Collins on Obama - top NYT emailed piece in the last 48 hrs.

[kstewart33]

July 10, 2008
Op-Ed Columnist
The Audacity of Listening
By GAIL COLLINS
We have to have a talk about Barack Obama.

I know, I know. You’re upset. You think the guy you fell in love with last spring is spending the summer flip-flopping his way to the right. Drifting to the center. Going all moderate on you. So you’re withholding the love. Also possibly the money.

I feel your pain. I just don’t know what candidate you’re talking about.

Think back. Why, exactly, did you prefer Obama over Hillary Clinton in the first place? Their policies were almost identical — except his health care proposal was more conservative. You liked Barack because you thought he could get us past the old brain-dead politics, right? He talked — and talked and talked — about how there were going to be no more red states and blue states, how he was going to bring Americans together, including Republicans and Democrats.

Exactly where did everybody think this gathering was going to take place? Left field?

Link: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/10/opinion/10collins.html?ei=5087&em=&en=8f0a215e095b39b5&ex=1215921600&pagewanted=print

[Larkspur]

1. I voted for Obama to break the stranglehold Clintons had over the Dem Party

and I'll help break Obama when he tries to play the Clinton triangulation game. Along with many other progressives upset at his FISA position, I'm refusing to donate to his campaign and rumors abound that he did not raise as much as he had planned last month. A month or 2 of lower than expected donations may drive the point home to Obama.

[skooooo]

10. Cut your nose off too?

[Larkspur]

11. Nope

Obama can eat the dollars of those elusive centrist voters he's chasing.

[scheming daemons]

12. OK.... enjoy the McCain Presidency.... at least you'll have "proved your point"

[high density]

16. Yeah a lot of people here don't seem to understand the alternative

I had a poster on here the other night telling me he didn't know how I could "sleep at night" after I said that I blindly support Obama.

[John Q. Citizen]

34. No, he will have proved that moving to the "center" is stupid politics, something

that will benefit Americans for years to come.

[Larkspur]

38. Obama is making the same mistakes Kerry and Gore did

In the 2000 campaign, when Gore moved "centrist" his poll numbers went down but when he moved "left" or progressive populist, his poll numbers went up. Gore won the popular vote because he figured out in time that his progressive populist appeal was a winner over Bush's crony compassionate conservatism. Unfortunately for Gore and us, the Bush mafia stole the 2000 election.

Kerry did similar things and of course he underestimated Bush and the Bush machine.

The only thing going for Obama this year is that the Republican brand stinks worse than garbage.

[Larkspur]

39. Obama is Bill Clinton ver 2.0

He'll stiff progressives and Labor just like Billy boy did. The only hope we have is that the Progressive Movement is stronger than it was in 1992.

[Captain Hilts]

15. FDR, JFK, LBJ "triangulated" all the time. FYI. nt

[high density]

19. But those guys were far too good at getting things done

The modern day progressive wants a president who does nothing, because doing nothing is better than doing a lot of good and maybe being wrong a few times (at least in their eyes). Obama could have a 90/10 good/bad ratio on the issues and they'd still be going for his nuts because of that 10% that they don't like.

[cliffordu]

22. That's right - some feel that politics is a simple consumer endeavor -

"I want it my way, I paid 20 dollars for the right to have it my way..."


The mark of a self-centered fatally spoiled view of the world.

[polichick]

2. It's one thing to emphasize common ground, and another to diss people like...

...Wes Clark and MoveOn ~ imo a lot of donors feel he slapped them in the face.

[rox63]

5. It's called message control

Until this campaign, the GOP have been masters at it. We need to do that too.

[polichick]

7. I'll take free speech and truth over Republicanesque "message control."

[tishaLA]

14. keeping a campaign on message isn't republiconesque

unless by "republiconesque" you mean "winning." It is THE way to win campaigns.

[polichick]

25. Obviously, I was responding to message #5.

[cliffordu]

23. That would be nice but it isn't the choice now, is it?

If you think it is you haven't been paying attention.

[polichick]

24. Perhaps you missed my original point, which was that...

...slapping free-speaking & truthful donors down might not pay off.

[cliffordu]

28. I don't understand why you feel it's as personal as a slap in the face -

The vote was a dance with the devil, to be sure, but it HAD to be done.

People act like he threw off his sheep's clothing to display his true wolfish nature - it just ain't true.

I am constantly amazed at the political nievete here at DU.

[polichick]

29. I was referring to comments directed at Wes Clark and MoveOn...

...during Obama's speech on patriotism ~ it was unnecessary, and probably costly.

[cliffordu]

30. Sorry - I completely missed that part. Apologies and nevermind!

[polichick]

32. No worries - it's true that he never was the progressive people hoped he was...

...but also true that the cash was coming in from those very voters ~ not likely the middle-of-the-road crowd will give as much.

[John Q. Citizen]

36. He has parts of his past that are extremely progressive. I just think FISA was a mistake on Obama's

part.

More so than dissing Clark and Move-on. But the combination is what's really hurting.

[John Q. Citizen]

35. How did that vote help Obama's campaign? I think it hurt it.

[rox63]

3. Excellent op-ed

I hope the teeming masses read it and try to understand our nominee.

[Inuca]

6. From your keyboard...

This whole "Obama is abandoning us" coupled with the idiotic comments in the media is driving me NUTS. The part of Collins' op-ed quoted in the OP puts it perfectly. What the hell did people think that all the talk of bridging the divide actually meant?!?!?

[Inuca]

4. Good, it's an excellent article n/t

[tomp]

8. never liked obama's centrism.

collins is not speaking to me, but to some fool who couldn't originally see the truth.

[jenmito]

9. Sounds kind of like the thread I started a few days ago:

Obama never claimed to be a liberal. We voted for him on his platform of bringing people together.

He's supposedly "post-partisan." And I think he's behaving consistent with that message. He's no Kucinich. He's no Lieberman, either. He wants to WIN. Do you realize how many talking points he's taking away from the Repubs.? McCain sounds ridiculous trying to paint him as a "flip-flopper" on Iraq since there are tons of videos to prove him wrong (luckily, McCain's not that familiar with "the google.") He also sounds ridiculous trying to paint him as a "loony leftist" when he says things like, "Obama may not have agreed with the Supreme Court's ruling on THIS case, but..." Obama ran a TERRIFICALLY planned primary campaign, beating the entire Clinton machine. I think he knows exactly what he's doing to win the presidency and he will be a president who lives up to the majority of America's and the world's expectations (IMO).

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=6463530

[Captain Hilts]

17. Then why was all the Centrist, sell-out, DINO, DLC crap thrown at Clinton and not at him?

when his stances were not that different from hers? You must have missed the "he's more progressive than Feingold" threads.

He was a blank slate that a lot of folks projected what they wanted to see onto him. He always got the benefit of the doubt, Clinton never did.

Our best presidents have been duplicitous, triangulating bastards: FDR, JFK, LBJ, WJC.

[jenmito]

Hillary voted for the war and never apologized for it, for Kyl/Lieberman, criticized Kerry when he

CLEARLY botched his joke about the troops (when he was talking about Bush), etc. Obama never claimed to be a liberal. He ran on bringing people together and bringing change by having transparency in govt., not having lobbyists run/donate to his campaign, etc.

[karynnj]

31. Also, independent of Obama - it was that there was far too much baggage

left from the 1990s - by that I do not mean things that they may have done wrong - but the very strong likelihood that there were too many people whose opinions were very firmly against the Clintons --- some of whom were more open to Obama or someone new. I know some among my family, neighbors and friends.

The mood was change, not nostalgia - which would have led to HRC. Whether Obama will be able to reach out both to other countries and to Republicans at home AND find them reaching out in return - needs to be seen - but that is what many people not at either extreme want.

[polichick]

27. imo it was his war stance that made him seem more progressive than Clinton...

It's what made me choose him over her ~ and also that he seemed to adopt Edwards' anti-corporate approach.

[NYC_SKP]

13. Obama vs Clinton comparison? Like black and white, night and day.

Leadership is more than policy positions.

I love Obama because he doesn't talk to me like a baby.

He doesn't make up sniper stories.

He didn't think he was inevitable.

He didn't pander to me with a bullshit tax holiday idea.

He knows how to save my social security and won't privatize it.

He is transcendent.

[Fire_brand]

18. black and white??

lol

[NYC_SKP]

20. I know...heh! nt

[grantcart]

21. worth a second thread and rec

great piece

[JoFerret]

26. Interesting that Collins hit a streak

with that one.
Her commentary has been increasingly on target these past few months.

[yodermon]

33. "His decision to ditch public campaign financing..was nothing but a complete, total..flip-flop"

is that true? I thought he had never actually committed to/against public financing, he had been sort of vague on that point. "I'll come to an agreement with mccain" or some such. The media portrays it as a 100% flipflop though, what am i missing?

[jenmito]

37. It's NOT true. But that doesn't stop everyone from saying it.