Canada... What's it like?

[dolgoruky]

I know that this is a kind of general question, but how do you Canadian folks find life in Canada? I mean, day to day living.

The reason I ask is that I'm a Brit currently looking for a neutral country to settle in as as Mrs Dolgoruky is not British and my son is somwhere in between, nationality-wise. We've had problems settling in our respective countries (and believe me, we've tried) so a third option seems the most appropriate.

Thanks for any answers

[Puzzler]

1. If your British...

... you'll find Canada a good place to settle. In particular the west coast, because of the very mild climate (both winter and summer).

(I'm originally from the UK)


-P

[dolgoruky]

2. Weather is not a problem

I lived in Russia for four years, so cold or hot, I don't care. Just looking for a place where my kid can grow up relatively normally and where you can leave your flat without being hassled by the cops, blown up by fundamentalists, beaten up by disaffected youths, or seeing Tony Blair's ugly grid on the telly every five minutes.

That's the kind of thing I've got on my shopping list. (ha!)

[Puzzler]

4. Then...

... you'll be fine in Canada. Also, outside of the Scandinavian countries, it has one of the highest standards of living in the world (not just in terms of per capita income, but in other aspects, including low infant mortality, etc.)


-P

[James T. Kirk]

3. I suggest the USA.

America is big and varied enough to suit any sort of lifestyle from urban living to the most remote cabin. Tell us what you're looking for and I'll bet we could come up with some place here that could be what you are looking for!
:D

[Glorfindel]

5. Abso-damn-lutely...

If you're straight, white, wealthy, and Republican, the good ol' USA is paradise.

:party:

[James T. Kirk]

12. I don't meet all of those criteria, but I love America and ...

...I think it's a great place to live.

[HEyHEY]

14. But it's not as great as Canada

As we have the same features you outlined plus the added feature of sanity.

[James T. Kirk]

20. Haha, that's funny! You little Canadians are so cute!

Canada is "great"! I'd say it's good, but not "great".

[Mother Jones]

22. uh....the original poster asked what Canada was like, dear....

don't turn this into 'my dad's bigger than your dad' nonsense.

Many of us who live here can find a myriad of reasons as to why the originator of this thread should choose to live here....not to mention why we feel it is "great".

And incidentally, did you know your idol, Captain James T. Kirk happens to be a Canadian?

[HEyHEY]

26. I was just gonna say that!

He shares my birthday too!

[iverglas]

98. oops

I was gonna say it first! ... yesterday ... but I had to go get dinner, so I waited til today and I went ahead and said it and *now* I see you guys have said it already ...

[James T. Kirk]

32. Heyhey said Canada is greater than the USA.

I'm getting the impression that Canadians are arrogant. They think they're so much better than everyone else, including Americans. I would guess it's based on jealousy.

[achtung_circus]

35. Well, I'm proud to be a Canadian.

I think that it is a great country, the UN tends to agree

Top Ten Ranking Countries:

1. Norway
2. Sweden
3. Australia
4. Canada
5. The Netherlands
6. Belgium
7. Iceland
8. United States
9. Japan
10. Ireland

<http://www.canadiancontent.net/commtr/article_695.html>

You call it arrogance, I call it pride.

tom-eh-to
to-mah-to

[HEyHEY]

37. Jealousy HA!

You're the one who came on here with an arrogant attitude buddy not me.
Jealous... one thing Canadians aren't jealous of it's a nation with race problems, gun toting rednecks, crazy drug problems, gang problems, a moron for a leader, and more morons than the eye can see.

Jealousy is the argument dumb hot girls use in high school to justify why smart people don't like them.

[James T. Kirk]

121. I'm trying to get your goat and it was so easy!

Canadians are so touchy!

[tuvor]

38. All of your impressions are quite mistaken.

And that's about all I'll say about THAT.

[iverglas]

99. oh! an original thought!

I would guess it's based on jealousy.

Not. Like, really, really not. Original.

But heck, if it makes ya feel good, eh?

Just sad how much it does tend to make other people really, really not like you.

But hey, maybe if you go bomb them a lot so that they too can have what you've got that they're so damn jealous of, they'll grow to love you.

[CanuckAmok]

143. I say instead of debating it, you just bomb and occupy us.

Seems to work elsewhere. ;-) :hide:

[ailsagirl]

142. Good comeback, Mother Jones!! :=D

[HEyHEY]

25. It's a world leader in "Not being a collective jackass"

You're nation is close... just take out the "not"

[HEyHEY]

29. May I add we're the "cute" country that kicked your ass in 1812

[James T. Kirk]

33. Back in 1812, Canada was a colony of the imperialists.

We became independent a long time before that.

[HEyHEY]

36. That doesn't change the fact we kicked your ass

We didn't become a nation before cause we weren't a bunch a traitors

[James T. Kirk]

42. Well, you didn't really have a choice in kicking ass, did you?

You willingly went to war because you were ordered by your imperialist masters.

You seem very proud of your warlike history. You Canadians are so jingoistic! I'm glad we're in a military alliance with you!

[Maple]

50. Actually we did it

5 times, not just once in 1812.

And we did it because we were invaded, not because anyone could order us to.

We aren't warlike, but we have certainly gone to war...WWI and II and Korea.

We prefer peacekeeping, and aren't in a 'military alliance' with the US.

[James T. Kirk]

120. Yo are so in an alliance with us! Ever heard of NATO & NORAD?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nato

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norad

You are so allied with us! Recall that you sent troops to Afghanistan after al Qaeda attacked on 9/11/01 as part of your NATO treaty obligations. Also, you have been for decades in formal cooperation with us for the strategic defense of the continent as part of NORAD.

Thanks! We could not be the military power we are without your cooperation.

[Maple]

128. NATO

involves a lot of countries. NORAD didn't get to involve Star Wars.

You are on your own in Iraq.

[James T. Kirk]

136. NATO

Yes, you are in a military alliance with all of the NATO countries. We can count on you to watch the backs of all the NATO countries while we have troops in Iraq! Thanks for backing all of us up!

[HEyHEY]

137. You don't deserve backup as your mission there is a farce

We don't kill unless we NEED to

[James T. Kirk]

140. So, on what date is Canada withdrawing from NATO?

I want to record it on my calendar.
:P

[Zhade]

141. You're gay? I didn't know that!

:D

[iverglas]

97. it took me a day to stop snickering

I mean ... you do know that James T. Kirk is Canadian, right?

America is big and varied enough to suit any sort of lifestyle from urban living to the most remote cabin.

Somebody's probably got around to asking this by now, but ... and this would distinguish the United States from Canada ... how?

[Beaver Tail]

6. It feels good

It feels good to know if I ever have a heart attack or stroke I will not lose everything I own.

It feels good to know religious fundamentalist do not have sway in my countries politics.

It feels good to know that my government does not “hop into war” just because someone else says so.

It feels good to be Canadian.

I did not mention we have never had a terrorist attack on our soil because it is only a matter of time before it happens.

[HEyHEY]

17. Uh we've had over 50 terrorist attacks in Canada

"I did not mention we have never had a terrorist attack on our soil because it is only a matter of time before it happens."

The FLQ loved to blow up shit in Montreal in the 70s

[James T. Kirk]

23. Canadian war #1 - Afghanistan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_history_of_Canada#Canada_in_the_Gulf_War_and_Afghanistan

[James T. Kirk]

24. Canadian war # - Persian Gulf War

[Mother Jones]

30. You have alot of nerve undermining something you know nothing about.

As was pointed out to you, our country went through a very serious crisis. We were subjected to terrorist attacks, the likes of which prompted our federal govt to call in the military.

We would never laugh or joke about any form of terror acts against your country, from the Oklahoma city bombings to 9/11. Yet somehow you feel it is ok to laugh at ours.

[James T. Kirk]

34. So your complaint should be about Beaver Tail, not me.

He said Canada does not "hop" into wars in her "it feels good" post #6. Pay attention and stop jumping to conclusions. Now take that back.

I did not say anything about terrorism, I think Canada can be proud of the use of its military in the war against terrorism in Afghanistan.

[moez]

7. I can't remember...

If it's cold and nasty... or, just nasty and cold....

It's one of those two, though.

[Swede]

10. It's 30 degress Celsius here right now.

No war,no health care scares, no pollution,yep pretty nasty.

[moez]

16. Oh yeah I forgot.... it's July 26...

This is part of your 2 weeks of summer... Live it up!

[HEyHEY]

18. And apparently we have a much better education system

Based on the knowledge you've expressed.

Between April and October it never gets below 12 (54f) degrees were I live with highs up to 40 (110F) degrees in summer.

And get this! I live in a desert too!

[Swede]

19. It's been summer here for 8 weeks now,20 degrees and warmer.

still august and september left. :)

[auntAgonist]

8. I'll put my 2 cents in for

South Western Ontario. Canada is a lovely place to live. I too am British. My family immigrated (emigrated?) to Canada when I was 10 years old. Canadian people are very accepting and outgoing. Health care isn't as bad as some would have you believe. I think you could settle quite nicely there.

best of luck!

[Mother Jones]

9. I love living here!

Hearing daily news out of the U.S since 2000 has reminded me just how lucky we are.

It's not just one thing. It's a combination of them all. Clean, green, accepting, diverse, etc... the list is endless.

While not perfect, I can honestly tell you that I believe I live in the best country in the world.

[best left blank]

11. Clean and green?

You must be referring to some bizarro world Canada.

[Mother Jones]

13. Relatively speaking...

And compared to many, we are....very much so.

Not trying to antagonize here, but this is a fact, based on my own travels abroad.

[best left blank]

21. Well...

We're one of the worst polluters in the world.

[HEyHEY]

27. But we mean well!

[Mother Jones]

28. Disagree!

Ever been to Japan? They are MUCH worse for pollution and waste. (that I have personally witnessed, at least) I imagine China and India are close runners-up.


I will say our govt can do ALOT better in terms of 'greening', but we are miles ahead of many.

Ever driven through NY State or Michigan and seen the garbage strewn about? Many parts of the U.S don't even have recycling programs in place yet.

[tuvor]

39. Come on up and check it out for yourself sometime.

It's clear you need some educating.

[best left blank]

43. I live in Canada, thank you....

Victoria, Montreal, Saint John, Halifax, Charlottetown and St. John's continue to use their surrounding waters as large toilet bowls to discharge their filth - human waste and toxic chemical cocktails - with little or no sewage treatment, says the report that graded 22 cities across Canada.


from: http://www.safewater.org/PublicEducation/inthenews/meissner.htm

here's another quote

"In a report from the NAFTA Commission for Environmental Cooperation, Ontario was the third-worst polluting state or province in both Canada and the United States in 2000 (see graph). In addition, Canadian toxic air emissions from plants and mills increased by 7% from 1998 to 2000 while those in the United States fell by 8% over the same period."

and another

"In 2001, Canada was one of the world's leading carbon emitting countries, generating 156.2 million metric tons (mmt) of energy related carbon emissions (2.5% of the world total)"


So... apparently I am not the one in need of educating.

[Maple]

47. Then clean it up !

No country is perfect. All of them have problems, but Canada has fewer than most.

The US is actually the world's worst polluter. Canada is currently implementing Kyoto.

But if it's not fast enough for you, then pitch in and help.

[best left blank]

49. I do.

I am very involved, thank you.

[Maple]

51. Then stop complaining about it

[best left blank]

53. Are you for real?

What is this? A Canada love-in board, or a political discussion board?

[Maple]

54. Actually this is

the Canadian page you're on.

Are you Canadian?

You're certainly not on topic.

[best left blank]

57. Yes, I am Canadian.

But everyone here seems so incredibly satisfied. Sure, we look great in comparison to our neighbours, but shouldn't we have a higher standard than that?

[Maple]

58. Most people living here are

but I don't think any Canadian ever stopped trying to make things better.

Well, beyond the few rightwingers we have in the Cons.

However, complaints alone aren't very useful.

[Mother Jones]

127. Wow, what a difference a day makes! lol

I know what you're saying blb, and as a fellow environmentalist and greenpeace supporter, I don't entirely disagree with what you're trying to say.

Wasn't going to get into it in this thread, however, it seems to have gone astray already.

Yes, we SHOULD have higher standards. No, we should never stop trying to improve and doing better. Agreed. Period.

I was only trying to point out that we do take steps in the right direction - earmarking federal $$ for Kyoto, for example. Not perfect, but a wonderful first step. We have emission standards on most vehicles, extensive recycling programs, increasing investment into alternative fuels, etc...

In my travels, I have seen smog and waste unlike I've ever seen here. Places I truly adored and love - the french riviera, for example. Can't say enough about it, however, the garbage and waste on the street was so bad, there were times I couldn't open my apt. window.
In Japan, every single purchase, came in a package, in a box, wrapped with ribbons, which was then re-wrapped in an outer box, then more ribbon, and finally a bag. None were made of recycled materials either.

I could go on and on...We all need to do our part to ensure every level of govt is pressured to do the right thing for our environment. It's because I love my country that I want to do these things.

If I may ask, what country would you suggest the original poster consider living?

[HEyHEY]

15. Awful place - People wear hats on their feet and hamburgers eat people!

Seriously though, terrific place, amazing cultural blending combined with Canadian blandness to smooth it all out. I suggest Vancouver, Montreal or Halifax.

[Hieronymus]

41. Montreal sounds intriguing.

I thought I might like Toronto, as it's a large city. Tell me more about Halifax.:hi:

[HEyHEY]

86. Halifax is an old, ultra cool city on the East coast

Very Historic, very colourful, great shops and amazing people.

Hell of a nightlife too.

Still, it's no Vancouver!

[Hieronymus]

119. Thanks for the picture.

I did look it up on the internet. You say Vancouver has a good nite life? And how about Montreal? Do stores, restaurants, bars etc. stay open late in Canada?

[HEyHEY]

135. Vancouver's Nightlife is bland

Compared to other cities... but it's adequate... and worth giving up for the daytime action, which is the best.

Vancouver bars can stay open till 4 A.M. But most close at 2 0r 3. IN Montreal all bars are pretty well open till 3. SHops and stuff are open till nine, ten downtown. Montreal Nightlife is insane and racy... probably the wildest in North America... Quebec city is nuts too.
QC is alot like Belgian cities (I'm told).

Vancouver's main attraction is natural beauty, do a google image search. Plus it has an interesting blend of cultures and it's own distinct kinda arcane quality, a very VERY Liberal city too.. probably the most liberal on the continent, one of the most Liberal in the world for sure... there is a city issued sign as you drive in, "Welcome to Vancouver - a nuclear weapons free zone."

[glarius]

31. Toronto is just about the most multicultural city in the world.

I believe it was just recently declared to be the world's most multicultural city by the United Nations or somebody...I forget who...It's a great city....I lived there 4 years and loved it....

[Maple]

40. I live in southern Ontario

near the city of London...which has about 350,000 people here. I am 3 hours away from Toronto which has 4 million people.

Summers are hot and humid, and where I live winters are just a couple of months of messy weather. We don't need to shovel the driveway because there is very little snow.

This is the most crowded part of Canada, and yet you can drive for miles without seeing buildings. Canada is the second largest country in the world as only Russia is bigger, but we only have 32 million people.

We have public health care and most companies have dental and drug plans...our drugs are cheaper in any case under the law.

Mixed race and mixed nationality marriages are commonplace. We have a gun registry, and a very low crime rate. We have the highest rate of university graduates in the OECD.

Canadians are very polite, and very tolerant. We now have gay marriage all across the country, and are about to decriminalize pot. It's already used medically.

There is no deficit..we've had a surplus instead for many years, and the national debt is only half of one years GDP.

We have a Parliament and MPs nationally, and the Liberal party has been in power for 80% of Canada's history...which officially started in 1867.

Official languages are English and French, official sports are hockey and lacrosse, and we are multicultural.

You can buy British food here in the grocery stores...along with food from just about everywhere else too. Same with wine, beer and spirits. British pubs, Indian, Thai, Vietnamese restaurants...you name it.

I go out for a walk late at night, every night, and have never had a problem. If you meet anyone they say 'hello, lovely night,' and keep going.

Canada accepts more legal immigrants relative to its population than any country on Earth


Have I missed anything you might want to know?

[KurtNYC]

44. As unofficial president of the unofficial Canada Fan Club

can add a few more?

Best overall quality of life
In a recent quality-of-life ranking of 205 world cities by Mercer Human Resources Consulting, five Canadian cities ranked among the top 25.
Highest Standard of Living
Commonly measured by real GDP per capita, Canada grew faster than any other G7 country over the 1997-2003 period. This turnaround is due to improvements in Canada’s productivity growth and a rise in its employment rate.
Lowest Cost of Living
The cost of living in most large Canadian cities is lower than or comparable to similar U.S. cities.
Best in addressing environmental concerns
Canada ranks best among the G7 countries in addressing environmental concerns such as air and water pollution, land protection, and greenhouse emissions.
Safest Place to live
Canada is well known as a safe, just and peaceful society. Canadian crime rates have been falling steadily since the 1990s. Canada tops the G7 countries as a safe place to live and conduct business and also has the most fairly administered judicial system.
Best Human Development
In the latest United Nations Human Development Report, Canada ranked first among the G7 countries and fourth among 177 countries surveyed.
http://www.investincanada.gc.ca/en/885/A_Great_Place_to_Live.html

A great place to raise your family?

In 2002, Canadian Craig Keilberger became the youngest person ever nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize at the age of 19. At age 12, Craig founded and ran a worldwide organization that fights child labor and abuse.
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1033938354944_9?s_name=&no_ads=

[iverglas]

105. oh - London!

*That* explains it.

Remember, I'm from London - emphasis on the from. I guess you were just ahead of me in high school then.

London's the place that had approximately two black families in the 1950s, and has all those trees, and everybody lives in a big house on a quiet street and nobody has any problems. It really *is* the place where everybody thinks happy thoughts and never gets sent to the cornfield.

In London, even electing a Liberal was unheard of until 1968. Nice people just didn't do such things.

So one can understand why a Liberal thinks, in 2005, that s/he is in the middle of the road! Back in the 1960s, a Liberal in London would have been convinced s/he was Tommy Douglas.

[Maple]

107. I think you've missed the entire point

I'm between London and Windsor actually, and London in 2005 is very different that it was half a century ago...but I was answering the original poster here...who didn't ask to know all your political campaign talking points.

They just wanted to know what it was like to live in Canada on a daily basis.

If you want to campaign, or discuss all the pros and cons of Canada as you see them...start a new thread.

Nobody shits on their own country quite like Canadian out-of-power party members. :D

[iverglas]

109. oooh -- me too!

I wouldn't have wanted to be left out now, would I?

Let me see ... shall I love it ... or leave it? ... love it ... or leave it?

If you want to campaign, or discuss all the pros and cons of Canada as you see them...start a new thread.

If you want to say "if you want to campaign" to me, come up with some evidentiary basis for the implied claim that I'm campaigning.

If you want to tell me that anyone's opinions about the present state of affairs in Canada are inappropriate in a thread that began with a question about what it's like in Canada, then you'll be pissing in the wind. Of course, you seem to be enjoying doing that, from the massive amount of it I see here, so don't let me stop you. I'm certainly not going to suggest that you go piss on some other thread. Not for me to say!

Nobody shits on their own country quite like Canadian out-of-power party members.

Ah yes. That would be the flip side of "Canadians are just jealous of Americans".

So I guess if bestleftblank is a Conservative, you're ...? I mean, by your logic and all.

And as far as your assertion that the original poster "just wanted to know what it was like to live in Canada on a daily basis" and your evident belief that this request is satisfied by saying "just peachy", I'll give the original poster a little more credit, myself.

[Maple]

111. Focus on the topic

and not on pontificating about your political agenda, and just answer the man's questions.

Cheezus...everything is a do-or-die scrum with you wing types.

[iverglas]

113. now if you could just tell us assembled masses

what post 107 had to do with "the topic" ...

Or what 92% of your posts in this thread have had to do with the topic.

Ain't this (e.g. the post to which I am responding) just the sort of behaviour that, when repeated in large doses, gets threads locked?

Fortunately, we're down here in the Canada forum, where nobody pays any attention to us ...


Cheezus...everything is a do-or-die scrum with you wing types.

And I match your revolting cheezies with a bag of Miss Vickie's, yum yummm.

'Cause the only doing or dying I'm smelling around here is wafting over on cheezie breath.

It's a gooooood life.

http://www.tzworld.com/ITSAGOODLIFE_EP.html

Now I'd like to introduce you to some of the people of Peaksville, Ohio.

This is Mr. Fremont. It's in his farmhouse that the monster resides. This is Mrs. Fremont.

And this is Aunt Amy, who probably had more control over the monster in the beginning than almost anyone. But one day she forgot. She began to sing aloud. Now, the monster doesn't like singing, so his mind snapped at her, and turned her into the smiling, vacant thing you're looking at now. She sings no more.

And you'll note that the people in Peaksville, Ohio, have to smile. They have to think happy thoughts and say happy things because, once displeased, the monster can wish them into a cornfield or change them into a grotesque walking horror. This particular monster can read minds you see. He knows every thought, he can feel every emotion. Oh yes, I did forget something didn't I.

This is the monster. His name is Anthony Fremont. He's six years old, with a cute little-boy face and blue, guiless eyes. But when those eyes look at you, you'd better start thinking happy thoughts, because the mind behind tem is absolutely in charge. This, is the Twilight Zone."

Liberal Party goooood. Everything in Canada gooooood.

No problems here, no sirree. Move along now, folks. There's nothing to see here. THE EMPEROR IS WEARING CLOTHES, I tell you.

[Maple]

115. Lord Durham 1839 report discussion

...any minute now folks.

:boring:

[IntravenousDemilo]

138. I've got this sudden uncontrollable urge to listen to Barnes & Barnes. nm

[hermetic]

45. The worst thing about Canada

is there ARE people up there who want the country to be just like the U.S. I do so wish you could round them up and then we could play swaps. I'd gladly trade places with someone up there who would rather be down here. And I am, very clearly, not alone.

[Maple]

46. Heh well we keep inviting them

to leave. Offer to pay their bus fare even. :D

Defeat them in every election too.

They're a very small group...just loud.

But we'd much prefer Dems.

[best left blank]

48. Really?

Defeat them in every election? Maybe in Manitoba and Quebec.

[Maple]

52. I have no idea

what you're talking about. Cons haven't been in power since Mulroney.

[best left blank]

55. Oh the Cons...

I see. Anyhow, they're in power in Alberta. And the Libs are doing a pretty good job of impersonating the old 'Red Tory' stance.

[Maple]

56. Alberta has PCs

and hasn't changed in over 30 years. SoCred before that.

Who did you think I was talking about with 'rightwingers'?

I was a Red Tory...since they've disappeared, I now vote Liberal

[iverglas]

103. haha haha!

*I* got it.

;)

[best left blank]

59. To answer the original poster's question...

Canada looks great when compared to our neighbours to the south. But in all honesty, we have our fair share of problems. Health care is under attack, tuition fees are rising at an alarming rate, air quality keeps getting worse, government treatment of first nations peoples is appalling, urban sprawl is out of control, the love affair with the automobile, we're getting fatter, more segregated, regionalism is at an all time high, our federal government is corrupt, abuses of power by police...the list goes on.

But the biggest problem is that people are so satisfied with our progress, only because we look better than our neighbours.

[Maple]

60. Gee, you wouldn't be a Con wouldja?

Sounds like the usual list of complaints.

None of those things are going on.

[best left blank]

61. So...anyone who disagrees with you...

is a Conservative? Really? When was the last time you heard a conservative complain about out country's mistreatment of the first nations people? Or a "liberal" mention it for that matter?

I can pretty much glean from your posts that you are much closer to being a conservative than I am. But then again, I'm not really into the guilt by association method of argument. But to say "None of those things are going on" is patently absurd.

[Maple]

63. LOL you are entitled

to your own opinion, just not to your own facts.

None of those things are going on I'm afraid.

[best left blank]

64. None?

Tuition is not going up?
Urban Sprawl is not taking place?
Canadian aren't getting fatter?
The healthcare system isn;t under attack (from conservatives)?
Regionalism isn't high? (check the last election results)
There isn't a gross mis-justice with the way the government treats natives?
Corruption? Err...despite lack of coverage, the ad scandal is still ongoing

Honestly, do you live in Canada?

[Maple]

66. None

See, post 65

And I'm sorry, but what a couple of local guys did in Quebec ten years ago isn't of much interest to Canadians.

It was known before the last election. The Liberals got whapped for it, and life goes on.

[iverglas]

101. you'll get used to it

Once you've been told the way it is, there's no point in requesting the facts that lead to the conclusion.

But hey, I'll keep reading and see whether you've had any better luck ...

[best left blank]

131. Nice to see...

...that there are people here who are not blinded my partisanship.

[best left blank]

62. Also...

Could you do me a favour and demonstrate how any one of those issues can be considered a Conservative issue?

[Maple]

65. Sure...

health care is 'under attack' by the Cons because they want to move to the American system, so they try to make ours look bad.

Tuition fees are actually very low, and the new budget helped even further. We now have a couple of foundations that will be kicking in shortly, and the premiers themselves are finally making an effort.

Canada is undertaking the implementation of Kyoto, and the list of areas in need of aid are being ticked off one by one.

We have just signed a new deal with the First Nations that they are tickled about. Reading Tom Flannagans book about them will explain the 'assimilation' he wants imposed on them as a solution.

Hard to have 'urban sprawl' in a country that's 90% empty. :D

Canadians need cars to get around...it's a big place, but we are switching to ethanol and hybrids, and we are big on fuel cells.

I don't know of any 'regionalism' beyond the usual kvetching from the Byfields of Alberta.

We aren't remotely segregated, and speak for yourself on 'fatter'.

It's the latest medical fad in the US and UK though.

Mostly it's a long litany of Conservative complaints to try and make Canadians feel bad about their country, and therefore willing to become American. Isn't working. Matter of fact, trashing Canada is the quickest way I know to turn off voters.

[best left blank]

67. Ok...

You do realise that 2 tier health care has essentially been okayed in Quebec, don't you?

Yes, the new budget (more specifically the NDPs contribution) might hold tuition for undergraduate studies. Many grad programs are now deregulated.

Kyoto is a joke. The government keeps pushing back their deadlines. We need something stronger.

I'm aware of the new deal. Are you familiar with Dudley George?

Apparently you don't know what Urban Sprawl is.

We need cars to get around? How about public transit?

You don't know of any regionalism? Did you see the last election results.

Not getting fatter? Well then Health Canada is lying. Pick your poison.

Willing ot become American? Give me a break. And leave up to a former "Red Tory' to refer to this as 'trashing Canada,' it's actually called democracy.

[Maple]

70. And again

the court decided that under the Quebec, not federal, bill of rights, the man was entitled to buy health insurance. Quebec plans to 'notwithstand' it.

We had insurance for it only a few years ago though. Most countries do. It's not a problem, and may help a great deal. Countries will try lots of things in future to help alleviate costs. It's eating up budgets as boomers age, and equipment becomes more high tech.

I repeat, education is being addressed, but our tuition costs are very low. Americans come here specifically for the cost. All of education needs to be overhauled...however it's a provincial matter and they get very touchy about it. The feds are trying to help though.

Kyoto is being implemented, and other countries are having trouble with it too, but we're all trying. There are no 'overnight' miracles

Dudley George was under that 'fantastic' provincial Con govt we had...and no longer do.

We don't have 'urban sprawl'

Many places don't have the option of 'public transit' either, beyond a bus service.

Nothing wrong with the last election results. People were annoyed at the Liberals. It has nothing to do with regionalism.

Gee, you gonna institute anti-fat laws?

I guess if a country isn't 100% perfect, 100% of the time...at least according to your views, then it should be wiped out eh?

If you wanna trash Canada, go join a Con site. They excel at it.

It's the only thing they DO excell at. :D

[best left blank]

71. Are you familiar with the phrase...

Strawman?

Guilt by Association?

How about 'putting words into people's mouths'?

Honestly, how am I trashing Canada? But pointing out its flaws? I must have been ill informed about the concept of democracy then.

[Maple]

73. How about the phrase 'political agenda'?

And this is not the forum for campaigning.

In fact, there is no election going on to campaign for

[best left blank]

75. What?

This isn't a forum to discuss politics?

[Maple]

78. Start your own thread

don't highjack those of others.

Then you can campaign all you want.

I doubt you'll convert anyone, but you can try.

[iverglas]

104. now there's a funny one

If you wanna trash Canada, go join a Con site. They excel at it.

By that logic, the entire population of DU should move to freeperland ...

[Telly Savalas]

125. No urban sprawl?

I take it you've never been to 905-land.

[Mother Jones]

130. You said it!

In fact, isn't urban sprawl the main reason McGuinty's govt is passing the greenspace legislation?

Me thinks so...

(I think they should have taken it further, but it's a great first step)

[iverglas]

102. there you have it

Matter of fact, trashing Canada is the quickest way I know to turn off voters.

The Liberals have learned the lesson so well -- to be used both defensively and offensively.

Defensively, never admit of any problem ('cause somebody might just blame you for it.) The Emperor IS SO wearing clothes.

Offensively, call anybody who asserts that there are problems an extreme right-winger. (Or left-winger. Does it depend on the day of the week, maybe?)

(Or no, I get it. If they say there are problems, they're right-wingers. If they propose doing new and better things, they're left-wingers. Got it.)

And all the rest of us must repeat to ourselves: It's a goooood life. Because if we don't, we'll get sent to the cornfield. The Liberals can do that. If we dare to question the Liberals, let alone don't keep electing the Liberals, we'll all get sent to the cornfield. Hey -- who wants to be the first to take that chance?

By the bye -- you live in Ontario, right? I particularly enjoyed that bit about how there can be no urban sprawl. I can only imagine how hard you had to work to keep a straight face and stifle the giggles as you wrote it.

[iverglas]

100. well damn

Here I'd have thought you'd have called him/her a socialist.

If one doesn't like what the Liberals get up to, is one just kind of interchangeably "extreme" right/left?

[IntravenousDemilo]

139. Oh now...

It's the faux Cons who are in favour of all those nasty things, inasmuch as they seem to promote policies that would exacerbate those problems. Bestleftblank seems to be against them, which to me says that he's not a member of Stephen Harper's Silly Party. I think a lot of those problems are getting worse in Canada, and politicaly I'm somewhere between David Orchard and the left wing of the NDP.

[Canadian_moderate]

68. Canadians can be smug little shits

from time to time.

I agree with Best Left Blank. Maple needs to get off his/her high horse and face the facts.

Don't get me wrong. I love this country, but we can improve in many ways. For example:
- less national insecurity.
- more mature national pride.
- stricter pollution laws (Ontario is among the worst in N.A.)
- our parliamentary system is far from perfect, with little in the way of checks and balances.
- we have our own share of rednecks.
- etc., etc, etc...

My wife is an American who is very open-minded and has always voted democrat, yet she is made to feel like shit by many Canadians who make ignorant statements about Americans this and America that.

We need to stop being such smug little shits and make Canada a country that matters on the global stage once again.

[best left blank]

69. Well said.

And I too love this country, that's why I try to help improve it.

[Maple]

72. If either of you actually thought any of this

you would have left for a 'better' country long ago.

I can only guess you haven't found one. :D

I'm amazed at people who enjoy all the benefits here, live off the public purse, and then complain all the time on public forums about all our so-called problems.

Fewer complaints and more work please.

And none of this is on topic btw

The original poster is looking for a good place to raise his family, and asked about Canada. He didn't ask for Nirvana, and he didn't ask for a political agenda bunfight.

[best left blank]

74. WHOA!

Holdup!

Who's spouting the conservative rhetoric now?!?

BTW, I'd say it's on topic, giving a balanced view of Canada rather than some head-in-the-sand Canada love-in.

[Maple]

77. Topic please

If you want to discuss how 'bad' Canada is, start your own thread, don't highjack those of others

[best left blank]

79. Oh yes.

Of course.

Obviously, I'm new here. And I can see that you have over 1000 posts. But is this your regular MO? Dismiss any dissenting opinions and facts as false, uncalled for, or off-topic?

[Maple]

80. Start your own thread

There is no MO involved. Most people here are polite.

[best left blank]

81. Would you mind explaining this to me?

Somebody asks for opinions on Canada. People post their opinions. All of the glowing ones, that agree with your stance, are considered valuable contributions. A dissenting opinion is considered a highjack, campaigning and the poster is asked to start their own thread.

What gives?

[Maple]

82. The person asked

about living in Canada. We've tried to fill him in on health,education, government, immigration chances...anything he might need to know about living in a new country. And tried to answer what he asked.

Since our problems aren't much different than those in the UK, and since all countries have problems in any case, we simply told him about daily life here.

But it's not a thread for an internal political campaign.

[best left blank]

83. No internal campaigning...?

Then why didn't you let my statements go by uncommented? Seems to me that you're more guilty of campaigning than I am. Just couldn't let anyone post a dissenting opinion without attempting to marginalise it.

[Maple]

Then I'd be agreeing with you

which I do not, and it would be giving the original poster the wrong impression of the country.

I'm sorry I'm too pro-Canadian for you.

Deepest apologies.

[best left blank]

88. Oh boy.

Too pro-Canadian? Give it a rest. Why must you insist on using that sort of rhetoric? Anyhow, I signed up for this board because I thought it might be a place where people opened discussed politics, it appears I am mistaken.

[Maple]

90. Whatever...

[best left blank]

91. Over 1000 posts...

are they all this enlightening?

[Telly Savalas]

126. If there are inappropriate posts in this thread, hit "alert"...

and I'm sure the mods will take care of it.

[iverglas]

106. don't you know??

Canada -- love it or leave it, friend.

Certainly don't answer anyone's questions about Canada by offering information or opinions that suggest that the Natural Governing Party is less than perfect. Heavens to Betsy, what's got into you??

[Maple]

108. See post 107

[iverglas]

110. trust me

If you reply to a post of mine after I've written a different post, I will see it. I'm not actually in need of directions.

Now, if said post actually said something that absolutely wasn't to be missed, I might not mind the pointer.

But.

[Maple]

112. The NDP?? Never

5 years of Bob Rae killed that idea. :rofl:

[iverglas]

114. stay on topic, woncha??

I say:

trust me
If you reply to a post of mine after I've written a different post, I will see it. I'm not actually in need of directions.
Now, if said post actually said something that absolutely wasn't to be missed, I might not mind the pointer.
But.

and you say:

The NDP?? Never
5 years of Bob Rae killed that idea.


And good gravy. If one of those foreigners wandered by, they'd think Canadians were raving loons.

[Maple]

116. LOL whatever...

[iverglas]

117. see post 90

[Maple]

118. Nah...I'm outta here

if the original poster wants to contact me for actual factual info on Canada without the political infighting, he can do so.

You guys can argue the 'angels on the head of a pin' thingy out amongst yourselves. Bye.

[Maple]

76. Any country can be improved

but it helps if your so-called improvements don't contradict each other.

We are neither 'insecure' nor 'smug'...and we can't be both at once in any case.

Our Parliamentary system comes from the UK where it's worked well for centuries. Actually we've added improvements.

Canada matters very much on the global stage, we just don't think power comes out of the barrel of a gun.

And again, this is not the forum for a national election campaign...there isn't one going on in any case.

[Canadian_moderate]

87. Our smugness is more like childish insecurity

We love to thumb our noses at Americans, yet we fail to see many of our own shortcomings. Do we have so little to be proud that we have to focus on the faults of others? What other country has its identity based on not being from its neighbouring country? We are no more cultured than Americans are despite all the rhetoric we are force-feed by our media sources and education system.

While I also hate with GWB has done to the USA, it bugs the hell out of me that bashing the USA has become Canada's favourite activity. Many of the comments I hear are ignorant and generalizing of all Americans.

While we're generalizing let me add that my experiences with Americans have been largely positive. The Americans I have dealt with tend to be more positive, assertive and get things done when action is needed, compared to Canadians who often focus on all the negatives and prefer to discuss all things infinitely instead of taking action. The city of Toronto's waterfront is a perfect example of this. Lots of discussion and no results. Compare this to the city of Chicago's waterfront and you'll see what I mean.

[Maple]

89. That's not even possible

and no Canadian bases their identity on the US.

That's the Con version of it.

That's because it's the only country the Cons compare us to all the time. Most Canadians have a broader view. There are 191 countries in the world...we try to take the best ideas from all of them, and leave the worst.

However one line in your post stands out 'Canadians who often focus on all the negatives'...yes indeed, some Canadians do that.

[HEyHEY]

84. I've never believe Canadians feel insecure

That is a bullshit made-up scenario.
If anything I think Canadians have a superiority complex and think they are better than half the world most of the time... hence the smugness.

[HEyHEY]

85. ANd yet we take more shit for that than the nation of openly wide assholes

[Canadian_moderate]

92. ???

Is Canada even on the global radar? I have family and friends in the Netherlands and other parts of Europe who comment how they hardly ever hear anything about Canada in their local news.

Hardly anyone outside of Canada and the USA gives Canada a hard time because we are outside their focus. The average European would have a very tough time distinguishing a Canadian from an American if it wasn't for the maple leafs plastered all over their clothing and backpacks.

The Simpson episode hit the nail on the head when it called Canada "America-Lite". What else can you expect from a country that exports 87% of its good to its neighbour and only 13% to the rest of the world? On one hand we want them to buy our goods and resources, yet we love to slagg them off at every opportunity.

[HEyHEY]

93. I'm talking about the US giving us shit

Fuckers like O'Rielly and Bucanan go on about us ALL THE TIME... yet if we respond or act a little pricky ourselves it's "SMug little shits"

[Canadian_moderate]

95. That is nothing

It's almost like Canada is excited about finally being noticed for being somewhat different from the USA.

I'm fully aware of Bill O'Reilly and Pat Buchanan putting down Canada; however, their comments seem to be more of a tit-for-tat response the comments we make about the USA. These guys are a bunch of blowhards who spew there crap to the type of people who prefer sensational tabloid type news. Nothing balance and objective, just raw sensationalism and BS opinions.

[HEyHEY]

96. Come on - they're responding to us?

The amount of Comments made by those two FAR outweighs anything coming out of Canada. It is not our fault at all, we didn't support the IRaq war...and they're out to demonize us for it

[sonicx]

122. "tit-for-tat response" You've never watched Oreilly have you?

The guy's a bully. He picks fights with anyone or anything that is even slighty left of center. He attacks the NY Times nearly everyday for simply existing. He thinks the ALCU is aiding terrorists and wants to boycott Canada and France for not going to Iraq.

And Buchanan hates Canada because he's a 'culture warrior' and hates the social progress.

[Canadian_moderate]

129. I've seen O'Reilly a few times

I have FNC on digital cable and I've seen his show a few times over the years when visiting the USA.

I know that he likes to spout shit about Canada, but I take him with a grain of salt because he tends to be conversial just to improve his ratings. Most Americans I know may think he's amusing from time to time, but they don't necessarily take him all that seriously.

[iverglas]

132. but the thing is ...

Most Americans I know may think he's amusing from time to time, but they don't necessarily take him all that seriously.

It's more subtle than that. It's a very carefully woven tissue of lies, and the loose threads are just never pulled, because the issue -- Canada -- isn't important enough to make it onto the radar in the US. Whether someone who takes O'Reilly seriously or not, those lies (like all the other lies) make it into the general consciousness as a subtext for anything else that the people who hear them later hear.

I did an analysis of a few of them, told by O'Reilly and his guests in response to the CBC's piece about the status of public discourse in the US. (The piece in question can be watched in full at the site linked, in case you missed it in its many reruns -- or you can just watch the couple of minutes of Coulter yammering out her bum about Canada and Vietnam, for entertainment.) Since doing the research about the CBC's audience share, I read about O'Reilly's own ratings. Apparently, in the 15-34 age group (I think that's how they define the all-important consumer group), he has somewhere around a half million viewers. ?!? Allow me to say I'm not impressed. Hockey Night in Canada really does get a multiple of that. I suspect that Coronation Street matches it, in a population 1/9 the size.

I'm going to get around to asking the CRTC why Fox News is back on my digital line-up for free trial. They already had a 3- or 4-month free trial at the beginning of the year. It's been back for weeks now, going to September, I think. There's a reason why it was approved as a premium pay digital channel. Unfortunately, my cable company has rearranged all its digital packages, so the one in which we currently get BBC World News has been broken up, and if we ever wanted to change our bundles and keep BBC, we'd have to get Fox as well. Dang, it just sounds like it wasn't selling, don't it?

Anyhow, if you want to have a look at what I looked up about the lies of O'Reilly, it's here:


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1600584&mesg_id=1601268

[best left blank]

133. Hmmm...

That cable package mess sounds a bit shady to me.

[Canadian_moderate]

134. I get free FNC

I watch it from time to time to laugh about the stupid, sensationalist, and tabloid-like news format.

[Canadian_moderate]

94. Sorry if I was off-topic a little earlier - To me, Canada is...

- A wonderfully diverse country
- A place with mostly friendly people (except not all that friendly to Americans)
- A country of extreme climates and geography
- A country of very diverse regions and regional cultures
- A wonderful place if you don't want to worry about being able to afford healthcare or post-secondary education (for the most part)
- A very new country, with an identity is not fully established and is still being formed and changing as an ongoing basis.
- A country that clings to its southern border for geographic (climate) and trade reasons.
- A country that offers a very nice trade off between the USA and Europe (best of both places in many ways).

I love this country, but as someone who has lived in other countries, I am fully aware that we also have our shortcomings and are far from being a utopia.

[sonicx]

123. I'm american and canadians i've meet haven't been unfriendly to me

Every poll I've read says Canada likes America and vice versa.

In fact, the only places I hear about how much Canada 'hates' America are places like FOX News. Of course, they like to conflate disliking Bush with disliking America.

[Canadian_moderate]

124. Maybe I used the wrong term

Here in Toronto people tend to be more condescending of Americans. Often when people find out that my wife is American (lived in Pennsylvania and Maryland), they'll respond with condescending comments about hillbillies, rednecks, ghettos, gun violence, war mongers, etc, etc. Admittedly, some Americans do make some dumb statements and ask dumb questions about Canada from time to time.

Even though my wife is a liberal-minded, peace-loving Democrat, it does annoy here immensely from time to time.