McCain is an idiot how many people remember Jimmy Carter's Presidency?

[ej510]

McCain is old!

[Fredda Weinberg]

1. Excuse me? I remember that tragedy n/t

[book_worm]

2. I remember it too, and it was no tragedy

We had a president who worked for peace and was years ahead of anybody else on the issue of energy conservation.

[Jackpine Radical]

11. The tragedy was how he was knocked off politically

by the Reagan troglodytes. All our current problems either began or were intensified by an order of magnitude during the Reagan years.

[Fredda Weinberg]

39. And the Democratic Party split between Kennedy & Carter factions n/t

[Fredda Weinberg]

37. Then you remember how he was mocked for his sweater chat. Look,

I was just as earnest back then. As for peace, again ... I remember Sadat taking a chance - not Carter.

[Terran]

45. That's the worst you can say about Carter?

That he wore a sweater? Pathetic. Or did you wish to further explain your use of the word "tragedy"?

[knixphan]

48. Right on, bookworm!

[ej510]

6. I'm 30. I believe that I was two yrs old his last year in office.

[Fredda Weinberg]

38. Not a problem ... but there are enough of us to remember how

ineffective presidents invite trouble. Iran hostages, anyone?

[ieoeja]

42. They took the hostages because we refused to hand over the Shah.

So "ineffective" means "not giving in to their demands"?

Then again, given the fact that Republicans claim Reagan WAS effective with regards to Iran when all he actually did was give in to all their demands, I suppose you're not alone in the formula you seem to apply.

I prefer the Democratic way. While you obviously recall that Reagan's effectiveness led to the release of the hostages in Iran, you seem to forget that it also resulted in Islamic terrorists taking American hostages repeatedly over the next twelve years. This continued until Clinton returned to the Carter policy of refusing to pay these ransoms when a US Blackhawk helicopter pilot was offered for ransom in Somalia.

The Republican method may convince the American public you're tough, but I will take reality over perception any day of the week.

[Terran]

46. Typical ignorance...blame Carter for the hostage crisis.

Do you know how it is the Shah came to be in power in the first place? And who'd ya vote for in '80, Fredda?

[knixphan]

49. thank you!

...As if Jimmy somehow magically went back in time to overthrow Mossadegh? We have to kill those RW talking points once and for all.

the man inherited the chickens of his predecessors...

[mikelgb]

3. wasn't that the peanut farmer from Gerogia?

I remember learning about him in grade school

seriously, that is about all they teach about Jimmy Carter too: Peanuts, Georgia

[whistler162]

No he is the former Nuclear Submarine Naval officer who

resigned his commission to take run the family Peanut farm when his father died.

There where problems. The economy was in sh*t. Iran after 25 years under the thumb of the US supported Shah over threw the Shah and his government. Which brought about the take over of the US Embassy in Tehran and eventually led to the ill fated rescue attempt. President Carters "Rose Garden" strategy during the election was bad - http://openweb.tvnews.vanderbilt.edu/1980-5/1980-05-16-ABC-14.html.

BUT, President Carter also recognized and along with Congress had started taking steps to lessen our dependence on oil. Funds for research and solar panels on the White House to name a few. But, Reagan atopped it all.

McCain isn't wise to go the comapre Obama to Carter route

[madaboutharry]

4. People born at the end of Carter's presidency are

now 28 years old. McCain is an anachronism.

[Arkansas Granny]

5. I remember Carter's Presidency. Does that make me old, an idiot, or both?

[ej510]

10. I'm talking about McCain. He said "Obama is running for Carter's 2nd term"

[Jackpine Radical]

13. Wow, now that you mention it, I recall

that for the first few years of Clinton's Presidency, I was always misspeaking and calling him Carter.

[sui generis]

17. I remember it - but I was evil larva spawn at the time

I had not molted into my current form yet.

Mostly, and from the historical record I think Carter got too involved in micro-managing his cabinet.

As a president, that is not a good trait to have, and just as crushing beer cans on one's coked-up forehead can cause you to lose credibility, acting like a little old granny (:blush: sorry AKG!) is not a virtue of commander in chief.

To be fair, I think that Carter is a better foreign affairs statesman than ever was president. I also applaud his Habitat for Humanity and other public works, but I draw the line at him offering political insight and public stances on the candidates.

We are in danger of ending up with another "one hit wonder", no matter what virtue or dreams we ascriber to Obama, for nearly exactly the same reasons that Carter did. I don't want Carter's advice - not even the 20/20 hindsight stuff.

If Obama wants to be different than Carter he needs to do something different than Carter.

[ihavenobias]

7. Excellent point actually, many people do NOT remember but not only that

People DO remember THIS terrible presidency and the tanking economy, gas prices, housing crisis, insane national debt and lies and secrecy that led to an unnecessary war.

This is a losing strategy for McCain, so let him go ahead to say it over and over again.

[Jackpine Radical]

8. I remember Eisenhower's Presidency.

What's your point?

Hell, I have a lot of memories of things that happened when Truman was President, although I won't claim I was politically very aware at the time. I o remember seeing Robert A. Taft speak when he was running in the Republican Primary in 1952, though. They had him onstage at the local movie theater.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

9. WTH is this in reference to?

[ej510]

12. "Obama is running for Carter's 2nd term"

[closeupready]

14. Yeah, I don't understand either. I remember Nixon's last term.

so what if I remember Carter's?

[scheming daemons]

15. I'm only 41, and I remember it....

I remember the odd/even gas days.


I remember inflation through the roof and how it affected my parents.


I remember the hostage crisis in Iran.


I'm not old.... and I remember it.

[ieoeja]

29. It wasn't Carter's fault that your governor was an idiot.

The United States never implemented odd/even gas days during Carter's administration because the deepest net drop in oil production following the Islamic Revolution in Iran was only about 4%. And that was only for a couple months.

The "energy crisis" under Carter was purely speculative. Just like after Hurricane Katrina, energy market speculators bid up the price believing there would be a shortage. And just like after Hurricane Katrina, there was no such shortage. So the speculators made a killing while the oil kept flowing.

In '73 there was a shortage as the result of the OPEC embargo. But not in 1979. This was after Carter negotiated the return of the Sinai to Egypt. The Arab nations loved Carter and rushed to make up for the loss of production out of Iran.


Inflation, of course, was through the roof before Carter was elected. Remember Gerald Ford's Wip Inflation Now (WIN) campaign? Carter ultimately got it under control, but not until his last year in office when it was running at a 3% rate and falling.


Then Iran ruined everything for everyone. Carter was the first pro-Muslim Democratic president (many Republicans were pro-Muslim because they had the oil; Democrats traditionally were pro-Israel). But that wasn't enough for the radicals in Iran. And when Carter asked the military to rescue the hostages he was famously told, "we don't do that; the FBI handles hostage rescues." But the FBI has no foreign projection.

So Carter initiated the creation of Delta Force and their unsurprisingly (for a new organization) bad first attempt. It was also at this time he began an overdue post-Vietnam reformation of the military, booting out the malcontents. I know so many people who fondly recall Reagan reforming the military in 1980. Not the 80s in general. They specifically recall when it began in the year 1980.

A few, a very small few, had their worldview shaken to the core when I pointed out to them that Carter, not Reagan, was president in 1980. Most call me a fucking liar and choose to ignore all evidence to the contrary.

There are a lot of really hopeless people out there.

[Captain Hilts]

16. The OP is trying to demonstrate that McCain's perspective on things is dated. nt

[rox63]

18. I remember the Carter presidency

I was a teenager during those years.

[Benhurst]

26. I'm sure Obama remembers it, too.

[napi21]

19. The people who remember Carter's Presidency are the older,

Hillary supporters McNut is targeting. Actually, Carter wan't a bad President. He had 2 main problems that I recall. He micromanaged everything, and Paul Volker, the head of the Fed. Reserve at the time, did him no favors, and inflation and interest rates were totally out of control. Yes, the American prisoners held in Iran hurt him too, but the other two problems were perceived to be worse.

[papapi]

24. I'm not a Hillarbot. I voted for Carter. He was cleaning up after Nixon and Ford.

[Benhurst]

28. "The people who remember Carter's Presidency are the older,

Hillary supporters McNut is targeting."

Like Obama? I'm sure most of the younger baby boomers remember Carter.

[high density]

20. Plenty of people?

My parents are well aware of it. My dad worked pumping gas during it. I may have been born during the Raygun years, but I know enough about it to form a generally negative opinion of Carter's presidency.

[katmondoo]

21. The problem with the Carter Presidency

was the 20% interest rates that ruined a lot of businesses. I was one. It was hard to borrow money to keep going and hard on suppliers too. All in all not a happy time. What caused the high rates I do not know.

[ieoeja]

30. Vietnam, Nixon and OPEC '73

Wars cause inflation. Always.

Nixon's response to inflation was to initiate price controls on certain items. This did not stop price increases, only delayed it.

The final attempt by the combined Arab nations to wipe Israel off the face of the map came in '73 and ended with the Israeli counterattack capturing the Suez canal (which they quickly returned). After starting and losing that war, they decided to shift the blame to the West and launch an oil embargo. This shot up the cost of oil. That cost impacted every other sector of the US economy giving an added push to inflation.

Ford then lifted the price controls and inflation really took off.

We also had powerful labor unions back then who took care of the American workforce. They made sure wages kept up with inflation. This in turn added to inflation. But by the end of Carter's administration the upward spiral had ended, and inflation was non-existent (running at a 3% annual clip and falling).

[papapi]

22. I remember Pres. Carter. I liked him. He was honest at least.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

23. Comparison to Carter?

Obama could do worse...

Carter confronted the Energy Crisis head-on, and if we had followed his lead consistently, we'd all be driving electric cars and not paying a fortune (I estimate that my family will pay nearly $4,000 for gas this year) on energy.

Carter worked for peace in the Middle East and brokered a deal between Israel and Egypt that is STILL WORKING TO THIS DAY.

Back when Carter was President, middle class families could still afford college without taking out massive student loans -- I was in the middle of my undergraduate degree when the Reagan Administration pulled the economic rug out from under me.

For his efforts to promote peace and justice both at home and abroad, Carter won the Nobel Peace Prize.

I think it speaks volumes about John McCain's character (or lack thereof) that he thinks that Jimmy Carter is somehow a problem.

[ieoeja]

31. Carter overstated the energy "crisis".

It was certainly not in a crisis at that stage. It certainly makes sense to take the long view and plan accordingly. But to this day most people believe we had an energy shortage during Carter's administration (just look at this thread) which Reagan made disappear by threatening to blowup the Middle East.

So in that regards, Carter screwed up. By acting as if there was already a crisis, he made Reagan a hero for eliminating the crisis that did not yet exist.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

32. How old are you?

I don't think you remember gas rationing...odd numbered plates got gas on odd-numbered days and even-numbered plates got gas on even-numbered days? Service Stations out of gas entirely? Coupon books (which were printed, but never actually issued)?

All of that happened during the Ford Administration. It wasn't the figment of somebody's imagination.

[ieoeja]

36. As you stated. Under Ford.

Because the Arab nations invaded Israel, got their asses kicked, then decided to take it out on everyone else.

Under Carter there was no energy "crisis". He was working to prevent a future crisis. But there was no real crisis during his presidency. Speculators drove up prices in '79 believing a shortage would occur as a result of the Islamic Revolution in Iran. Some states even panicked and started odd/even day rationing. But there never was a shortage.

The American public supported Carter's long-range plans for what they believed was a short-range problem: a temporary shortage in supply. With the wrong reason motivating the American public, it was easy for Reagan to come up with a solution that meant fewer hardships for the American public: intimidate the Middle East into satisfying our needs.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

41. OK...I think I agree with your logic there

But the point remains that if the country had continued to follow Carter's conservation and alternative energy programs, we'd be a hell of a lot better off than we are today.

[The_Casual_Observer]

25. Old would be remembering Hoover's.

[papapi]

27. Anybody want to go for Coolidge?

[2rth2pwr]

33. If any of you peeps remember Carter, you're too fucking old.

[Cha]

34. Certainly not all the young people who are

energized by Obama and his campaign.. The best part is Prez Jimmy Carter is still around and kickin' strong and can speak for himself.

[eleny]

35. I remember how solar panels went up on the White House....

And how Carter urged Americans to pay off their credit cards and even get rid of some or all of them.

[muryan]

40. I was -10 years old when he was elected

I'm surprised McCain didn't say it would be woodrow wilson's third term.

[onenote]

43. a majority of voters certainly remember Jimmy Carter's presidency

[demo dutch]

44. Yes, so that's not so great!

[TexasObserver]

47. All the ones over 50 do, and that's McCain's target audience.

He's trying to pick off older indies and GOPers.

[ej510]

50. Bush is the worst President ever. I bet you if america had to choose between the 2

they would choose Carter.

[H2O Man]

51. I think I read about

the Carter administration in National Geographic in about 1964. I think that Dr. Louis Leakey uncovered evidence of it at Bed 1 at Olduvia Gorge in Africa.

[WinkyDink]

52. Thirty years isn't a century.