If you still support the bailouts....

[busymom]

Visit this website:

http://www.bailoutsleuth.com/

Every blog is full of valuable information, but check out the CEO compensation scales.....

Then....get back to me...

[scheming daemons]

1. There's a difference between supporting the concept and supporting the implementation

The bailout as originally written was a good move.

The problem is.... Bush and Paulson are not abiding by what was in the bailout.... they're changing the rules as they go.

[uponit7771]

2. +1

[redqueen]

3. I'm sick of being trashed for supporting it.

Good luck using reason when the torches and pitchforks are out.

Throwing the baby out with the bathwater is all the rage these days in groupthinkland.

[busymom]

5. Yes, there were no other solutions but to give

the Bush Administration power over 700 Billion plus right before crawling out of office....

Were you hoping to raise MY taxes, btw, to help fund it....or will you be pulling out your checkbook too?

[redqueen]

7. Are you implying I don't pay taxes?

Nice tactic.

And nice talkin to ya.

[busymom]

13. Nope...not at all.

I'm just wondering though...I wonder if this bailout package would be so acceptable if in order to pay for it, Obama got up and said "we have to raise taxes on everyone....Each of you will have to pay .5% of your income annually as a prop-up-Wall Street Tax, and it will not be refundable in April."

For someone making ....say....40,000/year, this would mean a donation to the govt of about $200. Would that work?

Our schools didn't pass their Levy votes this year and we have to have 2 elementary schools close. For most homeowners, the cost would have been between $100-150/year...but funding the schools was voted down. One of my neighbors said "why should I pay for it....Let people who earn $250k/year pay for it." Seriously...I VOTED for it...I am willing to pay another $150/year. I am disappointed to see that most people want something that they might not be willing to fund.

For the record, I would be willing to pay .5% of my income...

[redqueen]

15. Yes that would work fine for me.

However, again, the problem is not that the bailout was done but wasn't necessary, the problem is that it was necessary but poorly implemented. The UK mandated that the banks led the money. Our idiotic / complicit congress did not.

[busymom]

17. We didn't expect any more from them really....did we?

I have not faith left in our government.

[redqueen]

18. I did, actually.

We had the model to work from. We knew that strict regulations about how the money should be used would be a big part of the success or failure of this bailout. Sadly, "centrists" in Congress have too much influence.

Congress will change a little next year. We have a two-year window in which to push through as much responsible legislation as we can. I'm still optimistic.

[busymom]

19. One of the main reasons

that I couldn't get behind the bailouts is that I had a sense about this based on how everything else has gone over the last 8 years...and based on the fact that we have had control for a couple of years now and haven't managed to accomplish month. It is just no surprise to me that the regulation end of it failed.

Capitalism on the way up, socialism on the way down.....

How much do you want to bet that when it comes time to talk about Universal Health coverage, etc...that will not be possible because of the Wall Street bailout.....We'll never have the money for the backbone of this society...just the Fat Cats who get to run it.

[redqueen]

22. It's less than surprising yes...

but the fact that we've allowed our party to become nearly as enamored of freemarketism (or whatever made them think we shouldn't strictly regulate that money) as the GOP is, that IMO did not affect the necessity of the bailout.

It's time to talk about Universal Health Coverage *now*. We need to pass HR 676. We need to start pushing for it -- educating people, pushing our representatives & senators, etc. -- NOW. We have two years. After that we may well lose control of Congress.

[busymom]

23. How can we push for anything?

How the heck can we pay for it now? A dollar can only be spent once (well, unless you're AIG)....

[redqueen]

24. How are we paying for the unnecessary occupation?

Who says the bill will take effect within the next two years?

There is time for things to change as we get it pushed through. Focus on the long-term goal. We know it won't be easy, but we also know it has to be done.

[Occam Bandage]

8. No. We are only raising your taxes. You in particular.

[thenam]

11. Bailout working people first?

Why the ruling class always gets their way is because we let them get away with it. It is even worse when we advocate on its behalf.

[redqueen]

12. Welcome to DU.

The "ruling class" gets their way because Congress as it is now would rather support them than do the right thing.

They do that because we allow them. That doesn't mean this bailout wasn't necessary, it only means it was poorly implemented.

[busymom]

14. I totally agree!

Why not take that 700 Billion and put it towards universal health care and job retraining programs for the people whose jobs will be affected!

[redqueen]

16. Do you really think *this* congress is going to pass UHC?

Really?

[busymom]

25. nope

[TheKentuckian]

27. Because people can't keep food on the table, keep their homes, or buy goods

with healthcare and retraining for nonexistent jobs.

There is nothing for people to do. Even if we magically could get people into every open slot in engineering and the medical field we'd still have millions of screwed people.
This is not even accounting for the millions more that have stagnated and are falling further behind daily.

I might be wrong but I think the most of the people playing hardasses have avoided being hit and have done at least ok in the last eight years.
Those of us that have been through a shut down or two (or three or four) and have taken some blows to the gut are a little more sensitive to further destroying the job market.

What do some of you all want, a two mile line when McDonald's has an opening? Young people with degrees fighting old people for greeter positions at Wal-Mart?

[busymom]

30. You don't have a lot of faith in Americans.....

My brother's computer industry job disappeared and he was forced to adjust...He retrained and is now working successfully on his own. It was hard for him...he was devastated. Now he says it is the best thing that ever happened to him.

There will be ripples and growing pains, but what is to stop educated americans from starting new Automobile companies, or retraining in different fields.

New industries will emerge, new products will be created, new technology will be learned...

[busymom]

4. I don't know that I agree with that.

These banks took risks, made bets and paid their execs salaries like 70 Million dollars/year. Bye Bye.

[frylock]

29. and who in their right mind could've ever believed that bush would fuck it up..

imagine that. i mean, you'd have to be a fucking goddamned idiot to have believed anything other than that bush and paulson would pull this thing off. i had all the faith in the world. you can imagine my disappointment. :eyes:

[dbonds]

6. There is bailoutrage for how the companies are abusing it, but something has to be done.

I do wish the fatcats would loose their job over all this. I hate to see them profit in any way with the bailout. But the economy is tanking and will get much worse before it gets better, we have to do what we can.

[busymom]

9. My concern is that the bailout will be a bandaid...

The fatcats will keep their jobs, keep doing what they're doing and we all will be paying for it...there will be no universal health care, no increased educational grants or money put towards public transport. It will be flushed down the wall street toilet.

[redqueen]

10. Thank you. (nt)

[Eyerish]

20. I think the problem is that

the people on the board who supported the bailout actually though that the plan would be implemented properly and that they would maybe do the right thing. They thought they'd actually see transparency and that Congress would exert some oversight as to where the money was going. 8 years of knowing what the * administration is capable of should of told us they'd take the money and run. Yes something needed to be done, but just not this...

[busymom]

21. yep.

[JuniorPlankton]

26. Exactly! n/t

[Zombie2]

28. Rich CEO's

Why couldn't they dip into their own pockets/profits to save their companies? Of course, they would no longer be AS RICH but that's what they get for committing fraud.