Some wisdom from Jack Germond...

[Dookus]

my favorite pundit, from his new book "Fat Man Fed Up":


Given everything voters hear and read, their harsh view of public officials is inevitable. Most Americans, unhappily, are too lazy or uninterested to question whether press accounts of malfeasance present a balanced view. When the sainted Ralph Nader revives the mantra of the late George Corley Wallace and insists that there is not a dime's worth of difference between the two major political parties, it sounds sort of sensible. Many voters like the idea of being "independents" who vote for "the man, not the party."

Enough Americans accepted that notion of civic virtue to alter the outcome of the 2000 presidential election, when votes for Nader clearly defeated Al Gore and elected George W. Bush. (The same thing probably happened in 1968, when George Wallace took enough votes from Hubert H. Humphrey to elect Richard M. Nixon.)

Nader's insistence that there was no difference in the parties was hard to swallow after Bush made John Ashcroft the attorney general and gained control of the makeup of the Supreme Court. But the selfless Nader was catnip for voters who think politics is a little dirty but still want to perform their civic duty by casting their ballots. It seemed to make them feel warm and virtuous. They should be ashamed of their naivete and embarrassed at the price Americans were forced to pay as a result. Ralph Nader has done many worthwhile things for this country; running for president has not been one of them.

[Syrinx]

1. I don't hate Nader, but I'm feeling some hate for him now

Where is Germond now? Is he on tv?

[JI7]

2. some people probably voted for Bush thinking he wasn't that bad

assuming there wasn't any or much difference between him and gore. they might have just "liked" bush more and thought he wasn't as right wing as most republicans so they will vote for him.

[bluestateguy]

3. Wallace did not block Humphrey

That is just bullshit. The south was already on its way out of the Democratic camp in 1964 with the Goldwater candidacy. Take Wallace out and Nixon wins the 5 southern Wallace states, and then he probably wins Texas (where HHH won because Wallace took Nixon votes). At that point Nixon now has 372 electoral votes. Even if we are generous and give Illinois and New Jersey to HHH, Nixon still wins with 327 electoral votes.

[Dookus]

4. take it up with Jack

I'm just quoting.

[bluestateguy]

5. Of course

I didn't even know Jack Germond was still punditifcating.

[pretzel4gore]

6. caught in the horns of dilemma...

poor jack....he's an honourable guy who has no idea how to resist the evil......blaming nadar is a convenient way out. germond has sat on panels with crudes like geewill, fred barnes, john mcglaughlin kruathummer etc so he knows the score..... truth is relative

[Dookus]

7. I would recommend you first learn to spell

then learn to read. Then read Germond's book. Then offer an opinion.

[pretzel4gore]

8. you have psychic energy to waste on this?

world's going to hell in a handbag and i should read jack's book? jack's been on MY TV for like 15 years: has he ever said anything about the neocons?
linda ronstad was thrown out of a las vegas casino cuz she advocated mike moore's film f911...do you think the jack germonds of america are cowards or maybe just a tad disoriented?

[Dookus]

9. Well

perhaps you should learn capitalization. You'd be taken more seriously.

[pretzel4gore]

10. i type one finger..

the other 8 oversee (like bushinc does in in iraq)

[Dookus]

11. that's

almost meaningful in English. But I have no fucking idea what you're trying to say.

[pretzel4gore]

12. "cursing is a feeble mind

...expressing itself forcefully"
;)
hey, i like mr germond....i just think he (like many of us) let go by too many RW lies and innuendo during the years that, i believe, made a geebush inevitable....
did you know that the japanese emperor TRIED TO SURRENDER a week before hiroshima? (the actual telegram can be googled). Our history is replete with facts that no-one seems to know of; ie: even in months leading up to ILLEGAL invasion of Iraq, bushinc sent 100plus thousand troops to Iraq's borders w/out UN sanction; in effect openly BLACKMAILING the US congress/UN security council to go along!
also, Dookus, there weren't any hijackers on the 911 planes (the '19' terr id's had been prepared long before the event, indicating LIHOP complicity at best...)
8 of the fake id'd hijackers are alive/well right now....

[Dookus]

13. pardon the cursing...

I didn't realize you were so delicate.

As to the Emperor's offer to surrender, you should research it a little more. A "feeler" was put out, but there was no actual offer, and at that point, the Emperor really didn't have authority to do so. The generals were in charge.

[Padraig18]

14. "...there weren't any hijackers on the 911 planes...."

Two words--- BULL and SHIT! The belief that there were no hijackers aboard the planes is demented, pure and simple.

:tinfoilhat:

[Dookus]

15. heheh

yes, the pilots themselves flew the planes into buildings.

I'm happy to have Padraig back without the moderator logo. I bet your tongue was bleeding from biting it so hard the last couple of months. :)

[Padraig18]

16. I nearly chewed it off, several times.

Yeah, it's good to be back, Dookus! How are the kitties?

:)

[Dookus]

17. they're SUPER

thanks for asking.

[LimpingLib]

18. At least he knows many who keep getting their pictures flashed

are alive and well.Our media is corrupt to the core. Might as well be Soviet Russia or frankly present Russia.

He is cutting the crap quite well thank you.

[Cuban_Liberal]

20. Bull feathers.

Show me proof, not some vague and unsupportable statements about pictures; what he said was and remains utter horseshit...

:eyes:

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Dookus]

23. Hrmm...

the original assertion was "there weren't any hijackers on the 9/11 planes".

The article you linked to says the identity of FOUR of the hijackers are in doubt, and the director of the FBI himself agreed with that.

They are not equivalent.

[LimpingLib]

25. Well.....

I dont have all the anwsers but some strong theorys that are somewhat backed up and tons of odditys happened that could be pointed out.

This is the BBC mind you , I had to post a mild watered down mainstream source so there would be no debate of my bone.This guy Waleed (I forget his name and dont feel like checking , probabily spelled it wrong) is STILL flashed on the screen with 19 others with no caviat whatsoever.

I will say that Bush actualy said that a technology to control planes could have PREVENTED the terrorist attack but wasnt invented yet. Actualy the technology existed months prior to 9/11. (dont ask me anything more)

And over 60 times 12 months prior to 9/11 US fighter jets intercepted planes that lost contact with Air Traffic Control for more than around 5 minutes. Go research that and find out why it didnt happen on 9/11.Well I think it happened to the plane that they claimed crashed (I think jets probabilly shot it down) but anyway.......

[Dookus]

27. ah

the scattershot approach to debate.

The narrow subject at hand is whether there were, in fact, NO hijackers on the planes. That's what we're discussing.

[LimpingLib]

28. Like I want to debate this.

I dont even keep up with too much research anyway and nobody knows for sure what happened.Bush knew what was happening though. He got some solid warnings that even our media got a shock over when they found out like Egypts warning 12 days prior.


Anyway at least the guy who is getting bashed has a clue unlike most and its the clueless that seem the most pround, go figure.

[bringbackfdr]

19. Nixon in 68

Exit polls actually showed that Wallace received a significant number of RFK votes in several states. And Nixon only had 301 electoral votes as it is; how would he gain by losing those two states?

[LimpingLib]

22. Germonds "civic virtue" includes Wallace's racist views I guess.

And Pat Buchanan really did earn those Jewish butterfly votes.

[FredScuttle]

24. Irony

(from Merriam-Webster)

2 a : the use of words to express something other than and especially the opposite of the literal meaning b : a usually humorous or sardonic literary style or form characterized by irony c : an ironic expression or utterance

[LimpingLib]

26. He could have compared Nader to Perot then

Nader really is the epitemy of civic virtue.Honestly and dont accuse me of worshiping him.

I dont care what Germond meant. His snide comment included somebody who literaly fit the description of the single term he used.And if Germond wants racist votes (who could very well have "belonged" to Nixon anyway)then be my guest.

Edit: Or the Libertarian in the 1976 race he could have compared Nader too.

[FredScuttle]

29. I think Germond's comparison was

how third party candidates tipped the balance in the '68 and '00 elections and gave the WH to two absolute disasters in the Oval Office, Nixon and *

Nader is the "epitemy" of civic virtue? Pffft...back in the day, perhaps. But taking GOP cash and Repuke signatures just to get on the ballot in Michigan is what I call straight-up fraud.

[LimpingLib]

30. We can play around all night.

Germond plays with facts, so Ill play with what he says.

Is he saying Naders views are as bad as Wallaces? Why does he want Naders votes then?

Is he saying Wallace was the Peoples Front Of Judea canidate compared to Humphrey being a leader of the Judean Peoples Front?

Germond can sniff all the whisky he wants too. This guy would continue to lay on his belly getting powder spanked on his butt before he would ever do 1 day of tireless work Nader has done his entire life.

[FredScuttle]

31. Play around all you want

the adults in the room will realize that Nader was playing the same canard that Wallace did and he got enough gullible votes to tip the election.

If you vote for Nader this time around, you're not just gullible, you're a goddamn cretin.

[LimpingLib]

32. I wont but

Nader being rendered useless will just kill him bringing in new progressive voters (who might not even know they are "progressive")which will hurt us badly in the long run. We are being hurt THIS election for undermining Nader in 2000 and not letting him bring in a ton of new voters then which would help us today.

Nader has went out of his way to not attack Kerry .The man deserves none of the crap he is getting.I think he said long ago that he prefered Edwards simply because he knew Kerry would probabilly get seduced into picking him.

The progressive movement is getting burnt bad by partisan idiots with no integrety,plus many who get paid a handsome sum like Germond to spit out enough pleasing sounds to fools that give him an audience, and professional politicans.

I will proudly defend Nader