Could CELL PHONE voting photos keep the neocons from stealing 2008?!??!?!?

[urgk]

For those of us who are still touching the screen to cast our votes into Diebold's black mystery box, could a cell phone photo of a voting machine screen along side something unique (like a driver's license or a handwritten "Obama") function later as proof of our votes?

I'd asked in another thread how voters who were in the 50% of the country without paper receipts and Rug said he/she was planning on taking a picture of the screen as evidence. My first thought was whether it was legal to do so, but my second thought was "who gives a $#$#@$@$ if it isn't?" We need to do something.

My question is this -- would it help for DU to start a grass roots effort to have people use cell phones to record their vote in case this thing is a repeat of 2004 and 2008? Any lawyers/ACLU DUers out there who might know?






Please K&R if you think it has a real chance of helping.

[glowing]

1. I would say, if you can, vote absentee in the case of the vote on a box.

AND no, its not illegal to record your vote in pic.. you can't anyone else's. Getting everyone to do that would be a miracle.. they barely know how to get to the voting booth, let alone take a pic of the evidence.

[WinkyDink]

2. There will be 3 major suppression efforts: Voter challenges; insufficient ballots; closing early.

By that last, I mean, "on time" but illegally, while people are still in line outside.

THIS is how the Republicans will counter the Democratic GOTV.

[urgk]

3. We have a LOT of early voting dates here in Chatham county, GA.

At least several days in two major chunks. BUT, there are still no paper receipts.

I'd like to find a home-spun way to get a more concrete idea of the number of Obama voters.

[glowing]

8. I would encourage everyone to do early voting or vote by mail..

I'm a bit worried that FL's goal is to have 40-50% of the votes done by mail in ballot... They cannot handle much, I can imagine this being another clusterfuck of a reporter showing up at some old person's home and that person saying, I signed up, no ballot.. AND McCain/ Palin are doing their victory lap.

[urgk]

4. What if there were pamphlets describing how? Or lessons in line? np

[elifino]

5. Signs a my polling place ,Turn off cell phone before entering .

[glowing]

6. Turn off ringer as to not drive everyone bonkers.. But take the pic..

They cannot tell you NOT to take a pic of your ballot.

[urgk]

11. Are there signs that say "And don't turn them back on..."

"...under penalty of law."?

;-)

Seriously,, if it's not illegal, it seems like one fairly ubiquitous means of making a record.

[glowing]

7. That's all well and good, but that takes money and time.. Do U have?

[urgk]

9. Grass roots doesn't have to be about money.

All it would take is a .doc file or a .pdf with the instructions and nearly anybody with access to a printer could bring 10 non-partisan copies to the polling place.

The question for me is more about whether it would stand as legal documentation of the vote.

If there are other ideas though -- petitions, lists, things that would be easy to do, please let's hear them.

[demodonkey]

10. This would not help. And it will add time to your vote and others, creating longer lines that may...

...disenfranchise others. Especially in Obama strongholds, anyone delaying other voters could cost Obama precious, much needed votes.

This is going to be a huge election. Many areas are short on voting machines (and we really don't want to encourage them to spend more taxpayer dollars BUYING more of these damn paperless machines) so lines will be long. Each voter should do his or her best to vote not to tie up a machine any longer than necessary while voting. Doing ANYTHING that adds to your time on the machine unnecessarily may ultimately disenfranchise someone in line behind you who can't wait any longer because they have to get to school, to work, or to pick up a child, etc.

There is no way that a cell phone picture of anyone's vote will help anyway because there is no way to prove that you actually pushed the VOTE button and cast the ballot that way. You could have photographed the summary screen and later changed it before pushing the button. MAYBE it would be proof of how you voted if there was an uniterrupted video including showing you pushing the final VOTE button and the machine saying your vote was recorded.

But even having "proof" you voted a certain way won't help because of the thousands of votes in the machine, how would you be able to prove that yours was one that was flipped or uncounted? Only if pretty much EVERY SINGLE VOTE was recorded could this be done, and realistically that is not going to happen.

Also beware in some states there may be laws against recording your own vote due to potential vote-selling.

Bottom line: photographing your own vote really won't help, actually might be illegal in some areas, and WORST OF ALL may cost other people's vote.

Exception to all this!! IF YOUR VOTING MACHINE IS BEHAVING STRANGELY, such as flipping your vote to another candidate or displaying a strange message, a photo or video of that WOULD BE VERY USEFUL to election integrity groups nationwide. In the case of vote flipping, a video showing it actually happen would really be huge. HUGE!

BUT PLEASE WHATEVER YOU DO, DON'T TIE UP A VOTING MACHINE ANY LONGER THAT YOU ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO, especially in areas where lines may be forming (and double-especially if you are in an Obama-supporting area!!)

[urgk]

12. Those are great points.

And incredibly helpful. So, thank you.

Have you heard of anything else that may help? I mean, with the long lines we'll be standing in, there must be some way to make a record that is more concrete than an exit poll.

[demodonkey]

13. The biggest thing IMHO would be recording any malfunctioning machines. Take times, places, & names.

God forbid if there has to be a challenge after the election (either officially by a candidate or by citizens) this is one thing that might hold weight. Recordings of the actual malfunction accompanied by sworn affidavits from citizens who observed that machine's strange behavior.

I don't think we have ever actually had that in a challenge yet, and it might help.

Also record and report any other problems! Voters being turned away. Voters being refused a provisional ballot, or no emergency ballots if machines aren't working. Anything that does not seem right. TAKE NAMES and try to get other voters who will be willing to give THEIR name and back you up later with testimony if needed.

By "recording" I mean video (best), or photo -- but DO NOT RISK ARREST OR BEING EJECTED FROM THE POLL. You can't get your vote for Obama counted if you are in jail. I am not an attorney, but I think in a court of law sworn testimony, especially from multiple witnesses, would actually be the strongest thing anyway. So GET NAMES & CONTACT INFO of others willing to back up whatever you observe.

[all.of.me]

14. We should have text votes! That way, it is in your phone as a record. nt