Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Mark Penn lecturing the Obama campaign. Tells him not to "return to the base."

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:07 PM
Original message
Mark Penn lecturing the Obama campaign. Tells him not to "return to the base."
Edited on Mon Sep-15-08 09:08 PM by madfloridian
Will someone tell this man to just shut up and sit down? He was supposedly let go from the Clinton campaign, but he still hangs around with Bill.

He is trying to tell Obama how to campaign, when he is one of the ones who mucked up Hillary's so badly. He really did, you know. She trusted him, and he gave terrible advice.

From the LA Times:

Mark Penn, Clinton strategist, warns Obama -- and the media

Mark Penn, the high-priced strategist who did such a good early job of launching Hillary Clinton's Democratic presidential campaign to doom at the hands of Obama, tells CBS.com he's worried that the Windy City gang will repeat the mistakes of the last two losing Democratic presidential campaigns by returning to the base after their convention instead of staying more on the convention message of centrism.


He is warning Obama not to return to his base too much.

Now that reminds me of when Mark Penn wrote about why Al Gore lost...it was because he did not toe the DLC line and because he went populist.

Mark Penn's analysis of why Gore lost....

Instead of running as a New Economy Democrat, Al Gore used an old-style populism that reduced his appeal rather than expanded it. The message prevented him from reaching the swing voters who could have pushed him over the top. Gore narrowly won the popular vote with this message by piling up large wins in states like California, where extra votes fail to count. But the message sent him tumbling backward in key border states, in his home state and, finally, in the electoral college. Liberal positions on social issues along with populism and big government positions took what could have been a substantial win and turned it into a draw. Had Gore combined his positions of conscience on social issues with a new vision of the role of government, he would have carried a larger percentage of upwardly mobile, socially tolerant suburban men that would have helped him win.


If Gore had stayed with the "old style populism"...things might have turned out differently. The will to fight would have been stronger perhaps.

More of what Penn said about Gore:

Both candidates failed to occupy the decisive center of the American electorate. This is not surprising given the failure of either candidate to break 50 percent. Voters see Gore as substantially left of center and Bush as right of center. By running as a social and big government liberal, Gore was perceived as being to the left of the Democratic Party. In contrast, Bush was viewed as being more to the center than the Republican Party; that was perhaps the single most important element of his success.


Keep this man away from the Obama campaign. Do not let him near it. We are where the middle is, we should no longer let this group of consultants like Mark Penn make up an imaginary middle way off to the right somewhere and tell us it is where we should be.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
barack the house Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:09 PM
Response to Original message
1. Obama take that as you must protect your base for dear life.->
Edited on Mon Sep-15-08 09:11 PM by barack the house
Especailly as Penn has workers in the McCain camp.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
knixphan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #1
28. abso-friggin-lutely!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
aquamarina Donating Member (772 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
2. Mark Penn can just go Cheny himself.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
3. Yeah, how'd that campaign you were runnin'
in the primaries work out for ya, bigmouth?

The one where you didn't learn your lesson about shutting the fuck up with your stupid advice.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
felinetta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-18-08 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
76. Penn is hideous
I think he and Bill want to give their advice in hopes that Hillary can run in 2012.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ContinentalOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
4. Huh? Who cares? Obama doesn't employ this guy right?
TALK TO THE HAND MARK PENN

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
5. So a guy who ran one of the worst campaigns in American history wants to offer advice?
Wow.

got grasp of reality?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BattyDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
6. Mark Penn ... the guy who took Hillary's "sure thing" victory and turned it into a defeat
This overpaid hack doesn't know a freakin' thing!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
7. "Inconvenient truths about the New Democrats, the Third Way, Democratic Leadership Council, etc"
an archived thread about the RW machine still inside the Democratic Party, started March 3, 2008-Mr. Penn is still part of it, as I'm sure our next POTUS and VPOTUS are aware.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2973191
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. I wish that were not archived. I could add to that list.
I have a folder of Eloriel's stuff and others who did a lot on this topic.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. If you want to harvest anything from it and combine it with your bookmarks madfloridian please do so
that would be worth reading!

Bob
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. I just may do that.
I have archived stuff way back to 2003 that is hard to find here now.

Penn needs to butt out of our party stuff now.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Zynx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
9. The New Economy model is an epic failure. Weak growth, high inflation, and constant crisis.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
alcibiades_mystery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
11. Mark Penn is a political loser
Why the fuck would anyone listen to him?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 01:14 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. Because they are used to listening to him.
It's a habit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hutzpa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:34 AM
Response to Reply #11
51. This is one of the fight Obama
is fighting, he is not only fighting those thugs but fighting his
own party with the likes of Penn, think DLC.

When people talk about Obama being soft, we have to sometimes
wonder who is putting that out, they are good at one thing that
is, keeping their power and neglecting the rest of us.

WE ALL SHOULD REMEMBER WHEN WE TRY TO CRITICIZE OBAMA, HE IS
FIGHTING 2 BATTLES REPUBLICANS AND DLC.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
12. blog after dem blog trashed kerry. these people ought to reflect on the damage they do
in all their fuckin wisdom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hutzpa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #12
52. They are trying the
same thing with Obama, think Harold Ford and all his favorable comments
toward John McCain, but we have to be grateful for Obama being on our
side.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jennicut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-15-08 09:49 PM
Response to Original message
13. Mark Penn makes me gag myself
He really is icky and gross.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 01:22 AM
Response to Original message
15. A sterling example of Penn's political acumen:
http://www.theatlantic.com/a/green-penn-3-19-07.mhtml

Penn Strategy Memo: March 19th 2007

I'm sure Madfloridian's seen it: I"m just posting for general consumption. It speaks to Penn's imagination.

MPK
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fujiyama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 03:30 AM
Response to Original message
16. Gore's problem
along with Kerry's was that they listened hacks like Penn.

Penn should go fuck off. Maybe go do some more PR for blackwater or another gang of murdering thugs.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 02:15 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. The gravy train consultants...
have had too much say in too many campaigns for years now.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DevonRex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
19. The rule is: Whatever Penn says, do the opposite. He is just
a republican slime ball and everybody knows it now.

And for god's sake, does the man own a frickin' comb???
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Agreed.
:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
orestes Donating Member (543 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
21. Someone needs to take this guy out behind the shed
and give him the Old Yeller treatment
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
anonymous171 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 09:48 PM
Response to Original message
22. Waiiiit, I thought Kerry he went hard right DLC during the election?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Plaid Adder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 11:28 PM
Response to Original message
23. Presumably Obama knows that he won the primary partly because Penn is an idiot.
I wouldn't lose sleep over the possibility that he'll start taking Penn's advice.

C ya,

The Plaid Adder
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 12:26 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. He just irritates me so. He didn't even know the delegate rules...
which caused problems for all.

No problem, though. I am sure Obama has his number.

:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #25
62. I wonder if Mark Penn knows about the electoral college rules
Next thing you know he'll be telling Obama to spend time in New York in California because lots of people live there.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 12:20 AM
Response to Original message
24. This coming from the "strategist" who didn't know how the delegates were apportioned
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Mark Penn should just go eat a case of Ex-Lax, and shit himself to death.

But, he's so full of shit, maybe a case wouldn't be enough.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 12:34 AM
Response to Original message
26. Hillary picked up running as a populist
These people just simply never learn. People want CHANGE. The "New Economy" didn't work. The proof is in the red ink running down Wall Street and Pennsylvania Avenue.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spiffarino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 01:14 AM
Response to Original message
27. Hey Mark, do the letters, "FO" mean anything to you?
Your plan worked real good for Hillary, didn't it, dumbass?

Go "help" the GOP for a while. We need it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
regnaD kciN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 01:24 AM
Response to Original message
29. And if there's one person who's advice we really ought to heed...
...it's the high-priced campaign manager who took Hillary from "inevitable" nominee to runner-up.

:eyes:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Wetzelbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 01:27 AM
Response to Original message
30. oh lord, David Axelrod whipped your ass, get over it, Mark. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ima_sinnic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 03:59 AM
Response to Original message
31. somebody, please, drive a stake through this cretin's heart once & for all
what a fucking LOSER. The entire corporate ass-kissing DLC can go fuck themselves.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DCKit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 05:03 AM
Response to Original message
32. You'd think this mega-sleazebag was trying to get his hooks into Obama or something.
Is there any way to get a message to the Obama campaign how revolting any association with Mark Penn would be to his actual base? Not enough lipstick in the world for THAT pig. That fat old whore Karl Rove shits prettier than Mark Penn.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
denem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 06:58 AM
Response to Original message
33. After steering HRC's campaign, Mark Penn's name is mud.
He knows it, so do his clients, so does the beltway, and so does just about everybody else.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 07:07 AM
Response to Original message
34. Is he mistaking Obama for a liberal, the way he did Gore?
Ludicrous.

Obama doesn't play to a "base." He's instead taking advantage of widespread disgust with hard-right politics and economics.

It's why Obama is responsible for far more new voter registrations than any of the campaigns Penn has ever been involved in.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
D23MIURG23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 07:19 AM
Response to Original message
35. Good thing his credibility is smouldering in the ashes of the Hillary campaign.
Edited on Wed Sep-17-08 07:21 AM by D23MIURG23
Talk about learning the wrong lesson.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 07:53 AM
Response to Original message
36. "return to the base?"
Obama has never campaigned to the base, if the "base" is to the left of center. He's campaigned as a centrist all along.

If he loses votes from the left wing of the party and from potential independent and 3rd party allies on the left, it will be because he distanced himself from the "base," and also from the "left," from the very beginning.

He's already center/right. Should he now just throw anyone to the left of center overboard and run solidly to the right, hoping that the centrists will stick with him?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 07:54 AM
Response to Original message
37. Consider it his resume for more work. Then, toss is it in the can.
New subject: Where do I read about WHY Hillary trusted him?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Wizard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 08:22 AM
Response to Original message
38. Note to Penn
Al Gore won as did John Kerry. Voting irregularities and a criminal element in the Supreme Court decided both elections.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
39. Say, Mark? Who asked you?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
asthmaticeog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 08:29 AM
Response to Original message
40. What an idiot. WHEN the fuck did Kerry or Gore swing LEFT?
I think I would have noticed if they did because the entire left WISHED THEY WOULD. STFU, Penn, and go away.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Politicub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
41. Mark Penn, please shut up
His advice isn't requested or needed.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
42. He sounds obsolete.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JHB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 08:51 AM
Response to Original message
43. Prescribing success as a "'New Economy' Democrat"?
I take it Mr. Penn hasn't been reading the financial news for the last week...or year...or decade or three.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sasquatch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:02 AM
Response to Original message
44. Can somebody deport this asshole please?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
45. Mark Penn
has a lot of nerve.. geez, this is the last person anyone would want to take advice from
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tutankhamun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:18 AM
Response to Original message
46. Penn redefines the left
Claiming centrists such as Gore and Kerry are left wingers is an inevitable GOP talking point every POTUS election.

Isn't it remarkable how any senator the Democrats pick to nominate for President or VP is always "far left" and "the number one (or number 2 if he's running for VP) most liberal senator"?

This is insidious if people don't pick up on it because it covertly shifts the "center" to the right. It's all the more dangerous when supposed Democrats such as Penn are the ones redefining centrism as leftism. When the right becomes the center, true centrists are ostracized, the right is celebrated and fascism comes to town. Penn is potentially extremely dangerous.

His only redeeming quality is that he doesn't currently matter.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
backscatter712 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:20 AM
Response to Original message
47. Fortunately, Obama listens to Plouffe and Axelrod, not Penn.
Penn should go back to lobbying for totalitarian foreign governments - he seems to be better at that job than at election strategy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:20 AM
Response to Original message
48. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Hutzpa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:25 AM
Response to Original message
49. This is good
because it shows that the Obama campaign must be doing something right
for him to offer some lacklustre advice.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Teaser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:26 AM
Response to Original message
50. "You will go to Dagobah, Obama..."
where you will study microtrends.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DefenseLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
53. Mark Penn: "I am a tool." n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 10:00 AM
Response to Original message
54. That means Obama should do just the opposite. Mark Penns career is dead
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Torn_Scorned_Ignored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 10:05 AM
Response to Original message
55. Hillary should have shit canned him
he lost her nom, just like you said.

Asshole, Penn shut the F-up, for all of us...you puke.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
gravity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
56. I would listen to Mark Penn
I want to win, and Mark Penn knows how to win elections. You don't have to follow everything he says, but you should listen to his advice.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Guy Whitey Corngood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 10:16 AM
Response to Original message
57. Oh shit everybody hide, Norm's (from Cheers) evil twin is back. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 10:39 AM
Response to Original message
58. To win, all Obama has to do is simply...
speak the truth.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LiberalLovinLug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #58
63. Yes but Truth has a decidedly Liberal bias
The more lies the more conservative you are. And Penn in his brilliance sees that this seems to be working for them

Obama must be more "truthy" like his opponent. You know that America is fine and anyone that complains is at worst an America-hater and at best a whiner. Big corporations should be given even more tax breaks and less regulation because the market (ie. the top 3%) know what's best for all of us...etc..

:sarcasm:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fovea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
59. Penn brings the fail
to the Democratic Party's election effort.

Obama made a big mistake with FISA, and he's overcome it. What he doesn't need to do is recapitulate
the strategy that has taken us into the minority.

Dems win when Dems fight. Dems lose when they triangulate and equivocate.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
60. Funny how Hillary started doing better AFTER Penn was let go.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Nikki Stone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
61. Finally something we agree on, madflo
This guy is trouble. I think he is deliberately tanking Democrats this year.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LiberalLovinLug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
64. Life in opposite land
"..will repeat the mistakes of the last two losing Democratic presidential campaigns by returning to the base after their convention instead of staying more on the convention message of centrism."

Exactly the opposite occurred. Kerry ramped up the military talk (started the convention with a salute) as a transparently desperate move to counter the swift-boaters and was boringly centrist. Gore never did get as vocal about the environment as he does now. He also ran to the mythical middle.

But Bush, or his handlers, knew to stay loyal to his own base. He was then loved and adored by the far right jack-asses and bible-thumpers, so they came out in droves.

But here's the kicker. The independents and fence-sitters were looking for leadership. Someone who sticks by his "principles" no matter who is blasting him. Bush did that maddeningly well. With Gore and especially John (I voted for it before I voted against it) Kerry they were seen as desperately trying to be all things to all people and they came across as disingenuous and unleaderlike.

I hope Obama has learned from this recent history. Stick to the base core principles. He will get all of the core votes, and many new young votes - plus he will get the grudging respect of the independents for "being a man" and not backing down, even if they don't agree with ALL of his policies.

THAT is how you win in November.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
PassingFair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #64
66. We see the same thing.
"Reporting for Duty" my ass!

I knew he was toast the moment he opened his
mouth and then SALUTED the crowd.

I worked my tail off, but being a apologist
is rather difficult work.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
PassingFair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
65. His BASE is working people who pay income taxes.
He should spurn us, why?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Larkspur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 02:16 PM
Response to Original message
67. Mark Penn is a "fat cat" elitest
And a major reason why Hillary lost her primary campaign. Only an arrogant a@@ would run a Dem Primary by Republican rules.

Why does anyone listen to this bozo?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blueclown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
68. mark penn did run a winning election campaign in 1996.
he helped re-elect bill clinton.

yet, he did a bad job with hillary, but he does have a good track record.

not saying that obama should heed his advice (he has some very good advisors too), but mark penn isn't some neophyte like many of you claim he is.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Phx_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
69. Yeah, cuz you did such a great job for Hillary, asswipe.
Edited on Wed Sep-17-08 02:21 PM by Phx_Dem
In fact, you should return the money she paid you, and then go crawl back under your rock.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Alter Ego Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
70. Obama: "Blow me, you fat lobbyist fuck."
Seriously, if Penn thinks his advice will be taken seriously he's a fucking idiot.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jrockford Donating Member (504 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-18-08 03:12 AM
Response to Reply #70
73. No kidding n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
yourguide Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
71. Dear Mark Penn...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Donald Ian Rankin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-17-08 02:26 PM
Response to Original message
72. Sound advice, whoever it comes from. McCain/Palin will do all that's needed to motivate the base.
I'm anything but an expert, but at this point I would guess that the people Obama ought to be concentrating on are not the Democratic base, the Republican base or even the swing voters, but the people who may or may not vote Republican, and will stay at home if he doesn't do anything to make them come out to vote against him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
billyoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-18-08 06:07 AM
Response to Original message
74. billyoc lectures Mark Penn, tells him "Return to Black Lagoon".
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mattclearing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-18-08 06:13 AM
Response to Original message
75. "People vs. The Powerful" was what WON the 2000 election.
Edited on Thu Sep-18-08 06:13 AM by tasteblind
There's a case to be made for staying in the center, but that sure as fuck ain't it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 19th 2024, 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC