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The Rude Pundit: Reasoning with the Unreasonable

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meegbear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:12 AM
Original message
The Rude Pundit: Reasoning with the Unreasonable
At this point in the neverending self-flagellation that is the Democratic Party's Trail of Tears to the nomination, it's worthless to attempt to reason with Hillary Clinton's supporters. No matter how much you try to point out that Clinton agreed to the nominating process at the beginning, they won't care. None of it matters: not the facts that she was the frontrunner and presumptive nominee up until the Iowa caucuses, that Harold Ickes (a man desperately in need of a punch in the nuts) voted to "punish" Florida and Michigan. You can't start an argument by saying that Clinton herself said that even elected delegates can change who they support; therefore, the fight for the "will of the people" or whatever in Florida and Michigan isn't really what's at stake. You can't speak to them metaphorically, like saying how if you start a game of stick ball, you can't in the middle of an inning say that second base ain't the car on the corner anymore, that it's the fire hydrant half a block down, just because it turns out the other team has faster runners. Or that we're no longer gonna score by runs, just by how many bases you touch. No, no, such figurative language won't do for Clinton's followers.

The Rude Pundit would like to think that if he was in the position of Clinton's voters, that his candidate was actually losing the nomination, he'd have the sense to toss in the towel, as many previous Clinton supporters are doing. He'd like to think that, well, shit, the rules sometimes suck, but so be it. And instead work to change the rules for the future. Yes, he'd like to think he'd be so gracious. Indeed, when it seemed that Clinton was the inevitable nominee back last year, the Rude Pundit was ready to go all in to defeat the real enemy, and that was never Hillary Clinton. And he certainly knows that he wouldn't keep fighting if Clinton got the number of delegates needed to win the nomination.

As Democrats, one of the things we have to figure out is how to respect the rage of the hardcore Clinton voters. While relying on commenters on a website for perspective is about as smart as thinking that your crack addict sister is actually gonna use that money you loaned to buy groceries for her kid, it's a bit alarming to read the rank hatred over at the Hillary Clinton blog in reaction to the statement by Ickes (a man desperately in need of a cock-kicking) to the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee that he's pissed and might take it to the convention.

In the over 1400 reactions, there's despair and arrogance and, yes, insanity, as well as a kind of support group mentality mixed with mass hysteria. Most of the comments are about how to proceed, and there's roughly five paths: fight for the nomination all the way to the convention in Denver, consequences be damned; or, if Obama is the nominee, write-in Clinton, get Clinton to run as an Independent, vote for McCain as a protest against the DNC, or not vote at all. These sentiments are spread over numerous writers, not just a couple of people bitching at each other, as so many comment threads become.

Now, we can simply flip these people off, treat them like deluded children and say, "Yeah, right, get in line, fuckers. You'll be voting for Obama like a good Democrat." It'd be like the way the Republicans treat the religious right or the way Bill Clinton treated black people. But that's a bullshit way to act toward fellow Democrats.

We can also appeal to reason, saying that, just for the sake of Supreme Court appointments (which might include Hillary or Bill, gang), you gotta vote for Obama. Don't go all Nader on the nation.

But how, Christ, how do we treat members of the family who have become estranged?
It's all such projection now, this whole quixotic battle that Clinton supporters are engaged in. It's projection of years of waiting for a female candidate that had an honest shot. It's projection for the way Al Gore was screwed out of the presidency. It's projection for how seven years of George W. Bush have left Americans feeling as if what they believed about government and the nation was worthless.

We who support Obama cannot take this rage for granted. Surely, Obama has his work cut out for him in reaching out to Clinton supporters, when he secures the majority of the delegates. When that moment comes, though, it's incumbent upon us, the Obama supporters in Left Blogsylvania, to offer comfort to Clinton's most rabid acolytes and give them another place to call home.

And then let's fuckin' tear John McCain's hopes and dreams to shreds.

http://rudepundit.blogspot.com/
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K Gardner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:14 AM
Response to Original message
1. " group mentality mixed with mass hysteria" - he's certainly right in his assessment.
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americanstranger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
2. How... not rude of him.
I'm actually surprised. But he does make a good point, as usual.

- as
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Turn CO Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. Yes, I was thinking the same. Not a very rude post. And he says
to offer comfort for those rage-filled supporters, by realizing that they have displaced anger against Obama, when really they're angfy about so many other hardships and injustices brought about by the Bush Administration and every conservative idea ever born.
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Turn CO Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #2
7. Yes, I was thinking the same. Not a very rude post. And he says
to offer comfort for those rage-filled supporters, by realizing that they have displaced anger against Obama, when really they're angfy about so many other hardships and injustices brought about by the Bush Administration and every conservative idea ever born.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
3. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
crispini Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
4. K&R nt
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. Hillary's diehards are trapped by their own lifetimes of resentment.
They have invested emotionally in Hillary's candidacy, and made it the visual representation of all their hopes for a woman president, as well as for their resentments for every real and imagined sexist slight in their lives. Hillary's candidacy is THEIR hope and rage, married together, and they're not taking the divorce well, as hope leaves them but rage remains.
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NJmaverick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. This is an insightful and dead on accurate assessment of the situation
the hope is that the saying, time heals all wounds, is still correct (and that there is enough time).
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leftofcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #5
12. Is this the O Campaign's new description of Hillary Supporters?
Why am I not surprised?
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Gore1FL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-03-08 12:22 AM
Response to Reply #12
17. Wow what a leap
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roguevalley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #5
13. Too bad they can't see the alternative is a historical vote too.
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NJmaverick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
9. I agree we need to offer comfort
the only problem is that many don't want comfort. Myself and many others, have been badly slapped down, whenever an effort is made to reach out for them. Although in all fairness, I suspect that those people represent a small, but vocal minority.
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meegbear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. I think that too ...
we'll be united when this episode is said and done.
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faithfulcitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
10. kick
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starroute Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 02:01 PM
Response to Original message
14. Can't we just reach out to the *less* rabid acolytes?
Frankly, I suspect that the most rabid ones are a lost cause and that even trying to reach them would have negative results. It's only the ones who are merely bitter and clinging to what matters to them who might be approachable.

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barack the house Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-02-08 02:09 PM
Response to Original message
15. Exactly this has to the place for coffee and sympathy until we are once again united. Then on to the
Edited on Mon Jun-02-08 02:09 PM by barack the house
GE. Even if they strike out don't strike back.
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ORDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-03-08 12:18 AM
Response to Original message
16. K'n'R!
:kick:
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