as far as I know..), but they should come out strong against it. It really disgusts me that this is a Democratic group and not some GOP sleezebag, because we expect that sort of stuff from them.

[high density]

58. In the words of Gordon Ramsay, "SHUT IT DOWN!"

As in shut down the Clinton campaign, it's a disgrace. Given the Clinton-endorsed Wright = Obama clause, we can easily assume WVWV = Clinton using the same logic. This is the end. (Said with a little sarcasm, but not much.)

[islandmkl]

67. one thing i can say about the clinton's:

they NEVER let me down.

They have met every low expectation I have had for the past 10 years.

[DerekJ]

72. Your country is messed up.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

78. That's what my English husband keeps telling me.

[redqueen]

83. No shit.

If I could afford to I'd have already left.

[futureliveshere]

80. Bah!! Bloody, Fucking, Idiotic, Stupid, Good-For-Nothing, Miserable Excuse for Democrats

I would spit on you with disgust if you were in front of me.

[chill_wind]

89. "Facing South Exclusive" has direct link to the details

http://southernstudies.org/facingsouth/2008/04/facing-south-exclusive-dc-nonprofit.asp

tape link: http://www.democracy-nc.org/nc/spprncall.wav

[marions ghost]

179. thanks for the excellent links

"the calls have been denounced by the NC State Board of Elections"

:applause:

[npincus]

91. Thanks- sent to Huffpo.

[npincus]

262. Huffpo has it!!!

:rofl:

[thewiseguy]

92. This is their web address:

http://www.wvwv.org/

[me b zola]

97. Nothing shocks me any more

Nothing.

[Triana]

98. Who's surprised? Anyone? n/t

[Elidor]

102. John Podesta, former Chief of Staff for President Bill Clinton, member of the board

Sure are a lot of Clinton veterans running this lousy outfit. But I'm sure it's all just a coincidence.

As the article points out, it's odd that so many political veterans would repeatedly mislead, misinform and break the law, in state after state.

[TheZug]

105. Also note that Gloria Steinem is on the advisory board.

Didn't know she was a fan of robo-calls.

[crankychatter]

113. "White men only vote for Obama to be associated with the perceived virility of a Black Man"

Gloria Steinem...

racist and sexist in one fell swoop

[redqueen]

122. HOLY CRAP!

:spray:

That... um... "so-and-so" is frickin insane!

[Spazito]

133. Wow!

Her next book should be "How to show oneself to be a vile human being in one sentence".

Beyond disgusting.

[Elidor]

213. She said that???

Um...wow.

[crankychatter]

222. very close... that's probably a paraphrase... I looked for it again

it was in an op ed

but it IS referenced in the transcripts from a democracy now debate with Melissa Harris-Lacewell.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

320. Please find a source for that quote.

What op ed did you see it in?
Google has only two sources for that exact quote---your post and a post at FreeRepublic.
The FreeRepublic post has no source.
You say it is "referenced" in the transcript to a Democracy Now debate.
Is it this the debate transcipt?...
http://www.democracynow.org/2008/1/14/race_and_gender_in_presidential_politics
If so, I dont find anything close to that quote referenced in that transcript.
If the quote is accurate then I am hoping it has been taken somehow completely out of context.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

318. Only other google reference with exact words (including Caps) is FreeRepublic.

Is that where you found it "paraphrased"?

[crankychatter]

349. Too late to edit... THAT IS NOT A TRUE QUOTE.... I apologize n/t

.

[redqueen]

106. "Odd" isn't quite the word I'd use. "Telling," though...

Yeah... I like that better.

[americanstranger]

107. I've got a lot of work to do today, but this might be worth looking into...

I'm looking at the WVWV web site, specifically the board members.

http://www.wvwv.org/about/board-and-bios

I'm also cross-referencing the board members and associate companies with the FEC Debts By Vendor of the HRC campaign as of 4/25.

http://query.nictusa.com/pres/2008/M3/C00431569/D_DEBTS_C00431569.html

This could be nothing, could be something - but I'm noticing a lot of surnames on that board or on sites associated with board members (like http://www.ltsrlaw.com/) are showing up on the FEC page - with zero balances.

Like I said, kind of interesting. Wish I could blow off work and dive into this, but time doesn't permit it.

Maybe someone with more time (and more brainpower!) than me can take a look. There are plenty of ways to funnel money, and the clintons seem to be well-versed on channeling money.

Might be something there, might not.

- as

[Elidor]

112. Very interesting

Let us know what you find. I'm also bogged down with work. And lunch is over, so I'll have to wait till this evening to see how this develops.

[blm]

117. Remember Mark Penn's expenses for April - he doubled what he made in March.

Penn may be paying these operations directly out of his 'salary' of course.

[americanstranger]

119. And that FEC page says they STILL owe him $2.5 mil!

He's robbing them blind.

- as

[Aloha Spirit]

115. Still though, I can relish the irony of this Podesta quote from a few weeks ago:

"It is not the Statue of Liberty anymore that people associate with the United States," said John Podesta, president of the Center for American Progress, a liberal, Washington-based think tank, at a human rights conference held last week at Georgetown University in Washington. "It is the black hole of Guantanamo and the picture of an Iraqi standing on a box with electrodes attached to him at Abu Ghraib."

[Melinda]

152. And Maggie Williams, Hillary's Campaign Manager, is on Womens Voices Leadership Team!

Of course, this is just a coincidence! :sarcasm:

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Women%27s_Voices._Women_Vote

[mmonk]

164. Yes, we live in a time of many coincidences.

I guess the earth is in transition while getting back towards a coincidence balance.

[knixphan]

109. Shocking! Simply Shocking!

[Barack_America]

114. I don't know about 'shocking' anymore, but it's certainly sad as hell.

I've got that sick feeling in my stomach like I did with the Nevada caucus lawsuit.

Why on God's earth would Democrats actively disenfranchise other Democrats?

*sigh*

[stillcool]

116. Mark Penn has to ...

spend his money on something.

[NotThisTime]

120. What a freaking surprise... wonder if this is worthy enough to make the MSM

Wonder's never cease do they, what is it? Win at all costs so they say?

[redqueen]

127. Welcome to DU...

:hi:

[NotThisTime]

141. Thank you, glad to be here!

[AzDar]

126. Jeebus.

:puke:

[AllexxisF1]

129. Good God.

I think I threw up in my mouth a little.


This just simply makes me sick. Any Hillary supporter that does not finally grow tired from supporting this woman must not simply be a Democrat.





We need to get this out to main media. Please post emails, links and phone numbers to who we can contact for this story.

[ej510]

145. Hillary Clinton supporters could give a fuck about thing she will or has done

to win the nomination. There is nothing that she could do that will upset them nothing and I mean nothing!

[MagickMuffin]

139. Who's going to make the CALL

The state board is asking anyone with information about the source of the calls to contact the State Board of Elections at [phone] or toll free 1-866-522-4723. If any citizens are uncertain about their voter registration status, they may call their county board of elections or check online.

Do you think anyone at the SBOE will do anything about it?.?.?

[DangerousRhythm]

140. Someone please get this to Keith O.

This is shocking and disgusting and I can't believe some people aren't outraged at this but can fake the outrage for other, petty, so-called issues. This is a REAL issue... voter disenfranchisement. Against fellow Democrats. What the hell is wrong with Hillary and her sleazy campaign? This is truly hideous.

[AllexxisF1]

163. Does anyone have Keith's email?

Does anyone have Keith's email?

[1776Forever]

149. OMG - Women's Voices Executive Director Joe Goode worked for Bill Clinton's campaign in 1992

And Hillary just keeps on going and going!

[Melinda]

153. And Hillary's campaign manager, Maggie Williams, is on this slime operations leadership team!

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Women%27s_Voices._Women_Vote

[crankychatter]

156. Her CURRENT campaign manager, since February

On the leadership team of the company that has done disinformation robocalls in 24 states?

[Melinda]

157. Became Hillary's Campaign Manager in 02/2008, unless somethings changed I don't know about!!

And she was Hillary's Chief of Staff when Hillary was First Lady... they are long, long-time friends!

*edited for typo

[crankychatter]

162. I was just so stunned... sorry, I googled and got it, THANK YOU

how can she still be walking around free?

this is a smoking gun... I mean isn't it?

[Melinda]

165. I don't see how it can be anything else! This deserves its own thread!!

Unfuckingbelievable!!

[KoKo]

173. And, John Podesta, founder of "Center for American Progress" and member of Clinton Cabinet

is also on the Board of Women's Voices... Yet, Center for American Progress is supposed to be our new Liberal Think Tank. I wondered why they never covered issues of "Election Fraud." Now I know. And, to target voters in so many states...and black women....

Makes you think about our great Dem Party when they engage in what the Repug Party does. What did our party do in Election '04? Why is Bush a two-termer. Disgusting!

[Basement Beat]

155. As a Black voter I am just furious...

about how we are CONSTANTLY treated like crap in this so called democracy. Why are we always targeted with malfunctioning voting machines, lost ballots, phony robo calls.

Seriously...why should I have faith in this system? Why should I spend time TRYING to become a part of this. This is just absolutely sickening.

[FlaGranny]

168. You don't have to be black to be furious.

EVERY time we get a real leader, what happens? Smeared or killed. Now the DLC Democrats are doing it too.

[KoKo]

175. Exactly ...the pattern is now clear....how could they be so sloppy and think

they'd get away with it in the Google and Internet Age. Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely...and so many of our Dem Leaders are part of it.

[myrna minx]

171. This whole this just makes me sick.

This is just devastating. :-(

[glitch]

172. We all must work to change it so that we can have faith in it.

Welcome to DU!

[Basement Beat]

200. Thanks. And you're right...

we all must definately work together to change this.

Also, I hope I don't appear to come across as polarizing; because I'm definately aware that these attacks on democracy negatively affects all of us across the board.

Just as long as we all realize that we can support each other in this is enough to make one encourage to stand up and work for change even harder.

[izzybeans]

159. As an employee of an non-profit I say strip them of their status and prosecute these fuckwits.

[AllexxisF1]

170. I just ...

I just emailed the Huffington Post, MSNBC and even posted in Cafferty's question of the day that had nothing to do with the campaign!

Get the word out! this needs to be addressed.

[KoKo]

176. One of Huffington's and "Open Left's Bloggers" Ken Lux is part of the Board of Women's Voices....

Disgusting:

Michael Lux, President, American Family Voices

Michael Lux is the co-founder and CEO of Progressive Strategies, L.L.C., a political consulting firm focused on strategic consulting for non-profits, PACs, and progressive donors. Since starting the company, Mr. Lux has launched a number of important new projects, including American Family Voices, an issue advocacy group working on pocketbook issues for American families, and the Progressive Donor Network, which works to coordinate a network of individual donors, issue advocacy groups, and top flight political consultants and strategists.

Mr. Lux has a diverse background in the consulting, labor and consumer advocacy world. Lux serves on the boards of several important organizations, including the Arca Foundation, the Proteus Fund, 21st Century Democrats, Progressive Majority, the Ballot Initiative Strategy Center, and the Clinton-Gore alumni association.

Mr. Lux is a native of Lincoln, Nebraska.

[Medusa]

177. They need to be reported to the Feds immediately

for violating their 501(c)(3) status.

[wildeyed]

178. The Clintons disenfranchising black voters to win an election.

Makes me want to weep. What have we become?

[ErinBerin84]

182. TPM updated story, with reaction from group

They are apparently "going to stop". Well, that makes me feel soooo much better. Except not.

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/04/nonprofit_womens_voices_women.php

[myrna minx]

183. Their excuses stink to HIGH heaven.

:grr: I say bullsh*t.

[americanstranger]

186. Wow. 'Do it until you get caught.'

How fucking Republican.

Yank their non-profit status pronto.

- as

[Aloha Spirit]

190. But, but.... they were "caught" in Virginia, right? And kept doing it?

[City Lights]

248. Reminds me of "it's not illegal unless they tell you so."

:grr:

[crankychatter]

185. If this isn't a SMOKING GUN, what IS?

seriously

[Aloha Spirit]

187. I'm waiting for an explanation as to why their 24 state campaign target black people. Until then,

I'm just going to assume they're the most retraded asswipes in Washington, DC.

[AllexxisF1]

188. Common People.

Anyone got any phone numbers, email contacts to get the story out?

[CaptJasHook]

189. Is the puzzle coming together yet for you Hillary supporters?

[dailykoff]

238. Are you kidding? They're all proud she's "fighting."

Big bunch of trolls.

[1776Forever]

192. Vote suppression, with Clinton ties? (Updated)

Vote suppression, with Clinton ties? (Updated)

http://weblogs.newsday.com/news/local/longisland/politics/blog/2008/04/vote_suppression_with_clinton.html

This is potentially an important story in the framework of Democratic primary struggles:

Facing South, a North Carolina blog, has been tracking robo-calls that have surfaced in North Carolina and a number of other primary states that seem to be spreading misinformation, leading voters to believe they aren't registered when they are. The calls have raised questions among election officials.

It now turns out that the calls are being financed by Women's Voices, Women Vote, a DC non-profit that in theory has been trying to encourage unmarried women to vote. The group got some publicity on Spin Cycle last year when it released an ad that featured women in the Oval Office -- which kind of seemed to have a pro-Hillary, as well as a pro-voting, message paid for by a presumably non-partisan non-profit.

The group has tons of Clinton ties -- current Hillary campaign manager Maggie Williams was on the group's leadership team a year ago. Former Clinton chief of staff John Podesta has been on the board, as well as ex-Clinton aides Joe Goode, Pat Griffin and others, and the group's president gave money to Hillary. The group refused to release all of its funding sources, but some of its money came from people who were also Hill-raisers.

Facing South is wondering why African American males were getting robo-calls from a man named "Lamont Williams" that were paid for by a group that is trying to get unmarried women to vote. Some blogs are describing it as a "voter suppression" effort....

Update: WVWV issues a statement. Says it's all a misunderstanding, and it will stop the calls that are causing confusion in NC.

[mmonk]

199. Should get interesting.

[mod mom]

329. Here's background from Virginia (February):

Virginia voter registration effort proves legit after fears of scam
Posted to: Crime Virginia



By Steve Stone
The Virginian-Pilot
© February 9, 2008

A day after State Police warned about what appeared to be someone trying to scam Virginia voters, authorities said Friday that all is well.

The voter registration drive is legitimate.

State Police, working with the State Board of Elections, began an investigation after more than a dozen reports from residents across the state saying they had received unsolicited phone calls Wednesday and Thursday about registering to vote.

They were told to expect a mailing with registration information and that they should complete and send in, said Corinne Geller, a State Police spokeswoman.

-snip
http://hamptonroads.com/2008/02/state-police-investigate-possible-voter-registration-scam

[mod mom]

330. WVWV spokeswoman said back in Feb Problems were being fixed:

Women's Voices Women Vote, a nonprofit, nonpartisan organization based in Washington, made the calls and sent the mailings, Geller said.

The group said it is part of an "unprecedented" effort to register women. Trouble was, it was largely unheard of. The calls to potential voters started even before the effort was announced. The organization said it is targeting more than 228,000 unmarried women in Virginia and 22 other states.

Sarah Johnson, communications director for the organization, said Friday that not including information about the source of the voter registration effort was "absolutely an accidental omission."

She said the group was changing its nationwide phone alerts to make clear who is coordinating the effort.

from the link above

[Aloha Spirit]

197. ABC is following this story

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=news/local&id=6113377&pt=print

[mmonk]

204. LOL That's what you call calling the wrong number.

Kevin Farmer (Durham County Democratic Party Chair) hears the message at the bakery he works on the answering machine. whoops! Classic:rofl:

[Alcibiades]

322. I know Kevin slightly

This is typical of the Clinton campaign. This group makes a big deal about the quality of its lists, and includes Kevin Farmer's workplace on it!

This is what happens when your campaign is run by beltway types who think they know everything but who, in reality, don't know the local political landscape.

Imagine running a voter suppression campaign among Democratic voters and including the County Democratic Party Chair on your call list! Did they think that maybe, just maybe, this would be one person who has no interest in suppressing Democratic election turnout here, and that maybe, just maybe, he would have every interest in exposing it, and that maybe, just maybe, this would alienate large numbers of people within the local Democratic Party?

If this is how Clinton runs her campaign, we need to ask if she is competent to run the country.

[Hutzpa]

198. This is 'FUCKED UP' man!

this is sooo fucked up in every way, why oh why would this
woman stoop this low.

UNBELIEVABLE



:grr: :grr:

[cbayer]

201. Statement released by WVWV today.

http://www.wvwv.org/2008/4/30/mail-registration

[Aloha Spirit]

207. Yeah, saw that. My question is... why keep being sloppy after the VA police investigation?

http://www.vsp.state.va.us/News/2008/news_release_02-08-08_NR-5.shtm

[cbayer]

214. I am not necessarily defending them.

There is an interesting interchange going on here between posters a a wvwv rep:

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/04/nonprofit_womens_voices_women.php

[redqueen]

209. Confusion?!

They've got some fucking nerve.

AR
AZ
FL
KY
LA
OH
MI
WI
VA

And now NC? (And I'm leaving lots out!) And they're just now catching on to the "misunderstanding"?

Bull frickin s.

[EFerrari]

232. rq, where did you get that list? I'm trying to catch up here. n/t

[redqueen]

234. The diary at DailyKos

has a summary of the issues surrounding this group in each of those states...

Pretty bold of them to try to play it off as a misunderstanding.

[KoKo]

239. Josh Marshall has the story....and the Comments on the Story reveal much more...

in case someone doesn't want to go through the whole KOS comment thread for the extra details.

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/04/nonprofit_womens_voices_women.php

[redqueen]

245. Thank you!

:)

[KoKo]

259. and...some folks might want to go over to "Open Left" and leave a few comments

for Mike Lux who blogs there and over at Kos. Mike is on the Board of "Womens's Voices" and he needs to know that Progressives take "Voting Suppression" activities by a Dem Organization very seriously.

Don't expect to see a blogger on a Dem Progressive Site being involved with stuff like that...

-----

Women's Voices. Women Vote.
by: Mike Lux
Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 15:50
I have been working at home today, completely focused on a May 1 deadline, but was just made aware of the controversy regarding Women's Voices. Women Vote. (Disclosure: I am on their board.) I called Page Gardner and have had a quick conversation with her as well as seen the statement that she released. I am completely confident that this was an accident. As far as I can tell, I think it was more a consequence of trying to move on 24 states in a short amount of time, and having nothing to do with the upcoming primary.

I have known Page Gardner for 16 years. She has dedicated her life to trying to get folks to register to vote, and would never do anything to deter anyone from voting.

I am still gathering facts, as to what happened and as to what the exact sequence of events was. As soon as I know more details I will do another post on what I learn.

In the meantime, I think that it's entirely possible that busy folks were a little bit asleep at the switch in this situation, but I really don't think there was any bad intent here.

http://www.openleft.com/

[EFerrari]

240. Who's going to question them, the inJustice Department?

Mr. Conyers is up for re-election. He might be more receptive this year. He's done work on the Voting Rights Act before.

Because that would be a Federal charge, wouldn't it -- as opposed to individual states going after this scum?

Thanks. I have to go back and read more slowly.

[redqueen]

247. Hah... maybe the FEC?

Either way, if news of this gets wide coverage... I expect her numbers to drop (even more).

[EFerrari]

253. It seems to be going viral. I hope it gets picked up on cable. n/t

[Spazito]

210. This group did NOT identify itself in it's mailing, used fictitious names

in it's robocalls. The targets were, according to their response, unmarried women:

"Women's Voices. Women Vote is a non-profit, non-partisan organization dedicated to bringing the voices of unmarried women to our democracy."


Hmmmm, are only African American women likely to be "unmarried", if not then why target the African American communities in their mailouts and robocalls?


These are NOT the actions of a group that is acting above board, imo.

[mmonk]

212. Bingo

Targeted only predominately AA areas. Man's voice, no identification of group name given.

[cbayer]

215. Do you have any proof that they were targeting AA women?

Honestly, I think they made a mistake and I think they are trying to take responsibility for it. I just think the reaction here is way OTT.

[Spazito]

220. Here is some info on that...

This is from a government watchdog group, Democracy North Carolina:

snip

"Hall said his group has also received reports of automated or “robo” telephone calls to black neighborhoods that tell people that they need to fill out a registration form being mailed to them before they can vote. The calls are allegedly from “Lamont Williams,” who sounds like he wants to help people “make your voice heard.” But he instructs them to fill out, date, and return a registration application being mailed to them, and “then you will be able to vote.”



The deadline for mail-in voter registration has already passed, and the calls seem to be going to black voters who are already registered."

http://www.democracy-nc.org/whatsnew/2008/EP&spprsn.html

Edited to add: If their intent really was to focus on "unmarried women" then why target African American communities at all???

[cbayer]

228. I appreciate that.

What the group is saying is that they had active voter registration drives in 24 states which were targeted at lower income women. They say they have been very successful to date. They have acknowledged that not distinguishing between primary voting and GE voting was a mistake and that using unidentified callers was also a mistake.

Sure, they might be lying. Or they may have made mistakes. I am not in a position to defend them nor do I wish to. I just find the Clinton haters reaction to this very disturbing. If it turns out that this was an attempt to disenfranchise poor and/or black voters and was being driven by the Clinton campaign, I will be more than just disturbed. However, I will not jump to that conclusion without facts.

[Spazito]

235. Again, why target African American communities?

You know as well as I, lower income women are not isolated to the African American communities, they are in ALL communities. You know as well as I, "unmarried women", which was the phrased used in the statement by this group, are in ALL communities yet the targeted community in MORE than one state has been the African American community.

[cbayer]

236. Again, I will wait until there is more information

before I draw any conclusions. There is a vague statement that there were reports of AA communities being targeted. The organization (which, if you look at their website, seems like a really good organization) says they were targeting rural, single women. If that is so, their mailing list will show it.

I just don't jump to conclusions based on limited information even if it supports what I want to believe, unlike so many people posting here.

[mmonk]

223. Why would a group that isn't local do this while

we currently have one stop registration and voting until Saturday? Registration by mail has been over awhile.

[Aloha Spirit]

227. Because NC was part of their incredibly sloppy 24-state campaign that started 10 weeks ago.

[cbayer]

230. They say that they were doing voter registration campaigns for the GE.

They have acknowledged that some might be confused and think this would make them eligible to vote in primary. They have asked that the mailings be held back until after the primary.

[mmonk]

237. So why would they call AA households the week before

a primary vote instead of just mailing them?

[cbayer]

241. They say they were doing a multi-state registration drive.

They were calling to tell people to watch for the packets that would be coming in the mail. They say that when they became aware that there was confusion about whether this would register people for the primary or just the GE, they asked that the mailings be held back. There is nothing I have seen that documents that they were just doing this to AA households.

Look, I can't speak for them, I can only listen to what they are saying. If it turns out that this was, in fact, nefarious, I will be a very loud and vocal critic. It is just not clear to me that it was.

[Medusa]

251. Because they hope to prey upon people who don't know the rules in NC

and/or hope to massively confuse them and make them think that they aren't registered or their registrations aren't good, thereby surpressing the primary vote. They are targeting African-Americans. Now you tell me why you think the Clintonistas would want to do that? :eyes:

[Aloha Spirit]

226. I completely agree, it's OTT up in here.

[Hutzpa]

That is the most lacklustre response I have ever read,

well.. theres been few but this takes the cake, no substance no emotion
none whatsoever just an elitist of a response.


:puke:

[Hutzpa]

211. delete - double post

[Bigleaf]

216. Newsday picked up the story (with the Clinton Ties)

Vote suppression, with Clinton ties? (Updated)

This is potentially an important story in the framework of Democratic primary struggles:

Facing South, a North Carolina blog, has been tracking robo-calls that have surfaced in North Carolina and a number of other primary states that seem to be spreading misinformation, leading voters to believe they aren't registered when they are. The calls have raised questions among election officials.

It now turns out that the calls are being financed by Women's Voices, Women Vote, a DC non-profit that in theory has been trying to encourage unmarried women to vote. The group got some publicity on Spin Cycle last year when it released an ad that featured women in the Oval Office -- which kind of seemed to have a pro-Hillary, as well as a pro-voting, message paid for by a presumably non-partisan non-profit.

The group has tons of Clinton ties -- current Hillary campaign manager Maggie Williams was on the group's leadership team a year ago. Former Clinton chief of staff John Podesta has been on the board, as well as ex-Clinton aides Joe Goode, Pat Griffin and others, and the group's president gave money to Hillary. The group refused to release all of its funding sources, but some of its money came from people who were also Hill-raisers.

http://weblogs.newsday.com/news/local/longisland/politics/blog/2008/04/vote_suppression_with_clinton.html

[Barrymores Ghost]

221. And look who their legal counsel is:

"{t}here's more to {Holly} Schadler and her law firm than a list of corporate pigs and polluters. Schadler, a former Sierra Club official, is an operator for the Clinton White House. She, along with Robert Bauer and Judith Corley--two other partners at Perkins Coie--incorporated the Back to Business Committee, set up in 1994 by Lynn Cutler and Ann Lewis (Democratic Party operators) to defend Bill and Hillary.

http://eatthestate.org/03-38/NaturePolitics.htm

So gee, I wonder who is behind these calls. Nice legal advice, Holly Schadler.

[redqueen]

252. Oh what a tangled web...

[MessiahRp]

231. Wow. This is more proof of why the Clintons are as bad as the GOP and need to be abolished

from the Democratic party.

Democrats don't act this way.

Rp

[youknowmenotdlc]

244. I will never vote for Hillary now

This is beyond Rovian

[SoxFan]

256. kick, kick, point, point

[marions ghost]

258. one of the posters on the TPM blog said this:

"...You don't spend tens of thousands sending mailings and making robocalls to a state without taking the ten minutes it takes to contact the Secretary of State there and make sure the information you're presenting coincides with fact. And you don't start the operation without checking both state and federal laws regarding robocalls and election-oriented mailings."

Like duh. :think:

[KoKo]

261. exactly! and a commenter over on TPM or maybe KOS did research and "Women't Voices"

looks like a "shell company." They spend more on Focus Groups and Polling than they do on actual "voter outreach."

The whole thing just is so bad....

[marions ghost]

264. yep, it reeks....

and as the diggers are digging...may they hit a hard layer of truth. There are certainly a lot of implications here that it doesn't take a PhD to figure out.

I want to see some of the folks at WVWV try to explain this on video. We really need to know what is going on in this little .org This cannot be ignored, no matter what the degree of Hillary's actual involvement. Election integrity is at stake.

These are her peeps running this...so what say you, Hillary?

[EFerrari]

266. I had hoped John Podesta was better than this. Too bad. n/t

[marions ghost]

272. I know

it's amazing how something like this colors your previous opinion in a flash. Politicians and public figures are often enigmas even tho we think we know them, but it's a subjective, sketchy kind of knowing. I can only count a few that I can't imagine doing anything underhanded.

[EFerrari]

281. I pretty much Howard Dean and that's it.

Maybe Dennis. Maybe.

lol

[KoKo]

282. It made me crazy.....

but then I finally understood why "Buzzflash" went for Obama and through it's Hillary supporters off the site.

It was this...they lost their funding from the Podesta Progressive wing...and got "thrown under the bus" so to speak... The pattern is getting clearer...at least to folks like me...

[EFerrari]

285. Damn. n/t

[eridani]

308. Ditto. He was a classmate of mine, and very impressive even back then

One wonders if all the board members are fully up to speed or not.

[krkaufman]

263. Ah, it's good to see the difference the fairer sex can bring to politics

I look forward to my next chat with my niece, to discuss how she can learn from the examples being set in this campaign.

[klook]

265. Audio link

http://www.democracy-nc.org/nc/spprncall.wav

WUNC Radio has an article about this on their website:
(scroll down to "Lamont Who?")

[delt664]

268. But... But....... But.........Angry Black Man!

Please, can we focus on whats important?



Also, I have noticed that I am wearing 2 flag pins, but no presidential candidate has been seen wearing more than one. Why do they hate America?

[crimsonblue]

269. Isn't it kind of counter-productive to have a male running an organization for single women?

Just a thought.

[cui bono]

277. Why is a man the Exec Director of Women's Voices???

When will this sexism stop?!?!?!?!




:sarcasm:

[Barrymores Ghost]

284. This STINKS to High Heaven...and I'm SURE Hilly had "no knowledge..."

....right.

[Spazito]

286. The N.C. Attorneys General's office has sent a cease & desist

letter to this group. In it he has asked for WVWV to provide him with the following:

1. The names of and contact information for all companies or entities that placed
these robocalls for WVWV.

2. Copies of all materials mailed or to be mailed by or on behalf of WVWV to North
Carolina residents.

3. The names of and contact information for all individuals involved in writing or
editing the content of any robocalls made to North Carolina residents by or on
behalf of WVWV.

4. The names of and contact information for all companies or entities that provided
or compiled the names or telephone numbers of North Carolina residents who
received these robocalls.

5. An explanation of the criteria used by WVWV, or any third party acting on its
behalf, to identify or select the names or telephone numbers of North Carolina
residents who received these robocalls.

Link to pdf of letter:


http://www.ncdoj.com/DocumentStreamerClient?directory=PressReleases/&file=Voter%20Registration%20Robo%20Calls%20final.pdf

[EFerrari]

295. These counties in NC are covered by the Voting Rights Act ('65)

North Carolina: Anson, Beaufort, Bertie, Bladen, Camden, Caswell, Chowan, Cleveland, Craven, Cumberland, Edgecombe, Franklin, Gaston, Gates, Granville, Greene, Guilford, Halifax, Harnett, Hertford, Hoke, Jackson, Lee, Lenoir, Martin, Nash, Northampton, Onslow, Pasquotank, Perquimans, Person, Pitt, Robeson, Rockingham, Scotland, Union, Vance, Washington, Wayne, Wilson

[eridani]

310. Southerners who complain about this kind of targeting are correct, IMO

Let's fix the situation by making the Voting Rights Act apply everywhere, no exceptions.

[EFerrari]

346. Well, since it's still happening in the places covered by the Act,

it seems to still be a problem. Expanding it to everywhere is still a good idea, imo.

[New Dawn]

287. K&R

[GetTheRightVote]

288. I for one am not to surprised there is a Clinton connection in this situation.

[marions ghost]

292. Actually I am

surprised. This creation of voter registration chaos is a despicable criminal practice --esp as here it's done under the guise of encouraging voting. I wouldn't think the Hillbots could sink that low. And targeting African-Americans...can they really be doing that? What?!? WTF--do they think they need to channel Jesse Helms in order to win NC?

This is a matter of principle. In blaming the candidate whose associates do this--one also has to acknowledge the weakness of the whole system and the moral bankruptcy of our society. Even if a candidate allows something like this to happen in his/her name, it's beyond sleeze--it's criminal. Hillary would have to throw a lot of people under the bus if these implications prove to be as they would seem.

We need to get to the bottom of this for a LOT of reasons....

[KoKo]

299. And I was, too. Of all the baggage of the Clintons...Voter Suppression of African-Americans

was one I'd never have suspected. It opens up a window...to wonder what other Dems have been involved in suppression...and is that why our Dems dropped the ball on legislation we were promised by those who attended the Conyer's Basement hearings after failed election '04. Why did our Dems drop the ball on so much of what they promised the grassroots who worked so hard to get them elected? And, then Nancy made the comment about those "folks hanging their underwear in her shrubbery." And, the other things that were done to throw the Progressive Activists "under the bus."

It's very disturbing.

[marions ghost]

326. interesting theory

ties to aftermath of election 04 seem plausible to me...:think: many unanswered questions

[redqueen]

334. Truly though... isn't this just "old time politics" of the new age?

Instead of flyers, it's robo calls.

Haven't Dems have engaged in this kind of chicanery in the past?

[marions ghost]

336. Donkey of a different stripe.

The Dems who engaged in this kind of chicanery of the past were those old-school (Forgive them for their racism, they know not what they do) DINOS -- not the enlightened progressives of today. I'm not sure if the old Dinos worked against their own party members either, as this WVWV .org appears it could be doing. I'd have to research that.

Calling this "same old election dirty tricks" and "everybody cheats" is what the Repugs always shout loudly to excuse and obscure the work of their helpful insiders after elections. So does that make it better? From what I've seen election tampering occurs on the Repug side far far more often than the Dem side today. That's why I say that I wouldn't have expected it-- especially from high level Dem party people and Clinton major players.

So do we want Dems to use these same lame excuses to cover crimes? Don't we want this kind of blatant corruption to be a thing of the past? Instead it seems, the Dems in WVWV MIGHT have decided to take a page out of the Rove play book in their desperate attempts to exert control on the selection process. Given the circumstances, this is not a far-fetched conclusion. There has to be a motive for this obvious kind of voter disinformation campaign. It is all the more reprehensible if it was done under the guise of "helping" voters, as it seems it was.

Investigations are warranted. We'd call for it if the Repugs do in the general, so we must call for it if Dems do it to each other or to the Repugs for that matter. If we don't we will never have elections we can trust in this country. This behavior hurts all parties concerned.

[redqueen]

337. Oh no no no no no... I'm by no means trying to excuse this... only observing history.

All dirty tricks are unacceptable, and now that voters have the ability to be so much better-informed (if they choose), I hope to see an end to it someday soon. ("Soon" being a relative term, natch... I don't expect changes overnight.)

I definitely hope this is investigated, really investigated... not the kind that got Bush a pass for his records disappearing from the TANG archives.

All that said... I would not be surprised to find that the Clintons' cronies are neck-deep in this. They are old school politicians. Remember Jerry Brown?

[marions ghost]

341. OK I see

we're on the same page about the need for investigations. This country is drowning in corruption everywhere you look.

The saddest thing is the spectacle of a .org designed to HELP voters apparently being used to suppress them. I'm reminded of how the Neocons designed HAVA (the Help America Vote Act) as a cover to shove paperless e-voting down our throats. And then there's the underfunded and ineffectual figurehead organization , the FEC (Federal Elections Commission).

This is what destroys a sense of community. If there is NO party or candidate with integrity, if there is NO organization or public servant willing to stand up for voters rights (& other basic rights),
if there are NO standards for public trust upheld anywhere, then you learn to trust nobody. This lack of community turns everybody into junkyard dogs who'll go with the first candidate who throws em a bone.

[redqueen]

343. And that's exactly why we are what we are.

A country that mostly doesn't bother voting... and mostly doesn't trust either party.

[Truth2Tell]

291. OpenLeft has a post up

by Matt Stoller that includes text of an email from Becky Bond of Credo Mobile, who has apparently helped fund WVWV. Interesting:

Some Context on WVWV
by: Matt Stoller
Wed Apr 30, 2008 at 17:43

Becky Bond of Credo Mobile wrote this explanation of WVWV's activities. It's a bit sloppily written, but it was a personal email she was gracious enough to let me publish.

Excerpt:

this is information i know first hand. working assets has funded WVWV since it started in 2004. we've seen the research and the field plans grow over time.

WVWV is the only voter registration group with two cycles of replicable randomized control studies showing the impact and cost efficiency of their mail and call based voter registration and GOTV work. here are a few things you may not know about WVWV.

1) WVWV doesn't just target unmarried women. they target hispanics and african americans. so it's not surprising at all that they are targeting black voters in n.c. they've done this in partnership with organizations like the NAACP in 2004 and National Council of La Raza more recently. they use their methods and infrastructure from the unmarried women work to get minorities on the roll. for instance, field groups and funders will pay them to do mail-based voter reg on african americans who don't live in the urban core where they can be cost efficiently registered via door knocking and mass site registration (at bus stops for example). so where minority voters may be more geographically dispersed, WVWV is employed to do that registration by mail order.

A shitload more at:

http://www.openleft.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=5489

[EFerrari]

297. They make some pretty unbelievable claims about their accomplishments.

http://www.wvwv.org/about/accomplishments

(Oh, and Matt isn't exactly neutral on Working Assets. He's worked with them. I'm not saying WA is dirty in any way. But this group did get funding from them.)

[KoKo]

301. Blogger Mike Lux at "Open Left" is on the Board of the WVWV...

and Matt Stoller is an ass...(sorry but he writes crap). Chris Bowers is the only reason I check out that site. Now I'm sorry I did.

Maybe "Working Assets" didn't check them out thoroughly and got duped. Better they find out about it now before they sink any more money into that "shell voting suppression" operation.

[Truth2Tell]

311. I agree about Stoller

he's been an apologist for the DLC crowd for awhile IMHO, even if he hangs with a few lefties. This whole thing circles back in a closed loop. I wouldn't be surprised to find the "Progressive" Policy Institute tied to this stink in some way or another. Podesta is an ass also.

[mod mom]

325. Well I for one plan to write to Credo/Working Assets and ask why they are supporting

this organization-Either it is a criminal enterprise (targeting Af Am voters w misinformation OR they are EXTREMELY incompetent. Either one is not worthy of support.

[mod mom]

327. Does anyone here have posting privileges for Credoaction's blog?

Their topic of discussion is voting suppression (although via Voter ID law) This should be introduced there!


http://action.credomobile.com/2008/04/supremes_decide_to_limit_acces.html

[sellitman]

293. "IF" this is verified then she is done.

I will wait and see before piling on.

[Imalittleteapot]

294. HRC has been so disappointing. xoxo Former Supporter

:cry:

[crankychatter]

296. kicked again

:-)

[Duder]

303. And...

"the firm in charge of voter outreach for WVWV is MSHC Partners, whose president is Hal Malchow. Sourcewatch.org reports that Malchow was a member of WVWV's leadership team.

At the same time, MSHC also does direct mail and outreach for the Hillary Clinton campaign. In fact, the campaign owes MSHC $807,000, according to Politico.com."

http://southernstudies.org/facingsouth/2008/04/same-firm-does-voter-contact-work-for.asp

[mystieus]

304. Damn, thats some dirty stuff.

[Scurrilous]

306. K & R

:thumbsup:

[ekwhite]

307. This is a disgusting example of voter suppression

I am ashamed that this type of tactic was used by supposed Democrats. It's amazing that these Washington professionals keep making the same mistake over and over, state by state, in states in which Obama is leading. They should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

[JMDEM]

312. The REALLY sad thing is...

This won't change a single Hilbot's opinion of her at DU. Not a one. It doesn't matter what she says or does -- they still support her.

What a slimeball tactic.

[Alii]

317. They want their Holiday Gas Tax "rebate."

That's ludicrous. And now I'm having to listen to Hillary's "Closing the Gap" on CNN and ABC.

I have faith, I HOPE, that people will somehow learn the truth. But...

[democracy1st]

350. you're right not one

[Hieronymus]

313. Hillary's a god damned Republican.

[amk]

353. Hillary is a GD Republican ? Why didn't anyone tell me that ?

Seriously, how Obama camp is planning to help these about-to-be disenfranchised voters ?

[Alii]

316. Is this making the rounds...

in newspapers in Indiana, North Carolina and other states? Front page or buried on page thirteen?

[democracy1st]

321. great job

[purji]

324. K&R

[Independent-Voter]

328. More old women trying to scam Veruca into the white house. Disgusting

[libnnc]

339. kick

[grantcart]

340. sorry my ass - criminal prosecution and jail time throw the book at them

and I don't care who they support.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

348. There is also an Obama supporter on the board... CNN/MSNBC said that the other day

n/t

[barack the house]

351. The thing is, is the emotive name. The organisation should be mentioned by name once, I feel.

Just so the meaning of the story is not lost on some people.

[SunsetDreams]

352. This is disgusting, and there are way too many ties to Clinton

She needs an R beside her name.

[npincus]

354. MSM fast asleep.... I hope Obama mentions it on MTP this SUnday