Does it really make any difference who the VP choice is?

[Peacetrain]

In all reality, will anyone change their mind on whether they will vote for Senator Obama or not because of his pick for VP among the front runners, Clinton, Bayh, Biden, Kaine, Richardson. None of them are perfect. Each one has their own set of warts. Obama is not perfect. Maybe we should start a "whats wrong with this canidate thread."

Take each one of the top five and put down all the things that we question about that canidate. I would say put down all the things that are good with that canidate, but I do not think anyone is in that frame of mind tonight. It looks like we are taking stock of our human but flawed representatives.

The flogging of the canidates will commence in 10 minutes.


:popcorn:

[truthisfreedom]

1. I'm not worried about it in the least.

It's not going to make or break Obama. He'll make a great choice. That's all I've got to say about it.

[KAZ]

2. Won't change my mind.

[gateley]

3. I think the right VP candidate may attract some voters who

aren't too sure about Obama, and that attention might translate into votes. So yes, the right person could very well make a difference.

The trouble is, deciding just who that person is!

[murielm99]

20. I canvassed Sunday.

We ran into people who are waiting to see the VP choice before they decide who gets their vote.

I find that odd. There is such a vast difference between Obama and McCain. I am only reporting what people said to me.

[gateley]

23. If I was unsure about a candidate, I might feel the same way.

Someone I respected and trusted on the ticket as VP would go a long way in making me feel better voting for a candidate.

Conversely, I've heard that many evangelicals won't vote for McCain if Romney is the VP on his ticket, so it DOES seem to matter to some.

[Cha]

4. Obama will be setting the policies if we get

our :kick: :kick: that far and it will be someone who will work with him synergystically.

[Maddy McCall]

5. It makes a huge difference.

It makes a huge difference, for both Obama and McCain.

This election will be very close...of course the selection of VP will influence voters, possibly enough to win or lose this election.

Can't believe there's even a question about the importance of VP selection.

[Carrieyazel]

31. It won't. For Obama, all the focus will be on him. His VP pick won't really matter.

A VP pick doesn't help you win a state anymore. Also, any weaknessess in Obama don't get fixed by a running mate. Just ask John Kerry, Michael Dukakis and Bob Dole.

[jobycom]

6. It could. If Obama chooses a pro-life, anti-choice running mate

that could inspire a lot of people to stay home, or even vote for a different candidate. In general, though, people will get over their problems with most picks. A nuance or two difference on some issues won't matter.

[Maddy McCall]

9. Hate to be blatantly honest, but I might even consider staying home...

in that circumstance. Being pro-choice is a deal maker/breaker for me.

[jobycom]

12. You and I have been in agreement for most of this election

and we are on this, too. Hopefully it's just the media being goofy, or Obama playing them to throw them off scent. Last week it was certain to be Jack Reed, this week Tim Kaine.

[Maddy McCall]

15. I hope you're right.

Choice is my number-one issue.

Yeah, you and I have agreed most of the election. But I owe you a spankin' for making fun of my Texassippi accent.

:spank:

[jobycom]

24. I hope I'm right, too, though I'm not predicting anything yet.

My number one issue is equality. Choice is included in that, as are marriage rights, civil rights, and freedom from religion. So Choice is a dealbreaker. Everyone keeps reminding us that it's all about SCOTUS, but if a certain candidate's first major choice is against Choice, I'm not sure what confidence I can have in him. Especially if that candidate has twice sided with Scalia and Alito in recent months, and against Stevens and Souter.

So far it's just a rumor. I hope that's all it is.

And who says I was picking on your accent. That was MY accent!

[elocs]

14. Of course, if McCain would somehow win I guarantee if you are pro choice

that you will be disappointed with the Supreme Court Justices he would nominate as opposed to the ones who would never be nominated by any of Obama's potential VP choices.

[Maddy McCall]

17. Thing is, Obama knows he needs the woman vote.

He's not about to pick someone who's anti-choice, if he's smart.

And I have no doubt that he's smart. He needs former Hillary supporters, and his VP will have to represent interest in women's issues, whether it's Hillary or any other person.

[saracat]

27. Choice is also my number one issue but I was crucified for it earlier!

It seems I don't have the right to express worry about a potential anti-choice VP. That could be a deal breaker for many folks. But there are also a lot of folks I met canvassing who are looking for military experience. That seems to be the litmas test for many. I have never seen so many voters on both sides of the aisle holding their collective breaths about VP before!

[Maddy McCall]

33. Don't let the Knights of Umbrage get you down.

Of COURSE you should be able to voice your preferences for VP.

Domestic policy history is going to be more important to me than military experience...but that's just me. However, if people have clearly stated reasons as to why they think military experience is more important than choice, then I'll listen to them, though I might not agree with them...they should afford us the same civility.

[napoleon_in_rags]

7. Not here. But a discussion about who is best for the GE makes sense. nt

[Median Democrat]

8. Prefer Someone Boring, Harmless But Competent

Obama has enough personality and personal background. A big name and personality invites additional drama. I want someone who is competent, reassuring, but boring. If they meet this criteria, I'm happy.

[Condem]

10. Not going to please everybody, peacetrain

So, you've got to please yourself.

[Peacetrain]

13. Hi Condem, very true

I am so pleased with all our top five. I would be a happy camper with any of them. They are there to basically support the next president. I think any of them would do a pretty good job of that, but each one of them, has issues. But not to worry, I understand the other side is going over the top with the thought of Romney. :) The republicans on the edge of a riot on that one

[Condem]

18. Hey peace

Moving day is Thursday, yes. Your husband and son are going to see a very different Iowa City. Tell them to take a look at City Park.

[Peacetrain]

22. Oh Condem, what a story this is.. Hubby is there now

Our son sublet for the summer and has an apt with a friend for the fall. He has to be out tomorrow, but cannot get into the other apt till Friday, so they are moving his stuff to a storage area for two days,and then back in *lol*

But I told them it would be all worth it, they could have lunch at Masalas'!

I told them what you said about Obama being in Cedar Rapids on Thursday..It will be a good break for them

[Condem]

30. I ride my bike around town......

every couple of days, peace, to check on progress. I don't know why I do it, because it ends up depressing me. The physical damage to the U of I and The Normandy area are bad, but it's my park that kills me. It looks like a beach. So many trees dying. A very surreal summer, indeed.

[Peacetrain]

36. I do not want to see it yet ..I have not been there since right before

the biggest part of the flood hit. I am waiting to go back in October. I think when the leaves are off the trees, it will not be such a shock. Maybe I should wait till the snow flies. Are a lot of the trees going to be lost?

Maybe we could start a tree drive to replace them.

[Condem]

40. The city hasn't started working on the park...

So you can see it in all it's glory. Dead fish, piles of sand and the smell. Still, seven weeks later, big ponds. Unbelievable. Tell hubby I'll be at the Sports Column Thursday night, for dinner. I'll happily provide him with dinner & libations. You can't miss myself & my wife. Tall & super short. I'd like to meet you're family. Off to bed. Good night , peace.

[Peacetrain]

41. Good night Condem..

Hopefully good things will come out of the flood in the long run. I keep telling myself that! I have to get off line also. Work comes earlier every morning it seems!!

[Beacool]

11. His choice of VP will not make a difference to his avid supporters,

but to those who supported someone else and are still siting on the fence, it may make a great difference.

[gateley]

26. And it could possibly make a big difference to those who don't

like EITHER Obama or McCain. Give 'em a VP they like, and I think that would get their vote.

[Beacool]

43. Yep, you said it.

I know some people who are just waiting to see who he chooses as VP before making a decision.

[Ian David]

16. At this point, I don't care if he picks Dennis Kucinish or Dennis Miller...

Joe LIEberman or Joe Wilson, Fred Willard or Fred Phelps.

I'm voting for Obama.

[democrattotheend]

19. I'm voting for Obama no matter who he picks for VP

I got my first choice at the top of the ticket for the first time since I started voting. I'm not going to be choosy about the bottom half. Honestly, I don't think it matters that much. Vice Presidents don't usually do that much, unless the president chooses to delegate a lot of power the way Bush has. And I don't see Obama doing that.

[Median Democrat]

25. Would I Vote For McCain If Ted Kennedy Was His Running Mate?

Nope. So, it is really tough to envision voting against Obama or staying home based on a VP choice.

[paulk]

21. personally,

I think the VP choice will make the difference between winning and losing this election....

[AZBlue]

28. I will support Obama 100% no matter who it is - but I do have my preferences.

I have a list I'd rather not see him pick and a list I'd rather see him pick.

However, for some voters who are still on the fence, it might make a difference.

[Carrieyazel]

29. NO it won't. This election will be decided at the TOP of the ticket.

Tim Kaine (as a #2) won't bring VA if Obama can't do it himself. In Obama's case, its all about him. He is the one who will have to get it done (along with his campaign) and whoever the VP selection is will not make a bit of difference.

[OmahaBlueDog]

32. In the end, you want a VP with as few negatives as possible

I have a friend who is what I'd term a "Country Club" Republican. He and I agreed on this much; the pick doesn't typically help you that much, but can hurt you at a number of levels. Think Eagleton or Dan Quayle to get a picture of what I'm talking about.

The GOP is hoping that Obama will select a veep that they can find a picture of at a 1968 flag burning...or someone they can find a picture of hugging Jane Fonda....or some other wedge "non-issue."

Clinton (I am a Hillary suporter) would be a great President, but veep -- not so much.

The problem with Biden is that the longer you're in the Senate, the more dirt someone can dig up.. and there's the plagarism thing from way back... I'm thinking no

Bayh is solid Midwestern stock.. he's a perceived moderate, and a governor, and might be able to tim Indiana our way. Ditto Kaine, who is too conservative for the tases of many progressives. Still, he helps solidify Virginia and doesn't bring a lot of downside.

Richardson will be blasted for "the failed energy policy that led us where we are today"; never mind that he's been out of DOE for almost 8 years. So he'll need to have a snappy answer for those charges. Otherwise, I like the idea of exploiting McSame's glaring weakness with Latino voters.

[Carrieyazel]

37. Good analysis overall. But VPs don't solidify or bring you states anymore.

Kaine won't bring VA and Bayh won't bring IN, if Obama can't do it himself. The top of the ticket is where this thing will be decided for Obama.

[wisteria]

34. It does, if God forbid, something happens to President Obama. n/t

[MercutioATC]

35. It will if it's Schweitzer...

He'll appeal to a lot of Indies and crossover Repubs.

[jefferson_dem]

38. Video response here --

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRCWbFFRpnY

[NYC_SKP]

47. ahh, and Epic Smack Down.

yet, they won....

sigh.

[Jakes Progress]

39. Not picking Clinton

just makes Obama seem weak. Why wouldn't you pick the candidate who carried the second highest number of votes? It would seem like he didn't think he would be able to outshine her. I even see big time Clinton foes worry that Bill or Hillary would draw more attention. A strong man would use that drawing power to his advantage. Otherwise, it's a little like george the first picking someone that even he could look good next to.

Obama has my vote. He has my money. He has my support and my campaign work. I think my vote, my money, my support, and my work will draw better dividends with HC as his Veep. This is going to be a harder election than many think; we need all the votes we can get.

[Beacool]

42. It's like spitting in the wind.

Around here it's not a popular concept. In the RW blogs they are petrified that Obama would pick Hillary because they believe that McCain could never win against that ticket. They are more relieved now that it appears that he won't pick her. Funny that the most conservative types see the strength in such a ticket, but not many of our fellow Democrats.

:eyes:

[NYC_SKP]

46. He can pick Hillary, that's cool with me.

But I cannot abide people who demonstrate conditional support, ie won't support him if they don't approve of his vp choice.

Come on!

[Beacool]

48. Thanks pooch!!!!

Have a good night.

:D

[NYC_SKP]

49. Hey, you too!

You made my (our) evening...

Nitey-nite!

:hi:

[Beacool]

50. Night, and kiss that cute dog of yours on my behalf.

:*

[NYC_SKP]

44. "Won't pick Obama if he picks a pro-life candidate"

Not me, others are saying that and, while I have to respect their honesty, I call them on their bullshit.

Such people are not democrats, they're self-abosorbed (self-loathing) disruptors who have no place here, IMO.

It's just as crazy as someone saying they won't support Obama if Hillary is on the ticket.

If any non-member trolls should happen to read this, I say go to bloody hell, seriously, you can choke on your own bullshit as far as I'm concerned but don't F up this election.

And any members who won't support the candidate regardless of his VP choice deserve to get their pizza ASAP.

[World Citizen]

45. Is there anyone that can bring a battleground state?

One that is doubtful? I am still worried about winning the election. For me that is by far the most important criteria.

[TheKentuckian]

52. Me, I'm voting Obama unless told directly by Christ himself not to

but the choice makes a difference to some for whatever reason.
I look over and see an apparently incompetent Senator McCain with super ineffective and dishonest people around him and couldn't vote for such a circus, even if his platform was lifted directly from my own imagination.

There should be NO issue that would allow a person to

I also think that even if he had every intention in the world of asking Senator Clinton to be his VP, it would appear MUCH, MUCH, MUCH weaker to select her right away because it would seem as he gave in to black mail.
Too many of her alleged supporters DEMANDED she be on the ticket and it makes it tougher to do it if he wants.

I am also strongly of the opinion that after the last two terms any Democrat not feverishly supporting Barack Obama is a traitorous idiot, not just to the party but to America it's self and at minimum should make a change of registration so as not to pollute the party further. Obama should not have to sure up the party AT ALL. No excuses, it's not like we've been running things the overwhelming majority of the past 40 years and have luxury of having the bureaucracy and the courts stacked with our people.

There has perhaps never been a more important time for Democrats to have the reins and try to start digging the nation out of the backwards and muck filled hole we find ourselves in but I hear of supposed Democrats on the fence or even in the other camp. Now is not the time for pettiness and pet issues because ISSUE #1 is and must be the well being of The United States of American and her citizens.

If McCain wins the nation loses big time, tell me how this guy is the reincarnation of Hoover AT BEST. Four years of this boob will have us begging Dubya to come back. If now is not the time for a vote for a democrat then there is no such time. We may as well shut down the party and officially cede the nation to the neocons.

Liberty is in too much danger for this nonsense, as is the very viability of this country.

[Skittles]

51. yes

I believe the selection of Lieberman, a man with the personality of a paper towel, lost a LOT of votes

[Awsi Dooger]

53. This thread demonstrates how inept the VP choices have been

There wouldn't be any question that a VP can influence his home state and therefore the election if we'd seen some recent attempts. Gore could have picked Graham. Bush could have isolated Ridge. Kerry lacked a good Ohio option in 2004 but if he had one he would have been a fool to pass.

Does anyone honestly believe North Carolina would have dropped to less than +10 GOP on the partisan index in 2004, if Edwards hadn't been the VP nominee? Whoops, I guess I should have skipped that question. DU is loaded with posters who think Edwards was somehow supposed to steal that state, from the VP slot, in a +13 Republican state.

A VP is worth 3-3.5 points in his home state, on average. It can be slightly higher than that if the state has not been represented on a national ticket in a long time. Virginia qualifies.

Go back and check our recent history and decipher the impact of adding or subtracting 3 to 3.5 points in a specific state. Then tell me a VP doesn't matter. I'm glad Obama is making the decision and not the ones who thrill to pretend a VP is irrelevant.