If Obama chooses Clinton as VP he is a weakling,

[woolldog]

with no cojones who is easily bullied. He obviously doesn't want her as VP. This is an important test of the kind of leader he will be. Does he stand for what he wants and for principle? Or does he cave easily?

If he can't stand up to the Clintons, how can he stand up to Ahmidnijad?

I expect him to pass with flying colors. But if not, it will take some of the shine off with Independents.

[yourguide]

1. If he chooses her

it's because he wants her, or he truly wants to unify this party at his own possible peril.

[Labors of Hercules]

15. He will know too how to deal with the risks of taking her on.

I doubt he will do it, but think he may be one of the few who could deal with the implications if he really wanted to. :shrug:

[damntexdem]

47. If he chooses her, he's going to need those cojones, and a thick skin.

He'll also need back protection, as in against stabbing. Actually, choosing her as a running mate could be seen as a rather gutsy action, albiet a dumb one.

[polichick]

2. I agree that he needs to stand up to these people...

...if he wants to be respected both in the US and around the world.

[BeyondGeography]

3. He'll make the best choice for himself

If he concludes that it's her, so be it. A lot of factors will go into this decision. His process will be a whole lot more rational than a from-the-hip OP from wolldog, and I say that with affection.

[woolldog]

39. haha. point taken.

but I'm not purporting to give strategic advice. I'm sketching out how my opinion of him would change. It's just me baring my soul, talking about how I feel....

[gateley]

4. He won't and he isn't. nt

[wileedog]

5. I'm a broken record at this point, but 18 million votes in your back pocket

is not a sign of weakness, its a calculated move that will probably crush the Repubs on sheer turnout this November.

I don't like it all from a post election standpoint, I don't think the Clintons (plural) are wired to play the good soldiers that is required of the VP.

But I think her on the ticket is a slam dunk to win, for what that is worth.

Note: I still believe we can win with a Webb or Clark etc ticket too, I just don't think this is about 'bullying'. Its about 36 million highly energized and motivated voters already in the bag before the campaign even starts.

[sfam]

18. Lets face it folks, Hillary SHOULD be on the shortlist...

There is a strong case to be made for Hillary, regardless of our feelings in the matter. And yeah, she brings loads of negatives too. But that's Obama's decision. Lets trust him to make the right one.

[union_maid]

6. Why don't we get to the next step

Before we decide who he should or should not have on his ticket. Hell, maybe he wants her there. Ever think of that? Maybe she's not even under consideration. As long as he doesn't pick Lieberman, I'm prepared to bow to his ability to tie his own shoes and pick his own VP.

[Doityourself]

7. ok edited...its hard to swallow the possibility of Clinton on the ticket..honestly. phew..lawd

[dflprincess]

42. Especially for those of us who don't like either Obama or Clinton

That would really be a dismal ticket for those of us on the left. I had hoped we'd get a someone a tad more liberal in the veep slot.

(standard disclaimer - yes, I'm voting for the Democratic nominee)

[VeraAgnes]

8. He would definitely do it because

he needs her to win.....The only reason he would dare subject himself to 8 years of both Clintons on each shoulder....Jeepers, that will be a challenge!

[Zomby Woof]

9. Don't worry

He'll have plenty of opportunities to disappoint you if he should make it to the Oval Office. When he gets his first NSA briefing, the honeymoon is over. Expect lots of spin and rationalization on his reversals.

Of course, he has one advantage - having built his campaign largely on rhetoric rather than specifics, he leaves less room for accusations of capitulation.

Still, after his caving on his church, I watched some of the squirming and discomfort here in this forum with some amusement. I expect much more in that regard come next April or May.

If he makes it in there.

[EmeraldCityGrl]

10. No More Business as Usual in Washington and then this?

The repugs will run with this.

[Texasgal]

11. Nice.

As if Obama cannot think for himself...

Unity? Where?

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

24. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Raejeanowl]

34. WHAT THE HELL DOES THAT MEAN?????

[WillyT]

41. Didn't Learn A Thing From The RFK Comment... Did You ???

:evilfrown:

[TwilightGardener]

13. I agree--I will be very disappointed in him.

[TexasObserver]

14. Dragging her and Bill around would be a full time job.

[sfam]

16. Bullshit. Why don't you TRUST Obama's decision. Or ditch your icon...

Seriously, if Obama chooses Hillary, he will do so REGARDLESS of the pressure from the Hill-Clan. It could be that he just happens to decide that she's the right choice. Who are you to question his judgment in the matter? Do you honestly think you have a better handle of who he should pick than Obama himself?

Bottom line, lets TRUST his judgment. He is our candidate - I for one think he'll pick wonderfully and will support whomever he decides. If its Hillary, then GREAT!!! Go Team!!!

If its Richardson, Sebelius (my choice), Webb or Strickland, than GREAT!!! Go Team!!!

[woolldog]

21. It will undermine one of the maine reasons he appealed to me:

Change, turning the page on the past, end to dynastic rule/concentration of power in the hands of a few families etc.

[sfam]

26. Perhaps you might be wrong about that...

Its Obama who has galvanized the country for change. He MUST know better than you. If he picks Hillary for VP, this does not mean he no longer wants to change the country. It means he thinks she's the right pick to help him get elected and to govern.

Again, I don't think he will, but I will be quite fine if he does. I trust his judgment better than mine or yours.

[Arrowhead2k1]

33. Agreed, plus there's undoubtly alot of passion on Hillary's side of the party.

If we can harnest even a fraction of that, we will be absolutely unstoppable.

Maybe it's not what we all wanted, but it's still a step in the right direction. Either way, change is indeed coming my friends. ;)

[woolldog]

35. That is how I feel. It is one of the main reasons he appealed to me.

[sfam]

38. My point is he would still be advocating change in Washington, even if...

He picked Hillary. Lets face it, there is a case to be made for choosing her. She is strong in the midwest, as rabid women supporters, is very popular with Hispanics and hard working white folk. She is also one of the best policy wonks in DC.

Yes, she has LOTS of negatives, but if Obama chooses her, he must have a reason. And in choosing her, this in no way means he isn't interested in changing Washington.

[Arrowhead2k1]

17. As Anti-Hillary as I am, after some deep thought

I don't think it'll be such a BAD idea. It's not a perfect world, but we would have still beaten Hillary. She would be on Obama's leash from now on, and all those feminist wannabes threatening to vote McCain won't have a leg to stand on. Plus, an Obama/Clinton ticket would truly strike fear in the Republican's hearts. That's what I want to see most. I want to see the likes of Michelle Malkin's and Rush Limbaugh's heads explode! :D

[FSogol]

19. Why not trust him to make the best choice?

Or what until you see his choice. Why start complaining now?

[rusty quoin]

20. Unless I am mistaken the delegates choose even the VP.

At least that is how Rhandi explained it.

[shadowknows69]

58. They won't vote against his choice

[roseBudd]

22. It is a common perception among Democratic insiders that a n African American / woman ticket is too

risky. She is much too polarizing. She brings nothing that isn't offset by Clinton hatred on the right.

[dailykoff]

23. Unfortunately I agree.

This is a test and I am not entirely certain he will pass. :scared:

[PseudoIntellect]

25. I'd rather be a weakling and win an election than risk losing half of the party's support.

[woolldog]

52. weaklings don't win.

[elfin]

27. Or else he has supreme confidence

in subjugating her to his initiatives.

BUT I think she detracts from his ticket more than she adds.

I will donate to Obama before his choice -- and then after, IF it is not Hillary. She is toxic, though not all her fault (ala Bill, "baggage" etc.)

I hope she returns to the Senate with enhanced status to usher in the new agenda.

[alcibiades_mystery]

28. You're a fucking child, and an idiot

Just shut the fuck up and let the people who know what they're doing do what they know.

[DevonRex]

29. If he chooses her as his VP it's a sign of how strong he is, IMO.

She is not my first choice for VP. But he's a brilliant man. If he thinks she would help win the GE, I'm okay with that.

[Condem]

32. THE FUCKIN NAIL, JenniferZ

Wooldog, you are looking at this backwards. What's your problem with Hillary?

[DevonRex]

40. Aw shucks. :) nt

[Condem]

43. He won't answer, JenniferZ.

He hates Clinton because he feels he has to.

[woolldog]

49. I don't care for her for a lot of reasons.

I started off neutral to slightly positive. But the way she's run this campaign has outraged me.

Plus I think she and Bill are so power hungry, they'd be undermining him at every turn, during the campaign and in the white house. I don't trust her based on her actions over the last year.

[Condem]

54. Politics, wooldog

Nothing fair about them.

[lumberjack_jeff]

56. Yes. A strong leader feels comfortable picking strong lieutenants n/t

[Orangepeel]

30. Oh, nonsense. If he chooses her (and I don't think he will)

it would be because he reasons that the likely political benefits outweigh the likely political and personal costs. He ran a very impressive primary campaign and I expect him to run an impressive general campaign, which may or may not include this.

He can always send her on an eight year, world-wide goodwill tour.

[Raejeanowl]

31. If THEY Can Get Over It

And be adult enough to come to some kind of productive working agreement, then so should you-be an adult and get over it.

[last1standing]

36. This from the poster who wants Sam Nunn, the homophobe, as VP?

I'm really not liking your idea of what is best for Obama at this point.

[woolldog]

44. I changed my mind on Sam Nunn, thanks in part to your posts,

that enlightened me. :hi:

[last1standing]

48. I appreciate that. Now lets try to let Obama run his campaign the way he sees fit.

I've seen enough to trust him to believe he'll make the right decision for the future of our nation. I hope you'll join me in that.

[graywarrior]

37. I think he is smarter than any of us here and will make a choice based on reality

Seriously. We don't know everything.

[Two Americas]

45. ROFL!

Next we will be tossing Obama himself out of the inner circle for being insufficiently loyal to the Obama movement. Damn. This is an exclusive club. Even the leader is not automatically a member.

[Vattel]

46. I would like to think

that he's not a lunatic who believes all of the silly smears of Clinton that many of his supporters believe.

[redstateblues]

50. At this point- the point is to WIN- get over the petty stuff

The function of the VP slot is mainly to help win the election

[Yanez Houston Jordan]

51. Not a weakling, but is there such a thing as a stupidling?

[guruoo]

53. Obama being sent to the ignore list, appairently

[lumberjack_jeff]

55. You would qualify as an Obama "supporter".

Your support of your candidate is more superficial than your hatred for his opponent.

We don't have the luxury of it.

[shadowknows69]

57. I'm inclined to agree

If the party forces her on him it would be a travesty. They really aren't a good ticket

[Kablooie]

59. I thought was going to ask McCain and get this election over quickly.

[woolldog]

60. told you so...