Larry King Live: Clinton calls Palin 'gutsy...real'. 2 words KNOWN to gain a positive response

[blm]

for candidates in focus groups.

blm calls Palin a coward who can't answer tough questions and a FRAUD who has no REAL thoughts of her own but is an excellent PARROT of RW trash talking points learned from Limbaugh, DeLay and Gingrich.

GUTSY and REAL are major compliments and desirable attributes to working class voters. Why on earth would Clinton anoint Palin with those attributes when it is apparent she is a fraud and a coward.

Gutsy and real people do not FEAR talking to reporters who ask tough questions.

Gutsy and real people do not FEAR speaking to investigators or FEAR testifying.

Bill is treating McCain and Palin the same way he treated Bush - as if THEY relate to the common working class people in ways that Obama, Kerry and Gore could not...yeah....in the interview with Larry, you'll be glad to know he called Obama 'smart'....how nice.

http://www.cnn.com/

While you're on that page, there's a poll about Mccain cancelling debate.

[Beregond2]

1. BC has become a complete mystery to me.

He seems to want to pretend he is stupid. What he gains from that I can't imagine.

[blm]

2. Bill knows as well as anyone that these descriptive words are focus group favorites to use

when the user wants to gain a positive response for the candidate.

We are supposed to continue to act like it doesn't matter for another election. Remember how many TIMES in 2004 Bill said people prefer strong and wrong over weak and right? He knew exactly what he was doing.

[blm]

17. I need to correct that - Bill knows BETTER THAN MOST the power of these specific words.

.

[karynnj]

53. OMG - I never connected the dots on that

The natural conclusion for people who thought Bush wrong was to take this as Kerry was weak - why else would the words be paired.

Even though in character, and willingness to stand up for what he believed in Kerry leaves Clinton in the dust. (and that is not even considering that Kerry was a genuine highly decorated war hero.)

[sandspur]

72. Bill is not preaching to the coverted, he is setting up the sell for

the people who will be turned away from the attacks. Are you paying any attention to the argument he is making for the Obama presidency? ? He is making a updated " are you better off? " pitch. The sky is not falling , he is not Zell Miller.

[blm]

94. No...he ISN'T. He knows CASUAL VOTERS hear key words. He knows they aren't sophisticated enough

to hear beyond those key words. He deliberately CHOSE known positive response words for Palin.

[Politicub]

76. Me too. I've given up on him

It's time for new Dem leadership. Obama has it -- Bill has jumped the shark, and is helping the enemy.

[rebel with a cause]

91. Watch the video.

Clinton said the people in places like Arkansas would find her as that and that she came across like that, but he did not agree with her policies or her ideals. It was a compliment with a but attached to it and the video was cut off right at that point. It might be interesting to see what he said after that. It is a put up job to me. Something edited to make it look like he was saying one thing where if you went on with the interview it might be something entirely different.

I say these things not as a Clinton supporter, because I have never been one. I am an Obama supporter through and through, and I don't think buying into this stuff is going to help us. Clinton said he was going to be campaigning for Obama. JMHO

[niceypoo]

97. Obama called her 'compelling,' called McCain 'Hero'

Wonder what the reaction would be from the regressive wing of the Democratic party if Bill had said that about them? We all know the answer to that, dont we?

[blm]

99. Bill used specific POSITIVE words....Obama used obvious ones that didn't ADD attributes

to McCain or Palin they didn't have before his statement..

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[blm]

5. Marginalize, my butt. Bill's using known positive response focus group words for Palin

and you're trying to reach for an excuse.

[joshcryer]

37. Got my post deleted, but yes, it is absolutely marginalizing.

Explain to me how it supports her by placing her in a class of irrelevancy. He's not going out of his way to say anything. He's answering questions and that's it.

[blm]

42. I'd prefer your post remain because I think this issue IS important. There is no way the casual

voting public would view his description of her as marginalizing. No way. Those are focus grouped words and anyone with an ounce of experience in marketing or political campaigns knows it.

[joshcryer]

47. I ignore you people all the time, it's marginalizing, but you wouldn't see it as such.

I normally don't even get into these garbage threads.

[blm]

54. Tell you what... MAKE a case that casual voters see words like gutsy and real as marginalizing

of a candidate.

Let's see if you can do it.

[joshcryer]

57. WTF, marginalization isn't about perception, it's about fact.

When people are marginalized in the workplace it's not because you can "see" them being marginalized, it's because the numbers don't add up and, for instance, women get paid less than men. It's not an obvious thing, it's covert, sublime.

Bill Clinton is not spotlighting Palin and it pisses you people off. Get over it.

[blm]

60. You don't marginalize a POLITICAL candidate when you describe them as 'gutsy' and 'real' and

Bill knows it. He doesn't focus on anything about her BUT whatever positive attributes he attributes to her and he leaves it at that....hardly an expert way to marginalize a person.

[joshcryer]

63. Uh, that's *how* you margainalize someone.

"Aww she's gutsy." *thinking* "God what a ditz."

You are so out of touch.

[blm]

67. Doesn't MATTER what he's thinking...he's using positive attributes that he KNOWS voters

respond to positively because they've been focus-grouped on these words for years.

"out of touch'....hah...just not deliberately naive because it suits the argument.

[joshcryer]

70. You're so right blm, I don't see how I didn't see this before.

Your honesty and integrity is really up there, and I shouldn't have questioned this before.

[FatDave]

68. Sorry, that's a pretty weak argument.

And I'm not in the "Clinton is trying to undermine Obama" camp, but his comments are increasingly curious.

[joshcryer]

71. You and I both know that they pick apart what he says and chose some irrelevant small thing...

...and make a huge issue out of it. You and I both know it. His comments about Palin are nothing more than marginalizing, period. Anyone who says otherwise is lying.

[FatDave]

73. No, I don't know that.

And that is exactly the argument that I called weak. How do the words "gutsy" and "real" marginalize?

Joshcryer is handsome and intelligent. Damn, how dare I marginalize you like that?!

Edit: can't sepll

[blm]

95. josh....you are certainly not in marketing, are you? Any political animal knows what focus groups

do and why they do it. So....if you ARE a political animal and you're trying to spin these words as an effort to marginalize the candidate not to highlight these attributes, then you are a spinner.....that's all. It won't work on many here.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[democrat2thecore]

4. What's happening

Bill wants to be able to say, if Obama were to lose, that they did everything they could for Obama. He can point to their convention speeches, etc. However, these one-off remarks, one after another paints a very different picture. They know (yes, I use 'they' on purpose) their only hope of being back in the White House is an Obama loss on November 4th.

[Vattel]

85. right, and they murdered vince foster

[democrat2thecore]

93. That's quite a leap - from political strategy to murder

I don't think that and you know it. But to deny that the Clinton's are not master political manipulators is absurd. You think Bill and Hillary truly want a Obama victory and cut them out of 2012?

Instead of hurling insults - admit to the political reality.

[blm]

96. Why link something he SAID on tape with the RW distraction of Vince Foster smear?

That tactic is a favorite of the RW spinners who use it to lump their real crimes in the same category as the wildest conspiracy theory. In fact, Cheney used that exact tactic against Kerry's IranContra and BCCI investigations, labeling Kerry a 'conspiracy theory nut' in the press.

[Cha]

6. What did he say about Biden..our Democratic

VP candidate?

[blm]

8. That was all I've read and seen so far. The show airs tonight.

.

[ClarkUSA]

7. What else does Hillary2012's campaign manager have to say?

We need Chris Rock to go on after Bill "I can see why she's hot" Clinton again. Rock could create a full hour-long sold-out
pay-per-view performance at this rate...

[blm]

10. heh...evidently the campaign told its loyalists to rate it down.

.

[ClarkUSA]

11. No doubt.

Bill needs to be put out to pasture.

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Metric System]

27. Many of you wouldn't know the meaning of unity even if someone handed you a dictionary.

[blm]

31. The problem here is that SOME of us know the use of focus grouped words WHEN they are used

and know WHY they are used politically.

And others need to pretend that those words are used innocently at the same time they profess the user is the sharpest political animal of our time. Total disconnect.

[cali]

33. well, bill certainly doesn't know the meaning of unity.

he doesn't need to trash Palin, but he could try praising Obama and Biden. That would be novel. Why not call Biden gutsy and real? But no, Bill can't stop himself. It's just sad.

[karynnj]

55. Hey, we are saying this on a Democratic board and BILL is not running and will never be running

Bill is saying these unhelpful things to bipartisan audiences and it is damning Obama by faint praise. His comments on Palin in particular are creepy. Which is worse?

[dionysus]

12. he really can't help himself can he?

10 seconds till the "he was being a diplomatic statesman you irrational hater" clowns arrive en masse...

[blm]

14. nah...now they have the power to rate threads like this down....

.

[dionysus]

16. yeah but who will pay attention to the rating system?

[blm]

18. heheh....apparently, those who'd rather show displeasure anonymously because excusing another

proMcCain-Palin statement from Bill publicly might be making them feel somewhat foolish.

Heh...and a good dig at 'blm' to boot, doesn't hurt. ;)))

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

13. F--- Bill

The man may have inspired me as a 14 year-old to get into politics, but his subsequent sell-outs to the right, triangulation, globalization and now outright treachery have made me the jaded cynic that I am...or was. Obama's making me remember the optimism Bill tricked me with.

Bill loathes Obama because he's everything that the Clintons are not - genuine, looking to change a system, inspiring an actual movement. Bill so wanted to be seen as the next JFK, but his wishy-washy track record, combined with his ego made his administration a forgettable pile of "meh" that will rank somewhere up there with Chester A. Arthur in the list of notable presidents when people look back 100 years from now.

[Disturbed]

19. Bill Clinton is not doing Sen.Obama or the Dems any favors.

I guess he doesn't know what Pit Bull Palin stands for & against.

Outlawing Abortion, even in cases of Rape &/or Incest.

Against any form of Birth Control.

Abstinence Only Programs in Public Schools.

Creation Education in Public Schools.

For overturning Rove v Wade

Extending US Occupation Iraq Indefinably

Believes that Homosexuals can be cured through prayer.

She is against Civil Unions.

*Gov. Palin is not only not qualified to be Pres., she needs to be Impeached as Gov.!

[blm]

20. Nah - he knows exactly who she is...he just CHOOSES to tell the public she's 'gutsy' and 'real'

because he knows those words garner positive responses from focus groups of working class voters.

[niceypoo]

22. Obama called her "Compelling"

He also called McCain a hero.

Obama gets it, Bill gets it, I get it, but apparently you don't get it. Hate is a republican thing, not a democratic thing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLpPktRXBFg">Obama on Palin pick.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200803070011">"I revere and honor John McCain's service to this country. He is a genuine American hero."- Obama

[blm]

25. Bill's use of positive response focus group words like gutsy and real are NOT meant to influence

working class voters....ok....gotcha....and, I will TRY and find a way to believe it. uh huh.

[niceypoo]

21. Apparently you missed Bills speech at the convention..

..or you are just too far gone to care...

Regardless, Clinton was on of the most successful presidents in history, as far as accomplishments go, and no amount of hatred from you, or the freepers, changes that fact.

Might I suggest anger management?

:rofl:

signed,

-The bigot slayer

[blm]

23. one message for Dem audiences and another for general public - just like he did on Iraq war

during the LAST election.....


U.S.
Clinton defends successor's push for war
Says Bush 'couldn't responsibly ignore' chance Iraq had WMDs

Wednesday, June 23, 2004 Posted: 7:55 AM EDT (1155 GMT)


(CNN) -- Former President Clinton has revealed that he continues to support President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq but chastised the administration over the abuses at Abu Ghraib prison.

"I have repeatedly defended President Bush against the left on Iraq, even though I think he should have waited until the U.N. inspections were over," Clinton said in a Time magazine interview that will hit newsstands Monday, a day before the publication of his book "My Life."

Clinton, who was interviewed Thursday, said he did not believe that Bush went to war in Iraq over oil or for imperialist reasons but out of a genuine belief that large quantities of weapons of mass destruction remained unaccounted for.

Noting that Bush had to be "reeling" in the wake of the attacks of September 11, 2001, Clinton said Bush's first priority was to keep al Qaeda and other terrorist networks from obtaining "chemical and biological weapons or small amounts of fissile material."

"That's why I supported the Iraq thing. There was a lot of stuff unaccounted for," Clinton said in reference to Iraq and the fact that U.N. weapons inspectors left the country in 1998.

"So I thought the president had an absolute responsibility to go to the U.N. and say, 'Look, guys, after 9/11, you have got to demand that Saddam Hussein lets us finish the inspection process.' You couldn't responsibly ignore a tyrant had these stocks," Clinton said.
>>>>>>

Bill just HAD to throw in a '9-11/Iraq connection' for Bush, too, just for good measure.

[windbreeze]

36. Ya know...I gotta tell ya...I have stayed out of the debate about what

the hell Bill IS up too lately...but...after going to yahoo this am...bright and early, finding that Bill Clinton had pointers to give Todd Palin...and then proceeding to read what he had to say....I find that whatever it might be that Clinton supporters feel he is trying to say about the opposition ticket...he is failing what he should be doing for OUR CANDIDATE, Obama, and the DEMOCRATIC TICKET as a whole, miserably...I can give a free pass to a point, but after reading the article I linked too...I give up...I can't figure out what the hell is going on...I just know I don't like it..it makes me very uncomfortable...and basically, I think he's out of line...

IF you go do a search for Bill Clinton/Palin on yahoo...there's a whole page of articles that allow you to guess exactly what he's trying to say(which dismayed me even more, because I didn't realize there would be that many)..but anyway...this is the one I was reading, and I wasn't impressed....wb

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20080924/pl_politico/13831_1

(ps: guess I will check and see if the source is always politico...maybe that's the problem, trouble is, they are quoting him)

[blm]

39. That's just it...he's TOO politicaly savvy to not know the effect of his words on CASUAL VOTERS

there is no reason on earth that ANY voter, especially Dem voters, should be confused about what Bill is saying.

IMO, his message is loud and clear to those of us who no longer trust his motives.

[karynnj]

56. He was NOT one of the most successful Presidents in history

he will likely be seen after time goes by as average - or maybe slightly higher then average. He looks good surrounded by Bush I and II.

[crazy_vanilla]

24. again, watch the nonverbal cues

90% of any communicated message is nonverbal

[mitchum]

26. He's just a real piece of shit who knows that an Obama presidency will...

dwarf his own centrist corporatist legacy.

[DiamondKrosse]

92. THE CORPORATIONS

THE CORPORATIONS are all out to get and kill us.

[Balderdash]

28. Bill Clinton is right and we need to adjust.

Small town people have a different mindset and it doesn't hurt us to look at that honestly.
You can rant and call names but the truth is, as Bill said, she is "perceived" in a small town
light. Palin wasn't just put out there to pull in women she was put out there because of her
small town mystique.

[JI7]

29. i don't expect him to say negative things about her or even McCain

by why does he keep saying positive things.

people are trying to twist it into how it's a suble master strategy. WTF ??????? as you say, certain types of voters are only going to pay attention to certain words and the media will only report those words.

also when he says things about how people shouldn't attack Palin personally it implies that she is being attacked personally. she certainly is not by the Obama Campaign or DNC or any other official party organization.

and one thing Palin certainly is NOT is real. she is a fucking phony like Bush is.

[CakeGrrl]

30. Screw Bill. He's no help. Hopefully this is his last "Global Initiative" pitch appearance. n/t

[blm]

32. The 'global initiative' brings out the best in Bill - Dem presidential campaigns without a Clinton

on the ticket seem to bring out the worst in Bill.

[BlueStateGirl]

34. Umm... did anyone watch the clip? He said he can only imagine

how this is coming across in places like Arkansas, where people live in communities of 2500 or less and hunt and fish etc....

He said she is coming across to them as gutsy and real. Is there anyone here who doesn't think that is true to some extent? He said it appears as if McCain chose well considering the energy she brought to his campaign. Well, like it or not she did. His crowds got bigger, his fund raising went up and the religious right got on board.

He said she is appealing. Guess what? She is to a certain segment of the American people. The kind we need to get on our side.

What happened in New Hampshire after Obama called Hillary "likeable enough" ? Womaen got pissed off and voted for her and she one. Appearing to be dismissive of her as a woman or a mother does us no good. Going after her on the issues does.

[JI7]

35. nobody is asking him to bash Palin

but why keep talking about what a great pick she is and using all these words that bring a positive response from people.

why doesn't he talk as much about what great candidates Obama and Biden are ????

[BlueStateGirl]

40. "Senator Obama is , I think, not only charismatic , but really smart

and a very disciplined candidate , who has handled himself, I think, by and large, remarkably well, I've always thought that in the end he would come out ahead."

There is more from the interview in the article as well.

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2008/09/bill_clinton_ob.html

I really don't know what everyone wants him to say about Obama.

[joshcryer]

41. They want him to spotlight Palin and call her out on her failings.

But he's focused on McCain and marginalizes her from existance.

[JI7]

44. the OP is about how he called Palin real and gutsy

that's not marginalizing her .

[BlueStateGirl]

48. He said that's how he believes she is coming across to rural small

town Americans.

And if we , as Democrats, cannot acknowledge that fact, I think we are turning a blind eye to reality.

[JI7]

64. because that's what they are telling them as with Bush

like the fake cowboy crap. but never reported how he is scared of horses. it woudln't play with the whole phony cowboy crap.

and Clinton just pushes it with what he is saying because he doesn't respond with facts to that which show they aren't true.

[BlueStateGirl]

65. Who's the "they" that are telling Clinton that? n/t

[JI7]

75. the Republicans and the media

[BlueStateGirl]

77. So, Bill Clinton takes his marcnig orders from the Republicans and

the media?

He is so politcally astute that he knows exactly which positive focus group words to use to trigger the average American voter to vote for McCain/Palin, but dumb enough to take his talking points from the Republicans and the media?

[JI7]

79. i was talking about the morons who think Palin is real and gutsy

the Republicans and the whore media told them to believe that shit with their lives. just like they told people that Bush was some cowboy.

[joshcryer]

51. Yes it is. He's not saying she's important.

He's not saying she's valuable. He's saying she has her place. That's margainalizing. By connecting and pretending she's more important than she is, by going down the list of her problems, he would be putting the focus on her.

His focus, as is Hillary's focus, is McCain.

[BlueStateGirl]

45. I think it would come across as bullying and petty to have an ex president

act as an attack dog. It would be different he were to attack McCain, but Palin is so far removed Clinton's league, that it would look like shooting fish in a barrel. ( or wolves from helicopters).

He , I believe ,would look like big bad Bill picking on poor little Sarah.

It would not be smart politics.

[blm]

52. How about not anointing McCain or Palin with attributes they don't HAVE or deserve?

How about using strongly positive words to describe Obama and Biden?

Some of you think Bill never once in the last 15 years received a memo about what words the focus grouped casual voters happen to respond to most positively.

[BlueStateGirl]

61. So how many casual voters, do you think Bill is hoping to swing over to

the MCCain/Palin side by using those positive focus group words? How many voters is the word gutsy worth? How many did he cost Obama by using the word charismatic, instead of charming?



I would think , that any voter, casual or not, who is swayed by anything Bill Clinton has to say is already on our side.


Is he an irrelevant ,washed up ex president, who should just disappear quietly into oblivion? Or is he some Svengali able to hypnotize American voters with the casual use of a positve response focus group word.


How many people do you think will see or hear about this Larry King interview versus the the number of people who saw or heard about his very strong and clear endorsement of Obama at the convention?

[JI7]

43. not even close to the bs words he uses about Palin such as real, gutsy

and it's more about what he is saying about McCain and Palin rather .

[blm]

46. Exactly - words that average voter responds to he uses to describe McCain and Palin

and words that the media has for years used to TAG Dem candidates as 'not like us' would include charismatic and smart. Charming would receive a more positive rating from focus groups than the word charismatic.

[joshcryer]

38. The people talking crap about Bill are projecting, this is undeniable at this point.

Completely undeniable, if you watch every video that he's in, there's no concievable, rational way to see what they see.

[salonghorn70]

49. It Would Be So Nice To Get Through One Day

Without Clinton Hate.

[joshcryer]

58. I know! Every time some news comes out that's awesome they *have* to start a Clinton post.

They have to!

[Dr Fate]

74. I know-I wish people would stop talking about Democratic politics for once.

What do they think this is- a political message board or something?

It's not like the Clinton's are important or anything- why cant they talk about a Democrat who has more influence?

[karynnj]

50. Nice, he knows exactly what he is doing

In I think 2006, there was a WJC New Yorker article where he gloated that he was a winner and Gore and Kerry weren't. He used words similar to those to describe himself - as differentiated from them. (He also had the chutzpah to make it Kerry's fault that the Bush people called a genuine war hero a coward.

I almost think in Palin he sees someone as unscrupulous, charismatic (to their own group), and as ambitious as he was - luckily for us she doesn't have Clinton's intelligence. In character, he might be closer to Palin than to Kerry and Gore.

[Uncle Joe]

59. Whenever I watch Hillary Clinton during an interview,

I pay attention to which direction her head is moving, regardless of what she says, is she shaking it no or nodding yes?

[1Hippiechick]

66. She definitely contradicts herself, I've noticed. She may be saying no, but she is nodding yes. n/t

[Uncle Joe]

69. And vice a versa. n/t

[Metric System]

84. Wow, a raging case of CDS here.

[genna]

62. No mystery here. Bill Clinton has lost the partisan part of the democratic process.

Every time this brutha opens his mouth, I feel like the conservative DLC has just gained three Republican leaning merit points.

If there is a third way, why didn't it work for him in the 1990s?

If Palin is so wonderful, why hasn't she accomplished smaller government in Alaska?

I keep trying to hold on to the good mojo I felt 10 years ago for him, but it is not working well at all.

[BlueStateGirl]

78. Please point out where he said she was wonderful or praised ANY

of her policies?

[Name removed]

80. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[moriah]

82. "Isn't that an interesting assumption."

[moriah]

81. I dunno what was said, but is it possible that something was taken out of context?

"Palin may be gutsy but she's so fucking stupid that it makes it a bad thing."

"Palin is the real anti-choice person -- she would 'choose life' if her own daughter was a victim of INCEST??? What about her daughter? Obviously she gets no say at all."

What I could wish he would say...

[beachmom]

83. Funny, Laura Bush was more critical. nt

[Metric System]

86. I watched the actual interview. And I think you're nuts.

[IndianaGreen]

87. Why is Bill still around? Why can't he just go to the Bahamas until after the elections?

Bill is displaying a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde personality that is quite annoying.

[Metric System]

89. He was actually effective tonight, but people like you are too blinded by hate. He made the point,

and I think he's correct, that bashing McCain and Palin fires up those already planning on voting for Obama but it does very little to win over independents or undecideds. He also made it very clear tonight that Palin does not share the same views as Hillary. I thought he was effective tonight in making the case that the Obama/Biden ticket was the right choice for the country, even IF a voter holds McCain in high regard. He also stated unequivocally that on issues like the economy, health care and energy Obama has the better plan (and the most similar to Hillary's).

[salguine]

88. Bill is trying to stealth-monkeywrench Obama. If Obama loses, it's a better setup

for Hillary in 2012. Believe it.

[moriah]

90. Pardon my language, but .... FSCK THE CLINTON HATE.

Seriously.

"FSCK" is a computer term for checking for errors on Unix boxen.

It's often used online by Unix geeks to say "fuck", because usually if you've had make your system do an FSCK you were fucked. Sometimes even after the FSCK you're fucked. But every time it boots, Unix FSCKes all the drives.

Unix is such a good operating system.

[Medusa]

98. Let him keep talking

he's destroying himself and Hillary everytime he does. I've had it with both of them.