Oklahoma City officer pulls man over for anti-Obama sign

[AndyA]

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=12&articleid=20090219_298_0_ENIDAn35798

My how times have changed...

The idiot with the sign probably doesn't realize that Bush did more to take away his rights than Obama ever will. :eyes:

[MrModerate]

1. Yeah, but the cop shouldn't have stopped him, regardless. n/t

[MadHound]

2. This sort of shit was wrong when it happened under Bush,

It's still wrong now when it happens under Obama. Free speech applies to everyone.

[randr]

6. How about a bumper sticker that says

"Pray for our Patriotic Sharpshooters"?
Saw this along with an assortment of hatred on the typical beat up 80's mini pickup with camper.
While we all have a right to free speech it is the acceptance by society at large of such vitriolic dialog that is offensive.

[MadHound]

8. Society probably isn't accepting of that sort of shit,

In fact society isn't accepting of a lot of free speech, check out Neo-Nazis, Skokie Illinois for starters. But the fact of the matte is that if we, as a society, are going to preserve the right to free speech then we've got to be prepared to deal fairly with speech that we find offensive. Pulling a guy over, calling the Secret Service on him, hassling him, etc. isn't dealing fairly with this guy. It wasn't fair when people who publicly criticized Bush were hassled in a like manner, and it isn't fair now.

[newfie11]

3. an "Abort Obama, not the unborn" sign

could have several meanings. I am glad the police and secret service are watching this closely. As far as I am concerned the officer was in the right.

[Kalyke]

4. Ahhhh - the Sanctity of Life people.

It's OK to kill brown people and force poor women to give birth to future cannon fodder, but don't you mess with some cells!

[newfie11]

12. Hey I totally agree with you. I am pro choice.

I am also concerned that there are enough of these idiots out there that one of them just might be in the right place at the right time to assassinate Pres. Obama. If that happens we can kiss this country good by. I can't imagine the disaster we would find ourselves in if that happened. We need Obama's intelligence to get out if this mess.

[Rainbowreflect]

16. While I do believe he has a right to free speech, I do see the hypocrisy.

If the guy was "pro-life" then by definition he believes abortion is murder. Therefore he, with that belief, is saying President Obama should be murdered.

[Hepburn]

17. I agree....

....I would rather that they be safe than sorry.

With the anti-choicer nuts, one never knows exactly how far they are willing to go to "save" the unborn. Killing lives already in existence for some reason seems to make sense to some of these demented individuals.

JMHO

[Cha]

24. I agree with you..those

fucking religious hypocrites have no appreciation of life only telling others what to do.

[TexasObserver]

5. You'd think they'd at least read the constitution occasionally ...

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dbmk]

9. Hello!

Before you are TS'ed, can you lay out how the stimulus bill is in gross violation of the constitution?

[FarLeftRage]

11. I smell pizza!

Alerted...

[cabbage08]

13. No TS yet.....

[YOY]

14. Do you realize just what Bush did?

I mean have you actually read the constitution? Besides the 2nd Amendment that it...and actually read the 2nd Amendment in full.

And what in the stimulus bill is anti-constitutional oh great expert on Constitutional Law?

[AspenRose]

15. Bwahahahahahahaha!

Can't you guys come up with ANYTHING original on your own? :rofl:

[TexasObserver]

21. Looks like I missed the fun!! Let me guess. "HOW DARE YOU?!"

The greater one's duty is to defend the constitution, the greater the likelihood one will find reasons to avoid doing just that.

[snowbear]

22. I know! .. Me too! ...and they looked like they got a good laugh out of the freep..

.
.

-- before his pizza arrived..


.

[npk]

25. "THEY" did

If by they you mean "the police". The police have the right to stop and detain anyone on mere suspicion if they believe the person or persons represents a danger or is about to commit a crime. In the case of Terry v. Ohio the United State Supreme Court ruled that the police can conduct "Terry Stops" or brief stops or detainment, that do not constitute an act of arrest. As long as the police believe that there is mere suspicion that the person may commit a crime.

Since a broad definition of the word "abort" can mean to terminate or bring to an end prematurely, it is reasonable to assume that the cop may have interpreted that the individual driving this vehicle may be implying by his use of "free speech" that he intended to bring about a premature end to President Obama.

But hey that's just one persons opinion. But as far as the Constitution goes, it would appear that the cop had at least brushed up on a few of its finer points.

[TexasObserver]

34. No, they didn't. You imagined they did.

Your dissent is noted, Mr. Justice Thomas. As usual, however, you fail to evidence even a rudimentary understanding of whatever the topic is. The topic isn't "Terry Stops." The topic is the failure of the police officer to understand what protected speech is, and why their duty under the constitution includes understanding it.

It was a police officer who lacks any decent understanding of the constitution and mistakes his poor understanding of language for a threat to the president. He didn't think about the constitution. He didn't think all. He used his authority to do what he wanted, and the constitution was never on his radar screen.

A police officer knows what he can typically get away with doing, which has nothing to do with any understanding of the constitution. It requires only the tutoring by superiors who inform them of what to say and how to say it to make a case for just about anything. Police are schooled regarding how to lie their way past the constitutional safeguards the courts have held the constitution protects.

Where's your God now, Moses?

[lady raven]

10. Yes, it is his freedom of speech, but I, for one, am glad that this

officer was concerned when he thought that the President's life was being threatened.

[onenote]

18. would you have been equally glad if the bumper sticker said abort bush

and the cop pulled over the driver?

[delete_bush]

19. depends upon whether or not the SS were polite?

"The Secret Service called and said they were at my house," Harrison said.

After talking to his attorney, Harrison went home where he met the Secret Service.

"When I was on my way there, the Secret Service called me and said they weren't going to ransack my house or anything ... they just wanted to (walk through the house) and make sure I wasn't a part of any hate groups."

Harrison said he invited the Secret Service agents into the house and they were "very cordial."

"We walked through the house and my wife and 2-year-old were in the house," Harrison said.

He said they interviewed him for about 30 minutes and then left, not finding any evidence Harrison was a threat to the president.
-----------------------------
Freakin' ridiculous.

[Sebastian Doyle]

20. I'd classify this particular bumper sticker as more pathetically stupid than actually threatening.

But I don't really have much sympathy for the idiot who put it on his car. And I'm sure this guy didn't give two shits about the guy who got arrested by the Secret Service a few years ago for making a Biblical refernce to a "burning bush" which was somehow interpreted as a threat against Chimpy.

[Cha]

23. I agree with the Police Officer..

"Abort Obama Not the Unborn"..can be construed as a fucking threat against his life or to instigate one.

[Colobo]

26. Me too. If to abort is interpreted as "to kill", then this guy is encouraging people

to try to do something stupid against Obama.

[Cha]

29. Exactly, Colobo.

Can't have it both ways.

[MadBadger]

27. Based on the headline, Id say that's ridiculous. But after looking at the sign, I can understand

To that man, Abort Obama means "Kill Him"

And that is a threat to the President.

[SpartanDem]

28. Obama's safety is a lame excuse

If this situation were reversed and it was an anti-Bush sign there would be none of this bullshit "better safe, than sorry". No, this cop would be accused of being typical RW, fascist pig. But he's on "our side" so it's OK if he violates someones First Amendment right.

[Colobo]

31. A message encouraging to kill W would be just as reprehensible.

[Bluerthanblue]

33. hmmmm..... how about carrying the Koran on an airplane- or wearing an anti-bush

shirt in an area bush was going to be in? There were more than a few people who were harassed by the feds for less inflammatory displays of 'free speech'-

What about the young student who made the disastrous mistake of wearing an led home-made sweatshirt to Logan Airport to meet her boyfriend??? Where was her right to free speech? And her shirt didn't advocate violence against anyone.


:shrug:

[a la izquierda]

30. Okay...I'm going to do something I don't often do...

and give Oklahoma a little grief. I live here. I hate when others make nasty, blanket statements about the south, rednecks and racism in the same post. So there's my little caveat.
If this sign were in, say, West Hollywood, CA, or Seattle, or Hawaii...I'd have thought the cop jumped the gun just a teensy bit (again, I'm probably generalizing a little).
But this is Oklahoma...the majority of the population is not fond of President Obama. There are few places where this guy might have been run off the road by ordinary citizens for a sign like that-parts of OKC, parts of Tulsa, Norman...but in the majority of the state, people don't like the President. In fact, I'd go so far as to say many people might hate him.
This is the home of Timothy McVeigh's.
I'm kinda glad the cop took the sign, no matter how vague and bizarre, seriously. It's sad that many people on the Tulsa World forum want to have his ass.

[Bluerthanblue]

32. if abort doesn't mean 'kill' or 'end the existance of'- then what are anti abortion people

so against?


:shrug:


They can't have it both ways.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

35. That DUers are defending this is disgusting.

This is as blatant as abuses of police power come.

Only someone being deliberately disingenuous far, far past the point of credibility could claim to believe that that placard represents a genuine threat to Obama' life.

Free speech is free speech even when we disgree with it; the policeman should be severely disciplined.

[kiva]

38. Agreed! It's the height of hypocrisy to waffle and say,

"well, it COULD have been a threat" when, had this been last year, we would have been outraged if a policeman behaved this way.

[genna]

36. I'd say the same for any president...the Secret Service should check out ANY threat

against the U.S. President's, current or former, life. Under no circumstances do I think that is an excuse to deprive freedom of speech liberties. I'd much rather for them to investigate than for a John Wilkes Booth to be successful.

[onenote]

37. so you would defend the secret service for questioning this woman or this man?

.html?g2_GALLERYSID=16e982e944e1d4df1ed38824ddad2383

http://www.pbase.com/jevvi/image/84003436

or anyone wearing this t-shirt: http://www.cafepress.com/timefordrinking.14389130#

[liberalsince1968]

39. I think when a southern redneck has a sign like this, it raises alarm bells that

wouldn't necessarily ring for, say, college students at an anti-Bush rally.

That being said, free speech is free speech, and there can't be more than one standard. I think this man has a right to use that sign.