Okay, Andrew Sullivan just went there with babygate.

[DemsUnited]

When Sarah Palin was Pregnant.

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2008/08/when-sarah-pali.html

on edit: the pic at the above link is an UNDATED AP photo. I believe I saw it in a previous DU thread described as a pic of Palin pregnant with one of the older children. That's why Sullivan says: "Here's a photograph of her looking as one would expect. Not in the last year, though."

Things that make you go Hmmm.

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2008/08/things-that-mak.html

And just in case y'all don't know about Andrew Sullivan, he's a mainstream journalist republican turned Obama supporter.

[dubeskin]

1. I think I've been on the internetz too long

Because that picture looks shopped or older than 2007/2008. The hair and the quality look like the 90s. Plus the head just doesn't look right.

Again, that could just be the conspiracy theorist/internet addict in me thinking that.

[DemsUnited]

2. That's the point. The photo is of Palin pregnant with one of the other four kids.

[dubeskin]

4. Oh, alright.

Just adds more suspicion to it. I would really like to see some official documents.

And anyone who suggests this shouldn't surface needs to ask themselves, "Why quell something that could potentially bring the judgment and trustworthiness of the VP into question?"

[janet118]

23. Will she have to submit her medical records?

Does she have to have a physical? Wouldn't they be able to tell if she had given birth five months ago?

[gal]

54. They have to doctor them first.

[avaistheone1]

35. She looks very preggers in this earlier pregnancy photo.

It is not mistakable in any way.

[jaysunb]

7. Can you say " photoshop ? "

I don't know and mostly don't care whether she or her daughter had the baby, but this poorly patched pic just adds more fuel .

[anigbrowl]

16. It just looks like a regular bad picture to me.

Pro photogs often say that if 1 in 10 pictures you take are good, you're doing well.

[FatDave]

43. So good it fooled AP!

This undated photo provided by the Heath family shows Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin pregnant in Wasilla, Alaska. Republican presidential candidate Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., announced Palin as his vice presidential running mate on Friday, Aug. 29, 2008. (AP Photo/Heath Family)

[avaistheone1]

37. David Sirota a respected journalist

said it has been rumored in Alaska for quite sometime that this baby was not Sarah's, but her daughter's baby.

[gmoney]

55. Honest question: is Downs Syndrome exclusive to children of older mothers?

I don't know much about DS, but is a healthy 17-year-old mother likely to have a child with DS?

[janet118]

57. Here's a NYTs article that includes some statistics

New York Times 2007

[redqueen]

3. Whoa... she certainly showed in that pic.

I like the second post you linked... I'm sure there are records, too...

[Life Long Dem]

5. And soon there will be "Three men and a baby!".

[truthN08]

6. My

Question is why is Bristel always holding the baby. Why isn't the father ever pictured holding his child? I find it odd that I've only seen the daughter holding the baby. Even during the rally where McCain brought her and her family out it's the daughter holding the baby.

[Mist]

19. And since Bristol now has a wedding ring, shouldn't we be seeing her

husband soon?

From Sully's blog:

[mitchum]

25. Maybe that's a purity ring that Oil Dad slipped on her finger...

a bit too late

[FatDave]

45. Jesus H Fucking Christ on a moped, I'd never heard of that shit.

But I looked it up. So, now that ring can either mean "I'm married" or "I'm a batshit crazy supposedly virgin fundie psycho"? I guess either one means "stay away".

[glitch]

51. Sorry, can't miss this opportunity.

Sure, Jesus H Fucking Christ on a moped, but do you have a picture like Jesus H Fucking Christ on a Trailer Hitch does?

[FatDave]

52. That's 8 kinds of awesome.

Do you have one with a rowboat?

[glitch]

56. Sadly, no. nt

[JVS]

8. YES!!!

[RollWithIt]

9. I think he raises an important point.... we need to see all her medical records...

She could be President. We need to know everything about her.

[indie_voter]

10. Good point. Don't all candidates release their medical records? n/t

[trueblue2007]

12. Sarah Palin should BE REQUIRED to submit medical reports

ALL OF THEM.

EVERY LAST ONE.

It's my opinion....she was NOT pregnant.

[bobd0]

15. Great point

The Obama campaign should INSIST that all of the candidates' medical records be made public IMMEDIATELY. Otherwise, I'm sure The Enquirer knows how to get to the bottom of this. They sure did with John Edwards. It's about time we had a little fair and balanced journalism even if the only news organization supplying it is The Enquirer.

[mudderfudder77]

11. I can't believe I even have to point this out

But Sara Palin is in much better physical shape now than when that original pregnancy photo was taken. Apparently she is a runner, and ran through her pregnancy. That is going to have a big effect on the type of weight you gain.

She is going to look much different if she was physically fit and pregnant, than if she was overweight and pregnant.

[DemsUnited]

13. Agree. Plus, TrooperGate is WAY more important than this unproven rumor, but

the point is that if someone like Andrew Sullivan is running with it, then it's percolating upwards big time.

[anigbrowl]

20. It's hard to tell who's right or wrong about 'Troopergate'.

Palin may have exceeded her powers, which would be bad, but on the other hand the state trooper in question may be a an embarrassment to the uniform as well. I'm not looking for an argument, just pointing out that it's a complex local issue rather than a clear-cut one.

[nsd]

29. It's called "abuse of power."

The point about trooper-gate is not that Palin's former brother-in-law might be an asshole. Rather, the point is that Palin might have used the power of the governor's office to pursue a personal vendetta.

Every police department in the country has some neutral, official way of punishing or terminating its officers. Apparently the Palins, before Sarah became governor, complained about the brother-in-law. The department reviewed the complaints and suspended him for a brief period. That should have been case closed unless something new happened.

But the Palins were unhappy with the official outcome, so that when Palin became governor, she sought to have the matter re-opened. That was simply not something a governor is allowed to do. And firing the public safety commissioner for refusing to take part in her personal vendetta would not merely be the governor "exceeding" her powers -- it's plain abuse of power. An impeachable and probably criminal offense.

Trooper-gate is the real scandal. That's what needs to be investigated more.

[anigbrowl]

49. What folks are missing about my point...

is not whether WE think she abused her powers (and while it looks like she did, and she may even be impeached for it, it's not a foregone conclusion yet), but whether GOP voters will care. Let me explain in more detail, as I didn't make this point clearly in my first message.

As you've probably noticed by now, GOPers LIKE snap judgments from executives, even if they bypass proper channels and procedures. They think executive experience stems from the wielding of executive power. That's why they don't like the judicial branch or congress much - they want a strong leader, not a strong institutional government. So my point is that unless it emerges that Palin very clearly and knowingly crossed the legal line between now and the election, those who lean towards voting Republican might actually approve of what apparently happened in this troopergate case.

Looking on mixed forums where I know a bunch of conservatives, I see a lot of comments like 'if MY sister was in danger, you better believe I would do whatever I had to', 'this guy was a thug in uniform and should never have been a state trooper', 'Dems always hate cops unless they're beating up on a defenceless woman'.

It's bullshit, but that sort of thinking is why I say that making a big fuss about 'Troopergate' isn't an automatic win for us. Now if the AK legislature impeaches, that's probably a win (though some will say it proves she has been butting heads with the state party). But if the DNC or presidential campaign team make a big issue of it but no official charges are brought, GOPers will say she's being punished for taking on a violent bully.

[avaistheone1]

33. It is not all that complex. Palin was pursing a personnel vendetta

and was interfering in a trooper personnel matter that had already been settled through the proper channels.

[DemsUnited]

46. The point about troopergate is NOT the ex-brother in law state trooper

(who may or may not be a dirtbag) but that she fired a popular Public Safety Commissioner who basically said he wasn't going to break the law for a family feud.

[Pacifist Patriot]

22. Every female body is different. I was a swimmer and in great shape with my second child.

I was still in maternity clothes by 10 weeks! (Around 20 weeks with the first) I was in even better shape with my third and didn't need maternity clothing until 15 weeks.

I realize there are women out there who do not show much. I realize there are women who show less with subsequent children than with previous. But a standard rule of thumb is that the female body "remembers" and we pop sooner with each subsequent child.

I have a hard time believing that a 5th pregnancy to a woman over 40, regardless of her physical condition would result in absolutely no outward signs of pregnancy in the seventh month.

I'm not Sarah Palin and obviously cannot speak for her, but if I were under this spotlight as a candidate and knew the child was mine, I'd do a DNA test immediately, shut everyone up and use the accusations shamelessly for sympathy value.

I actually feel horrible for her that this kind of personal situation is the subject of speculation, but the description of her behavior on the day she went into labor just does not ring true to this mother of three. I confess. I am curious.

[ladywnch]

58. what , she didn't run during the other 4 pregnancies?

your argument doesn't hold water. If she's always been a runner then she should look equally small during her last pregnancy. In fact according to women on this board who have had multiple children you show MORE and earlier in later pregnancies than the first one....I yield to their expertise in this matter since I myself have never had children.

[kickysnana]

59. In the podcast she did at 7 months she claimed to have run in the summer.n/t

[jonnyblitz]

14. you are way to kind in your description of Bareback Andy, the

log cabin hypocrite and all around pompous ASSHOLE. :D

[DemsUnited]

17. Well, yeah. But he's for Obama. And his wedding pics were sweet!

[RagAss]

18. .......so now it starts.....n/m

[Bernardo de La Paz]

21. In his next link he addresses the "smear" and calls out Palin-McCain

In his next link he addresses the "smear" and calls out Palin-McCain.

"Let me address one question being lobbed at me. Is raising questions about the Palin pregnancy a smear campaign? Here's why it's not. The circumstantial evidence for weirdness around this pregnancy is so great that legitimate questions arise - questions anyone with common sense would ask. The answers to those questions can easily be provided. This is an easier call than the "cross in the dirt" story, which will never be resolved one way or another. The McCain-Palin campaign can resolve this now with medical records, as are mandated for presidential candidates anyway." -- Andrew Sullivan, http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2008/08/a-smear.html

[wuushew]

24. Genesis 19?

19:36 Thus were both the daughters of Lot with child by their father.
19:37 And the first born bare a son, and called his name Moab: the same is the father of the Moabites unto this day.

[gaiilonfong]

26. this means the press is going o ask about this

here we go

[moc]

27. Here's what I don't understand. She's in Dallas, home of the largest birthing hospital in the

country, if not the world. (There are 17k babies delivered per year at Parkland.) The UTSW medical center and Parkland Hospital train some of the best OB/GYNs in the country.

She's 36w pg with a high risk pg. Her water breaks in Dallas. And neither she nor her FP who is many thousands of miles away even consider consulting an OB at Parkland?

WTF? Things that make you say hhhmmmm indeed.


And then, it gets worse. We know that she flies to Anchorage. Instead of staying at a hospital with a level 3 NICU, she drives 45 minutes to an outlying, less well-equipped hospital. We know, without a shadow of a doubt, that when a high risk baby is born, mortality and morbidity is MUCH lower if that baby is DELIVERED at a hospital with a level 3 NICU. Morbidity/mortality is much HIGHER if baby is delivered at an outlying hospital and transported to a tertiary facility after birth.

There is much that smells about this.

[Virginia Dare]

32. Add to that..

she was very late in announcing the pregnancy, appeared to not really show too much, the daughter is home from school for months with mono, and she only takes 3 days maternity leave.

Yeah, it stinks.

[indie_voter]

34. I hope Barr uses this against her in TX

Real baby or not...

He can say she was dissing TX. Why didn't she want her baby to be born in TX? Not good enough for her?

[tblue37]

40. Easier to keep an awkward secret in a smaller, less urban hospital maybe? n/t

[bobd0]

28. I couldn't help but notice the ring on the third finger of Bristol's left hand

And her tummy looks a bit larger than it did even in those other photos. Probably why she's draped in that blanket and holding the baby.

On a blog I saw up in Alaska, word is that little Bristol is PREGNANT AGAIN so that hypocrite of a mother of hers arranged a quickie wedding for little Bristol. I guess that was easier than faking another pregnancy with the spotlights on this time. :)

[gemlake]

31. A much simpler explanation

here

[indie_voter]

36. This is just so freaking bizarre. All of it, from the pick onward. n/t

[Virginia Dare]

30. Put the same assholes who ratted out John Edwards on it...

seriously, this needs to be investigated. This will be huge for whoever breaks this story.

[EC]

41. Enquirer won't do anything

It's Murdock owned...

[helderheid]

38. I bet we'll hear about this next time he's on Maher's show.

[eshfemme]

39. Well... the evidence is circumstantial enough that he probably felt it was newsworthy

Of course, I'd prefer that this not be aired out in the MSM because whether it's true or not, I'd feel horrible for the daughter, Bristol.

But I can understand why he would want to cover this story since Palin made such a big deal of her Down Syndrome baby (she specifically noted this after her 5 children line).

Just personally, I think this smacks too much of the "black baby" rumor... although that rumor is officially debunked and this one seems to have far more questions...

[NoodleyAppendage]

42. Sullivan throwing the gauntlet down. Next move, McCain & Palin. n/t

J

[vaberella]

44. If NE won't touch it...then let Sullivan investigate, and he's far more reputable. n/t

[BlueIdaho]

47. Leave it to him and the National Enquirer...

we've got better things to do.

[FatDave]

48. I find this quote from Sullivan interesting.

"and the rumors buzzing across the Internets and the press corps are unfounded and unseemly."

I have a feeling somebody is doing some digging.

[krkaufman]

50. Which person in the pic is Palin? It could just as easily be the gal on the left ...

... from what I can see.

[krkaufman]

53. And what if part of the motivation for the alleged coverup ....

... was to enhance her anti-abortion posture? Her child having a baby might reflect negatively on Palin as a mother, especially if she'd ever advocated abstinence-only education, while presenting the Down Syndrome baby as her own might make her a hero of the anti-abortion movement.

Sure would be interesting to know for sure...