Chavez offers talks with "black man" in White House

[ecstatic]

CARACAS (Reuters) - Anti-U.S. Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez predicted on Sunday the "black man" will win the U.S. presidential race and offered to hold talks with him to improve ties between the superpower and one its biggest oil suppliers.

"We are not asking him to be a revolutionary, to be a socialist -- no," Chavez said at a political rally. We just want the black man who is about to be the U.S. president to have enough stature for the times the world is living through.

"I send an overture to the black man, from us here, who are of Indigenous, black, Caribbean, South American race," he said.

"I am ready to sit down and talk ... I hope we can, and I hope we can enter a new stage," he said later at another rally.

http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSTRE4A24RT20081103

[skooooo]

1. Shut up, Hugo.

"The black man" doesn't need input from you right now.

[ej510]

3. If Obama wins I hope talks to everyone.

[skooooo]

6. Hopefully he will be talking to people who can say his name. nt

[Renew Deal]

28. Right

Does he think Venezualens are that dumb that they just see Obama as "the black man?" It's bullshit.

[ecstatic]

35. exactly! WTF??! How unprofessional of Chavez

and disrespectful. He's already starting off on the wrong foot, IMO.

[Dorian Gray]

99. That's what got me, too

His constant reference to Obama as "The black man." His name is Barak Obama! It annoyed me reading the article.

[PretzelWarrior]

119. only if they first say to Hugo, "The name's Barack, you 3rd world dipshit"

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

5. Yeah.

Stupid Samoans.

[ananda]

2. Good lord.

Chavez is SO racist.

[Sensitivity]

13. Chavez refers to HIMSELF as Black -- black is beautiful

[skooooo]

16. Still it plays funny to American ears..

...you have to admit.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

27. That says more about Americans than it does about Chavez.

...you have to admit.

[SweetieD]

34. Agreed. People are jumping on Chavez for nothing. I'm Black. There is nothing wrong with being Black

or being called a black man or black woman. Chavez and the Bolvian president (can't think of his name), are two of the few non-European(i.e. majority indigenous) leaders to be in charge of South American countries. I think Chavez's comments were a gesture of solidarity. Nothing more or less.

[ecstatic]

42. You're missing the point... Chavez was unprofessional

and disrespectful. Obama has a name, use it! And it doesn't matter what race Chavez himself is, he still needs to show some respect.

[SweetieD]

43. Chavez did use his name. Someone else posted the other sourced version of his quote.

[Hope08]

I'm Latin and Caribbean

The way he used "el negro" was no term of endearment. It's not quite the n word (we don't have an equivalent in Spanish, that I can think of) but the way he used it was an insult (not exactly an insult, a little weaker -- more like "despectivo" or a sign of "menosprecio," I can't quite get the thought in English).

"Negro" can be used in totally friendly ways in the country where my folks are from, but not the way Chavez used it, in a public speech -- it's not that kind of word. It is also one step from "el negrito," which is **way** worse and which I promise is going to be trotted out at the first sign of a disagreement with the Obama administration. My only question is who will say it first, Chavez or one of the top guys in Cuba (I don't see Raul Castro saying it, frankly -- maybe Alarcon or Perez Roque).

Also, Chavez is criollo or mestizo, not indigenous (granted, he likes to identify as such in speeches). The race dynamic is totally different in Latin America than here.

[Why Syzygy]

69. Fortunately, Obama isn't prickly about what names people call him!

He gets respect because he gives it. Hugo will catch up.

[EFerrari]

90. You're full of it. You don't know what he said.

You don't know what it means, therefore, and you know shit about Chavez OR Venezuela.

And Latin America is not a totally but many different places, people and cultures.

Holy Christ on a crutch.

:rofl:

[Dorian Gray]

100. It's not that....

black is beautiful. It's the de-personalization or de-humanization of a person by referring to them by a characteristic rather than their name. It bugs me.

[skooooo]

41. Well I guess....

That's what we are so. :shrug:

[EFerrari]

17. Against himself?

lol

[Runcible Spoon]

110. Venezuela and South America don't have the same conceptions about race as we do.

It's uniquely American. Calling Chavez racist just belies your ignorance of cultural differences.

[sellitman]

4. He will talk to "That One" ?

How quaint.

[Clio the Leo]

7. The Obama effect has already started...

... I mean Chavez is an idiot, we all know that. And Barack's not gonna invite him over for dinner.

But an Obama presidency will change the way the world looks at us. No matter how much some of them may hate us now .... if we win this bloomin' election, they'll hate us a little bit less on Wednesday.

Hope renewed for ALL of God's children and one of the MANY reasons he's getting my vote.

[my2sense]

8. I guess he didn't get the memo

Obama will be our President that happens to be black. I hope I don't have to hear too much about Obama's race. Truth be told he is bi-racial. Why do we continue to embrace backwards ass ways of the "one drop rule" anyway.

[carnie_sf]

56. I know

I thought he was Irish.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=EADUQWKoVek&feature=related

[liberalmuse]

9. That's 'President Barack Obama' to you, sir.

'The black man'. Chavez had potential many years ago, but it seems he's turned into an asshat.

[Alter Ego]

21. He almost sounds like if Borat was the leader of a country.

"I will talk with black man President of United States. Is nice!"

[bdamomma]

10. oh geez, can Hugo wait until after the election.

cause the wingnuts will use that against Obama.

[Phoonzang]

11. *sigh* God I hate him....

Helpful as always.

[sharp_stick]

12. Chavez is such a tool

I'm sick to death of that grandstanding asshole.

[onetwo]

14. He isn't trying to be derogatory by using the term, "black man."

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

15. Clearly he hates Indigenous, Caribbean, and South American peoples.

:crazy:

[cali]

20. so what? His name is Barack Obama and it's only respectful to refer

to him by his name.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

22. OK, we can't mention he's the first black president.

I see.

[cali]

31. how ridiculous. We're not talking about "us". we're talking about one head of

state referring to another. Yes, it's historic. And his name is still Barack Obama- not "the black man". He's a fuck of a lot more than the color of his skin.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

36. Considering he was dicussing race of both Obama and the Venezuelan people...

I'm still not see any difference, or any sense to your knee-jerk reply.

[Renew Deal]

32. You don't see anything.

You can mention that Obama is the first black president. But it's obtuse to refer to Obama soley as the black president.

Try this. Read anything on DU and replace Obama with "the black man." That's what Chavez is doing.

[Toucano]

23. No, it is actually complimentary.

Linguistically and culturally, it is favorable reference.

¡Viva el Negrito!

[SweetieD]

26. Really Though. I don't see anything wrong with what he is saying. Lighten up people.

[IsItJustMe]

38. No shit. Lighten up. I think we have some cross culture ignorance in our own house to clean up.

[Alter Ego]

18. Um, Hugo?

STFU.

[Jennicut]

19. LOL...what the hell is he talking about? The man needs to just shut up

an mind his own business. That being said, Citgo is cheaper gas then Exxon Mobil.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

24. Fuck Chavez.

[Renew Deal]

25. I hope we can enter a new stage too, but Chavez's comments are idiotic.

What a moron.

[TheDonkey]

29. He's a fucking mess.

[Sensitivity]

30. Why are we buying the nasty MSM twist on Chavez speach. Chavez did use Obama's name

and I bet the spin is an attempt to make the kind of news that helps McCain.

Another source quotes Chavez as saying:

"Hopefully with Obama, we will enter a new phase," Chavez said.

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/world/AP/story/753322.html

Nothing wrong with that and it reflects the type of comments which could be pulled from political speeches of many leaders around the world.

[SweetieD]

39. I agree.

[EFerrari]

46. It's hilarious -- look at this thread. Most people don't even know what he said

let alone that this Reuters translation is terrible.

But Chavez is the moron, right? lol

[GreenPartyVoter]

49. Very sad.

[Dorian Gray]

103. Is that even

from the same speech?

[ceile]

33. sigh

[Captain Hilts]

37. Take a hike, Hugo. nt

[IndianaJones]

40. Chavez is bush-like in his idiocy. nt.

[ladjf]

44. Let's not forget that Bush made a lot of money for Venezuela by

running up the price of oil by invading Iraq. In the economic sense, Chavez may well actually prefer a more war like candidate. So, he sends this message to make voters think he backs Obama causing them to vote McCain.

Who knows? It would have been better if he had just kept quiet.

[eshfemme]

45. Way to make a fool out of yourself, Hugo Chavez

Seriously, whatever political cred he got out of mocking Bush, which is such a no-brainer, went out the window when he decided to speak so dismissively of Obama. WTF, Venezuela?

[EFerrari]

47. Wtf don't you read what he actually said before you make a fool of you?

Wtf,is right.

The media does this all the time and you guys fall for it every time.

Eta: Sorry, that was rude of me. But Reuters and the AP does this all the time. They take a snippet to create an impression -- and it works!

[eshfemme]

52. I find it disrespectful that he doesn't refer to Barack Obama by name

Yes, Barack is a black man but that's not the sum of his identity. Also, he's biracial and because of that, his symbolism is in healing that divide. When you have someone like Hugo Chavez pigeonholing him like the people in the media do (which you obviously have contempt for), WTF do you think people's reaction would be?

Most Obama supporters aren't voting for him because he's black (although there are a minority who are voting for him because he's black) but because of his stance on issues, his judgment, his temperament. Not for being a token minority.

Would it be offensive of me to refer to Hugo Chavez as the Hispanic man? I think it would be-- no matter what his politics or policies are, I'd rather criticize him on those rather than simply label him as a simple member of an ethnicity or color. Again, Barack Obama's already been pointed to as "that one" by John McCain so hearing such language from Hugo Chavez simply reinforces that whole idea of trying to dehumanize Barack Obama. That's my opinion and I still say WTF, Venezuela.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

55. "he's biracial"

How dare you not refer to Barack Obama by his name!

[EFerrari]

58. He did. Read the thread. And Hugo Chavez is not Hispanic.

Reuters did not give you his complete comments and you poll vaulted to a conclusion.

Btw, "negro/a" is a term of endearment in many parts of Latin America.

[Hope08]

61. People, "el negro" is not a term of endearment in this context!

Yes, saying to your girlfriend in bed, "mi negra," or to your best buddy when you hand him a beer, "mi negro" is cool (btw, regardless of if he's black or white). But to refer to the President of a country as "el negro" is not a compliment! Try this on: Hugo Chavez would never refer to George Bush as "el blanco" or "ese blanco." That term has no linguistic charge. Why did he refer to Obama as "el negro"? Because it has a charge, a negative one, **as used in this context**.

[EFerrari]

63. You haven't read his remarks, have you?

lol

[Hope08]

67. No, I am a dumb spic

Incapable of reading. Vete pa' la pinga.

[Name removed]

70. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Hope08]

79. La resingada de tu abuela

[EFerrari]

82. Hermanito, the rules here are that we post in English unless we're in

the Latin American forum, fyi.

[EFerrari]

72. Very nice!

[Name removed]

73. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

64. So when he was referring to Venezuelans as Caribbeans, blacks, South Americans...

Is that supposed to be an insult too?

Jesus fucking Christ. Did you people even read the OP?

[EFerrari]

65. Somebody said "Hugo Chavez" and after that, it's all over.

lol

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

48. I've a question.

Could you tell me when he was dismissive of Obama?

Kthnxbai

[eshfemme]

53. He's dismissive of Obama when he doesn't refer to Obama by his name

Remember the uproar when John McCain refused to look Barack in the eye and then pointed towards him and said "that one"? Perhaps there is something lost in the translation but even reading it in context, I dislike hearing someone referring to Barack Obama as "the black man" because it IS dismissive of Obama being the possible President of the United States. When you have a character like Hugo Chavez often making allusions to Bush by claiming that he can smell the brimstone and sulfur in the air and showing his contempt for Bush by not referring to him by his name (it is disrespectfully funny of course), I find it ridiculous to expect that he's not showing the same sort of disrespect towards Obama by not using his fucking name.

I don't refer to Hugo Chavez as the Hispanic or the brown man because it's dismissive and disrespectful-- for me to expect then that it's perfectly okay to refer to Obama in similar terms is hypocritical.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

54. He did refer to Obama by his name.

So please answer the question.

[Joiwind]

50. Chill. It's not as bad as it sounds.

Chavez is a populist, and he's stupid like a fox. He goes out of his way to talk like a working class Venezuelan, kind of like a Sarah Palin from the other side of the political spectrum. "Negro", or "negrito", don't have anywhere near the bite in Spanish that it does in the US. Venezuelans have a lot of Afro-Caribbean blood, and they take pride in it. They say its one of the reasons why their beauty queens are perennial contenders in international beauty pageants.

Its worth learning Spanish to hear Chavez speak. He's funnier than anything SNL can come up with. He swears like a sailor or an oilfield worker, and I think whatever "objection" he may have towards Obama might be towards Obama's educational attainments, which Chavez routinely belittles in his attempts to win over his macho compatriots.

Bush he hates from the bottom of his spikey little heart.

[Freddie Stubbs]

51. Senator Obama was correct to label this clown as a demagogue

[mshasta]

57. for us in latin america

we don't have any problem to call a black person black, is normal...has nothing to do with being an-respectful is part of our culture.

[Hope08]

59. Oye negro

"Oye negro" is not insulting? C'mon! Ok, not insulting to yell to your friend across the street but unquestionably insulting in a political speech. And to refer to the (probably) President of the United States as "el negro" is not an insult? Ok, then Evo Morales is "ese indio." Not an insult?

Granted, this depends where you are from. In Cuba, Puerto Rico, Venezuela, Republica Dominicana, "el negro" definitivamente puede ser un termino de menosprecio. Todo depende del contexto.

[EFerrari]

62. That isn't what he said. And insider/outsider rules apply to these terms, right?

It is a matter of context. And Chavez is not biracial but multi "racial" himself. He was speaking as an insider to insiders about an insider.

Good grief.

[Hope08]

66. Not to him -- he is not negro

Racial dynamics are totally different in Latin America.

But no need to argue about this, it will not be the last time he uses that word, and it will be clearer what I am talking about in the months ahead.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

68. Yes he is. He is black and native (south) american. He brings it up all the time.

So do many of his detractors in Venezuela.

[Hope08]

77. To look at him

He is mestizo, punto. De negro no tiene nada. Aparte, el que lo insulte por ser negro es idiota y reaccionario. Sin embargo, sigo pensando que no debe referirse al futuro presidente de los ee.uu. como "el negro." En México hay un montón de gente que hablan horrores de la raza negra, a pesar de ser ellos mismos miembros de una raza explotado (o sea, la indígena). Lo cortes no quita lo valiente.

[EFerrari]

80. You sound just like a freeper defining Obama

as if he couldn't figure it out on his own and as if we shouldn't respect his self definition.

Another busted irony meter.

[Hope08]

87. Well, that has no basis in truth

Seeing as how I have supported Obama with ample money and time because I identify with him more than with any other politician in my life.

You, on the other hand, sound like a typical pie-in-the-sky Anglo who wants to help us poor "darky" Third Worlders by praising politicians that you would never tolerate in your own country. Without understanding the culture. Without speaking the language.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

91. Listen, I'm not a huge fan of L.A.

But I wouldn't exactly call it a third world country.

[EFerrari]

94. I think that newbie just called me "whitey" and that PISSES me off.

Pendejo!

:rofl:

[Hope08]

115. I was wrong

I have now listened to the quote on the El Pais website, in Spanish, rather than reading it in English, and I agree with you that it is being exaggerated. "El negro" can be a very insulting term in the proper context, but it isn't here. I still dislike the guy for other reasons, but he was not calling Obama a n*gger, and fair is fair.

Separately, I am deeply annoyed by folks that don't speak our language or know the culture intimately, and yet insist on giving us lessons in our own history and in what is good for us. Limousine leftists that tell us we should be happy when a revolutionary government shuts down the newspapers and takes over the radio stations, because what matters is an abstract "social justice" that they would under no circumstances accept to see applied in their own countries. I put you in that category in my prior post, it appears that I was wrong, and I apologize for doing that.

From your use of "pendejo," I gather you are quisqueyana. Saludos de parte de un cubano.

[EFerrari]

122. It's all good. My family is from El Salvador but raised in Mexico

and established here in the immigrant community so my slang is a salad.

The press here loves to create problems with liberal liders in Latin America. They'll do it again in about a minute. Watch. :)

[Hope08]

116. You'd be surprised

[EFerrari]

93. Lastima that you couldn't be even more wrong.

lol

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

81. El hombre ha dicho una y otra vez

que su abuela era negra igual que la mía. Así que si tu quires decir que el inventó eso, allá tu. "Y tu abuela donde está". te acuerdas de esa? El hombre es tan mulato como mi padre o yo y lo he escuchado decirlo 20,000 mil veces. Porque tu no lo veas en su apariencia no significa absolutamente nada. No defiendo la manera tonta en que lo fraseó pero si Chávez es racista you soy fuckin' John McCain.

[EFerrari]

84. Guy Whitey Corngood McToast!

lol

:rofl:

[Hope08]

101. Cuidado que no te echen

por escribir en español, que ya me lo advertio mi supuesto "hermanito" (será mi hermano bobo, no se).

En todo caso, si tienes razón que se le fue la lengua sin querer, pues ya veremos en los meses que vienen. Con Obama de Presidente, si Dios quiere, Chavez tendrá bastantes oportunidades para referirse a el de una manera mas apropiada.

Sin lugar a dudas, en Cuba llamar a un presidente "el negro" (vaya, que ese "el" es bastante importante) no es ningún elogio. No se trata de un racismo estilo yanqui, sino de ir persuandiendo al pueblo que cuando llegue el enfrentamiento inevitable, a ese señor no se le debe confiar **por naturaleza**.

La razón por la cual tengo mis dudas que su fraseología haya sido inadvertente es que ya hemos escuchado a Chavez llamar a los que no están de acuerdo con el "apátridas," "lamabotas," "pichi-yanquis," etc. -- todas palabras diseñadas para convertir al Otro en un sub-humano. El hecho de que la derecha venezolana sea doblemente racista, no quita que en Venezuela -- igual que en Cuba, P.R., R.D. -- hay una fuerte corriente de racismo generalizado que puede tener un valor político indudable.

A mi juicio, a Chavez le puede costar bastante caro un presidente de izquierda, negro, que lo lleve "rajatablas" cuando se ponga a hablar tonterías. ?Como vamos a seguir creyendo que EEUU es el país mas racista, imperialista, etc. del mundo cuando ha elegido semejante presidente? Es el mismo problema que tienen las clases imperantes en Cuba -- blancos casi sin excepción -- que tendrán que explicarle a su pueblo porque en un país con una población 70% negra, no hay ni siquiera un líder de consecuencia que sea negro. Pero reitero, el tiempo dirá.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

105. La persona a la que te refieres es una chamaca y es latinoamericana también.

Ella no quizo decir que te van a botar, pero se refería que nosotros aquí le hablamos en inglés a los que no hablan español. Pero eso son otros 20 pesos.
Chávez ha dicho cosas muy positivas en el pasado de Obama y no ha dicho nada en los últimos meses especialmente durante la primaria. Porque el mismo admitió que si decía algo bueno de los candidatos demócrats los republipuercos lo usarían en su contra. El hombre será bocón pero de racista no le veo ni un pelo. Al contrario el le tiraría a un blanquito antes de decir algo de un negro de manera despectiva. La constitución Venezolana que se propuso en su primer término específicamente reconoce a los decendientes de Africanos e Indígenas. Lo caul no se hubiera visto nunca en un gobierno Venezolano. Esta cita del artículo en El Universal para mi lo pone en contexto:

"Horas antes, durante el mismo acto dijo que "desde ahora le envío señales al hombre negro, desde aquí nosotros que somos raza india, negra, caribeña, suramericana, ojalá se ponga a la altura de lo que está ocurriendo en el mundo y de la esperanza que el mundo tiene", dijo."

Yo no llamaría a Obama un presidente (esperemos) de izquierda. El ha sido bastante claro que es centrista. Esos insultos que el lanza a la oposición son mas bién por "vende patrias" pero no tienen que ver con raza.

El hombre también ha dicho cosas muy positivas de Clinton el cual trató a Chávez con respeto.

Yo lo único que espero es que si Obama gana que sea humilde en su trato con latinoamérica y que se pueda llegar a un acuerdo mutuo sin estar empujando supestos tratados de comercia libre que lo que han hecho es joder la cosa.

[EFerrari]

107. Exactamente. Chavez has been very circumspect and quiet

during this whole contest. Not an accident. He knows how our press and the Republicans would use anything he says.

And remember, he went out of his way to call McCain and Bush "comrade" during the bailout / socialization of the banks. Leon que casa echado -- like a lion who hunts while reclining.

Don't allow the right wing media to create these problems. They are foam, nothing, bubbles. There's nothing there except the hope to keep a rift open between the United States and democratic Latin American governments to the detriment of our people here and their people there.

[Hope08]

111. Acepto tu interpretación

Me encantaría ver a un presidente que trate a nuestra América con el respeto que se merece. En cuanto Chavez, ya habrás adivinado que no defiendo el antiguo sistema venezolana. Mas bien pienso que era un sistema indefendible. Sin embargo, tampoco puedo juntar hombros con un señor que parece dividir el mundo entre los que están de acuerdo con el, quienes son verdaderos ciudadanos, y los que no, quienes vienen siendo vende-patrias. O sea, que "dentro de la revolución todo, fuera de la revolución nada."

Aceptaré tu opinión que Chavez no es racista, ya que lo que escribes tiene sentido y veo que actuas con toda buena fe. Quizás me encabrone mas bien por las mil y un veces que he escuchado palabras abiertamente racistas ("negros ni en los frijoles," "total, un negro menos," "sino fuera por tanto negro, aquí se pudiera vivir," etc.) salir de la boca de uno que otro supuesto "revolucionario." En fin, el tema de Cuba a nosotros nos persigue asiduamente.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

114. Creeme que desde que a mi madre le dijeron sus familiares que no se casara

con "ese negro" (mi padre) en Barrio Obrero San Juan hasta el día de hoy en Chicago que las madres de mis panas hablen de "esos negros" me he estado teniendo que tragar esta mierda. El primero en cantar racismo cuando lo oye en mi corillo soy yo. En este caso no lo veo. También estudié en una escuela de "blanquitos riquitos" siendo yo un pelao'.

Al rico en latinoamérica le falta mucho por crecer y madurar. Yo no apoyaré todo lo que sale de la boca de Chávez pero admiro que vino del fondo. La alternativa para los venezolanos lamentablemente es mas de lo mismo. Esos cabrones han tenodi mas de 80 años para ayudar a sus compatriotas y se han comido la mierda. Algo que las victorias de Chávez han despertado es un es la esperanza entre los pobres de participar en su democracia y mejorar su condición.

[Hope08]

121. Ya escuche la grabacion en El Pais

en español y tienes razón, el tipo lo que estaba haciendo mas bien era acercándose a Obama.

Las revoluciones son bien complicadas. Fíjate, mi familia era de clase media antes del triunfo de la revolución (mi abuelo era panadero). Un tío peleó con la columna del Che, otro (mucho mas tarde) en Angola, y yo me crié en EEUU entre marxistas académicos. Hoy en día, mis familiares en Cuba viven, se puede decir sin exageración, prácticamente como animales. Sino fuera por el dinero y la comida que les mando todos los meses, se murieran de hambre. Yo he visto cosas en La Habana que realmente te asustarían. Lo que ya sabe todo el mundo -- falta de medicamentos en los hospitales (médicos muy buenos pero uno tiene que traer sus propias sabanas), el sistema de apartheid bajo el cual ningún cubano puede quedarse en un hotel turístico aunque tenga el dinero (esto recientemente cambio). Tampoco un cubano puede alquilar un carro o un celular, pero un turista sí. Me ha parado la policía para registrar el carro (ellos se cagan en el "probable cause") a ver si llevo contrabando (llevábamos langosta, que implica una condena de varios anos, pero por suerte no encontraron nada). Una pila de mierdas tan grande que me canso de escribirlas.

He oído mis propios tíos -- que pelearon por esa revolución hasta en África -- decir que no quieren negros en su casa. Y esto la revolución lo acepta como cosa normal. Incluso tengo la impresión de que el gobierno revolucionario fomenta este tipo de actitud, ya que pueden mantener a la población blanca pensando que, "apres moi le deluge." Hay hasta generales de brigada de la fuerzas armadas revolucionarias que hablan así.

Sin embargo, en este país -- que tanto criticaban mis padres -- he podido estudiar en una de esas escuelas que tu mencionas (quizás habrá sido la misma) a pesar de estar "comiéndome un cable en marcha atrás." Me ha ido muy bien. Mis primos en La Habana le dan gracias a Dios si les llega un bistec por delivery (bistec que compre yo a un precio exorbitante, en una pagina de internet del gobierno cubano, a pesar de que en Cuba la carne de res no entra por la libreta).

Por eso digo, las revoluciones a veces son necesarias. No dudo que en Venezuela haya sido así. No debe existir niño que se acueste sin comer, ni que vaya a la escuela sin zapatos, ni que se enferme sin tener acceso a un medico. Temo, sin embargo, que es mas fácil destruir que construir. Llegan a haber zapatos y escuela, pero ya no hay trabajo que de un sueldo digno, con tal que la escuela se convierte irrelevante. Hay médicos, pero los hospitales están decrépitos y falta la medicina. El niño come pero no todos los días, y a veces solo arroz con frijoles. ?Me hago entender?

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

126. Esas son las contradicciones con que vivimos.

Cuba a tenido sus logros y sus problemas lo mismo que venzuela. Pero es claro que el modelo impuesto por Washington no ha funcionado en latinoamérica punto, ya sea por demócratas o republicanos. Quizas la respuesta no esté en los modelos cubanos o venezolanos pero la autodetrminación y el cese de la agresión directa o indirecta de este país (hacia sus vecinos) tiene que parar. A la misma vez que en Cuba hay grandes problemas no los veo cambiando lugares con un Haitiano o hasta un mismo Nicaraguense. Algo tiene que cambiar. Yo veo en Sur América por primera vez en mi vida un espíritu de solidaridad que no he visto antes. Eso quizas tiene que ver mas con la gente y el surgir del internet que los mismos gobiernos pero yo no veo marcha atras.

Este país en que nosotros vivimos tiene dinero para gastar en tanques aviones y armas nucleares que cuestan cientos de millones pero aparentemente no hay dinero para un sistema de salud que valga un carajo a menos que seas rico o afortunado para que tu trabajo te lo cubra. La educación pública espcíficamente en los barrios pobres en Chicago y Columbus donde he vivido es casi a nivel del llamado tercer mundo. Aparentemente tampoco hay dinero para finaciar un sistema electoral que valga un carajo y las últimas 2 elecciones deberían abochornar hasta al patriota mas orgulloso.

En el caso de Cuba yo no acabo de entender que propósito sirve este estúpido embargo. No veo que halla resuelto en mas de 40 años. La hipocresía mas grande de nuestros líderes es que la ensñanza parece ser que los comunistas Chinos y los déspotas Saudies son buenos pero los cmunistas Cubanos son malos. Si yo entiendo la crítica que el gobierno Cubano supestamente se beneficia del embargo pero entonces. Por que no quitarle ese instrumento o excuasa al gobierno si ese es el caso?

En cuato a Venzuela si hay mucha corrupción todavía y múltiples otros problemas. Pero no se puede negar que un ciudadano analfabeto está casi al nivel de un esclavo. Es una forma de marginar a lagente y hacerlos sentir inservibles. En este momento hay personas en Venezuela que por primera vez están aprendiendo a leer ya tengan 5 0 80 años. Otro aspecto de la ecnomía venezolana es el paro masivo y el sabotaje de PDVSA que pesar de qu ocurrió hace unos años los billones que se perdieron descabronaron a la enomía y no está fácil salir de eso. Además como reaccionaría el gobierno estadunidense si un gobierno extranjero le diera millones a la oposición política y un grupo de golpistas tuvirean runiones en la embajada de dicho gobierno.

Si algo me dice a mi que la cosa no es blanco y negro sino gris es el echo de que una de las mejores amigas de mi hermano es Sobrina de Huber Matos. No tengo que decirta la puercada que el gobierno cubano le hizo a ese hombre. Sin embargo esta muchacha es sumamente izquierdista y no quiere saber nada de sus compatriotas en Miami (ella vive en Jersey). Las coas no son como las pinta Raul Castro necesariamente pero tampoco son como las pintas Alvaro Uribe.

[EFerrari]

108. You, while othering me, project the same intention to Chavez?

I won't be needing a dessert tonight.

lol

[EFerrari]

76. Yes, Chavez has "black" blood and yes, it will be increasingly clear.

That's right!

[EFerrari]

60. It's not an accident that Santana wrote "Black Magic Woman".

It sure gets a little WHITE around here sometimes.

lol

[Meshuga]

71. In Brazil, for instance

Calling someone "preto" (Portuguese for black) is demeaning because people of African heritage don't have black skin. The polite usage is the word "negro" which is formal word like a white person is a caucasian. I assume that in spanish might be similar so I don't see a problem when Chavez uses it.

My wife got in trouble when she first moved to the US because instead of using the work "black" to refer to an African American she thought it would be more polite to use the word "negro" (not knowing the baggage that the word "negro" had in the US). She was attacked for it by the whites around her but a black person understood where she was coming from and came to her rescue. :-)

Bottom line, the word "negro" is a "bad" word in the US because racists from America made it so, while "black" is not a kind word elsewhere (and not a big deal around these parts).

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

123. That's about correct. -nt

[PretzelWarrior]

120. BULLLSHIT! Oh by the way. Politicians/Diplomats know

you refer to someone in accordance with THEIR culture--not yours. That dog don't hunt.

Chavez did it on purpose, and we could make sure there is a bunker buster with his name on it.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

74. Article in Spanish from "El Universal". n/t

http://lta.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idLTASIE4A10J020081102

[camera obscura]

75. Chavez is one side of the coin, Bush is the other

I have no respect for this brutal, free-speech squashing, dictatorial POS.

[EFerrari]

78. You must be talking about some other Chavez

because his government has no record of any of that. Obscura is right.

[fadedrose]

83. Peter Werbe, talk show host

Peter Werbe has a radio program on in Detroit every Sunday night at 11 pm. He also guests on Air America Radio and also for Mike Malloy.

Werbe has been to Venezuela several times and speaks of Chavez with respect. Chavez uses his country's oil to build roads, schools, hospitals, etc., for his people.

Our oil people don't like him because they can't get their fingers into his oil.

Werbe says that although Chavez is very popular, there are many in V. that do not like him. He may have some stuff about him on his website. It wouldn't hurt us if our new President talked to Chavez..

[EFerrari]

86. Mr. Chavez can sound bombastic to us but he isn't talking to us, is he?

He's talking to another people in another culture.

The Bushies and their lapdog media love to create these hassles. If they can poison the well for Venezuela with the new administration, they'd LOVE that, wouldn't they?

:hi:

[camera obscura]

88. Amnesty International disagrees

http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/venezuela
http://hrw.org/doc/?t=americas&c=venezu

[EFerrari]

92. No, actually it doesn't with the exception of the RCTV flap

that has been rebutted not only by FAIR but by leading intellectuals all over the world.

And please don't drag in that Pinochet apologist fronted by so called Human Rights Watch.

[StreetKnowledge]

85. Chavez, get lost

Seriously, this is just GOP ammo right here, you fool.

[EFerrari]

89. The GOP is consulting with Chavez now?

Damn, now they must know Obama is BLACK!

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

95. The guy is definitely whacked, but we still should engage with these people at some level. . .

Pissing them off just do to piss them off is not the way to go.

[brindis_desala]

96. Yes, let's get all lathered over what "anti-US Hugo Chavez"

has to say. No doubt the report is completely objective. Gosh, we Americans are such cultural dimwits.

[SoCalDemocrat]

97. He is attempting a compliment

In his country his supporters are predominantly dark skinned, while his proponents are light skinned. This divide cuts across their social structures of lower class vs. upper-middle and upper class.

It sounds strange but I'm pretty sure he is trying to pay him a compliment.

[EFerrari]

98. Thank you, sane person. n/t

[donco6]

102. That's how I read it, too. n/t

[RollWithIt]

113. So talking like an ignorant racist is ok, as long as you're just talking to "Dark Skinned People"

BUT, the reality is that he's trying to explain to his supporters in Venezuela why he might talk to an American President. I understand that. Still, the language is not dignified.

[Selatius]

104. I honestly don't think Chavez is so insanely stupid that he would burn bridges with Obama.

Given the context of his words, heavily edited by Reuters as it is, it is apparent that Chavez was trying in his way to compliment him in front of his own supporters, many of whom typically come from the urban poor and the rural destitute. For the longest time, the president of Venezuela was always white, and the wealthiest people in Venezuela were and continue to be predominantly white.

If anything, I think the editor of the article, Bill Trott, could be throwing bombs. Everything else quoted from Chavez doesn't appear to be slamming or criticizing Obama.

[EFerrari]

106. Most Latin American leaders have crossed everything for Obama except

Bush's lapdog in Colombia who may need to find a new career. Maybe the oligarchy in Mexico and in Peru are also not happy. My uncle and his rich white buddies in El Salvador are probably crying into their beer, too.

Not Chavez or any of the left leaning governments.

[Tatiana]

109. This is a poor translation, methinks. I am called "negra" by my family.

It is a term of endearment.

[fishwax]

112. it's always funny to see people who wouldn't normally trust the media

jump eagerly and unquestioningly for whatever negative spin they toss at Chavez

[EFerrari]

125. I wish I could lay bets. And this thread will get another 25 posts

as if nothing has been clarified after the OP -- calling out "Hugo, the third world dipshit" for disrespect!

lol

[PretzelWarrior]

117. HUGO. SHUT THE FUCK UP!

I hope Obama team puts him in his place FAST!!

[Danger Mouse]

118. Chavez is kind of a dick.

:rofl:

[QueenOfCalifornia]

124. WTF?

Hugo needs to learn the new presidents name and soon.

What a maroon.