I don't like the word "scab" in connection with non-union shops.

[achtung_circus]

I managed several plumbing companies, 2 non-union, 1 union.

A "scab" is a worker who crosses a Union picket line.

Working for a non-union shop does not a scab make. Our men (and 1 woman)were as well trained and as well compensated as any union shop with which we competed. Often our benefits package was better than the union package.

We had none of the inter-trade difficulties that can result in ugliness, and occasionally violence, on jobsites. Any hassles that would, in a union shop, involve a grievance process and a shop steward were settled by sitting down and talking.

Our productivity was better, making us more competetive.

The term belittles the many people who do not work through the Union and Local process.

[av8rdave]

1. As a union member, I have to agree

Working in a non union environment does not make one a scab. Usually, in those situations, union membership is not even a choice for the worker.

Only one who crosses a picket line or otherwise engages in strike breaking is a scab. For those individuals, I have no understanding, compasson or forgiveness. The are taking advantage of those who are taking a tremedous professional and financial risk.

[blockhead]

2. true,

I prefer the word "Rat".

[achtung_circus]

3. Why? nt

[anigbrowl]

16. It's attitudes like this that have put me off ever joining a union

I've always preferred working freelance or for small companies, because I like to negotiate direct with the person who hires me and because I'm not shy about walking from a job if I feel I'm being abused. I have nothing against people who prefer to be in a union, but the freedom to join one should surely also translate to freedom not to do so. Some (not all) of my personal experiences with unions have left me less than impressed; I think there are poorly run locals and poor stewards just as there are also poorly run corporations and managers.

Your kind of post is NOT a good advertisement for union membership - I have no desire to join an organization where a mob mentality is tolerated.

[yardwork]

4. In many parts of the country unions are not an option.

In the south, for instance, unions barely exist.

[Sebastian Doyle]

7. Well they used to openly call it "slavery" down there

Now they just hide it a little better and call it "right to work", which really means "right to fuck your employees every way possible"

[yardwork]

10. Yep.

[sufrommich]

5. Your companies pay and benefit package is a direct result

of having to compete for workers from union shops. I guarantee that were your area devoid of union competition that would not be the case.Compare anywhere in this country where skilled trade jobs are heavily union to areas in the country where they are not and pay scale and benefits drop significantly in the absence of union shops.

[Pithlet]

6. Well, I do agree with you about the term scab.

Anyone who uses the term for non-union workers is using the term incorrectly and unfairly. I do disagree with your characterization of the union process, however, particularly this part:

"We had none of the inter-trade difficulties that can result in ugliness, and occasionally violence, on jobsites. Any hassles that would, in a union shop, involve a grievance process and a shop steward were settled by sitting down and talking."

Sure, they were settled, but were they settled to the same degree of satisfaction? I would rather have the grievance process, personally. For people who are fortunate enough to work in an environment where they will be listened to, the talking it out might garner them the same results. But, most workers need more teeth because of the imbalance of power. We need more unions and stronger unions in our workforce, and I hate to see myths and misconceptions of the union process spread. I know there were plenty of times in my working history where having someone on my side would have made a world of difference when I had a grievance to settle. I had to go up against my employer when they wrongfully denied me health benefits because they screwed up the paperwork. Talking it out with them did me no good. Having a union would have made all the difference, I'm sure, and if someone told me "well, we're all working a lot more efficiently then those union workers!" at the time, I would have popped them one.

[achtung_circus]

8. Well, I am in a different country

with better labour (sic) laws.

[amborin]

9. as a union supporter, i agree

a scab crosses picket lines to work to break a strike, siding with management

however: you made your point about scabs, then went into a thinly veiled attack on union shops

enough, already

[bookman]

11. I concur

The line:

"Any hassles that would, in a union shop, involve a grievance process and a shop steward were settled by sitting down and talking."

...is laughable.

[Ikonoklast]

12. In a non-union shop, the way that goes is the Boss Man saying

"Shut up, do what you're told, or quit. We don't need whiners like you here."

[crankychatter]

14. get down with your bad self - NT

[anigbrowl]

17. BS. That's true in some cases, and false in others

I have worked for people like that, and they're assholes. But I've also worked for people who take the needs and concerns of their employees very seriously and actually run the business as a team effort. Your post is just as foolish as a RWer saying all unions are corrupt or suchlike.

[achtung_circus]

15. Laugh away,

that's the way I treated employees, with respect. I believe I got respect in return.

[crankychatter]

13. boeing subs work to asia then asian companies sub to american shops

then laid off boeing workers go to work for half the wage and benefit package they had originally

i wouldn't call them scabs either

but neither would i extol the fucking virtues of this system

and i would never assert that the union is somehow responsible for low productivity and quality...

i know that bush's "owner society" is looking for recruits and that "work ethics" which are a union source of pride; have been replaced by "owner mentality," which is diminutive and untrue... suggesting that if you're not an "investor" you have poor morals

i'm sure you're right, from your experience and i TOTALLY AGREE regarding the use of that term "scab"

i've been thinking about the union busting that's transpired over the last thirty years with government corruption and political complicity

it must be nice to be a corporation, with super-citizen status and unfettered access to the halls of power

whatever that IS, it isn't "free enterprise."

Collective bargaining is an essential element in healthy capitalism... without it, you'd be working 80 hour weeks for chump change

as it is, two income families have become a necessity of survival, not a function of yuppies wanting to sustain their lifestyle... and how DOES IT FEEL, to be unable to own a home, and have the school system raising your latchkey kids?