Will the NDP benefit from Martin shifting Liberals rightward?

[Cascadian]

What is Paul Martin's problem? Is he really trying to do to the Liberals what Tony Blair did to Britain's Labour Party? I thought it was silly for Martin to dump Carolyn Parrish from the Liberal caucus for being critical, and rightly so, of America. She was only expressing the opinion of what almost everybody around the world (even in some corners of America.) thinks of the U.S. I also find it disturbing that Martin and his allies were in favor of Canada joining the American invasion of Iraq. Your country would very likely become more of a terrorist target if that happened. It would also seem that some of his domestic policies are quite "Tory-Lite" from where I am sitting.

Will this swing to the right and Martin's disire to be Bush's Canadian poodle may hurt the Liberals in the long run and give the NDP more support?

John

[Feathered Fish]

1. I am a longtime Lib

but the second that PM took over from Chretien, I was out. Not only a tory in disguise, but his actions in cementing his popularity in his own party were reprehensible. I know people that were completely banished from riding associations in 2003/2004 for supporting Chretien in the 1990 leadership. The party basically had a bunch of thugs that were pushing the old libs right out, getting fired for no said reason, changing the party membership rules and other fishy things. I lost all respect for the young Libs too after being accused of being a socialist at a meeting. To hell with him and the Federal Liberals.

[Telly Savalas]

2. Perhaps

But the benefit the NDP might get in winning a few extra seats in the next election will be outweighed by the adverse effects the rightwing policies will have on all Canadians.

[V. Kid]

3. Maybe

But the Liberals are nothing if not opportunists. They want power and if the rank and file are smart and Martin doesn't win a majority, or even looses the next election he's basically toast. This could trigger a civil war in the Liberal Party. When Shiela Copps claimed Martin was going to liquidate parts of the Canada Health Act (I think it was that specific thing) it was sort of a shot along Martin's bow.

The NDP thought they would've gained from this last election but they didn't. This can be easily explained -- in BC they were decimated in the 2001 provincial election and are now recovering, SK has a tired NDP government (13 years and counting) -- Jack Layton is a new leader and he wasn't able to effectively convince enough people that either he or the NDP was a viable choice. I think the NDP realizes they need to hammer the Liberals, and when they hammer the Conservatives it only drives possible supporters to the Liberals who claim that they "share the NDP's values". Of course the NDP should attack the Conservatives in areas that have a mainly NDP vs Conservative dynamic but the NDP should be focused on attacking the Liberals, especially when they are in government. Sometimes the claim that the Libs and Cons are the same can be used.

[Feathered Fish]

4. Also a matter of strategic voting

You're correct to point out the wariness Canadians have regarding the NDP, but also it had a lot to do with stopping the new tories and their gang of thugs. In the GTA, I get the sense that people who had the intention of voting NDP went to the polling station and thought if 'I vote NDP, I could very well be ensuring a Cons. gov't'. Give it time, if Layton plays his cards right by keeping the pressure on Martin to make sure that the liberal government stays on the left side of centre, he will be more successful next election.
By the way, welcome to DU!:hi:

[V. Kid]

9. true

Yeah true. In BC I got the sense that a lot of people wanted to vote Liberal to stop the Cons yet some of the races the Cons weren't even a factor. Some other races were NDP vs Con and voting for a Liberal when one ‘wanted’ to vote NDP only elected a Con. As such the best NDP strategy is to insist they are basically the same -- and pointing out to people that Martin is pretty conservative himself and doesn't believe in "NDP principles" (a hilarious statement to be sure).

Thanks for the welcome. :)

I hate to call people stupid, but a lot were uninformed. They really need to check out the dynamics of their local races before they make a decision to vote 'strategically'. Lets not forget that we only vote for an MP (technically) -- we don't vote for a Party leader or a Party (even though those are clearly influential factors).

[Swede]

5. I think Martin is far more left leaning than you think.

I think if given some time in office this will be more apparent.

[Feathered Fish]

6. How do you figure?

Not trying to flame you, but I'm just curious what would lead you to that conclusion?

[Swede]

8. It's hard to explain,but I think he is going to be a good PM.

Something about him makes me believe he is goint to surprise a lot of his critics.

[V. Kid]

10. I don't know about that

He comes across as honourable but....

Let's not forget that he organized a coup against Chretien that makes me wonder about his character. He didn't intervene in the Copps/Valeri fight yet he appointed various candidates in other places. So how does he believe in solving the democratic deficit when he has done things that are so contrary to his rhetoric on the issue?

Besides he voted for Ed Broadbents motion back in 1989 to eliminate child poverty by 2000. When he was Finance Minister he cut back on programmes that could've solved this. His father was a solid left leaning liberal. But he is clearly a right leaning liberal. He has to earn my support, and considering the fact that he's chosen businesses over the population quite often -- I doubt he'll get my support.

Besides his political skills leave a lot to be desired. Why did he call that election when it was so obvious that the best outcome he could hope for was a solid minority? Not to bright it you ask me.

[Joel]

13. time will tell

When he was Finance Minister he cut back on programs that could've solved this.

Saving the country's economy from stagnation. He has done some tough things, but I think he did them for the right reasons.

That said he's got some honesty issues and he's pretty greasy whenever a scandal pops up. However, I think we can agree on the fact that he has earn his support. Now that he has the chance (money) to fix some of the problems he helped cause it will show his true colour.

[Spazito]

7. If Martin continues to veer more right, I certainly will be ...

putting more effort toward the NDP and I normally vote Liberal. If he and his government okay MDS, I will give my everything to try and defeat them while making sure the faux repub lites don't get in either. If needs be, will work toward another minority government but with more seats by NDP than currently.

[Iceburg]

12. Following your lead and breaking new trails

a) If he sends troops to Iraq or
b) Back tracks on Health Care or
c) Back tracks on gay marriage

...I will do everything within my where-with-all to put more NDPers on the Hill.

And as far as Dolton McGuinty's provincial government is concerned: He has already crossed the line with the Health Care tax. Legislating the Ontario doctors to be on fixed salaries will be the last straw.

[canuckforpeace]

11. After Bush's visit I feel I made the right choice voting NDP

I wish we had never let * across our border. It made me sick to see Martin shaking hands with a war criminal. And to see * sitting in front of that backdrop featuring Winston Churchill and Roosevelt at Pier 21 in Halifax, well all I can say is WHAT A JOKE!