Shameful behavior from FSU McCain supporters. Sickening. Sirens, yells disrupting Biden.

[madfloridian]

I can't believe this was allowed to go on so long. Oh, wait, yes I can. I guess my state is so used to these idiots who think of nothing but division and bigotry that no on even noticed.

Watch this video and go back and watch it again. Then again.

This is the hateful, ugly side of Florida.

http://embeds.blogs.foxnews.com/2008/11/02/biden-bats-down-mccain-protesters-in-florida/

I hope that FSU is aware of the results of its educational system if this be any indication.

This is bigotry and hate and lack of any courtesy at all. I don't like it when our side interrupts people like this. But this is one of the worst I have seen.

TALLAHASSEE, FL — Joe Biden’s first foray into Florida’s more conservative northern regions was met with a group of about 30 very vocal pro-McCain protesters, who disrupted the rally in the shadows of Florida State University’s football stadium from 300 yards away with a constant stream of chants — and a steady siren from a megaphone carried by one of the protesters.
Biden carried on for 5 minutes without mentioning the omnipresent wail, but as he launched into the section of his speech outlining just how John McCain is exactly like George Bush, he couldn’t resist a dig at the protesters’ expense

“The fact of the matter is, maybe those McCain folks can hear this, they’d be interested back there,” Biden said. “They can hear this, I’ll say it loudly as I can.”

“I thought it was a siren, it’s just a whine, I guess,” he continued to laughs. “It’s gonna be okay folks.”

But later, Biden used the protesters as an example of the types of people an Obama administration needs to reach out to in order to unite the country.

“We can’t move past the politics of division unless after this election is over, if God willing we win, we reach out to the people in the outer parking lot,” he said. “I know you find some of that obnoxious, but…, we’ve got to reach out, we’ve got to end this. Somebody’s got to be big enough to stand up and end this.”

“They’re good folks,” he said of the protesters. “They’re committed to John’s notions, but we know what they don’t know. We know that we can do this. This is not some hat trick. This is not something beyond our capacity.”

Kudos to Joe Biden, and once again shame on my state for allowing this ugliness to continue.

Oh, yeah, I know it is free speech. I guess. The McCain protestors have free speech, but Joe Biden doesn't unless he can yell louder than the siren.

Horrible stuff. I am ashamed of Florida.

[madfloridian]

1. I forgot to say "Florida again."

Because it is. It is always something here.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

2. Looks like free speech to me.

I don't have a problem with it.

[madfloridian]

6. I already said it so you could repeat it. They had free speech at Biden's expense.

There's a line between free speech and just plain ugliness.

But I was expecting someone to say it.

[Tallison]

8. There's no line between free speech and ugliness

Free speech is inclusive of ugliness. :shrug:

[madfloridian]

12. They are the only ones there who had "free speech".

Biden really did not. He was forced to talk over and around them.

Yes, I know it was free speech. But when it gets that ugly it means others don't have it.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

13. Mostly.

Free speech is inclusive of ugliness. Mostly. Sometimes just plain ugliness. Sometimes just plain truth. Sometimes neither. Sometimes both. That's the beauty of it.

:thumbsup:

[madfloridian]

15. I am glad you saw beauty there. I saw hate and anger and contempt for others

Of course we should all have free speech, though.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

16. Beauty in the act.

Laughter at the words. :shrug:

[VPStoltz]

11. Yeah but these are the fools who, based on appearance alone,

have audience members removed from their rallies. Some free speach.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

40. Strawman.

[Festivito]

22. No. It's not a free speech issue, it's a who has more free speech.

They are having their free speech trying to trump Biden's free speech. The two attempts at free speech CANCEL each other, and it is not an issue of denial of the RIGHT of free speech.

It then drops to a matter of disturbing the peace.

Neither one deserves MORE free speech than the other.

One set an event, is licensed for that event, and therefore has a reasonable hold on that area and of course a right to a peaceful assembly.

Are these R's denied knowledge of the event? NO.

Are they denied the ability to set a meeting? NO. Even if they wanted to meet Biden himself, they must still accept that Biden may only want to meet with Palin or McCain. If Palin or McCain do not take such challenge, their problem is with McCain and Palin and not Biden, and we're back to a charge of disturbing the peace.

If they were to only hold signs -- fine. But, here the attempt is to unpeacefully deny speech during the right of peaceful assembly secondary to equal rights of free speech.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

39. Disturbing the peace?

What peace?

If looked at objectively, Biden had more support than the freeps. Game, Biden.

:shrug:

[Festivito]

68. The peace of a peaceful assembly.

My point is that it is NOT a free speech issue. The situation devolves into them disturbing the peace, and Biden's group exercising peaceable assembly.

[Joe Chi Minh]

51. Nor did Hitelr, you mutt. Every tinpot, fascist dictator has relied on it to

build their movement, initiate pogroms and lynchings, too, no doubt.

You need to use your intelligence more with regard to freedoms generally. Civilised societies have laws, quite restrictive on would-be malefactors. What do want anarchy?

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

57. Anarchy?

They were spewing their bullshit in a fairly orderly manner.

I'm not threatened by that!

Are you anti-Code Pink?

Anti-yard sign?

Anti-bumpersticker?

Where do you draw the line? I draw it at physical intervention.

Pogroms and lynchings? Laughable. The vid rose nowhere near to that level.

Oh, and I'm invoking Godwin's Law. :)

[Joe Chi Minh]

58. I understood you to be generalising about freedom, when the reality can,

in reality, be licence.

The problem with Godwin's Law, you know, is that Nazism is simply the Old Adam at its most primitive, and crypto-Nazism has never been far away from the imperial-governance cultures of the UK and the US.

Given "the banality of evil", is it any wonder the meaning of the term has long lost appreciable significance to our jaded ears, corrupted for so long by the corporatist governance of our respective UK and US politity.

[Olney Blue]

3. I'm impressed that Biden had the guts to go there.

[Cha]

32. Biden's got guts, alright..

mccain's supporters are typical non reality based, beyond low information voters who personify a loud WHINE!

[Jennicut]

48. LOL! Joe is not intimidated by anyone. This is the guy that told Slobodan Milosevic off.

Joe once told the Serbian president to his face that he was a thug. I don't think he is afraid of anyone.

[quiet.american]

4. Biden's reaction was that of a statesman. So proud he's ours. nt

[47of74]

25. Much better than what McSame or Falin would've done in his shoes.

[Clio the Leo]

5. Biden no doubt rolled up his sleeves and beat the crap out of them right? Or maybe not..

“We can’t move past the politics of division unless after this election is over, if God willing we win, we reach out to the people in the outer parking lot,” he said. “I know you find some of that obnoxious, but…, we’ve got to reach out, we’ve got to end this. Somebody’s got to be big enough to stand up and end this.”

And this is EXACTLY why I'm voting for these men. Something you will NEVER hear Palin say. None of that "teach them a lesson!" BS.

LOVE YOU JOE!!!!!!!!!!!

[tosh]

7. My alma mater. That was ugly indeed.

I'm not sure they were students, though. I hope they weren't. :grr:

[bertman]

9. Since when did free speech include drowning out the other person who is speaking?

Or disrupting the opposition's rally?

They have every right to be where they were and to speak their minds about their opposition to Obama and Biden. But they don't have the right to disrupt the other event. Nazi-style tactics.

It's sad that we have come to think that just because you oppose someone else you can shout them down or keep them from speaking. Same old stuff that Bill Orally and Hannity do and then call it an interview.

Amazing.

[Lumpsum]

10. Too bad police weren't nearby.

That fat idiot would have gotten in trouble for sounding off that megaphone siren.

[deadmessengers]

14. Figures, it's from the Criminoles.

FSU doesn't have very high standards.

[hellbound-liberal]

36. That's a pretty ignorant statement. I went to FSU and I abhor that behavior.

That type of blanket generalization is something I expect from McCain's supporters, not Obama's.

[tallahasseedem]

50. As someone who is

working on her third degree from FSU, I can say that I am truly offended. You might want to do a little more research into some of the wonderful things that are going on within the university and not judge us by the actions of football players.

[madfloridian]

17. This should be renamed "The beauty of free speech."

:shrug:

[bluestateguy]

18. Our side needs to get our union guys out there to flatten these little pricks

Big Teamsters guys could take care of these punks.

[tsuki]

19. If Obama supporters had tried those tactics, the Tallahassee police

would have been there post-haste.

[libertad]

20. So true. When Obama was here (in Jacksonville) the McCain people

had an airplane fly over the whole time Obama was speaking with a banner that read, "Paying taxes is not patriotic".

[DemocratSinceBirth]

21. Fox Is Wrong As Usual - Tallahassee Is Not A Conservative Region

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._presidential_election,_2004,_in_Florida

It went for Kerry 62-38!!!!


Don't condemn an entire area for the action of a few yahoos!

[Alexander]

23. No, but it's in a conservative region.

The Florida panhandle is the most conservative part of the country.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

27. The Panhandle Is Conservative

But Tallahassee is at the tip of the Panhandle and pretty isolated from the rest of it...I went to school there...Tallahassee is Leon County...The next big city is Jacksonville to the east and Panama City to the west and both are over a hundred miles away...

I also suspect the campus is pro-Obama like ninety nine percent or so of the campuses in America...

[madfloridian]

24. I condemned the Yahoos....

and I said it was free speech.

If FSU is allowing such behavior, they must condone it.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

29. I'm Not Speaking To The Behavior But To Fox's Characterization Of Tallahassee As Conservative

~

[deadparrot]

26. No offense, but we laugh hysterically every time McCain or Palin get heckled.

Why is it "sickening" when it happens to our guys? I mean, it's politics...shit happens. It's just something you have to expect.

[madfloridian]

31. Our side doesn't act like these idiots....not like this.

Did you see my comment?

This is bigotry and hate and lack of any courtesy at all. I don't like it when our side interrupts people like this. But this is one of the worst I have seen.

Too many here at DU have lowered their standards to defend anything at all. I have always said our side should not disrupt such events.

But what this group is doing is very very far out of line.

[deadparrot]

34. I'm glad Biden has a thicker skin than you do.

Politics isn't sunshine and roses. If the worst that happens to the Obama/Biden team is a little heckling and sirens, I'll be thrilled.

[madfloridian]

35. The fact you call that "heckling"...says more about you than me.

Stop with the thick skin, tough hide crap with me.

Biden had no choice but to put up with it and be gracious.

The people in this thread who seem to think that display with the siren was just fine and dandy are making me wonder what the heck is going on here.

That was not heckling, my friend. That was the face of uncontrolled hate.

[deadparrot]

37. Same to your definition of "sickening."

As long as all that's being thrown at Biden is words, I'm really not inclined to agree with you at all. Are they irritating? Stupid? Pathetic? Yes on all counts, and probably several more. But you know what? There's a lot of sick shit in this world, things that make my stomach churn just thinking about them: bigotry, poverty, war, hunger, violence. I love Joe Biden to death, but some idiotic Republicans spewing nonsense at him is pretty damn low on my list of things that are "sickening." And I hope he'd agree with me on that, even if you don't.

[madfloridian]

44. Yes. they are young people who care nothing about the tragedies you mentioned.

They only care about being obnoxious, and yes it is sickening.

Oh wow...what a mood here at DU today. I post a video of nasty young Republicans and people are getting pissed off at me??????

:wtf:

[deadparrot]

61. You can cure youth.

You can't cure stupid. What category those young people fall into has yet to be seen. And there will always be political opposition in this country--god willing, the worst that will happen is a little heckling. I'd much rather them use their vocal cords than a weapon.

And I think it's fairly evident from my posts that I'm not "pissed off." But I do think people have to grow a thicker skin when it comes to our candidates. They're not going to be treated with kid gloves (Obama in particular), and the sooner people start realizing that, the better. If Obama gets elected, a lot of ugliness is going to be released from the other side, and if we spend all our time sitting on the internet discussing our righteous indignation over every single offensive incident, nothing productive is ever going to get done.

[madfloridian]

62. You are right.

There is no cure for stupid. But if we do not speak out and call attention to things it makes matters worse.

I don't think they are stupid. I think they are brainwashed by the right wing extremists, I think they only know how to divide and disrupt.

I will continue to point out such events, and I hope others will also....NOT shove them under the rug.

[deadparrot]

69. Instead of talking about it on a liberal message board, in effect preaching to the choir,

I'd much rather people go out and work to change the attitudes that cause people to say such hateful things.

[asdjrocky]

28. Where's the fucking steelworkers?

Man, walk over with a few big steelworkers and those punks scatter like flies..

[DemocratSinceBirth]

30. No steelworkers in Tally

The only union members there are AFSCME...

[asdjrocky]

33. Sigh, nuff said.

[spanone]

38. the 22 percenters....dimwit fuckheads....obama will be their president too.

[Epiales]

41. Allow me to chime in to support the free speech point

These protesters said so much more than they intended.

They said "We have nothing constructive to argue with."
They said "We concede that we cannot argue on the merits of the issues."
They said "We have the maturity of toddlers."
They said "Hey, take a good look as we look like idiots."

Biden also spoke with more than his words. His behavior is one of the truly masterful things that the Obama campaign has utilized... they've looked like adults, acted like real statesmen.

Unless you are already deep in the tank for McCain, this behavior left a very negative impression -- both on whomever might actually still be undecided in this fight, but more importantly, to the rest of the world looking on in hopeful anticipation.

I pray we turn the corner on Tuesday.

[WheelWalker]

55. The great challenge is to know things as they really are. I couldn't agree with you more. n/t

And, welcome to DU!

[Vektor]

42. Smells like desperation to me, expressed in a very low class manner.

Says more about them than it does about us.

[zulchzulu]

43. There are no shortage of twits

Don't worry. The Repigs will be handed a nice big can of whoopass on Tuesday. They seriously can go Cheney themselves...

[Jennicut]

45. Biden handled like a pro. He made fun of them a bit then also mentioned how we need to reach out to

them and move the country forward. As others mentioned here, Biden acted like a real adult and so does Barack. McLame and Phalin act childish and so do their protesters but someone had to be the adult in Washington. Shrub and the Rethugs acted like kids in a candy store. And our two guys also are adult enough to want to heal the country, not tear it apart. McLame has tried Rove's way to tear us apart to win and it has not worked....finally! People are sick of it, and hopefully the sign will be sent Tuesday that these kind of politics don't work. Not when we have inspiration and hope in the form of Obama and Biden.

[demo dutch]

46. I'm ALWAYS ashamed of Florida, but at least I live in a Dem county! and we experienced the same

thing during a Kerry rally in 04 at FAU

[demo dutch]

47. So how's the youth vote going there????

[tallahasseedem]

49. It was highly annoying...

but it didn't take away from the speech. In fact, it was hilarious because Joe actually made fun of them.

[Iwillnevergiveup]

52. I'm with you, Madfloridian

What those folks did was beyond obnoxious - it was downright cowardly.

Unfortunately, the video has been scrubbed, so I didn't see it. But I can imagine.

[madfloridian]

53. The video is still at the link. I just checked.

Wait a second for it to load.

[retread]

54. Both Leon county and the city of Tallahassee have a noise ordinance. Seems like a

siren that is not used in an official capacity would fall under one or both.

[and-justice-for-all]

56. “I thought it was a siren, it’s just a whine, I guess,”

Ha!

[Muttocracy]

59. free speech is one thing, but is playing a siren by a busy street OK? wouldn't that bother police?

[madfloridian]

60. Well, I would think so...

But the reaction overall to this surprised me. I get the same thing when I say groups like Code Pink, as wonderful as they are...should not disrupt government hearings.

When the youth of our country, though just 30 in number, are acting like that it is creepy.

[Muttocracy]

63. Country First = disrupt law enforcement?

:shrug:

[1monster]

64. This is the Hateful, Ugly side of REPUBICANS everywhere, not just the hateful ugly side of Florida.

I don't understand why, if you hate this state so damned much, you haven't moved to somewhere you would be happier.

Florida has no monopoly on idiots, jerks, and hate mongers, otherwise known as Republicans. They are all over the US, and there are those just like them all over the world.

I've lived in northeast Florida for thirty-five years. I'm very aware of the ultra and neoconservative nature of the area.

But guess what? This place is far more liberal and cosmopolitan than the place I moved from thirty-five years ago.

Florida has been over built by the greed mongers and eight years of Jebbie Bush did more damage than the hurricanes of 2005. Prior to Jeb Bush, we had Governor Lawton Chiles and Gov/Sen Bob Graham.

This state isn't all bad. It was a pioneer in Government in the Sunshine Laws which Jebbie and his gang tried unsuccessfully to get rid of a few years ago.

There's a lot of good in Florida, but to read your posts, one would believe that this place is Hell on Earth. It isn't.

POST SCRIPT: Thirty obnoxious, mannerless protesters don't quite add up to an indictment for the whole state.

[kwolf68]

65. Well Obama supporters have been protesting

McLame/Palin rallies. This too is to be expected in kind.

[madfloridian]

66. Yes, you are right. I should not have posted it and thought it bad behavior.

I was wrong, and I have been set straight now.

It is all okay if our side does it. Right?

I am very sorry I posted it in anger. I should have thought it over and realized that it is only political activism like our side does.

Right?

[madfloridian]

67. Never mind. It was only free speech. Democrats do it also I am told.

Apparently I touched some nerves with this post, and at first I was not sure why. Now I know....people are afraid to be critical because Democrats do it, too.

And you are right, you know.

When we disrupt them, then it is okay if they disrupt us.

I learned a lot from some of the posts here.

I am learning a lot from DU lately.

[lies and propaganda]

70. "spread butter not wealth?"

oh DEAR jesus!