If this is the way we celebrate Obama's victory

[mtnsnake]

...with whinery, bellyaching, & divisive innuendo, then one can only wonder what the reaction would have been, had we lost instead of won. We won for crying out loud.

All these threads and posts about Obama's consideration of Hillary for SOS are just excuses to divide and disrupt because the easiest way for anyone to drive a wedge is to make it about one or both of the Clintons, even when there's no real reason to complain about either one of them right now. It's not Obama's fault that he's considering Hillary for SOS, nor is it Bill's or Hillary's fault.

Sure, some people have legitimate concerns and express them reasonably, but it's clearly obvious that some people are only here to rain on everyone's parade, and considering the monumental significance of this election that we just won, you ought to be ashamed.

For gods sake, can't you just celebrate a little while and look forward to Obama doing what's best for all of us, or at least give the man a few months to see how well he produces? Jayeeesus!

[Sannum]

1. It is irritating to see this.

I am all for legitimate criticism, but at this point, people are ranting and raving like lunatics.

Are people so used to complaining that they can't see a good thing when they have it?

[GarbagemanLB]

2. The Clinton hate is pretty pathetic. I got over it after the primaries finished, and it seems some

here just haven't matured enough yet.

[DevonRex]

4. As soon as I saw her campaigning her heart out I got over it, too.

Bottom line is that if Obama wants Hillary as SoS then he thinks she would be good at it. Everybody knows she's a foreign policy wonk and that's a great thing. About time we got some wonks in positions of power after the last 8 years of absolute idiots running every agency and driving policy as GWB rode his little bicycle.

[Marrah_G]

31. I hope the admins step up soon

Threads telling Clinton supporters or even Clinton admirers to get off the board should never be allowed here. The OP of that thread should be banned or suspended. This sort of bullying was the norm during the primary, the primary is over and that sort of thing was supposed to stop. I would like to see someone in power here on DU say enough is enough.

[Lilith Velkor]

52. They won't.

[ShortnFiery]

7. Oh please stop with the tired ole meme "clinton-hate"? That has nothing to do with the FACT

that Obama and Clinton disagreed on foreign policy. The thought of him nominating her as SOS is appalling. She is not "on the same page" as Obama and will NOT follow his guidance. I think if he follows through with this selection - he'll truly regret it later. That's my opinion and it's relevant.

Centrist democrats trying to dismiss every criticism with "haters" is just LAME. This party is not a "glee club" so that tactic will not work. Let go.

[GarbagemanLB]

9. "and will NOT follow his guidance". Um...how the hell do you know that?

Excuse me if I trust Obama's judgement over your own.

[ShortnFiery]

12. HRC's past behavior has proven that she is not "a team player" but works well with small groups

of people. She will do what she wants to do ... her past efforts have strongly suggested the foregoing. She doesn't have it "in her" to play WITH the team.

[GarbagemanLB]

13. Clearly you didn't follow her actions in the general election. She did everything she could

to help Obama, and anyone who is honest with themselves can see that.

[ShortnFiery]

16. No, she did less than she could and part of this effort was to get Obama to pay down

the massive 20 million dollar debt that still hangs over her head from the Primaries.

[GarbagemanLB]

18. Wow....talk about being blinded by Clinton-hatred. Any fair observer could at least admit

she was great in supporting Obama in the general election.

[ShortnFiery]

That's all you have? The "hatred" meme. It's getting old. HRC is not political royalty and

it's about time that *new blood* come into the Legislative and Executive Branches of our beloved party.

[rvablue]

39. You are wrong on both points

it is a fact that she did MORE than any other primary opponent in recent history to get the nominee of her party elected than anyone else.

and her debt isn't gone or even that much reduced is it...soooooooo, she didn't make her record breaking rally appearances stumping for Obama b/c of that because it still exists.

[joeybee12]

29. That's a FACT don't you know...Lord, I wish people here would

understand the difference between what is fact and what is their opinion...some people seem incapable of that. Not you, of course, if you get my drift.

[L0oniX]

27. Indeed ...in fact I expect the Dem party to divide because of the centrist Reagon DLC love'n Dems.

[Lilith Velkor]

51. Like the President-Elect.

oops.

[LaurenG]

3. Heh

Though I agree that too many are too over the top with their "concern," you've got to know what a flame fest this will become so here: :popcorn:

[mtnsnake]

8. That wasn't my intention

but if the mods agree with you, then I hope they lock it before it turns into that, as opposed to locking it after the usual people make it such.

[LaurenG]

11. It's the way of DU anymore

The man hasn't even gotten into office yet.
I hope it stays sane - I'm sure you didn't intend it to be a flamer but you and I know how it goes anymore. :(

[Honeycombe8]

5. I am not seeing "Hillary hate", generally. Looks to me like "Hillary lovers" are overly sensitive.

It seems to me that the Hillary supporters are being overly sensitive to any questioning or criticism. ALL the cabinet appointments are being questioned. This is normal for all administrations. I have NOT seen posts (except maybe one) that seemed to have a hatred built into the discussion.

It doesn't help, though, that there are Hillary supporter posts trying to make her SOS position out to be more than it is, actually calling her the head of state (instead of the President), implying or stating that she will be handling foreign policy (the SOS never decides foreign policy; the administration does).

Being SOS is a big deal. An important deal. It is the highest, most important cabinet position. But it is a cabinet position from which anyone can be fired (ask Colin Powell).

I questioned at the start the numerous Clintonites being hired by the Obama administration. But I merely found it eery because of the sheer number of them. And now Obama has explained this, and I underestand it. The change will come from him. The jobs of the ones he hires will be to implement his plans and policies. And regarding Clinton, my posts have discussed whether it's wise, pointing out the positives and the negatives, but ultimately saying it could work. I mean, it could, couldn't it? I don't have a crystal ball. But it also could not work out. We'll see. I, and others, don't hate Hillary at all. There are positives to her being SOS. I think foreign leaders will automatically listen to her....she's a heavyweight globally. But they also might think that since she was a rival of Obama's, and he has Biden in his ear, that she won't have the straight line to Obama or influence over him that they might want to see in a SOS they're discussing serious matters with. She might be great, though. We'll see.

I'm sure there were discussions among freepers when Rice was picked for SOS, or when Powell, who was known not to be a neocon, was picked. It doesn't mean anyone hates the new SOS.

[mtnsnake]

10. Maybe some Hillary lovers, but most of the ones I see are huge supporters of Obama, too,

including myself.

Awesome post, though, indie_ana_500.

[Silence Dogood]

17. Actually, I believe Obama has great respect for Hillary

and the primary reason for him choosing her for the SOS position.

[mtnsnake]

20. True, although I think the respect is mutual

...at least judging from any body language between the two of them.

[Honeycombe8]

23. I think so, too. nt

[Marrah_G]

32. There is a thread up right now telling us to get off the forums and create our own boards

same as happened in the primary.

keeping the division alive.

[Armstead]

6. We love to savor a Fine Whine.

[Hellataz]

14. The Hilary "Criticism" should be ok, but just keep it all in ONE thread.

I think a lot of other posters including me, who at one post called out others for their "Hilary Hate" are only seeing half the board filled with new thread after new thread of people who don't care for Hilary, or don't agree with her for SOS and just repeating the same sentiment over and over, giving the appearance of of "hilary hate" on the board, simply because there is so much negativity towards her everywhere you look here. If Posters wanted to express their criticism of her, I say fine, it's your right, but I think it would stop a lot of these in board fighting's if all the posters who oppose her in Obama's administration, would just keep that discussion to one or 2 threads and allow the board to fill up with more positive Obama threads.
JMO.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

15. If we'd lost, we'd have united. Opposition unites, power divides.

Everyone on DU agreed that Bush was wrong.

Whether, when and to what extend Obama is right will be much more divisive.

[ShortnFiery]

19. Hello, we're presently bailing out the super rich. The wealthy have won, the middle and lower

class get the scraps. With this continuing bail out and now Obama's backing off at giving tax cuts to the working people because Heaven Forbid he raise taxes on the super wealth puts another nail in our middle-class coffins.

We are not part of the big club.

This isn't Democrat vs Republican but Corporatists vs. Populists.

I'll hold back judgment on Obama until I see what he actually does.

If it makes you feel any better, I fear that both Obama and HRC are DLC "corporatist" democrats.

Again, us liberals get shafted in favor of benefits to those "haves" and "have mores" of both parties. :(

[ProSense]

21. "whinery, bellyaching, & divisive innuendo"

You mean like this OP?

[mtnsnake]

25. Nice try, but thanks for taking some time away from your busy schedule to humor me

Much obliged :)

[ProSense]

38. What does celebrating Obama have to do with criticizing Hillary?

It's possible to celebrate Obama without celebrating Hillary.

[Name removed]

47. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProSense]

50. Assholery! n/t

[stevenleser]

22. One of the dumbest and most self defeating things I have ever seen.

Skinner may as well call us all to a large open field, align us all in a circle, give us automatic weapons and have us start shooting at each other.

I'm only slightly exaggerating.

There isnt something even slightly more important for us to be talking about? Economy? Terrorism? Etc?

[CitizenPatriot]

24. it's pretty normal group activity

and still boring as hell. Are there really people here who believe Obama is so stupid that he needs DUers to warn him about the Clintons? HAHA. Okay, seriously, people. Get a grip. Hey, have you heard? Smoking is bad for you.

Here's what we coulda had in office instead: "now, there with the books there that those americans from the right parts who are lovin this country and were again as I said urging on their leaders to get in there and fix things not to focus, again, and get those books cleaned up not for the gotcha media's consumption but because those small town americans who love this country like you and me and again we are all just carin and also, seein problems there in the books, and fightin god's holy wars and again...the liberals who have ruined this country - this christian country- and again, reeducation isn't a bad thing, not to be looked at like but rather also again, a way of promoting democracy and lovin this great country and also, keepin it proud and patriotic...there, to, who needs books? winky wink! what's this red button? Oh!"

Imagine who they'd have been appointing. Good times.

Environment: Dead. Vets: No help. Main Street: FU. Education: ha ha. Art: What? books: burned. ETC.

[Political_Junkie]

28. beautifully done!

Thanks for the reminder. This should be it's own thread!

[CitizenPatriot]

33. thanks! I'm palin and I can't stop...nt

[Dis Pater]

36. yes, but he still smokes

lol

[CitizenPatriot]

41. I know:-)

psstt....so do I (when drinking and far away from clients).

don't tell anyone.

I'll bet we smoke same brand (holds head high).

[dbmk]

48. Throw in at least 5 also's and you're good.

[Saturday]

26. Some people just like being grouchy. nt

[Marrah_G]

30. I am hoping the Admins decide to put a stop to that sort of behavior.

Criticism is one thing. Trying to bully others off the boards is something completely different.

It was allowed during the primary. It needs to be stopped now.

[Jennicut]

34. I disliked Hillary in the primaries but I got over it pretty quickly with her campaigning for Obama

and Palin's idiocy in comparison. At least Hillary is intelligent.

[LWolf]

35. A few thoughts:

1. Obama's victory is not a "celebration" for everyone. Including all Democrats. It's not a celebration for the left wing of the party, or the nation, for example. The celebration is not in Obama's victory, but in McCain's defeat.

2. I expect Obama to appoint mostly centrist-conservative and dlc democrats. As long as that's where he's going, HRC is as good as any, and better than many.

[Dis Pater]

37. I like this sentence

"It's not Obama's fault that he's considering Hillary for SOS, nor is it Bill's or Hillary's fault.
"

I don't know why, I just do.

[IndianaGreen]

40. Prop 8 dampened by enthusiasm

and Obama has yet to recognize full equality for LGBTs.

[rhett o rick]

42. The types of threads you are talking about would drop out of sight if no one would respond. nm

[sniffa]

43. It's just too much fun to watch certain DUers lose their shit

Some even start OP's about it.

:woohoo:

[Ozma]

44. Great points!

There are a lot of nut cases here who are NOT pleased with Obama, 3 weeks after his election. They wanted extreme left politics, extreme socialist unaccountablility.......

They wanted that Dennis K guy to be someone important? They wanted Ron Paul to be someone important?


They wanted us to give away the nation's wealth to welfare moms? NO!!!!!!!!!!! We would have done better to give it away to Wall Street and Citigroup........billions and billions........with no restrictions !


Oh wait.......Obama hasn't taken office yet.

Dennis K and Ron P would have bankrupted us normal people by giving away the wealth to poor people, George B and the rest are bankrupting us by giving away the store to billionaires. Let's see if the billionaires do better than poor people with those billions.

[PresidentObama]

45. DU whines when we're up, whines when we're down. Whines when we win, whines we lose n/t

[TexasObserver]

46. Like a theatrical production short a stagehand, some of these whiners need to get a fucking grip.

I cannot believe the amount of whining going.

I couldn't be happier.

[Riktor]

49. Celebrate what, pray tell?

What continually befuddles me is why there's a contingent of fawning toadies following the president-elect around as if he were a fucking rock star.

Obama, as promising as he looks and a Democrat though he may be, is still a politician wielding incredible influence and nigh-ultimate authority. People should be holding him to a critical flame, not joining his goddamn fan club, and if I have to choose between the tinfoil hats making outlandish allegations or suffering through another eight years of repressed dissent, I'm putting my lot in with the Reynold's customers.

[iamthebandfanman]

53. if they are whining, what are you doing?

just curious why you dont feel you just did the same thing..

[Occam Bandage]

54. Had we lost, many of us be much happier. DU only really knows how to hate.

[davidpdx]

56. You have a point there, especially the "hate" factor

It's sickening isn't it.

[davidpdx]

55. There are no legitimate concerns about Hillary

If you dare say anything bad about her, you are a "Hillary basher". I've seen this used in a knee jerk fashion over and over again on this forum.

On the other hand, if you don't criticize Obama about everything he does, then you are a "worshiper".

It's funny how that divisive stuff goes.