BUSH:... Kerry saw the same intelligence I did....STOP IT NOW !!!.

[Hot Water]

This is their last, and latest desperation rope they're hoping to hang on to, as they're going off the cliff.


What a load of crap. A President sees ten times the intelligence reports a senator does.

Is he trying to imply Kerry saw the PDB--"Bin Laden determined to attack within the United States?

Kerry has to PULVERIZE him on this point. And right now. Before those weak minded undecideds buy into it. Saying, well if Kerry knew the same thing Bush knew and voted yes, Bush must have been right to go to war.

They're too stupid to know Kerry only voted to give him authority as a last resort.

He has to kill this dead, NOW!! :argh:

[Goldom]

1. My reply:

"You criticize Kerry for voting for an unjust war.. but you are the guys who think it -is- just. So shouldn't you be thanking him?"

[Deja Q]

2. Kerry said he was going to trust *, as I recall.

:shrug:

[VotefurKerry]

12. Why would he trust that dope?

That's not good if that's Kerry's argument.

[sandnsea]

22. Link please n/t

[Mountainman]

3. So? They cooked up the intelligence.

It was false and they lied to Kerry and all of Congress. They should be held in contempt of Congress.

This is the next piece of truth the public needs to hear from some creditable source.

[No2W2004]

8. Agreed, someone should ask Shrub

where the intelligence Kerry saw came from. Did it come straight from the CIA or the NSA....or did it come from the White House after a bit of
"creative modifications"

[Jack from Charlotte]

26. Exactly.... 2 Points..... Bush is IN CHARGE of the Intel agencies...

He's reponsible for it's accuracy.

#2. Congress did NOT see all of the Intel. For example the 8/6/01 PDB that Bush had and ignored.

[MichiganVote]

4. Yeah well Kerry didn't see the Aug. 6th PDB

[maine_raptor]

5. My Reply (for Kerry)

"No I didn't. What I saw was "cooked" intelligence that your administration cherry-picked to only support your well known desire to invade Iraq no matter what the real, true facts were."

[SeanQ]

28. The Dem on Paula Z's town hall

said basically that to counter the Rep in the debate who used that 'Kerry saw the same intelligence'

So they have that response field tested now. :)

[DoYouEverWonder]

6. Before the war, they said they had intelligence they couldn't show

to anyone. You would assume that the pResident gets much more information, than anyone one else in the whole friggin country. I bet the Senate Intel Committee doesn't get to see even half of what the pResident gets to see.

Plus Senators don't have there own National Security Adviser to read and interpert all of this information for them.

The only way that Kerry could have seen the same Intel, was if Bush didn't bother to look at the Intel. Then you might be able to say they 'saw' the same information.

[rocktivity]

7. He said that at least twice during Debate 1, and I still don't get it

Does he mean that it was stupid or gullible of Kerry to agree with the intelligence, or that he should have been smart enough to realize it was faulty? And how would Bush himself answer those questions?

He showed Congress the intelligence he WANTED to show them, and now we all know it.

:headbang:
rocknation

[dogtag]

18. Kerry can use Shrub's discomfort with his daddy issue

and kill two birds with one stone.

Kerry can say that he didn't vote for the 1991 war becuase he had concerns about the rationale, but Bush 41 was an honorable man. Based on that experience, he voted in favor of Shrub's bait and switch authorization on the assumption that he was also trustworthy. "I was wrong."

Clean it up and it would be a killer statement.

[MsUnderstood]

9. Here is the comparision

I read a book.

You ask how was the book?

I tell you my summary on the book.

Do you know all about the book now?

No, you know what I told you about the book. In most cases that is okay, but what if I didn't like the book, wanted to disparage the author, Misread information contained in the book.

Kerry and the Senators and the congressmen saw so much LESS information than the pentagon showed the Commander in Cheif. You can't release all the top secret information to our government or it isn't top secret!!

[seabeyond]

10. cheney had his own govt set up within white house

to decipher thru what they wanted that would promote war and get rid of what suggested no war. also he used intimidation on the cia agents if they didn't give him what he wanted.

we knew this at the time, almost, and we know it now

[cal04]

11. Kerry should answer back with what happened to the pages

that were torn out. I don't think anyone saw the same intelligence
they did.

America Tore Out 8000 Pages of Iraq Dossier
Current and former UN diplomats are said to be livid at what some have called the 'theft' of the Iraqi document by the US. Hans von Sponeck, the former assistant general secretary of the UN and the UN's humanitarian co- ordinator in Iraq until 2000, said: 'This is an outrageous attempt by the US to mislead.'

Although the five permanent members of the security council -- the US, the UK, France, China and Russia -- have had access to the complete version, there was agreement that the US be allowed to edit the dossier on the ground that its contents were 'risky' in terms of security on weapons proliferation.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines02/1222-02.htm

[guitar man]

13. Kerry and the rest of congress

Saw the *Cliffs Notes* version. I think it is a good and accurate meme to describe what happened, no? :shrug:

[w13rd0]

14. When BushCheney say "intelligence agencies"......

...they are including the OSP. So they'll say "intelligence agencies said this", when one of said "intelligence agencies" operated as a front for their already established positions, cooking the intel to suit their agenda. This has not been addressed.

[no safe haven]

20. Exactly.....

This is the bottom line. Kerry needs to make the distinction between “mainstream” intelligence and Rumsfeld/Wolfowitz’s OSP who manufactured the lies for the consumption of not only the American people but the entire world. And what does it say of * when it was his own hand-picked gang of liars that fabricated this travesty in the first place? If * had “the same intelligence as Kerry”, then that’s proof enough that * knows nothing of what is going on under nose (at the very least).

[Mountainman]

21. Maybe Powell will come out and talk about the OSP

Someone creditable should step up.

[rocktivity]

23. Would it be fair to say that the purpose of the Office of Special Plans

was to circumvent the intelligence gathering of the CIA et al in Iraq.

:headbang:
rocknation

[no safe haven]

25. Looks that way from where I'm sitting

But then I'm a cynic.:evilgrin: There was ample other intel demonstrating that the tubes and yellow cake stories were outright lies, but your boy (and *mine* = Howard) CHOSE to follow the OSP/PNAC agenda.

[Hot Water]

15. Kerry campaign kills this....it's over.

It's his only hope. He said it again today.

He has to make people believe Kerry would have done the same thing if he was President. All the other news is killing him daily.

This has got to be blown away. I don't know why Kerry didn't do it in the debate. But he has got to debunk, crush and humiliate Bush on this point before it gets legs to the undecideds.

This is the ONLY thing Bush has left to try to sell. Kerry has to convince the country this is absurd, as it is pathetic. Or, IT WILL BE SERIOUS.

[ThoughtCriminal]

16. Fool me once...?

nt

[DesEtoiles]

17. Kerry was not the president at that time - you were

[ClintonTyree]

19. Kerry sees much more information than Bush does...........

Bush is the most intellectually lazy man on the planet. He never looks at ANYTHING that's given him. He has his Cabinet members and aides look at it all and give him thier assessment.
Now, Kerry did NOT have access to all of the information that the Cabinet members had,not even close.
Another lie by the Bushies to escape responsibility for their actions. They're NEVER wrong, even now they won't admit their monumental fuckups.

[mzmolly]

24. "Kerry saw the intelligence I WANTED him to"

is a more accurate statement. :hi:

[Hot Water]

27. It's as if he's trying to imply Kerry was as misled as he was.

That should win the academy award for balls of the year.

Kerry was only a senator at the time of his urgent need to invade. As an officially nominated candidate for President, I believe both are kept currently up to date with all incoming information.

But not when he was merely a senator. Not only that, there were all kinds of cautions, caveats and disagreements between the very members who were providing the intelligence that only Bush saw. That was made blatantly clear in the 911 reports.

But people don't know this. Hell, 35% still think Saddam was smoking his victory cigar when the towers fell.

That's why I can't emphasize this enough. Right now they're scrambling to find another cup to put the ball under. They're desperate to find cover. They've been playing three card monty from day one.

Kerry has got to just humiliate him and drive it like a nail into his coffin, on this absurdity in front of this large audience Friday. Do not let this become another Swift Boat illusion.

[Disturbed]

29. The last dot to be connected...

OSP. The Bush admin. is guilty of fraud and an illegal invasion of a sovereign country, Iraq. This can be proven. Will Kerry have the stones to do so?