A plea for Obama...

[Dangerman]

When Bush leaves office, prosecute him for the various war crimes he committed against the country and humanity.

Please, Obama. I beg you. Don't sucker up to Bush like you did in your visit to the White House. Give us Americans true justice and arrest Bush for those crimes!

Then, we will all believe you are the man who promised change, and enforce it.

[democrattotheend]

1. Bad idea

And who is "we all"? If Obama uses his political capital when he gets in to try to prosecute the Bush administration instead of solving current problems, I think about 15% of Americans on the far left would believe he is "the man who promised change" and the rest of us would be sorely disappointed that he is looking back instead of looking forward as he promised.

[JuniperLea]

2. I couldn't disagree more

It's time to follow the rules, pay the piper, prosecute the criminals. Only then can the US and the world heal. THAT is change. If we don't seek justice, how long before another rat bastard like Bush and his cronies set up shop and rob us blind again?

And what is this "instead" deal? I'm sure the Obama administration can walk and chew gum at the same time. Everything else doesn't have to come to a screeching halt to do this, far from it.

[still_one]

5. It is a distraction, and he won't do it. The time to do it was the last 8 years

Congress refused to, partially because they were also responsible

[JuniperLea]

7. I bet he'd bend to the will of the people on this

It doesn't need to be a distraction. All we need is a state supreme court to issue an indictment. People like Vince Bugliosi have already done the legal leg work, and Bugliosi has offered to take the case pro bono. And he hasn't lost a case yet. I doubt he'd take on a case he couldn't close at this stage in his career. He sounds very, very confident to me!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/vincent-bugliosi/the-prosecution-of-george_b_102427.html

Obama doesn't really need to lift a finger.

[still_one]

8. You really believe that is the will of the people? Have there been any polls out on this? /nt

[DevonRex]

18. That is exactly right. Congress failed. They had the opportunity

for the last 2 years and did nothing.

Another thing: One of the worst things Bush did was to politicize the Justice Department. That is something we have to clean up now. We certainly can't look like we're doing the same thing.

Sure, I'd like them all to go to jail for what they did. But I don't think it will happen.

[Two Americas]

22. they are the problem

We cannot solve current problems so long as the cause of the problems is still there.

There may only be "15% of Americans" speaking about this, not I am convinced that we speak for 70% of the population. The people, outside of upscale liberal circles, voted for "another New Deal" and an end to corruption, according to thousands I heard from everywhere I went in poor neighborhoods and rural formerly red districts. They didn't vote for some sort of silly "healing" and "for the good of the country" nonsense. The working people know that this means "restore the crooks" and "for the good of the wealthy and powerful few."

The fight for justice is how we are looking forward - we are making sure that they don't come back in the future to destroy things again. Ignoring crimes is going backward. Glossing over them may give the appearance of moving forward, but that is an illusion.

[kimmerspixelated]

3. It's all such a frucking mess!

What to do??!!! We're all going to be homeless and starving soon if big swift emergency motions are not made SOON, so does justice just have to take a number???!!

[still_one]

4. He won't, and he shouldn't. We have too many problems. You want to prosecute

bush, then prosecute Congress and a bunch of other president's also, including Johnson

[JuniperLea]

9. Again... Obama needs to do nothing

Even if he did, he can walk and chew gum at the same time.

What's your real deal? Why do you risk looking like a Bush apologist? Since when is it ever a good idea to let criminals off the hook?

[Danger Mouse]

6. Yeah, we'll just put the economy and the war and our crumbling infrastructure on hold...

to exact a vendetta against Bush.
Fantastic idea. :eyes:

[JuniperLea]

10. Such bullshit!

You mean the world has to come to a crashing halt every time a criminal is prosecuted? Bullshit. This wouldn't take up a bit of Obama's time. We have courts, judges and prosecutors for such things.

What makes you think this would take up any of the new administration's time?

[Danger Mouse]

11. Okay. Then why is it a 'plea for Obama' what exactly does he need to do?

[JuniperLea]

14. I didn't write the OP, and I wasn't responding to the OP

I was responding to what you wrote. Obama doesn't need to do anything except NOT pardon Bush or any of his cronies.

[CADEMOCRAT7]

12. Thank you for your post, I have wanted a discussion on this.

I was ready to start calling and writing, especially Barbara Boxer, and doing what I could to push for holding Bush, Cheney and Rumsfield accountable. I felt that for our standing to be regained in the world, and to stand on the principal "we do not agree with war criminals", we had to hold them accountable.
For all the teenagers around the world who knew America as "torturers" since they were young when 9/11 occurred, and did not know the love affair the world once had with America, we had to hold them accountable. For moral and ethical reasons, we had to hold them accountable. To state that we believe in the Geneva Treaties, we had to hold them accountable.
I want President Obama to close Guantanamo first thing. This will send a clear message about torture. We are faced with the worst financial crisis since the depression and two wars.
How now, can we prosecute for war crimes, which I feel so strongly about...it is a struggle.
I believe in being in alignment with the Geneva Treaties. Could they be tried at the Hague ?
I do not want the country to be side tracked, there is so that is dire to do.
Are the dark ages behind us, and the world knows that we as Americans stood up to the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfield administration by electing by a mandate President-Elect Obama ?
I understand your sentiment, and I struggle with what is best for our country right now ?
There is so much optimism and the US has, in one night, regained accountable by electing Obama. Do we want to look at the past, or move toward the future? I struggle with this because I believe in the importance of accountabilty...And, then, I think of His Holiness the Dalai Lama...truly, in the big picture, what is best for all ?

[CADEMOCRAT7]

13. One more question, if nothing is done, how do we hold other leaders around the world accountable?

If nothing is done, we have basically said "The Geneva Treaties" are not valid, or... we in the US are above the law and hypocritically everyone else has to follow them. This is my struggle.

[DevonRex]

15. The president doesn't arrest and prosecute. And if there were

even the hint of politicization of the Justice Department, democrats would pay dearly. Dems in Congress had the opportunity over the past 2 years to investigate and impeach, yet they DID NOT.

Also, I don't know whose speeches you were listening to, but Obama never promised to arrest and prosecute Bush et al. So don't act like he isn't the change WE can believe in simply because he doesn't pass some litmus test YOU have imposed.

I would certainly like justice to be done. Realistically I doubt it will ever happen.

[GarbagemanLB]

16. Everyone on this board needs to get one thing through their skulls.

Nothing will happen to Bush or Cheney. Bush will retire in comfort to Texas, and Cheney will go back into his hibernating chamber.

[ailsagirl]

17. Cheney doesn't look good-- he's lost a lot of weight

[cwydro]

19. He didn't "sucker up" to Bush.

He was polite, professional, and presidential.

What did you want him to do?

[pat_k]

21. Stop appeasing. Call on the House to immediately impeach. . .

. . .for torturing under the color of law. For violations so grave violators to subject to the penalty of death.

Violations committed in plain sight.

Violation that Bush and Cheney don't even bother to deny.

[pat_k]

20. He must call for immediate impeachment, if he is to be. . .

. . .the champion of the People's Government he claims he is. There is no middle ground. Each of us must choose to advocate impeachment or oppose it.

As long as Obama remains an opponent, he is a defender of torture. He will continue his policy of appeasement and denial of reality. No amount of hope-mongering can change that.

There is no substitute for impeachment. Certainly, justice demands prosecution and punishment, but prosecution cannot rescue the Constitution. Only impeachment can do that. Only impeachment is a collective declaration that we are Citizens; Not Subjects.

Nothing is impossible, but if they fail to impeach, prosecution is effectively "off the table." bush and cheney can simply point to Congress and say "If the Democratic Congress believed these acts were crimes, they would have a duty to impeach. They didn't. They didn't even attempt to. We have committed no crime. The Democrats in Congress agree. http://talkingimpeachment.com/blog/Hall-of-Shame-Inductee----Barak-Obama.htmlPresident Obama agrees>."

If bush and cheney aren't impeached, the resistance to prosecution will be massive -- perhaps insurmountable. The resistance we are up against on impeachment pales in comparison.

Congress is Our Voice. Whatever they may believe their chances of success, each member has a personal, moral obligation to join the fight for impeachment. Every single day that War Criminals hold the massive power of the American presidency in their hands, we too have a moral obligation as citizens to call on them, and each other, to act.

Make the assertion "we do not torture" REAL. Confront the Congressional leadership; confront Obama; confront your district's representative -- current and elect. Call on them to finally set aside their irrational fears and join the fight for impeachment. Call on your fellow citizens to do the same.