Go Roger Ebert!! Mclame "rigid and contemptuous" at debate

[ailsagirl]

Guess who's not coming to dinner
BY ROGER EBERT / September 28, 2008

I do not like you, John McCain. My feeling has nothing to do with issues. It has to do with basic decency. During the debate, you refused to look Barack Obama in the eye. Indeed, you refused to look at him at all. Even when the two of you shook hands at the start, you used your eyes only to locate his hand, and then gazed past him as you shook it.

Obama is my guy. If you are rude to him, you are rude to me. If you came to dinner at my house and refused to look at or speak with one of my guests, that would be bad manners and I would be offended. Same thing if I went to your house. During the debate, you were America's guest.

=snip=

During the debate, Jim Lehrer repeatedly called upon both candidates to speak directly to each other. Obama looked at you. He addressed you as "John," which as a fellow senator is his privilege. His body language was open. You stared straight ahead, or at Lehrer, or into space. Your jaw was clenched. You had a tight little smile, or a grimace, or a little shake of your head.

=snip=

I'm not the only one who noticed your odd, hostile behavior pundits were wondering if you might explode in a display of your famous temper. I think we saw that happen, all right, but it was an implosion. I have instructed my wife to exclude you from any future dinner parties.


http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080928/COMMENTARY/809289997

[hlthe2b]

1. 'been waiting for this article to be posted all day... K&R

[HowHasItComeToThis]

45. HE ACTED LIKE A TWIT

:nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity:

[polichick]

2. "I have instructed my wife to exclude you from any future dinner parties."

:rofl:

[grannie4peace]

3. bad link

[ailsagirl]

They changed it-- so I updated it. Should be OK now...

[tabatha]

4. The article has disappeared.

Do you have the full article?

[Tallison]

11. Wondering if his site was hacked

While I'd love to have his support, and suspect we do, that article was weird. To have his wife publicly disinvite McCain from dinner parties? Seems stranger that he was ever a dinner guest to begin with...

[Cha]

34. No worries..Rogert Ebert had a good take on

mccain and did it in his own inimitable way.

I loved it!

[tblue37]

67. It was a metaphor. nt

[dgibby]

75. Tongue in cheek!

[Patsy Stone]

18. Try this link:

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080928/COMMENTARY/809289997

[pnorman]

35. "The page you requested cannot be found.'

There was discussion of this Ebert statement on another DU thread. It was noted that not only it was apparently "pulled", but it was done before Google had cached it. But at least, a lot more of that article is given on this thread!

pnorman
On edit: It appears that the link is now working. THANKS!

[slampoet]

101. I had to hit reload a few times but it is there

[Tallison]

5. What's weird is that Ebert's also a Biblical literalist

believes in Creationism, that the world's 6,000 years old, etc.

This guy's a bag of contradictions, to be sure. Good to have his support, but interesting.

[Lex]

6. WTF? Link please?

[Tallison]

15. Here 'ya go, from his own website

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080921/COMMENTARY/809219997

ETA: I wonder if it isn't a reaction to his recent bout with thyroid and salivary gland cancer.

[ailsagirl]

17. Here it is-- Read it while ye can

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080928/COMMENTARY/809289997

[Cha]

42. I sent that article to myself in an

email so I'll have it forever! I love it..thank you!

[ailsagirl]

53. My pleasure-- I think I'll do the same :)

[calmblueocean]

20. No no no. This was satire. Please read this link.

http://blogs.suntimes.com/ebert/2008/09/this_is_the_dawning_of_the_age.html

[Tallison]

31. Thank God

There was a whole thread on it here at DU in days following its posting. I'll have to re-read it, but at the time it didn't strike me or anyone else here as satire, and in fact I wondered if it wasn't a reaction to his recent bout with cancer.

[Akbar]

63. As Someone Familiar with Ebert and Creationism

It didn't occur to me that it was anything but satire. Sorry, but if Ebert had become a creationist, then something would have had to have happened to him that would have prevented him from writing such a lucid presentation of their talking points.

[tavalon]

108. I just read the article and he played it way too straight

but yes, we are too credulous these days.

[msallied]

22. Did you not see the irony at all in that article??

I've been a reader of Ebert's for several years. Trust me, this is NOT literal. lol

[Tallison]

38. It helps seeing the f/u article

As an RN, I figured his recent cancer (thyroid & salivary) had literally gone to his head. Re-reading it, I've seen better satire.

[pokerfan]

46. I am ashamed to admit that I fell for it too

But it can be difficult to detect a parody when it comes to creationism. It's an example of http://rationalwiki.com/wiki/Poe%27s_Law">Poe's Law. It takes a deft hand to parody creationism. One of the best is http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=EdwardCurrent">Edward Current. His videos are hysterical. For example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXf8COiHMuM">Intelligent Design Really Is Being Expelled! :rofl:

[13 Hawks]

78. Cotton Hill is so funny! :toast:

Thanks for the post! I've always contended that John McCain
was the inspiration for Cotton Hill. I wish more people would
use the comparison since it fits so well:

grumpy
short
rude and foul-mouthed
womanizer
fascist
intolerant
war vet who can't forget

[13 Hawks]

79. Cotton Hill is so funny!

I swear McCain was used at the inspiration for Cotton Hill:

Both are:

Grumpy old white men
Short
Fascists
War vets who can't forget
Foul-mouthed
Womanizers
My way or the highway

[Lex]

26. Um, OMG. Satire much?

nt

[Tallison]

33. Um, no, and apparently it didn't strike many others here as satire either

(there was an entire DU thread on it) which is why I guess he posted the clarifying article linked upstream.

[Lex]

39. seems pretty obvious to me

I mean, the moose answer? Come ON.

[Tallison]

43. As an RN, I've seen cancer do weirder things to people

so I chalked it up to the face he's battling thyroid and salivary. And re-reading it, I've seen better satire and wackier seriousness.

In any case, I'm relieved it's all a joke and he's still the same, smart cynic he ever was.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

103. Did his cancer call your literacy deficiency?

Or is it just because of chronic english malnutrition?

[tavalon]

109. You missed the point there,

speaking of poor comprehension. The nurse (forgot to check gender- refuse to assume) was speaking to profound changes that can and do happen with people battling cancer, both spiritually and physically.

And I concur, it was played too straight. I'm sure my husband who is a huge Ebert fan, would have recognized it as satire. I just read it a few moments ago and it was played too straight for me. I would need insider knowledge of Ebert to parse the article correctly.

Frankly, it leaves me wondering if he really is against McCain or just playing more of his "age of irony" games. Note that I get the irony of placing that in quotes.

[volstork]

92. This is also a satirical piece.

I have been reading Ebert for years, and know his wry humor when I see it.

From his journal/blog:
Some days ago I posted an article headlined, "Creationism: Your questions answered." It was a Q&A that accurately reflected Creationist beliefs. It inspired a firestorm on the web, with hundreds, even thousands of comments on blogs devoted to evolution and science. More than 600 comments on the delightful FARK.com alone. Many of the comments I've seen believe I have converted to Creationism. Others conclude I have lost my mind because of age and illness. There is a widespread conviction that the site was hacked. Lane Brown's blog for New York magazine flatly states I gave "two thumbs down to evolution." On every one of the blogs, there are a few perceptive comments gently suggesting the article might have been satirical. So far I have not seen a single message, negative or positive, from anyone identifying as a Creationist.
http://blogs.suntimes.com/ebert/2008/09/this_is_the_dawning_of_the_age.html

[EOTE]

104. It's a joke. Ebert has very logically defended evolution in the past.

It's a fairly well hidden satire. Ebert would be embarrassed if he thought people thought he was really a creationist.

[msallied]

13. WHAT?? Um... far as I know, he's a lapsed Catholic.

[terrya]

24. I find that extremely difficult to believe.

Everything I've read about Roger Ebert suggests that has never believed in creationism.

[msallied]

25. He doesn't. The article the OP above sourced as evidence was satire.

I've read Ebert for a very long time and have NEVER encountered such a thing. lol

[terrya]

30. Ah.

Thanks. LOL.

:-)

[ailsagirl]

41. This from Wikipedia-- he is agnostic

Ebert has been known to comment on films using his own Roman Catholic faith and his own interpretation of Christianity as a point of reference, and has been critical of films he believes are grossly ignorant or insulting of Catholicism, such as Stigmata and Priest though he has given favorable reviews of controversial films with themes or references to Jesus and Catholicism, including The Passion of the Christ,<24> Martin Scorsese's The Last Temptation of Christ, and to Kevin Smith's religious satire Dogma. However, Ebert identifies himself as an agnostic.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Ebert

[targetpractice]

28. He definitely is not a Creationist...

See this article below by Ebert where he explains his motive by writing prior article about what Creationist's believe.

This is the dawning of the Age of Credulity

[Starry Messenger]

36. Phew. I love my Ebert.

To find out he was a Creationist would have given me vapors.

[blogslut]

62. nevermind

Looks like you already heard. :)

[Occam Bandage]

83. What's weird is that you completely missed the point of that article.

[ecstatic]

94. That's his choice and it's not relevant at all to the current topic nt

[reichstag911]

102. WTF?

Where'd you get that one?

[kenny blankenship]

7. McGrimace

Have some distilled water and pure grain alcohol to take the edge off.

[Left Is Write]

8. "If you are rude to him, you are rude to me."

Damn straight.

[Cha]

48. That is what I loved! And, it was pointed out

on DU, too, that he was being rude to all of Obama's supporters.

[ClayZ]

9. K and R

[Kerrytravelers]

10. Basic decency. Exactly. Obama has it by the truckload. McCain's could fit in a Radio Flyer wagon.

[musette_sf]

12. edited, OP's link is bad

Guess who's not coming to dinner
BY ROGER EBERT / September 28, 2008

full text can be found at

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080928/COMMENTARY/809289997

[msallied]

14. Why in the hell was it taken down?? Dammit!

[madaboutharry]

19. Robert Ebert is a good man.

I feel very bad that he is so ill.

[ailsagirl]

21. So do I. I loved it when he and Gene did "At the Movies" :(

[ailsagirl]

23. Good thinking-- thank you for doing that :)

[Applepie]

16. Here's the link

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/section?category=COMMENTARY

[Kajsa]

82. Thanks, Applepie!

I've saved this article for future reference.

Ebert is absolutely correct!

:)

[msallied]

27. I love Roger Ebert. Though he can no longer speak...

he can still share the great gift of his written words with us. And he's as lucid as ever. Love it!

[Cha]

29. You got it, ailsagirl! I knew this article by Roger Ebert

would be Fantastic and was bummed there was no link to it from google!

And your link says "Page cannot be found"!! What's up, how did you even get this much!?

Rec'd!

[ailsagirl]

32. I can't take the credit-- veracity made note of it and I thought

it should be its own thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4113601

:patriot:

[Cha]

50. Yes, but all those links aren't working..

and I got the whole from you which is safely in my inbox now!

Thank everybody involved with getting this out here!

It was so dead on..I wonder if it is in the newspaper part of Chicago Sun Times?

[ailsagirl]

52. I'm sure he has carte blanche at this point...

I'm sorry he's ill-- I always liked him.

[noel711]

37. Dammit, Ebert is right!

The McCains have been crossed off of our dinner guest list too!

No more dinners in rural PA for those dastardly McCains!

We simply will not abide such a rude spectacle!

[Stinky The Clown]

40. Mr. Ebert speaks for me.

Mr. and Mrs. Ebert:

[Lex]

44. Implosion!

exactly so

[Frumious B]

47. I take it that is a "Thumbs down!" then.

The funny thing is that I was listening to the debate while doing other stuff and as such didn't pick up on McCain's hostile body language, facial expressions and so forth. I went to bed satisfied with the impression that the debate was either a tie or a very narrow, but not particularly game changing McCain win. Seeing clips online and on my DVR recording I know what everyone is talking about now.

[K Gardner]

49. Hah! Thank you, Roger Ebert !

[intheflow]

51. Ebert's getting angry in his old age.

A good, feisty, righteous anger!

[judasdisney]

54. Roger Ebert = Longtime Liberal & living national treasure.

Ebert's been dissing Dumbya since 1999, spoke out against the Iraq War before it was started, and is a great Chicagoan liberal.

He is a living national treasure.

[ailsagirl]

55. He is that.

:patriot:

[Cha]

56. An after dinner toast to Roger Ebert!

:toast: :patriot: :bounce: :kick: :party:

[Bluenorthwest]

90. Yes he is

Ebert is also the only film critic ever to win the Pulitzer Prize. He's one of the great ones, an assest to the cinema world and a great liberal American.

[tavalon]

110. Weird that I didn't know that

My hubby is a huge fan of Ebert and I would have thought he would impart that, but then he is a fan of him because they are fellow movie buffs.

[crazy_vanilla]

57. definitely not a satire

He was voicing what many of us wanted to say, but had no access to McTurd or a large audience. I wish I could shout this in McTurd's slimy face!!!:spank:

[Afikpo Chic]

58. Obama should not call him John

No matter how this is slized; it seems disrespecful for Obama to be calling a man old enough to be his dad by his 1st name. Just because McCain was rude and all to Obama does not mean Obama should also do anything that appears rude towards him too. I just don't like Obama calling him John. Too much for me to bear. It looks bad. Don't like it one bit.

Obama/Biden 08

[Pattib]

60. I'm sure Obama will take that under advisement. Jeez, lighten up!

John McCain uses Obama's first name when he smears him in campaign ads...what? Obama should call him MR.?

[mwb970]

76. First name!? McLame's supporters call Obama "Hussein"!

How anyone can find calling someone by their actual name insulting eludes me.

[Cha]

64. Bulloney...Obama can call the lying asshole by his first name.

This isn't the 19th century.

[TooRaLoo]

65. Welcome to 2008,

stranger.

[tavalon]

112. You owe me a new keyboard!

:spray:

I kid.

That reminds me of a strange moment with a guy that one of my extended family members brought home one day. He is an Iraqi war vet who has been wandering the country since he got back. Anyway, when he met me, he said, "Pleased to meet you, ma'am!" I'm only 45 but I guess to a barely 22 year old kid, I look like a ma'am. It was weird. That guy, btw, has remained part of our extended family and he is a really, really good kid. He seems much, much younger than his now 23 years, unless you look only at his eyes.

[TwilightGardener]

68. They are colleagues and equals. Obama is almost 50 years old.

He doesn't defer to McCain, nor should he.

[Miss Chybil]

69. So, what are you going to do about it?

Surely, not vote for "Mr. Senator McCain?"

[WorseBeforeBetter]

71. Too much for you to bear, eh? You'll live.

Obama is a class act.

[K Gardner]

73. You are absolutely wrong. Where would you get such a wrong-headed idea? Have you

EVER watched even another Presidential debate??

Ridiculous.

[stlsaxman]

74. awww was Senator Obama being a little too "uppity" for you? maybe he should address him as

"Massa McCain"?

your post disgusts me.

[Sorceress]

93. Hate to say it...

But I was thinking along similar lines. Ebert is absolutely correct in that Obama and McCain are equals as they both hold the title of Senator. Obama maintained a high level of class and respect throughout the night, especially in the face of McCain's constant disrespect and underestimation of Obama's knowledge, intelligence and comprehension skills. McCain's strategy (however misguided) was to attempt to show Obama as an inferior and subordinate, hence, the blatant refusal to give Obama the basic respect of even looking at him. It was Obama's job to counter this. By exercising his right to address McCain as "John", Obama was not acting "out of pocket" (as AfikpoChic seems to be suggesting) but rather, cleverly and respectfully countering McCain's attempts and establishing himself McCain's equal. J.M.H.O.

I post in peace.

[Occam Bandage]

85. Yeah, it's awful uppity for that boy to call that fine, upstanding white man by his name.

"Mr. McCain, sir" would be much more appropriate.

[Bette Noir]

86. Obama and McCain have the same job.

They work in the same office. They are peers, age notwithstanding.

[Retrograde]

95. Should he give him a cute nickname

like Pooty-poot or Turd Blossom?

They are peers, and members of a very exclusive club: the US Senate. They could keep addressing each other by their titles, or surnames, but "John" is less formal.

[JuniperLea]

98. They are peers...

It was perfectly acceptable. In fact, it would have been rather "uppity" to call him Mr. McCain or Senator.

Obama is a Senator... jeez.

[CottonBear]

99. They are fellow senators. They can call each other by their first names.

It's not disrespectful between equals.

However, Republican partisans and pundits call Senator Clinton "Hillary" instead of Mrs. Clinton or Senator Clinton while calling Senator Oabama "Obama" and Senator McCain "McCain." I think it's rude for those who are not fellow senators to address her by her first name only.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

105. Too uppity, eh?

You'd prefer "sah?"

[tavalon]

111. They are fellow Senators

They have the right to call each other by their first names. They are equals in the eyes of the Congress.

That said, I did suspect he was employing a subtler version of what Palin pulled with "In what respect, Charlie?". We shouldn't forget that while Senator Obama is a stand up guy, he is also a very savvy politician.

[demokatgurrl]

59. my favorite line from the article:

"Did his agreement show honesty, or weakness? It is significant that you said it proved he was not ready to lead. "

LOL.
edited for typo

[Raine]

61. Good article. Ebert is correct McINSANE was insulting

he insulted more than half the people in this courtry by disrespecting our choice with his rudeness.

[mucifer]

66. Ebert is great. Thanks for posting this. And here's an Ebert article about my favorite Studs Terkel

Another Chicago treasure. I hope to marry him some day:

http://ebimg.sv.publicus.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/bilde?Site=EB&Date=20070515&Category=PEOPLE&ArtNo=705160301&Ref=AR&Profile=1023&Maxw=438

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070515/PEOPLE/705160301/1023

[Lautremont]

80. Act fast!

[Suprk]

84. As Always, Spoy on Roger

[Miss Chybil]

70. Does anybody have links to anyone else talking about this?

Anyone, as in talking head, journalist, columnist, personality anyone? I'd like to think it got a lot of play. McCain's behavior made me sick.

[Fluffdaddy]

72. Nice

[13 Hawks]

77. The next debate

Now the question becomes what happens at the next debate which
will be less formal and in a town hall format. If McCain
overreaches, he looks like a dufus. I think he will try to be
warmer, but it will difficult and it will come across to the
public.

[RoccoR5955]

81. I've been waiting for someone to say this.

I don't think it's sarcasm. McCain never looked at his opponent. Could this have been a way for him to keep himself from "going off?"

[Bette Noir]

88. That was the speculation in the audience,

per an immediate post-debate interview by Chris Matthews.

[Suprk]

87. Thank you Roger for pointing out the obvious

[IllinoisBirdWatcher]

89. So well stated. Please read the entire column.

Roger Ebert has spent his adult lifetime analyzing performances of actors (people playing a role).

Eber't analysis is so spot-on.

The debate and Roger Ebert's analysis confirm what Senator Obama stated so clearly in his acceptance speech in Denver:

John McCain has neither the temperament nor the judgment to lead.

Plain and simple.

John McCain's behavior is that of a spoiled 10-year-old child. He tried to "take his marbles and go home," but Barack Obama and the American public would not let him.

John McCain is the most DISHONORABLE candidate to run for office since Richard Nixon.

[Thrill]

91. This is kind of what a Republican friend of mine

said earlier today. He thought McCain came across as hateful.

[Douglas Carpenter]

96. KICK AND RECOMMENDED ---

[redqueen]

97. At least one of my co-workers thought McCain did a good job.

Unreal.

[ann_american2004]

100. excellent

nt

[RepublicanElephant]

106. you go, roger!

:yourock:

[RepublicanElephant]

107. you go, roger!

:yourock: