The obvious choice of VP

[bdf]

Since this is my first opportunity to do so, I'm catching up on the pseudo-impeachment hearings on youtube. There is only one choice of VP for Obama: Kucinich.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

1. I don't think that would get him very many votes.

:shrug:

[trueblue2007]

6. I want to see a WOMAN Vice President.

[Alexander]

19. Would you be happy with Condi Rice or Carly Fiorina?

Seriously, let's be done with the idiocy of identity politics.

[newmajority]

24. OK... where is there a female governor, who brings something other than gender to the ticket

and who will NOT be replaced by a Repuke if she leaves the state?

Sebelius - Adds nothing. Electoral or otherwise.

Napolitano - Good choice geographically, but she would be replaced by a raging Repuke secretary of state.

Gregoire - Nope you can't have her. Too late for a new Democratic candidate to get the advantage over that fucking puke crimnal bastard Rossi, who came too close to stealing the election last time, and would unfortunately have the advantage if Chris moved up to VP

Granholm - Canadian and DLC.

Am I missing anyone?

[mloutre]

25. Not that you're gender-biased or anything, of course.

Sexist much?

*ahem*

[RichGirl]

7. I would get him...

...the Roswell vote! Seriously, well, actually it would....I wish we lived in a country where Kucinich was an asset as VP.

[bunnies]

2. put the bong down. nt

[saltpoint]

3. I'd be quite enthused to have Dennis Kucinich in any high-profile

position but I don't think there's a chance for him on Obama's ticket.

That's no reflection on Kucinich but on the voting population, who likely lack the foresight and clarity to consider Kucinich as a true warrior for the well-being of the nation.

Great Congressman, too many dumb voters.

[bdf]

11. I don't have a dog in this race

I'm a Brit, living in Britain. I don't get a vote in the Presidential election (doesn't stop me having fervent hopes, though).

Just as it has been said, by evil, psychopathic arseholes, that the view of the world dramatically changed on 9-11, I think you're looking at Kucinich through pre-impeachment-hearing tinted spectacles.

I made that post after having seen a small fraction of the pseudo-impeachment hearings testimony. I say "pseudo" because officially the hearing is not about impeachment but looking at the testimony it clearly is. The verdict of the hearings cannot bring about an impeachment directly, but either it will result in true impeachment hearings or we are all well-and-truly fucked, because the Bushies will have won and what they got away with this time around will be seen by them as the absolute minimum they can get away with next time.

Let me repeat that: either there will be an impeachment (and if so it will succeed) or we are all fucked.

If there is impeachment, Kucinich will be the biggest hero the US has seen for decades. Single-handedly he forced through the impeachment that the majority of Americans cried out for when they returned Dems to majority control of both houses of Congress two years ago. He may not have been the most impressive speaker at the hearings, but without his perseverance there would have been no hearings in the first place.

You might think that Kucinich would deter marginal Republicans. But I watched the youtube video of him taking calls. One from a Republican who voted for Dubya both times and now asked for forgiveness and praised Kucinich for doing what he was doing.

If the impeachment happens then what Kucinich achieves in deposing an insane tyrant named George is comparable to what Washington did with an earlier insane tyrant named George.

I understand people who think that Kucinich just isn't vice-presidential enough. When Kucinich stood for President I caught one of his campaign speeches with the bizarre intonation and rhythm and thought "what a muppet" even though I agreed with his message. But his demeanour and elocution in testimony today was far better.

Yeah, he's extreme left wing (by US standards - not when compared to many mainstream UK politicians, though), but the US is sick and tired of the extreme right that's currently in power and are looking for anti-Bush.

Obama has upset a lot of people on the left by signing off on the FISA stuff and saying he would only indict Bush for egregious crimes. Maybe he really was just trying to make himself appear centrist: maybe he will change his view on the FISA stuff once President, and maybe he will consider just about everything Dubya 'n' Dick did was an egregious crime worthy of indictment. What better way of reassuring his base than by nominating Kucinich as Veep?

Remember, either the impeachment happens, or we're fucked. If the impeachment happens, Kucinich is the biggest asset Obama has. If the impeachment doesn't happen, it doesn't matter who Obama chooses as Veep because we're fucked.

Oh, and let me remind you that in living memory, only two Veeps played any significant part in the administration, the rest (as the saying almost goes) weren't worth a pitcher of warm spit. One of those Veeps was later elected President of the US (but did not serve); the other is effectively President of the US. If Quayluude can be Veep, Kucinich can.

[Muttocracy]

12. you answered it with this comment

"Yeah, he's extreme left wing (by US standards - not when compared to many mainstream UK politicians, though), but the US is sick and tired of the extreme right that's currently in power and are looking for anti-Bush."


The first part is correct (our left is Europe's center) but the US perspective changes VERY slowly.

[bdf]

13. I took that into account

You're not going to shift long-term opinion quickly. I understand that. There is a horror on the right of what the US considers the extreme left (but isn't by UK standards).

But short-term opinion is another matter. There are life-long Republicans who despise Bush and refuse to vote for McInsane because of what Bush has done. Backlash may be short-lived, but it can last long enough. Most of the repentant Republicans aren't bright enough (if they were intelligent they wouldn't be Republicans) to have figured out that Dubya isn't a Republican, he's a fucking fascist. Their desire to escape Bushism will transcend boundaries.

Anyway, in any of the testimony by Kucinich, did you see any ultra-left-wing (by US standards) sentiment? Any ordinary-left-wing? Any slightly-left-of-centre? Everything I saw, including his phone conversations in the TV show, had him saying it wasn't a partisan issue but a matter of the Constitution.

Most voters aren't very smart, don't pay a lot of attention, and have short attention spans. The ones who remember every one of Kucinich's stances are the ones who would never vote for any Democratic candidate, especially a black one.

If the impeachment is successful (I'm an atheist but right now I'm tempted to pray) then the two things that are at the top of the "three items max, short attention span brains" of Repug voters who are disillusioned with Bush are going to be "Thank fuck we are finally free of Bush" and "Kucinich was responsible."

If the impeachment is successful, Kucinich will be (for a short time) golden. Eventually the wingnuts like Limbaugh and O'Reilly will brainwash the least stupid Republican voters, but for a while they'll see Kucinich as their salvation, just as we do.

[Muttocracy]

15. The NY Times isn't even reporting this last I checked; Americans have no idea

about all this.

I dearly appreciate Kucinich, but you'll have to review media reaction to him from the debate season to understand our perspective.

[bdf]

17. Think it through

Yeah, the mainstream media isn't reporting this pseudo-impeachment hearing because it is only a pseudo-impeachment hearing. Right now it's non-news (for the GOP-biased media) and can be ignored.

What if it results in a real impeachment hearing? Then it's the sort of news even Faux can't ignore. Really, they can't. Because if they do then one of their rivals will report it and prove themselves to be more on the ball than Faux is, therefore get more viewers, therefore get advertising revenue that previously went to Faux. There is a positive feedback effect at work. At this point none of the media gains a significant advantage by reporting what's happening. Come a real impeachment then none of them can afford to ignore it.

Let me re-iterate: if there is no impeachment then we're all fucked, no matter who Obama chooses for Veep. In the best case it's because Obama will win but eventually the Repubs will take the White House and use what Dubya got away with as a starting point. In the worst case it's because Dubya 'n' Dick will arrange another false-flag operation before the transition that means they get perpetual power. An impeachment is our only chance, and it's a fucking slender one.

For an impeachment to help us, it has to happen right fucking now because one way or another Dubya 'n' Dick will fuck us over if they're in power much longer. Even if it's only by launching a war in Iran that dumps big problems onto Obama.

So, if an impeachment is going to do any good at all, it has to happen now. And if it does, it will hit the media. And if that happens, Kucinich will be a fucking hero. If none of that happens then it really doesn't matter who Obama chooses, because we're fucked.

I'm guilty here of presenting things in black and white. There's a middle ground. One where there is an impeachment but Obama leaves the left thinking, because of his repugnant FISA vote, that he's no better than McSame. And as the polls have often shown, if voters are faced with the choice between a Republican and a Democrat emulating a Republican, even those that hate Republicans will choose the Republican because they prefer the real thing to a fake.

C'mon. Read the board. We're left wingers here. We hate McCain. But how many of us were pissed off over FISA? How many of us were worried that Obama's definition of "egregious crimes" falls far short of ours? How many of us are worried that Obama might be selling us out? Kucinich as Veep would reassure us.

Voting reality check: Gore won the election. Kerry won the election. In an honest election after a successful impeachment, Obama/Kucinich would soar. In a dishonest election it really doesn't matter a shit who Obama chooses for Veep.

[YOY]

4. You know, a lot of us love Dennis here.

But as for mainstream America...that would have them screaming bloody communism to have a real left wing candidate.

The idea to have him as candidate or even VP, as much as I would love it, is FARKING INSANE.

[SteppingRazor]

5. I think his VP should by that white-and-pink flying unicorn from the last Jib-Jab video.

Kidding aside, I like Kucinich, but there are political realities to consider.

[scheming daemons]

8. Yes..... that is the obvious choice.... if you want President McCain

:eyes:

[DesertFlower]

9. give me a f------ break.

do you want to lose this election?

[Douglas Carpenter]

10. I LOVE DENNIS KUCINICH!!! But that is NOT going to happen

[bigwillq]

14. Never going to happen

He's perceived as too liberal, and too loony and he's not seen as being presidential enough.

It's too bad because he is the most progressive of the 2008 DEM candidates, and he earned my vote in the primary. He's one of the few that always speaks his mind and stands up for true progressive values.

The party, and the people, are content with a moderate/centrist.

[Phx_Dem]

16. I assume you're joking. nt

[MasonJar]

18. If he truly wants to guarantee a win, he will choose Hillary. I am somewhat

worried by some of the recent polls. This country and the world in general cannot take a presidency of John McCain. He is just too unstable. We need to escape the doctrines of the neocons, not double it. So it is incumbent upon Obama to choose the VP who will help him win.

[Mass]

20. I'd go with that, but I think it is unlikely...

[Mz Pip]

21. Uh, no.

Dennis represents his constituents well, but he would not be a good fit for VP.

[newmajority]

22. What I find sickening here

Is that there seems to be more people defending the idea of a Republican like Hagel, Nunn, Bayh (and yes all three ARE Repukes) on the ticket than an actual Democrat like Dennis Kucinich.

Yeah, I don't think it's likely either. And I don't think a congressman in the VP slot would be any better than another senator. But I would be proud to vote for that ticket. :patriot:

[zulchzulu]

23. Kucinich is a good guy, but not a VP

His strengths and talents would not cater to a VP position. We need him in the House.