Hopefully, Edwards won't open like Lieberman did in 2000

[UrbScotty]

It may have cost him and Gore the election.

I doubt Edwards will do the same.

http://www.debates.org/pages/trans2000d.html

October 5, 2000

The Lieberman-Cheney Vice Presidential Debate

MODERATOR: From Centre College in historic Danville, Kentucky, good evening, and welcome to this year's only vice presidential debate sponsored by the Commission on Presidential Debates. I'm Bernard Shaw, moderator. Tonight we come to you from the hall in the Northern Center for the Arts on the campus of Centre College. Thank you to President John Rausch, the faculty, students and community leaders state-wide, we thank you for hosting this debate. The candidates are the Republican nominee, former Defense Secretary Dick Cheney of Wyoming, and the Democratic nominee, Senator Joseph Lieberman of Connecticut. The Commission, these candidates and their campaign staffs have agreed to the following rules. A candidate shall have two minutes to respond to the moderator's question. The other candidate shall have two minutes to comment on the question or the first candidate's answer. When I exercise the moderator's discretion of extending discussion of a question, no candidate may speak for more than two minutes at one time. This audience has been told no disruptions will be tolerated. A prior coin toss has determined that the first question will go to the Democratic candidate. Senator, few hard working Americans would base their well-being on bonuses they hope to get five or ten years from now. Why do you, and you, Secretary Cheney, predict surpluses you cannot possibly guarantee to pay for your proposed programs?

LIEBERMAN: Before I answer that very important question, let me first thank you for moderating the debate. Let me thank the wonderful people here at Centre College and throughout Kentucky for being such gracious hosts, and let me give a special thank you to the people of Connecticut without whose support over these last 30 years I would never have had the opportunity Al Gore has given me this year. And finally let me thank my family that is here with me. My wife, Hadassah, our children, our siblings and my mom. My 85-year-old mom gave me some good advice about the debate earlier today. She said, sweetheart -- as she's prone to call me -- remember, be positive and know that I will love you no matter what you're opponent says about you. Well, Mom, as always, that was both reassuring and wise. I am going to be positive tonight. I'm not going to indulge in negative personal attacks. I'm going to talk about the issues that matter to the people of this country; education, health care, retirement security and moral values. I'm going to describe the plan that Al Gore and I have for keeping America's prosperity going and making sure that it benefits more of America's families, particularly the hard-working middle class families who have not yet fully benefitted from the good times we've had. And Bernie, I'm going to explain tonight how we're going to do all this and remain fiscally responsible. Let me get to your question.

MODERATOR: You have about ten seconds.

...

:eyes:

[aden_nak]

1. I have gym socks that could out-debate Liberman.

I know what Gore was thinking when he picked him. It's what he WASN'T thinking about that staggers me.

[MsTryska]

2. My CAT can out-debate Lieberman.

all it would take is one-look of incurable boredom, and then the "this fucker don't know jack" look followed by a turn and a stalk out of the room.

[MockSwede]

24. CAT-Max

So Cat. Mine are crashed in their catbasket in the kitchen and on F2's bed between his legs, sucking up body heat. NOT listening to VP debate.

[MsTryska]

26. *lol* Mine were screaming bloody murder

to be let out last night. I guess they weren't interested in the debates at all.

[MockSwede]

27. Smart Co-Worker

My cats come in when we call them at night and one is slumbering between my 13 year old son's legs as he falls asleep. He loves these two cats we have! Two hobbits, we think.

Your cats were wise to avoid the dogfight of last night! Love to see the 'factcheck' by the media torpedoing Dick. Close call, otherwise.

We're organizing a debate party for K-B II on Friday. Will have some nice folks to chew the political fat.

We're all concerned about our cats and our kids - I only wish BC04 felt the same way....

[bushwakker]

3. hopefully he won't do anything like lieberman

[AntiCoup2K4]

4. This debate won't be anything like Dick vs Holy Joe.

The reason that one was so boring was that the two of them agreed on damn near everything. I don't think that's the case with Edwards.

[SpiralHawk]

5. Feel the Joementum ! Not.

Feel the JohnMentum !

Totally

Fer sure, fer sure.

[MsUSA]

6. I saw that debate on C-SPAN again

and just thought Lieberman was just a putz.

[dolstein]

8. You probably thought Lieberman was a putz before the debate

NT

[MsUSA]

11. Yup, I did.

and he still is. :)

[Crunchy Frog]

12. I didn't before that debate,

but I did afterwards.

I remember not knowing much about Lieberman and feeling pretty neutral about him when he was picked. I was expecting him to clean Cheney's clock in the debate and I can remember how disappointed and disgusted I felt afterwards.

I felt neutral towards Lieberman before the 2000 campaign, and despised him after. It was only later that I recalled that he had run for his senate seat by running to the right of Republican incumbent Lowell Weicker, and that at the time, Jerry Falwell had been urging people to vote for him.

When I remembered that, his performance in the 2000 campaign made more sense to me.

[arewenotdemo]

17. Weicker was great

not a Repuke at all. Was he what they refer to as a RINO?

[patdem]

14. dolstein...the point is the VP is SUPPOSED to be the attack dog

and Lieberman was too Presidental and not Vice Presidental enough...you know...the Vice Principal is the bad guy...do you remember high school?

[arewenotdemo]

18. Yeah, the VP at my high school was a total dick.

Had the HS machine shop make him a paddle with drilled holes that read: "Blood, Sweat or Tears" (this was a few years ago).

[dolstein]

20. No, the point is that critics like you completely ignore the context

The fact is, the VP debate occurred after a presidential debate in which Gore ended up getting ripped to shreds by the media for his obnoxiously over-agressive behavior. The press hated, and by the time of the VP debate, the voters hated it.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion. But you aren't entitled to rewrite history. After Gore's performance, it was clear that BOTH sides understood the need for a more toned-done, "adult" performance. If you were actually following the campaign back then, you'd understand that. There was nothing accidental about Lieberman's performance. If you have a problem with it, blame the people running the Gore campaign, because Lieberman gave the performance they wanted.

[dolstein]

7. Lieberman had to do damage control, Edwards doesn't.

Kerry's debate performance was well-received by both the press and the population at large.

By the time of the 2000 Vice Presidential debate, Gore's debate performance had become the object of ridicule and parody, and it became imperative that Lieberman turn in a respectable performance in order to stem the damage. And you have to admit, unlike Gore, nobody was laughing about Lieberman's debate performance a week later.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

9. You call that damage control?

[dolstein]

10. Yes, I do.

As has been noted elsewhere in this thread, the consensus view was that both VP candidates fared better than their running mates did in the presidential debate.

[Don Claybrook]

16. Lieberman was utterly useless during that debate

He did no damage control. It all began to make better sense when I found out Joe was on the same committee with Lynne Cheney in an effort to ban "wrong thinking" in colleges and universities. Lieberman, Cheney--birds of a feather, really. Take foreign policy, for example... On second thought, scratch that; this isn't the I/P dungeon.

[Crunchy Frog]

13. Damage control as in

drive a stake through the heart of.:)

[WI_DEM]

15. On this I have to agree with Dolstein

While I felt Gore won the first debate with Bush in '00 the concensus was that he hurt himself with the "sighs" and wearing too much make up and that he was too "mean" to poor little Chimpy. So, it was a strategic choice that the campaign have a "gentlemanly" encounter with Cheney--which it did, but so did the second debate between Gore and Bush. Gore in my estimation embarrassed himself in that debate by being overly gentelmanly towards Bush and even agreeing with him on something or other. Frankly, Lieberman handled it better than Gore did in the second encounter. The big issue in the 2000 debates was that Gore didn't know who he was and he presented a different persona in each encounter while Bush was his usual lumbering self.

[JI7]

28. i agree about that 2nd debate

it was far worse than the cheney lieberman debate.

as for the criticism from the first debate i think he should have dealt with it by stopping the sighing and other things which have nothing to do with the issues. but he should have continued to debate on the issues.

his third debate was probably the best one but he messed up there by getting out of his seat and walking over to bush during that one moment.

[Doosh]

19. Lieberman is a neo con like Cheney

so how can you expect him to debate Cheney? he wants to BE cheney.

[hippiechick]

21. "It may have cost him and Gore the election."

Did you forget that GORE WON THE ELECTION ????? :shrug:


:hippie:

[UrbScotty]

25. Well, it cost them the inauguration.

Yes, Gore won, but the SCOTUS wouldn't have been involved if Joe were stronger from thew beginning.

[bagnana]

22. Doesn't read half bad until you start hearing his voice

saying it. His voice! It is like nails on a chalkboard to me. Unbelievably whiny and nasal and awful.

[MockSwede]

23. Don't Worry

He came out swinging at the end of his first sentence. Thanks for your memory about last VP debate.