The security guard at my apartment told me two weeks ago that even with ID there's suspicion.

[LoZoccolo]

I ended up on the hospital the Sunday after last and had to leave in a hurry, closing the door while leaving my keys inside. When I got back, I told the guard who had to call the super to go get the keys, and we chatted for a while while I was waiting. He told me about a really bad mistake he once made in giving someone access to an apartment that was even on his license. Try and guess what it was. And if it takes you any length of time to figure out, ask yourself if you really know enough about security or law enforcement to jump to criticizing the police in a situation where you are not present.

[Dawgs]

1. You're right, cops are always right and never racist. We should always believe them first.

:eyes:

[LoZoccolo]

2. And yet you still haven't figured it out. n/t

[Dawgs]

10. Actually, I have figured "it" out. n/t

[LoZoccolo]

15. OK, but it took you around 20 minutes.

Now how long did it take you to reach a judgement on the police officers?

[itsrobert]

3. Not true, cops are never right and always racist. We should never believe them first

[Dawgs]

9. Huh? I don't agree with your stupid comment either.

Come on. Think.

[Flabbergasted]

26. Dude he's deing sarcastic. nt

[Starry Messenger]

4. Where does Nader come into this story?

[John Q. Citizen]

5. Did he give the keys to Ralph Nadar? I suspected as much!

[LoZoccolo]

6. Bingo. And then Ralph Nadar broke into Ralph Nader's apartment. n/t

[John Q. Citizen]

11. Well he didn't have to break in, did he, because now he had the keys. Did he

steal the other Ralph's secret plan to turn the country over to Newt for the next two decades?

Well duh. I mean Obama is still in office.

[fasttense]

7. I've broken into my house several times.

I've lived in DC, Virginia, MD and PA. I've had to, at one time or another, brake into each of my homes because I left the keys inside (the same for my car).

I've done it in broad daylight with numerous people watching me. I've never, ever been even approach by the police (and sometimes I wished they would have come by, so I could get their help).

I am a short white woman. And there in lies the rub.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

8. I'm sure you are referring to a domestic dispute

where the couple split, the woman keeping the apartment and the man leaving. Woman changes the locks, man talks his way past the security guard, goes in and either trashes the place or rapes the woman. But the problem in that case wasn't being suspicious even with ID, the problem was that someone hadn't alerted the security guard to the situation (either the woman herself or the super; if locks were changed, the super would likely have known about it).

What I find ironically amusing about your example is that I know of cops who have just laughed off domestic disputes, seeing them as nothing very important, even when the woman has been robbed of things. So what I've seen is the exact opposite of vigilance when it comes to suspect B&E. But then all the people involved were white.

And you have to agree that once Gates showed not only his driver's license but his Harvard ID, and there was no evidence of any destruction or mayhem in the house, there was no cause for suspicion. Sorry, but the only reason the cop acted the way he did was because Gates bruised his ego by not smilin' and shufflin' along, saying "Yas sir, anything you say sir."

[jberryhill]

12. Yes, Divorced/Separated Individuals Can Unlawfully Break Into A Home

...which is identified on their identification.

But if you know enough to know that the address on your ID might not be your lawful address, and might require further questions, then the only thing you are going to be here on DU is a fascist-loving racist.

[cboy4]

13. Oh brother.

How many of these ridiculous ID threads can we expect from you?

[Kind of Blue]

14. Obviously you haven't had any issues with

law enforcement that would cause you to even speculate. But many of us have had good and bad incidents with officers and is in our world view to criticize based on experience. So you really need to offer more than a story that you swallowed and weren't even present for that a security guard told you :crazy:

[high density]

16. So how much proof is enough proof?

The officer admits in his own report that he was mostly convinced that Gates was lawfully in the residence, even before the ID was checked. The report doesn't mention why the officer felt that way.

[AspenRose]

17. Perhaps a birth certificate would have helped.

[mkultra]

18. we bow to your security gaurd legal advice

Next time we will jump to believing a security guard instead of jumping to criticize the police.

[LoZoccolo]

19. This was a while before the Gates incident.

He had no interest in defending police who hadn't yet been involved in the current controversy, and as a matter of fact he was a little embarassed that he'd let someone with a restraining order back into an apartment from which he was barred to take things from it. He wasn't exactly flexing his muscle.

[PurityOfEssence]

20. A bit of respect for the law is part of the covenant of society

It's a messy world, and those entrusted to keep it moving along with a minimum of acrimony should be given a few breaks. It's a tough job.

There's a deep childishness at play here. Many people feel that if they've been somehow mistreated, they have the right to rain death on anyone they please. Somehow it's "their turn", and nobody's ever suffered like they have.

The sheer irrationality at play here in many of these posts is quite illuminating. Cops are portrayed as assholes itching for a fight, but it's not seen as somewhat idiotic to berate an animal like that. Somehow it should be obvious that the man was in his own dwelling, when the whole incident was sparked by a call about a possible break-in. Not letting something drop and insisting on carrying it out into the public street and not backing down when warned is somehow just fine. It makes one wonder what kind of response would have been adequate.

We need the police. Most of us wouldn't want to risk our lives like that. Reminding everyone in sight that they're the enemy doesn't do us a bit of good.

Perhaps we need to have a discussion about manners and coexistence.

[MadMaddie]

22. We do need the police and yes we need to be able to trust

that when we call them that we don't end up in jail or worse dead.

Since 9/11 there have been more incidents of police officers going beyond what is acceptable.

Now having said that I know for a fact there are good officers around the country but these incidents are continuing to rise. This is happening to all Americans.

Shooting a handcuffed suspect in the back - Officer said he got his taser and gun mixed up....result 1- dead black man


Shooting of white young male in swim trunks by officer that didn't identify who he was (not in uniform and not in marked car)- result 1 dead white man
http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/event/article/id/125829/

Taser Abuse (too many to list).
http://www.blogcatalog.com/search.frame.php?
term=taser+gun+abuse+by+police&id=64b64606fc41a4420cd0d079f550d225

You mention manners and coexistance, when a man or woman decide to join a police department they take on an oath and responsibilty to protect and serve the citizens. No where is it written into the law that citizens must show deference to police officers. I respect the job they do but I shouldn't have to be in fear of them.

[berniebern]

21. It's not clear whether he showed his license originally

The police report talks about the Harvard ID only. and it doesn't have an address. Gates says he showed both the Harvard ID and the license.

[Forkboy]

23. How much fail can one person post?

[LoZoccolo]

24. Let's step back and look at this.

You have been replying to my posts for five years, ever since the tiny winky theory (a pedestrian work compared to what has emerged since then), presumably to get me to stop. If that's the purpose, and I am still posting, then you have registered five years of fail, and the winrar is me.

[Forkboy]

25. Stop? You're the funniest damn poster here.

If that's your purpose, and I'm still laughing after five years, then I guess you are the winrar.

And I'm flattered you remember our first encounter. I didn't.