If your so upset with our current democratic reps

[AllentownJake]

because they won't do exactly what you think is right than run for office yourself. I'm not saying run right for congress, a majority of our reps started somewhere else whether it be as county commissioners, state representatives or state offices. If you honestly feel that Obama is betraying you than step away from the keyboard and go into the world and be the democratic candidate you think a democratic candidate should be.

No excuses, I live in a red state blah blah blah. We have democratic reps in those states. Maybe after you run you might be a little bit more sympathetic to the process of getting elected in the first place.

[Selatius]

1. Well, I can pretty much tell you what a whole bunch of them are gonna say:

"Got 5 million dollars you can loan me to run a congressional campaign?"

[AllentownJake]

12. Tried to stamp that out

Most people start off at the lowest elected office before hitting the highest.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

13. This is what irks me about Nader. He pops up every 4 years to run for president

but doesn't build a party from the bottom-up. The Greens saw how opportunistic he was and threw him out of the party. They are doing the right thing by building the party from the grassroots level; running people for lower offices and moving them up.

[AllentownJake]

14. Exactly

If you really are upset with the party go to your local party and get involved or run for office yourself or leave the party for another party and start building that.

Sitting around crying about things never solved any problems.

Nader is a media whore. He loves attention.

[frogcycle]

2. You're

"your" = possesive form of "you"
"you're" = contraction of "you are"

[AllentownJake]

7. I work with numbers

the english language is my second language.

[frogcycle]

57. lol

sounds like that is a -1 statement!

[WinkyDink]

3. Because any little boy or girl can grow up to be President, too?

[AllentownJake]

8. No

However, if people really think they can do a better job at being in politics maybe they should give it a try.

[onenote]

15. if obama gets elected, it may well come close to proving that to be the case

But if you are saying that any little boy or girl with positions that are not shared by centrist/moderate voters can grow up to be president --- then the answer is, no, at this time, those little boys and girls can't grow up to be president.

[AllentownJake]

17. Not everyone who has done great things in the country

have been President.

Actually a most of our current and historical heroes that made a difference never were President.

[onenote]

21. I agree. ANd Obama didn't start at the top. Community organizer. State office

Then US Senate. He had a quick rise, despite having a background/profile that hardly fits the norm for a fast rising politician.

[xchrom]

4. when you start paying my bills -- you can tell me what to or not to

complain about.

[AllentownJake]

9. When you start paying mine

you can stop telling me how to excercise my freedom of speech rights as well by criticising your free speech.

[xchrom]

56. you're hallucinating -- stop telling people what to do unless you pay the fuckin bills.

and you can start with mine.

other wise mind your own bloody business.

[AllentownJake]

58. WAH

Someone said something I don't like on the internet so I'm going to curse and :cry:

WAHHHHHH

[knixphan]

59. lol

[xchrom]

61. project much? -- you start a piss and moan

and don't like the results. poor baby.

[AllentownJake]

63. I could care less of the results

I find it funny that you are so upset you have to curse when there really isn't anything that politically upsetting in my thread.

I knew the purist were here.

[xchrom]

68. nah -- you just wanna wank off on every body --

tell them what to do -- and complain when they tell you to mind your own fuckin business.

[AllentownJake]

69. No

Actually I post very few threads like this. However the purity fools tend to make me angry because having grown up in a GOP household I know how they win and how we lose and the blame always falls on the purity fools in my opinion.

I assume in real life your a nice person once the internet persona is stripped away so have a good day.

[tkmorris]

5. Oh bullshit

There's "doing things I don't agree with", and then there's "voting like a Republican and expecting you to like it". It's not a purity test, it's just expecting a bare minimum of our reps.

[AllentownJake]

11. If you don't like them

run yourself if you think you can do a better job.

I'm pretty liberal I'd probably vote for you.

[a la izquierda]

6. In my area, I have an extremely conservative

representative (Tom Cole). Calling him is a useless gesture (I've tried). Even the Democrats in Oklahoma are conservative by all measures. But my democratic state legislators are pretty receptive to calls and complaints. They may not be able to do much, but they will at least listen to my rants.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

10. I don't have a Democratic Rep

What ticks me off is that the Arkansas Democratic Party are not even fielding a candidate this year--the one year I feel we really have a chance to claim this seat.

[ClassWarrior]

16. If not elected office, at least get involved at the grassroots with your county Dem Party...

...and lend your fellow Progressives a hand at taking the damn thing back.

NGU.

[AllentownJake]

18. but if I get involved

and understand the world is more complex and politically harder to navigate than in my mind than how can I come onto the internet and complain :sarcasm:

[Saturday]

19. I shouldn't have to run for office to get my employees

to do what I want them to do. But good try at putting the blame for our Democratic leaders failures on us.

[AllentownJake]

20. You are one voice

If that voice is so powerful and politically popular in our democracy I encourage you to use it by becoming a rep of the people.

[onenote]

22. In case you didn't notice, they don't work solely for you.

And you might ask yourself: in your experience of the world, does everyone agree with you?

[Saturday]

40. I'm tired of Obama supporters kissing his feet no matter

what he does. You're an example of that.

[AllentownJake]

43. No I am not

by any sense of the imagination. I'm smart enough that opening a left flank during a GE is not a winning strategy.

[ClassWarrior]

23. So it's all about you and your employees, huh?

I thought "I got mine" was the other side's philosophy.

By the way, our elected officials are our representatives, not our "leaders."

NGU.

[Saturday]

39. What does this have to do with "I got mine"?

And Obama is now the leader of our party, isn't he?

[MadHound]

24. What an idiotic and arrogant contention

That's like stating that if one doesn't like the food at a haute cuisine restaurant, just go right into the kitchen and start cooking yourself. Not everybody is cut out to be a chef, neither is everybody cut out to be a politician. That doesn't mean that people still don't have the right to demand good government or political leaders that uphold their sworn oath to uphold and defend the Constitution.

All you're doing with this post is trying to stifle legitimate criticism. Put a sock in it, we all have the right to criticize, thank you very much.

[FredfromSpace]

27. Indeed.

Another morning, another "blame the victim" thread....

[AllentownJake]

32. Yes

I'm sure your a victim of our cruel democracy.

Got another system in mind?

[FredfromSpace]

36. You are right. I really do hate democracy...

:rofl: :spray: :patriot: :sarcasm: :headbang: :hurts: :nopity:

[AllentownJake]

45. K

When you find an alternative or run yourself let me know.

[FredfromSpace]

53. Do you actually imagine that we are having a conversation here?

Cause we aren't.

[AllentownJake]

54. Than why are you replying?

Seriously?

You can have the last word I'll give it to you ;-)

Say whatever you want.

BTW thanks for the Kick.

[FredfromSpace]

55. OK. Last word.

Your original OP was very silly.

Just because a person has problems with their representative does not mean they should run for office.

Political activity has all kinds of levels and some individuals are more suited or inclined to different kinds of organization.

Besides, the right to petition one's representatives, and to criticize or oppose them for their actions, is pretty much enshrined in our national documents.

Your suggestion that I had some sort of problem with "democracy" was similarly silly and totally off-topic.

I responded to it with gentle mockery, which seemed appropriate enough.

If you want to have an exchange on substance in the future, just try saying something worth responding to and I will happily join the discussion at that time.

For now, enough of this very silly thread.

[AllentownJake]

28. What?

You have free speech and I don't? You can say whatever you want without critism. How hypocritical of you.

You can say what you want to say...however I can point out that I think some people on here are arm chair generals bitching about the plays being run.

[MadHound]

37. Stop playing the hyper-victim

You have the right to free speech, I didn't say that you didn't. But the American people, by the sheer simple fact that this is a democracy and that our tax money goes to support the government, have a right to complain about that government, where it is going, what it is doing, any day of the week and twice on Sundays. After all, this is government of, by and for the people. All you're doing by your little demand that if we criticize we should run for office is trying to stifle this free speech and criticism. Hmmm speaking of hypocritical.

Oh, and in your generalization and broad brush attack on people, you are completely eliminating the fact that many, many people have done a lot more in politics than be an armchair general. Frankly I'm willing to put thirty seven years of political creds up against your happy ass any time.

So it simply comes down to this, we have the right to criticize the government, in fact in a democracy it is our duty to do so. And all you're little screed is trying to do is suppress criticism and free speech. Are you sure you can handle living in a democracy?

[AllentownJake]

46. I don't like what you said

so now I'm going to rant and cry and call you a fascist :cry:

I'm happy your out there. If your out there helping it wasn't directed towards you.

I have the right to support my candidate under the constitution and defend him and just because I want to I get called as many names by the purist as you do by the people like me. Can you handle living in a democracy?

[MadHound]

47. Again playing the hyper victim

I'm not the one demanding that people either shut up or run for office. You are. Apparently it is you who are the one who can't handle democracy.

[AllentownJake]

48. I never said shut up or made demands

I made a suggestion on earning my respect.

I respect people who take action alot more than people who moan and groan.

[ClassWarrior]

30. If you're not cut out for it, see #16 above.

You have a right to demand whatever you want. But the only way you can be sure you're going to get it is by doing it yourself. The founders based this country on citizen leadership for this very reason.

All you're doing with this post is trying to make excuses. But I'm not idiotic and arrogant enough to tell you to "put a sock in it" yourself.

NGU.

[MadHound]

42. LOL, pal, I've been there, done that,

I've worked in the political arena for thirty seven years, done the delegate thing, tried that whole change the system from within thing time and again(after all, it isn't like we haven't been concerned about this two party/same corporate master system of government for the past four decades). And guess what the fuck it's gotten me? A Democratic candidate who thinks that it's OK to shred the Constitution. Ooo, aren't we making progress now:eyes:

Sorry pal, but the only way one can effect real change from within is if one has massive amounts of cash to wave in front of the party. Unless you have that, it matters not how much you work with them, how much blood, sweat and tears you put into the party, if it's not money talkin', then it's walkin'

You don't like those beans, tough shit, they come from decades of experience in politics at all levels. Deal.

[ClassWarrior]

51. Yeah, that's what they all say.

:eyes:

NGU.

[sufrommich]

25. Yes, every single person who has a bone to pick

with the government should either run for office or STFU. Which office did Thomas Paine hold again,I forget?

[AllentownJake]

29. When you right Common Sense 2008

Give me a PM I'd love to read it.

[sufrommich]

34. It's "write" and American citizens(even those of us without

Paine's skills)have not only a "right" but a duty to criticize the government without holding office in order to do so.Why not go all the way and return the vote to landowners only? The anti democratic crap being bandied about on this board is a real eye opener.

[AllentownJake]

35. I never said STFU

I simply stated what would make me respect the purist complainers on here.

You can whine all you want. I won't respect you till you take real action on your bitching.

[FredfromSpace]

26. DCC is not supporting the Dem contender in my district.

Just read it in the paper last week.

They say it is too "Republican" to waste their funds on, even though we have an open seat this year, for the first time in eons.

I guess I could run myself next time, but it would make more sense to run as a Green or something, since the DP has written off my district.

[jonnyblitz]

31. boy, some of you "democrats" sure do hate free speech and

people speaking their mind. I often wonder why thin skinned people like you who can't handle adult discussion and disagreement even participate on these political discussion boards. I also don't understand politician groupies who freak out every time somebody criticizes the politician they worship. I could never be enamored of any politician THAT much. it is creepy.

[AllentownJake]

33. "Free speech"

Doesn't mean I can say whatever I want without critism. If you want to dish it out be prepared to hear it back.

See I'm excercising my free speech that you so cherish for yourself but not for others.

[ClassWarrior]

38. Wow... look at all the vitriol. I think you hit a nerve among the slackers, Jake...

They're so desperate, they're resorting to criticizing your grammar.

:rofl:

NGU.

[sufrommich]

41. So do you agree with Jakes contention that

running for office should be a condition for criticizing the government? What is so "vitriolic" about disagreeing with that premise? How sad that you would see anyone defending the right to protest government actions as "slackers".

[ClassWarrior]

50. That wasn't his "contention."

NGU.

[AllentownJake]

52. Words are being added to my poor grammar

:rofl:

[AllentownJake]

44. Arm Chair Generals

They are as bad as I am watching and EAGLES game on Sunday being critical of the players. The only difference is an Eagle's game doesn't matter and doesn't effect my life.

John McCain being President effects my life.

I have terrible grammar. I work with numbers and the written word isn't my strong suit. Probably why I enjoy reading people who can do it. I also suck at art but enjoy it.

[ClassWarrior]

49. Hey, you get in there and you DO IT, even if you do have "terrible grammar."

Because you know it's the right thing to do. Which is the point.

:toast:

NGU.

[depakid]

60. Rgar's almost exactly what Ralph Nader was saying in the late 90's and early 00's

Just sayin'

[grantcart]

62. agree 100%

especially love the folks who say its just so easy lol

[AllentownJake]

64. Hey Grant

I'm going to see the Dalai Lama this weekend. He's doing a 6 day event in my mid-size city!

[grantcart]

65. great you should post an article on the Religious forum

He is a great teacher and a great voice for peace.

[AllentownJake]

66. Will do

Shame I don't have the Time off to go all 6 days.

[Lucky 13]

67. Not everyone is cut out for public office or RUNNING for public office.

But every American has the right to hold their elected officials responsible.

[truedelphi]

70. It is not easy to runa s a Democrat --

You have to submit to the Democratic Powers that be.

In the San Francisco Bay Area, that means Lady Di and her minions.

If they aren't happy to welcome you aboard you end up going the indie route.

BUt I do think that one of the things wrong in our society is that the local frustrated Repugs will run for dog catcher, or County SUpervisor or whatever.

While the more progressive people find some excuse, like they are busy raising the kids, or they don't feel they are good enough (no Msster's degree, not enough credentials, etc - though shouldn't we start realizing that George W has one - fat lot of good it did him!)