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johnnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:01 AM
Original message
What's the bigger issue with you?
What is more important to you, proving the fraud and intimidations or a Kerry win?
Of course we would all like to see both, but I am wondering if the American people can see how corrupt the system is, would that satisfy you enough?
I'm just curious on everyone's opinion on this.
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tk2kewl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:04 AM
Response to Original message
1. proving the fraud and intimidations
exposing the rethugs for what they are and then hanging the "cheating thug" label around their necks for the next 20 years
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blueokie Donating Member (38 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. ditto
I really don't think they'll unconcede but I would LOVE to see fraud truly exposed. I'm a little upset that my vote didn't get counted!
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jamboi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
24. ditto n/t
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New Earth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:04 AM
Response to Original message
2. i'd like to see an honest recount and a Kerry win
but if there was an honest recount and Kerry still didn't win, obviously we would have to accept it, but at least we'd know for sure.

i don't believe any 'proof' of fraud will be found until months, if not years, after this election. right now all we have are numbers to rely on in New Mexico and Ohio.

The most important thing is to fight for the truth and have that truth before Inauguration day.

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mary195149 Donating Member (231 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. I would first like to see Kerry be inaugurated.
That way he can get the country back on track while he finds enough evidence to put the bushies away for good!!
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nicho Donating Member (97 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #2
16. should not limit allegations to Ohio then
if fraud is the issue of concern, we should not limit ourselves to Ohio. Wisconsin, Iowa, and Minnesota had tighter races than Ohio but I don't see the demands for recounts in those states. sorry, but I think most are interested in reversing the election results rather than exposing fraud.

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New Earth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. so you are admitting that a recount of Ohio might change the outcome?
Edited on Tue Dec-07-04 01:36 PM by Faye
w00t, thanks for the boost of hope! :D
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brainshrub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:08 AM
Response to Original message
4. Proving fraud.
The election of Kerry is a side issue, we are talking about the future of Democracy.
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mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:08 AM
Response to Original message
5. Proving the fraud
it will FINALLY be the chimps long awaited undoing
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
6. proving fraud
would undo the ponzi scheme that has become the Republican party. that would be better.
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lostnfound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
7. Proving the fraud. nt
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seito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
9. Since you asked...
Finding truth, uncovering fraud and bringing those guilty to justice are the biggest issues for me.

I want election reform:

Uniform Federal standards for Federal elections
Paper trail for all elections
A time line that allows for recounts to be completed before electors are selected
Mandatory random hand audit to confirm election results

I want the truth to find its way to the highest levels of the * administration.

I want * to leave office in disgrace, and take his mandate and his Congressional majority with him.

I would love to have John Kerry as President in 2005, but I think that saving this nation begins with drowning the rats.
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johnnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. All of that sounds like it would be great.
I am pretty sure that this crap has been going on since day one, but it is time to face the fact that the election process has to be revamped. This is not the 1800's, we should be much more secure in our voting process.
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:19 AM
Response to Original message
10. Getting all the votes counted accurately
No matter what the outcome.
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Cheswick2.0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:23 AM
Response to Original message
12. fraud
and the need to have paper ballots.
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WildClarySage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:23 AM
Response to Original message
13. Proving fraud which would hopefully
begin investigations into how to safeguard voting rights for everyone. The dem party has been cheated, I believe, and not only did we 'lose' the election, but we've been coerced into attacking each other over whose fault, where did we go wrong, etc. when I don't believe we did go wrong. We could have done better, yes, but I believe a fair vote would have had a different outcome. I don't quite believe the irregularities are going to prove to be enough to convince Bill and Sally Ignorance that the system is in need of an overhaul, but as long as these questions are in front of the public, there is hope. I hope that more than half of my fellow Americans aren't idiots, but even if they are, they have the right to vote like idiots fairly and without irregularities.
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unpossibles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
14. revamping the election process
is the most important thing.

If there was fraud, prosecution for all involved. No Ollie North crap please.

If kerry legitimately won, even better. but my first concern is the accurate counting of votes and the transparency and non-partisanship of the process.
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LisaLynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
15. Fraud.
Prove that and I really think we can get people behind some serious reforms (and I'm not just talking election, although that's an important part) and get this country back on track.
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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:56 AM
Response to Original message
17. proving fraud makes correction possible.......
There's nothing that's been done that can't be UNdone if our vote is intact. I have absolute faith in the American people to do the right thing with the truth.

Yes, we won this past election, and we won the previous election, but with a broken system winning is useless.

If we can't make the system work (even in it's previous, creaky but mostly honest, way) Then we have truely lost our country until some new revolution.
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libertypirate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 12:28 PM
Response to Original message
18. Fraud
and justice
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MarkusQ Donating Member (516 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
19. Finding the truth, and getting the facts to the public (n/t)
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electropop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
20. All that and more.
Put Kerry and the other rightful Dem winners in office, repudiate the Rethugs, and put a whole bunch of 'em in jail.
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marions ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 01:33 PM
Response to Original message
21. I want significant reforms before 06... either way...
If the American people can see how corrupt the system is, I believe they have the guts and integrity to change it. But at first even well-meaning people may not want to face the awful truth...there is always resistance to thinking things are really THAT bad. Gonna take hard work after this selection, whether Kerry is installed by some miracle or not. We have a clear challenge now--to see that the election system has undergone a significant overhaul by 2006. It may take longer for the total fix, but the primary mechanisms should be in place by then. No American citizen of any political affiliation should accept less.

The sleeze is bubbling up through the cracks and maybe there aren't enough Shop Vacs in Walmart to contain it now...
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Eloriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 04:23 PM
Response to Original message
23. Fraud because if we don't it's the end of democracy
and that's not hyperbole.

I could care less about kerry, which is probably a good thing because there's no way in hell the election will be overturned, no matter what -- IMO. If nothing else, I believe it will take longer than whatever deadelines theres are, including Jan. 20, for the whole thing to shake out -- IF we're lucky.

And if we DO continue to make progress, I think another "terrorist attack" on U.S. soil would be the likely distraction.

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jsascj Donating Member (425 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
25. Proving fraud
Otherwise all is lost and we'll be slaves to the Republicans forevermore. We will lose any voice that we might ever hope to have...if we haven't already.
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Patsy Stone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 04:32 PM
Response to Original message
26. Count my vote and prove to me that it's been counted.
That's my goal. Kerry is the cherry on top of that sundae. If there is provable fraud, I'll buy everyone a drink. I hope that is the case, on a scale wide enough to bring down that whole cabal. It'll be Christmas whenever that happens.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:27 PM
Response to Original message
27. Vote Fraud is THE issue for me.
A Kerry "win" would be almost superfluous.
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Carolab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
28. Proving that there was corruption and fraud and who actually won (eom)
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liberal43110 Donating Member (687 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:30 PM
Response to Original message
29. Proving the fraud and problems
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skids Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:30 PM
Response to Original message
30. Putting people in jail.
The only reason we need to PROVE the fraud is so we can convict them fairly.
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The Flaming Red Head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #30
41. I agree
People serve life sentences now for stealing pizzas. How much is a couple of million votes worth to our society?
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Amaya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:33 PM
Response to Original message
31. Proving fraud
Edited on Tue Dec-07-04 05:37 PM by Amaya
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:33 PM
Response to Original message
32. Proving or Disproving Fraud
either way as long as it is investigated FULLY
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Blue_In_AK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:39 PM
Response to Original message
33. Fraud
Would LOVE to see John Kerry in the White House, but I think ultimately proving the fraud will have the biggest impact on our system.
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smartvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:42 PM
Response to Original message
34. Fraud.
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rumpel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
35. Truth
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IndyPriest Donating Member (685 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
36. Why can't I have both?! OK, fraud! n/t
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Hamoth Donating Member (292 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 05:46 PM
Response to Original message
37. Fraud W/ Election reforms by 06 NT
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johnnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 09:36 PM
Response to Original message
38. It looks like we are all on the same page here
I want to have this all shown to the American people one way or another.
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Pepper32 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 09:50 PM
Response to Original message
39. Proving the fraud and intimidations
Can't believe so many are not for proving voter intimidation/suppression. Says a lot! And probably confirmed a lot too...
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driver8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 10:22 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. Fraud -- and for Bush and Cheney to fry! n/t
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Pepper32 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:38 PM
Response to Reply #40
46. Yeah, voter intimidation don't really matter. Who cares... ^5 n/t
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carolinalady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 10:28 PM
Response to Original message
42. Seeing The Almighty impeached!
along with his disciples. It eats me up that they can get away with lies and criminal acts cause they have the money and the power to do so.
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Trillo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 10:34 PM
Response to Original message
43. Proving fraud. It's definitely bittersweet. I keep wondering
how many elections over how many years have been subjected to serious manipulation.
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Unforgiven Donating Member (613 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 10:37 PM
Response to Original message
44. One
and the same!
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Pepper32 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #44
45. Very true n/t
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Donailin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-04 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
47. good question
what's most imp
Power corrupts. Money corrupts. What is government at this point if not money and power?
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