McCain's Secret, Questionable (Navy) Record

[RamboLiberal]

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The New York Times' front-page story about McCain declining promotion to admiral lacks credibility for other reasons as well. For example, McCain had been promoted to captain on August 1, 1979, so he wouldn't have been due for another promotion by March of 1981.

Retired Admiral Peter Booth, who was promoted to rear admiral in 1981, flatly disputes Lehman's claim about McCain. "No, John McCain was not selected for flag rank, for admiral. With all due respect, I think I was selected that same year, and I have never heard anything even remotely like that. To begin with, John Lehman did not select Navy flag officers. That was done with a very august selection board headed by a four-star admiral. The Secretary of the Navy does not appoint. He is in the approval chain, but he is not on the committee.

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Some of the unreleased pages in McCain's Navy file may not reflect well upon his qualifications for the presidency. From day one in the Navy, McCain screwed-up again and again, only to be forgiven because his father and grandfather were four-star admirals. McCain's sense of entitlement to privileged treatment bears an eerie resemblance to George W. Bush's.

Despite graduating in the bottom 1 percent of his Annapolis class, McCain was offered the most sought-after Navy assignment -- to become an aircraft carrier pilot. According to military historian John Karaagac, "'the Airdales,' the air wing of the Navy, acted and still do, as if unrivaled atop the naval pyramid. They acted as if they owned, not only the Navy, but the entire swath of blue water on the earth's surface." The most accomplished midshipmen compete furiously for the few carrier pilot openings. After four abysmal academic years at Annapolis distinguished only by his misdeeds and malfeasance, no one with a record resembling McCain's would have been offered such a prized career path. The justification for this and subsequent plum assignments should be documented in McCain's naval file.

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"fter a European fling with the tobacco heiress, John McCain reported to flight school at Pensacola in August 1958.... is performance was below par, at best good enough to get by. He liked flying, but didn't love it. What he loved was the kick-the-tire, start-the-fire, scarf-in-the-wind life of a naval aviator. ...One Saturday morning, as McCain was practicing landings, his engine quit and his plane plunged into Corpus Christi. Knocked unconscious by the impact, he came to as the plane settled to the bottom....McCain was an adequate pilot, but he had no patience for studying dry aviation manuals.... His professional growth, though reasonably steady, had its troubled moments. Flying too low over the Iberian Peninsula, he took out some power lines, which led to a spate of newspaper stories in which he was predictably identified as the son of an admiral.... he flew a trainer solo to Philadelphia for the Army-Navy game. Flying by way of Norfolk, he had just begun his descent over unpopulated tidal terrain when the engine died. 'I've got a flameout,' he radioed. He went through the standard relight procedures three times. At one thousand feet he ejected, landing on the deserted beach moments before the plane slammed into a clump of trees."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jeffrey-klein/mccains-secret-questionab_b_107409.html

IMHO this is the legitimate questions that should be asked about McCain's naval career. Not the Forrestal "wet start" crap and the "songbird" BS.

[KittyWampus]

1. The BIG Story is the NYTimes knowingly published a bogus story about McCain's Naval Record

All credible statements in the historical record show McCain was never going to be Admiral and yet they allowed that lie to appear in their pages as it was pushed by Lehman. That they didn't note Lehman was on McCain's campaign staff proves the point.


John Lehman doesn't figure in any accounts of McCain's naval career, probably because Lehman was appointed Secretary of the Navy less than two months before McCain retired. The New York Times didn't note this, or the pertinent fact that John Lehman is currently serving as National Security Adviser to McCain's 2008 presidential campaign. Two admirals in the Times story confirmed Lehman's claim, but for unknown reasons the Times, in violation of its own guidelines, accorded them off-the-record status that makes it impossible to assess their motives and credibility.

[Frances]

2. I think I've met this Peter Booth and his wife

His wife was very conservative, and I think Peter Booth is too. So, I don't think Booth has an axe to grind. I can only suppose he is just telling the truth.

[spag68]

3. McCain

For more info about him read "Sailer's to the End". Evidently he crashed more planes then actual real missions flown.

[Ichingcarpenter]

4. To me he is a Manchurian candidate that thinks he's a jedi but

has worked for the Seth Lords all his life.

[RamboLiberal]

6. Sailors to the End - I read that book - no such stuff in it

Just finished it a couple of months ago. I was always interested in the Forrestal fire having remembered stories of it from when I was growing up and following what was happening in the Vietnam war. I had seen the History channel & other documentaries on the fire. Had seen the book when it first came out and read some of it then, but got a cheap used paperback of it to read in the spring this year.

That is the book about the fire on the Forrestal and sailors who were killed/injured fighting it. It is also the story of how the Zuni Rocket was fired by a surge of electricity to the firing system when they switched from external power to the internal power of the plane. The deck crews were taking shortcuts in safety measures so they could speed the launching of the planes.

Another factor was the night before they took on old thin-skinned degraded WWII bombs which had been stored in some outside tropical depot because there was a shortage of bombs. There are only brief mentions of McCain in the book relating to his external fuel tank being hit starting the fire. The WWII dropping off probably his plane from the hit. His escape and almost being a victim when the first bomb cooked off in 134 seconds (he took some minor shrapnel wounds). And they cover him a couple of other times helping throw ordinance off the ship and visiting sick bay.

McCain is not the focus of this well-written book. BTW this book came out several years ago and has no relation to McCain's run for president.

[TacticalPeek]

14. One view:

http://judicial-inc.biz/82jjohn_mccain_and_the_uss_forresta.htm


Not saying it's anything.

But it is the makings of a nice smear if one were in the mood, or provoked - factual or whichever.

[wvbygod]

20. judicial-inc.biz appears to be an anti-Jewish site

Here is one example among many where they blame Israel for killings in the US.

http://judicial-inc.biz/Oklahoma_City_Bomb.htm

Utter garbage.

[ProgressiveEconomist]

5. Remember the hullaballoo over Kerry's military records? Why isn't McCain

held to the same standard? Couldn't McCain sign waivers of any Navy privacy rules to allow them to release ALL his military ratings and records?

Just how many and what models of jets did he crash? Just how bad were his grades at Annapolis? When he was shot down over Vietnam, was he flying the way he was supposed to? What other misconduct is in his Navy records?

[Ichingcarpenter]

7. His debriefings as a POW were never released

even after 40 years.

[AZ Criminal JD]

8. Actually none of the debriefings of any of the POWs have been released.

I know accuracy is not a big thing with many posters on this site. It only demonstrates their ignorance about military regulations and policy since most have never served. Thank goodness Obama is smarter than the people who post here.

[blogslut]

10. Jesus

Could you be more pompous please?

[AZ Criminal JD]

11. The truth making you a little uncomfortable? I thought so.

[blogslut]

12. Uh huh

I bet you're a blast at parties.

[AZ Criminal JD]

13. At least I get invited to some

[blogslut]

15. Oh, owww, I am wounded!

This playground banter is proof of your intelligence?

Have fun with that.

[AZ Criminal JD]

29. The proof of my intelligence is that I posted a fact for the discussion

You posted none in your posts, just sarcasm

[WA98070]

9. Why would the MSM let the truth get in the way of a good story?

[enough]

16. The echoes of the Baby Bush history are remarkable.

[uponit7771]

17. RIGHT, my impression of him now is he's a notch better than bush and that's not sayin much. i used

...to have a better perspective of the guy before he sold his soul for the presidency.

[wmbrew0206]

18. The first section of this post is not quite accurate

While a promotion board normally does select who goes from being a Captain or Colonel (O-6) to Brigadier General or Rear Admiral (O-7), that is not always the case. Occasionally an O-6 will be promoted to O-7 without being selected by the board.

It is obviously not the proffered way to go and this way normally involves a lot of ass kissing.

The only reason I am aware of this is because I had a former Colonel I worked for get passed over twice by the promotion board and we thought his career was over. He went to work for the Commandant as his secretary and within a year had been nominated by the Commandant for Brigadier General.

[KittyWampus]

19. Thanks, though the point being-McCain wasn't an exception to the rule & never came close to Admiral

[wmbrew0206]

22. Actually, reading the article it seems to me that McCain was going to pick up Admiral

It sounds like McCain was not going to get selected by the Promotion Board, the traditional way, and the Secretary of the Navy was going to ensure that he did get a star.

This is just my opinion, and we all know what opinions are like, but here is what I think happened:

McCain, son and grandson of 4 star admirals, doesn't think he is going to pick up a star because he did not have a sea command at the O-6 level and has not been selected for one. He is thinking of retiring and his dads knows it.

Dad has some friends put in a call to the Secretary of the Navy. SecNavy then calls John the III into his office and tells him not to worry because he'll pick up a star when the time comes. The SecNAvy has the ability to do this even if John isn't selected by the promotion board. John, probably knowing he'd become a pariah and would never get a flag level command if he got his star this way, declined and left to run for congress in a cherry picked district.

[KittyWampus]

24. the historical record and interviews with those involved show he was NEVER CLOSE TO ADMIRAL

[wmbrew0206]

26. This is the quote that lead me to believe think the scenario I laid out above is likely

From Retired Admiral John R. Batzler:

"First of all, telling him at all is not kosher, but we all know the Secretary of the Navy does what he damn well pleases, in particular John Lehman."

In the scenario I describe above, McCain is thinking about retiring out because he doesn't think he is going to make Admiral. Lehman calls McCain into his offices and tells him "Don't retire because you are worried about not making Admiral because I'll make sure it happens."

So what you have is a verbal promise from the SecNavy that McCain will make admiral and like Admiral Batzler said it's "not kosher."


I am not disputing that McCain has not selected for Admiral. That is clearly a fact. Would he have made Admiral if he stayed in? If you have the former SecNavy saying he offered McCain a star, I think there is a good chance he would have gotten it.

[wvbygod]

21. Maybe an aggressive swiftboating against McCain is the ticket

Could the risk payoff in the end?

[wmbrew0206]

23. I don't think it would.

I don't know if McCain has ever said he was going to pick up Admiral and even if he did he has a former SecNavy backing up his story.

Overall, McCain served his 20+ years in the Navy and received an honorable discharged and had 5 years as a POW. He also had a O-5 command, which is the high point of many officer's careers, and picked up Captain. I'd call that a good career.

I think it is total acceptable to ask McCain to sign an SF-180 to release his military record. That would include all his fitness reports that would say what kind of officer his superiors thought he was, but I doubt there would be anything really bad in there since he picked up an O-5 command.

It would be interesting to see if he received a fitness report for his time as a POW and if so, what was said of him.

[KittyWampus]

25. we don't know the details about his actual career until he releases his records

which he hasn't. He's only released selected material.

Interesting, you are willing to help in the effort to puff up McCain's record and trash Wesley Clark's.

[wmbrew0206]

28. Where did you get that?

The only problem I have with Clark's record is how he left EUCOM and Gen Shelton's comments. Other than that, he had an exceptional career. I just think that Zinni brings everything Clark does to the ticket and he doesn't have any baggage from his time at Centcom.

The only "puffing up" as you call it, of McCain's record I did was list the fact he had an O-5 command. I also pointed out he did not have an O-6 command, would have more than likely had to have the SecNavy do him a favor to make admiral, stated he would have been a pariah if he did get a star, and stated he would never have a flag level command.

I think he should release his military records. I just don't think there is anything in there that will be that damaging. Probably one or two superior damning him with faint praise, but nothing really juicy. They way Fitness Reports are written, you have to have really screwed up to have something negative in there which would require you to sign the report to acknowledge that it is adverse. Since McCain got an O-5 command, it is unlikely he has a adverse report. So his bad reports, if he has any, will not have anything negative in them, and they will sound good if you don't know what you are looking for.

[TexasObserver]

27. Like Bush, he was a third generation brat who thought he was ENTITLED.

I have no doubt that the Secretary of Navy could and would go over the admirals who didn't think McCain measured up. McCain's entire Navy career was one gigantic affirmative action based solely upon who his daddy and grandfather were.