MSNBC panel saying Cheney obliterated JE

[in_cog_ni_to]

OMG! What debate were they watching???

[pimpbot]

1. mathews sucks

Mathews: "will the liberal media admit cheney won tomorrow?"

WTF IS THAT?!?!?!?! I swear I want to punch him in the face right now.

what a shill

[RummyTheDummy]

2. CNN is a little more even handed

I knew tweety would react that way. He's so reactionary. So predictable. If his panel said Edwards won, he would say Edwards won. Clearly from MSNBC's own online poll Edwards was the clear winner.

[Sperk]

3. They should look at their own poll....JE KILLED!

n/t

[StevieM]

4. They are such liars...

Edwards won hands down. I thought he did even better then Kerry did on Thursday. But we all know how the biased, conservative news media works.

Steve

[MoonRiver]

5. Yeah, well the MOFOs should check out their own poll results!

77% think Edwards WON!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697

[WI_DEM]

8. 177,000 results 77-24 say Edwards won

[napi21]

6. I heard that, and switched the damn chanel!

I did look at CNN for a moment, but turned to AAR on the net.

[Cats Against Frist]

7. FUCK THEM

They are fucking insane. This is the most insane thing they've ever said, and I've been watching the damn channel everyday for a year.

[restorefreedom]

9. cats against frist

awesome handle

Bitching!!!!

[Zomby Woof]

10. Reagan didn't

Did you see him say Cheney was the "CEO" of the admin, and got another dig at Bush from last week? And they tried laughing him down, but he stuck with it.

Reagan could not say Cheney won this. He knows.

[Rose Siding]

11. CBS News:Undecided voters give it to Edwards 42% to 29%

Voters, not schitzoid pundits matter.

[Carolinian]

12. It's the same crap Matthews always pulls. Why bother watching - you

know exactly what Matthews will do every time. He's a republican who loves to set up a Democrat for a fall. He does it every time.

[Roland99]

13. Personally, I'd give Cheney the edge with 7/10 vs. Edwards 6/10

Edwards seemed too aggressive...too rambling...too nervous in the first few answers.

He also never raised the fact that Bush was threatening to VETO that $87 billion bill. WHY NOT?? Kerry didn't Thur. night and Edwards failed on that tonight.

And, no mention of the fudged-up intelligence from the special Pentagon office of Wolfowitz and Feith. No mention of ideologues. And what was with that cheesy story about his dad at the end?


That said, I'm sure we're in for quite a treat from Kerry on Fri. night and another embarrassing performance from Bush.

[Carolinian]

14. As VP Cheney can run the country without having to account for his

actions. Is that why he never wanted to be President?

[Roland99]

15. Yeah...kind of blurs that ol' accountability line, eh?

I think there's room for attack on Cheney from that statement of his.

[secular_warrior]

16. It's true - Cheney did obliterate Edwards - denial won't win us this race

Even before I turned on the pundits, I knew Cheney destroyed Edwards. I watched intently, informally scored the debate on paper, took notes and Cheney came out way ahead (just as I had done with the Kerry-Bush debate and knew Kerry destroyed Bush, before hearing what the pundits had to say).

Go watch it again as impartially as you can and you will see. Cheney successfully painted himself as the experienced older Principal to Edwards' "timid little boy who doesn't show up for class". He was ready for everything Edwards threw at him. Somehow Cheney managed to shift focus to Kerry/Edwards. Edwards should've come out like a pit bull, methodically building the case on this adminstration's disasterous record. Edwards should've anticipated Cheney would've been ready for his attacks.

This is why I was worried about the choice of Edwards. I like him, but the VP is supposed to be the attack dog, not a sunny optimist. And in times like these we need gravitas.

However, I'm not worried about Kerry. I have complete confidence he will come back and destroy Bush both times. Kerry has shouldered the burden on his own through this campaign. It is two against one, unfortunately. But Kerry will win.

Experience and knowledge count more than charisma and personality in this election. Kerry showed this to Bush and Cheney showed this to Edwards.

[Shopaholic]

18. Keith Olbermann didn't either--of course they wouldn't let him on the air

to say that--but he did the Hardblogger entries tonight, round by round (like a boxing match) and he gave the win to Edwards. It's a must-read after we get through Tweety & Co's sorry ass.

[scarface2004]

19. yeah right

cheney came off as a lying cocksucking bloodsucking piece of shit!!

[Carolinian]

22. NO, no, no! Edwards was great! Read the transcript. He spoke a

language the common man can understand. Cheney spoke politik. Edwards reached a lot a people tonight. It may not be on the lips of the pundits, but it reinforced the doubt of this administration. The lies Cheney told will come out in the next few days. Edwards came across as honest, trustworthy, competent, and didn't back down one bit. He successfully avoided traps set by Cheney (voting records) while hammering home important Dem points.

[Mountainman]

25. Cheney repeated all the old lies he has told before.

He has a good voice and a good way of saying things but what he said was the same old shit he's been saying all year. If he won in your mind I say so what? Edwards at least tried to tell it like it is.

[TimeToGo]

26. Cheney didn't destroy Edwards

Perhaps Edwards didn't win, but a tie goes to the challenger -- and Cheney didn't do very well for the old hand.

[Pax Argent]

28. Al Gore was a viscious attack dog?

Seriously, I'll grant you that I was hoping for more from Edwards, but he held up pretty well. Facing the prince of evil can be daunting.

Kerry vs. Cheney would have been way more entertaining. For being a lawyer, Edwards really didn't seem to have much of a killer instinct.

Oh well, we'll just have to look forward to two more baby-seal clubbings from Kerry for Bush to make the sting of this encounter go away......

[secular_warrior]

30. Al Gore was VERY effective as Clinton's running mate

Gore complimented Clinton very well. He was the straight man assassin to Clinton's "feel your pain" charisma.

People forget Al Gore was once a really tough debater and politician, before he was "remade" into the hapless, boring candidate of 2000. Gore was never afraid to take hard shots at Poppy. Also, Gore had far more gravitas and was more sure of himself than Edwards is now.

[kodi]

29. haha! you missed the point. Edwards showed he was Cheney's equal

whether your scorecard was unanimous or a split decision, Edwards showed that he could go 15 rounds with Cheney.

by not losing to Cheney, Edwards won for Kerry/Edwards.

the past GOP attacks on Edwards as inexperienced were attempts to question the wisdom of voting for Kerry/Edwards. with Edwards showing that he could stand as an equal with Cheney, he removed that issue from the campaign. the only effective result is that the differences between the two vp nominees of the respective parties are sufficiently insignificant that the focus will be entirely on the differences between kerry and bush.

that is a complete victory for the Kerry/Edwards ticket.

[secular_warrior]

31. I don't think Edwards measured up at all

I'm extremely disappointed in his performance. I expected him to come out and put the focus squarely on Cheney. But Cheney - the evil, cunning old bastard he is -- somehow managed to shift the focus on Kerry/Edwards and get in a few really hard shots. He managed to paint Edwards as not ready for prime time.

I would've hoped our side would admit reality here. I even talked to friends and relatives who all say the felt bad for Edwards the way Cheney reprimanded him like a little boy. The trap we must not fall into is the one the Republicans are falling into when they think Bush actually won the debate against Kerry. They try to convince themselves of a false reality. In public, we can and should spin this as an Edwards victory, but amongst ourselves it would be better to deal with reality, so we can move forward. There is less than a month left in this campaign and there is no time for living in denial. We need to look ahead at how Edwards can improve out there, and look forward to Kerry destroying Bush. I have complete confidence in Kerry. I always have, which is why I've supported him from the beginning, even though I didn't agree with his Iraq vote. I know John Kerry is the one who will rid the world of Bush.

[funnymanpants]

32. Not true

I thought Cheney scored a lot of points. But your statement that cheney "was ready for everything Edwards threw at him" is not true. Cheney was speechless when Edwards brought up that Cheney vote for plastic guns and for aginst meals on wheels. Edwards scored a few other really good points, too.

I thought both candidates drew blood. I'm disappointed, because I thought Edwards would kill the dour Cheney. It looks like Edwards got rattled early, and that hurt him.

[Crunchy Frog]

34. Well, thank God the average viewer

doesn't seem to agree with you. He wasn't my VP choice either but I thought that he turned in a very creditable performance and came out looking vastly better than Cheney. Most other viewers, including undecided voters, seem to think so too.

[against all enemies]

17. Is there a place where Cheney's mistruths are documented.

I am sure that dick told some big stinking lies tonight, what were they, is there a list?

[Dudley_DUright]

27. right here

http://blog.johnkerry.com/rapidresponse/

[SayitAintSo]

20. Edwards knocked Dick's dick in the dirt. .....Period.

MSNBC - check the freaking polls .... America doesn't care what you think ... We'll make up our own mind.

[qanda]

21. Are they the same ones who said the last debate was a draw?

Yes, they're credible :eyes:

[The_Casual_Observer]

23. cheney was very forceful with his lies even when he has been

discredited by actual history and the truth. These heads have been smarting ever since last week and would hang on anything for a * victory.

cheney was so full of shit that it only took seconds to find clips contradicting himself and this by MSNBC themselves.

[iwantmycountryback]

24. I could only stand to watch for 2 minutes

It's disgusting.

[Crunchy Frog]

33. I think they had their post-debate marching orders

and followed them to a tee. I only saw the first few minutes, but it all looked very scripted and pre-planned.

It definitely felt like Bizzaro World. They seem to have seen a completely different debate then the one I did.

[Swamp Rat]

35. John Edwards won the debate.

Cheney was only successful at keeping his human form in check for the duration of the debate.