demo dutch
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:06 PM
Original message |
Pelosi needs to go, the Stim package is becoming an embarrassment because |
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Edited on Tue Feb-03-09 01:59 PM by demo dutch
she let the Dems load it down with stuff that shouldn't be there. She's just not on the same page as Obama. She's going to be a distaster for him. Check out this link http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/02/gop.stimulus.worries/index.htmlEven if you're for some the items they shouldn't be in the economic stim package
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Barack_America
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:07 PM
Response to Original message |
1. You say "sorry" as if you expect that to be an unpopular opinion around here. |
demo dutch
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
2. Ok ...I took it out! I do think she's a distaster for him, don't you agree? |
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Edited on Tue Feb-03-09 01:14 PM by demo dutch
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Barack_America
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
15. I think the consensus around here is she is a disaster, period. nt |
KittyWampus
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
8. So many DU'ers hate Pelosi they will blindly agree with the opening post regardless of its actual |
Edweird
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Tue Feb-03-09 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
48. You say that like it's a BAD thing... |
JuniperLea
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:14 PM
Response to Original message |
3. She's dead weight and needs trimmed from the party |
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She hasn't stood by one thing she promised us. Her oneupmanship photo op with Bush was the last sort of good thing she ever did.
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KittyWampus
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
9. What does that have to do with the opening statement about the Stimulus Bill? |
D-Lee
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Tue Feb-03-09 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
35. We ought to give Pelosi a chance to show what she can do with a Dem majority |
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Edited on Tue Feb-03-09 04:45 PM by D-Lee
I believe the Repubs did all they could to trash Pelosi -- as part of their general campaign pushing the position that Congress was inept (ignoring that law makers can't be be effective when legislation is ignored by the executive and trumped with signing statements or just plain disregarded AND that the Senate Repubs blocked anything being passed by the Senate).
Pile that degrading campaign on top of a little sexism and -- VOILA! -- Pelosi didn't have much of a chance to develop an reputation for effectiveness nor to be fully effective.
I'm in favor of assessing her role with the votes we have following Obama's election and a new Congress.
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tavalon
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Tue Feb-03-09 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #35 |
57. Pelosi destroyed her own rep. She needed no help |
geek tragedy
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:14 PM
Response to Original message |
4. No, it's Obama's fault for accomodating Republicans instead |
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of fighting for good policy. He's triangulating against his own party in a way that Bill Clinton would never have dared to do.
Congressional Republicans vs. Congressional Democrats--whose side is Obama on?
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demo dutch
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
5. The campaign promised to work accross the isle but in the end it will still be "his" package |
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Edited on Tue Feb-03-09 01:16 PM by demo dutch
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geek tragedy
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
6. Then he should act like it and FIGHT for it. |
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This is a fight, and if he didn't want to fight Republicans he should not have run for President.
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KittyWampus
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
7. How exactly is the Stimulus Package 'triangulating'? |
geek tragedy
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
11. He's not saying "The Republicans are full of shit and advancing |
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nonsense arguments." So, their arguments are considered credible.
Because, heaven forbid, that would be telling the truth instead of kissing the party of Bush's ass.
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demo dutch
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
14. I don't think the GOP leak on the pork helps its popularity see link |
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Edited on Tue Feb-03-09 01:30 PM by demo dutch
http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/02/gop.stimulus.worries/index.htmlAfter the passing of TARP and its problems, many Americans just don't get it.
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geek tragedy
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #14 |
23. Do you think that summer jobs programs for students |
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is wasteful pork that has no place in a bill that tries to create jobs?
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Boomerang Diddle
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:21 PM
Response to Original message |
10. I don't understand this hatred of Pelosi |
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The left hates her and the right hates her!
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geek tragedy
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
12. Left hates her because she didn't impeach Bush. |
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It's amazing--she's fighting the good fight for the right issues, but she gets blamed while Obama doesn't even bother debating the Republicans.
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WCGreen
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Tue Feb-03-09 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #12 |
34. It takes 2/3 of the Senate to Convict and the proceedings would |
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have been run by Roberts...
That is why the House didn't start Impeachment hearings...
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laugle
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Tue Feb-03-09 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #34 |
54. I know it is way to late now, but I think she |
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could have impeached Chaney. Besides, he was the real president, Bush was the idiot puppet!
If she does some investigations on the torture at Gitmo, Wiretapping of citizens, and all the rest, I will support her again. Right now I don't!
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dmr
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Tue Feb-03-09 11:20 PM
Response to Reply #34 |
60. That's not the point for many of us. The point is standing for (& documenting) the rules of law |
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For us to sit on our hands was/is wrong. Besides not even trying to honor our Constitution, as leader, she seemed to not even buck old 43 and his buddies in Congress.
Truly, truly frustrating. The Democrats have been given the gift of trust from weary Americans and Pelosi and big name Dems fuck it up during their first major vote, giving truculent Republicans ammo to throw at our new president.
Though, I agree with you that the Senate (and Roberts) would have sunk anything the Democrats put forth on Bush*, I do believe something - anything - should have been officially done on the floors of Congress.
History will not be kind to Pelosi, nor to many other Dem leaders.
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bvar22
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Wed Feb-04-09 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #34 |
65. That may be true, but |
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...that is NOT a good reason for "taking Impeachment OFF the Table" before the 2007 Congress even began.
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Still Sensible
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Tue Feb-03-09 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #12 |
50. You are right, the left hates her |
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over impeachment. I don't like her because I believe she is incompetent.
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AlinPA
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Tue Feb-03-09 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #50 |
56. I don't like how she almost worshipped Bush** - lots of pictures of her and Bush**. |
Sonicmedusa
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
16. The right think she is a flamming liberal |
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because she has a "D" after her name.
The rest of us know she is not.
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mmonk
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Tue Feb-03-09 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
33. I understand it given I don't like her, but not on or concerning this issue. |
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Edited on Tue Feb-03-09 02:01 PM by mmonk
The stimulus is going to be attacked no matter what by the republicans to keep their cult alive.
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uponit7771
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Tue Feb-03-09 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #33 |
42. The house dems didn't have to make it EASY for them to attack though. Some of the shit they threw in |
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...there was stupid and low hanging fruit for reThugs to pick at either way it slows things down.
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mmonk
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Tue Feb-03-09 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #42 |
46. Maybe some of it was designed so that they can take |
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something off and the important spending stimulus can get through.
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elocs
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:24 PM
Response to Original message |
13. In case you are not familiar with how the Speaker is chosen, Pelosi cannot simply be made to "go". |
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She was just reelected as Speaker and she will not be going anywhere just because she is not liked here so we may as well accept that fact.
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demo dutch
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #13 |
17. I know that, but I believe she's going to cause him lots of problems |
elocs
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #17 |
20. What's causing Obama problems now is nominating people who have tax problems. |
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Either this is poor vetting or these people somehow believe their avoiding paying taxes will not be exposed. The next time this happens it is going to have to be on Obama for making the choice.
As for Pelosi, she is here and she is not going anywhere. Take it to the bank.
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endarkenment
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:28 PM
Response to Original message |
18. turn off the hate radio |
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it is bad for your mental health
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demo dutch
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
19. actually not listening to the radio |
endarkenment
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:51 PM
Response to Reply #19 |
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the 'wasteful spending meme' is the current refuglican talking point.
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paulk
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:38 PM
Response to Original message |
21. So, an article about what the GOP deems "wasteful"? |
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Perhaps you could explain why we should give a fuck about what the GOP "deems wasteful"?
Other than as just another excuse to bash Nancy Pelosi...
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geek tragedy
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
22. LMAO--they think a summer jobs program |
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Edited on Tue Feb-03-09 01:58 PM by geek tragedy
doesn't belong in a stimulus.
Because a stimulus is about job creation.
Or something.
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demo dutch
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #22 |
28. Come on that's one of minor things there are other items that are rediculous and should not |
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Edited on Tue Feb-03-09 01:57 PM by demo dutch
be part of a stim package. I'm all for these items but not in the stim package
A $246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion picture film. $248 million for furniture at the new Homeland Security headquarters $1 billion for the 2010 Census, which has a projected cost overrun of $3 billion. $75 million for salaries of employees at the FBI $100 million for reducing the hazard of lead-based paint
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paulk
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Tue Feb-03-09 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #28 |
45. anything that puts money directly into the economy - |
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where it will get spent - is fine by me
I would be happy with a couple more billion being put into the Census, especially because it's looking like that's the only work my wife or I are going to get this summer.
You are arguing for the Republicans.
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demo dutch
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
24. I think that several items do not belong in this bill. The more details that are coming out |
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after the TARP fiasco the more negative it will become
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geek tragedy
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #24 |
27. Yeah, we should only pass legislation that the Republicans |
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wouldn't dare criticize.
Fortunately, Pelosi has bigger balls than many of her critics.
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Occam Bandage
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:50 PM
Response to Original message |
25. Pelosi needs to go because the Republicans think she's a tax-and-spender. |
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Edited on Tue Feb-03-09 01:51 PM by Occam Bandage
Solid logic there.
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Fire1
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:53 PM
Response to Original message |
29. Rarely, if ever, do I agree with anything a Republican says, |
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particularly, McConnell. But, in this case, I have to agree. Too much waste and pork to the point of taking away from the urgent issues at hand.
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demo dutch
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #29 |
31. Thank you. There's a time and a place and eventhough I'm for some of the items they shouldn't be |
Medusa
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Tue Feb-03-09 01:57 PM
Response to Original message |
30. She's been a failure since Day 1 |
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I've never understood how she got that leadership position to begin with, let alone keep it.
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ProSense
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Tue Feb-03-09 02:00 PM
Response to Original message |
32. Screw the GOP. When they eliminate all the tax cuts for the wealthy in their package then |
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maybe they get to hurl criticisms. Never forget, their BS is what brought on the financial crisis.
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Thrill
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Tue Feb-03-09 04:52 PM
Response to Original message |
36. The problem is the Democrats let the Republicans frame the debate as usual |
uponit7771
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Tue Feb-03-09 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #36 |
41. Unnn, some of the shit in the link looks stupid. If we're in an emergency then don't load the measur |
blueladybird
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Tue Feb-03-09 04:57 PM
Response to Original message |
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"she let the Dems load it down with stuff that shouldn't be there." A lot of weird stuff is included in the package. I don't see how some of the stuff included will help the economy.
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bigwillq
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Tue Feb-03-09 04:58 PM
Response to Original message |
38. She needs to go, but not because of the stim package. |
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The stim package will pass.
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Minimus
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Tue Feb-03-09 05:06 PM
Response to Original message |
39. The only ones that really bother me are: |
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- A $246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion picture film.
- $75 million to construct a "security training" facility for State Department Security officers when they can be trained at existing facilities of other agencies.
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uponit7771
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Tue Feb-03-09 05:10 PM
Response to Original message |
40. Yeah, that move was stupid...loading this down slowed it down. We'll see, .... |
ieoeja
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Tue Feb-03-09 05:20 PM
Response to Original message |
43. My opinion on their list. |
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Wasteful
• A $246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion picture film.
No Opinion
• $650 million for the digital television converter box coupon program.
• $75 million for "smoking cessation activities."
• $25 million for tribal alcohol and substance abuse reduction.
• $75 million to construct a "security training" facility for State Department Security officers when they can be trained at existing facilities of other agencies.
Not Wasteful
• $2 billion earmark to re-start FutureGen, a near-zero emissions coal power plant in Illinois that the Department of Energy defunded last year because it said the project was inefficient.
• $88 million for the Coast Guard to design a new polar icebreaker (arctic ship).
• $448 million for constructing the Department of Homeland Security headquarters.
• $248 million for furniture at the new Homeland Security headquarters.
• $600 million to buy hybrid vehicles for federal employees.
• $400 million for the Centers for Disease Control to screen and prevent STD's.
• $1.4 billion for rural waste disposal programs.
• $125 million for the Washington sewer system.
• $150 million for Smithsonian museum facilities.
• $1 billion for the 2010 Census, which has a projected cost overrun of $3 billion.
• $200 million for public computer centers at community colleges.
• $75 million for salaries of employees at the FBI.
• $500 million for flood reduction projects on the Mississippi River.
• $10 million to inspect canals in urban areas.
• $6 billion to turn federal buildings into "green" buildings.
• $500 million for state and local fire stations.
• $650 million for wildland fire management on forest service lands.
• $1.2 billion for "youth activities," including youth summer job programs.
• $88 million for renovating the headquarters of the Public Health Service.
• $412 million for CDC buildings and property.
• $500 million for building and repairing National Institutes of Health facilities in Bethesda, Maryland.
• $160 million for "paid volunteers" at the Corporation for National and Community Service.
• $5.5 million for "energy efficiency initiatives" at the Department of Veterans Affairs National Cemetery Administration.
• $850 million for Amtrak.
• $100 million for reducing the hazard of lead-based paint.
• $110 million to the Farm Service Agency to upgrade computer systems.
• $200 million in funding for the lease of alternative energy vehicles for use on military installations
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biopowertoday
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Tue Feb-03-09 05:21 PM
Response to Original message |
44. Mitch McConnel said Obama is embarrassed by it. on the |
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Sunday talk show. Wonder if he is.
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sundog
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Tue Feb-03-09 06:12 PM
Response to Original message |
47. since when does pelosi -not- have to go according to du? |
Still Sensible
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Tue Feb-03-09 06:18 PM
Response to Original message |
49. Yeah, because she couldn't herd her cats |
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the GOP has valid talking points. And the sad thing is they can pass just about all of those pet projects individually after they get the Recovery Act done.
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lonestarnot
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Tue Feb-03-09 06:21 PM
Response to Original message |
51. Totally fucking agree! |
onenote
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Tue Feb-03-09 06:35 PM
Response to Original message |
52. so your premise is that Obama and his team had no real input into the bill |
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that was introduced even though that bill was going to be and was labelled as Obama's proposal?
If that was true, and I'm quite certain that its not, it would say more about Obama than Pelosi, wouldn't it?
The fact is that the bill was worked out by members of Obama's transition team and house leaders and reflects a series of compromises and strategic choices, such as the inclusion of provisions aimed at teeing up an issue even with the knowledge that it would come out of the final bill.
I'm sure you know the old saying about legislation and sausage -- two things you never want to watch being made....
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uponit7771
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Tue Feb-03-09 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #52 |
61. No, Pelosi didn't have to let this crappy ass'd bill hit the floor. It was stupid to load it down... |
BuyingThyme
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Tue Feb-03-09 08:52 PM
Response to Original message |
laugle
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Tue Feb-03-09 09:11 PM
Response to Reply #53 |
55. That just about sums it up! LOL........nt |
CATagious
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Tue Feb-03-09 10:03 PM
Response to Original message |
58. by my calculations... |
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which may be incorrect... that list amounts to $19.1 billion dollars which is just 2.12% of the total bill. I don't think I would characterize that as loaded down... I do think much of that should be removed but to say it's loaded down with pork does not appear to be accurate.
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uponit7771
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Tue Feb-03-09 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #58 |
62. It wasn't loaded down numerically but anyone who's watch 3 seconds of political shows knows reThugs |
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...were going to whine like children about the "social crap" they put in it.
They could've kept it simple...2 - 3 programs get passed and let the other crap fly when they have some credibility.
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Clear Blue Sky
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Tue Feb-03-09 10:08 PM
Response to Original message |
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Obama wants to be bipartisan and she doesn't. It won't end well...
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Jamastiene
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Tue Feb-03-09 11:35 PM
Response to Original message |
63. I have despised Pelosi since she said "Impeachment is off the table" |
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But...
Fuck the Republicans and what they think. President Obama won. That's why he is President now. The Democratic Party is in charge now. The Republicans can learn to work with us or go off whimpering about it. The choice is theirs. Either way, we won. They need to step down off their high horses and realize the country wants the Democrats in charge, not them.
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Writer
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Tue Feb-03-09 11:51 PM
Response to Original message |
64. Okay, demo dutch I vote YOU for House Speaker... |
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Go ahead, now. Let's see you get nearly 500 representatives to agree on a bill! Heck, let's get just the 300 or so DEMOCRATIC representatives to agree on a bill.
And while you're at it, I'm sure you'll care when a DU'er named stemo stutch decides to go online and get uptight about there being compromise measures in the bill.
Let's see how well you'd do with strict ideology and no compromise.
Good luck.
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Barack_America
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Wed Feb-04-09 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #64 |
67. Nobody can disagree with infrastructure spending. |
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IMO, Pelosi took the lazy route in assembling this bill. She just went around to Dem representatives and asked them, "hey do you have any projects that are "stimulative"?" and then tossed them in the bill. Some of it may be, most of it isn't. But adding any of it opens the bill to criticism, slows the process down and is an embarrassment.
All that shit should be tossed out and the money added to infrastructure spending.
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Barack_America
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Wed Feb-04-09 10:00 AM
Response to Original message |
66. Kicking this because I'm very much agreeing with it today. |
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What a mess Pelosi made with that bill.
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