Democratic party wants to know how we feel

[zeemike]

Just got an E-mail saying they wanted to know how i felt so I told them;

http://www.democrats.org/feedback

Here is my remarks:

I personally felt betrayed after the election with a rush to concede the election when there was so much evidence that there was fraud.
And to then here from the party leadership that they wanted to investigate the fraud but were sure “it would not affect the outcome of the election” All of that just seem to confirm the conspiracy theorist that told us that it was all fixed from the start by the “stop Dean” movement in the party leadership.
So what Am I to think now? Will this party move to the right and leave the rest of us to either not vote at all or to find another party like the Greens to support?

We will see if you take anything I say seriously or not.

Go there and give them just what you think.

[dzika]

1. ditto. n/t

[zann725]

13. ditto...ditto...ditto..

n/t

[LisaM]

2. I replied. Thanks for the link.

I told them that the Democrats didn't seem to have any fight in them, and that (among other things) media coverage of our candidates was lacking and that we need to form coalitions with environmental groups and the Green Party to address our common concerns.

[zeemike]

4. I wish I would have added that too. n/t

[Downtown Hound]

3. Done

[momzno1]

5. here is my email

I feel very strongly that I wasted my donation to the DNC since my vote clearly means nothing when elections are made fraudulent through multiple means. I am disappointed in the DNC's reaction to this fraud - or should I say "non-reaction", and only hope that you are waiting for the "right time to act" - MAY THAT PLEASE BE SOON!!
I feel like I am living in a surreal world, where the DNC who I thought was concerned with democracy is acting like Republicans in ignoring the ELEPHANT in the Middle of the Living Room.
I am just so confused by this - it seems absolutely insane, and the only island away from this insanity is with the enormous number of sane people I am finding on the Internet. Mainstream Media is failing us in a big way, and I am fearful for our future - seems like we are blind to the fact that we have slipped from Democracy to Fascism - or just about...
Please Wake Up....

[intheflow]

8. Good last line!

Wish I had thought to tell them to just wake up! :hi:

[buddysmellgood]

6. Thanks. I sent a stong message.

kick

[intheflow]

7. My email:

In a lame attempt to be centrist, the Democratic Party has moved too far to the right. We need to start reconnecting people to the good things that government does for the people, using taxes FOR the people, and not for oil or military profiteering interests. Our social safety net is all but dismantled, labor unions have almost been completely busted, public school teachers have to buy school supplies out of their own ever-meager paychecks, and I've only had affordable insurance twice in the past 20 years though I've been employed in one or more jobs over all that time.

These things are unacceptable. I feel like the DLC has sold me out to corporate interests, betraying the people who voted you into power to protect the public interest. I would pay more taxes for public infrastructure, and think the Democrats need to get back in line with the REAL American values of loving your neighbor as yourself, NOT exploiting people and natural resources so the top 4% of wealthy Americans can get wealthier. I believe part of the problem is that Democratic leadership tends to be wealthy, and that has corrupted them.

I fear for the Constitution. I fear for the loss of my privacy rights. I'm fearful when gun rights get more credibility than human rights. I'm disgusted by the torture techniques being used by my government in Iraq and Cuba. I am scared that the media have become exclusive mouthpieces for the religious and political right. I want voting transparency and integrity, and NO MORE PAPERLESS ELECTIONS. I want the US to restore its relationships with the world wide political community, including working with the UN and NATO and global environmental movements. The US should go to war ONLY as a last option. As far as I can see, the Democrat Party has done virtually nothing to see that any of the above were stopped or even slowed. (Although individuals in the party do seem to want to work on these issues, I have not seen any leadership emerge from the party on thee issues, and witnessed the party trying to dismiss those who did speak out, such as Howard Dean and Dennis Kucinich.)

*******************************************

I also made sure they knew I volunteered for Kerry but will not volunteer for the DLC again until I know their values come back to being more aligned with my own. :grr:

Thanks for the link!

[bardgal]

9. I sent them my rant from Bartcop radio:

I feel betrayed. Here is the text from my latest web radio show: (you asked)

FUCK!FUCK THE FUCKING DEMS. It’s been a gradual thing- the slow moving to the right of the Democratic Party. And in case you haven’t noticed, it’s gone into overdrive since the election. They are now eating their young. The DLC and the DNC are flying the party’s plane into the side of a mountain – ON PURPOSE.

Lately, they’ve joined the far rightwing yapdogs in trashing Michael Moore. Yes. Michael Moore. Perhaps the one person in the country with the biggest iron cajones, who isn’t afraid to take on the BFEE, and is maybe the one person who single-handedly opened more people’s eyes and turned more people around to the truth about Bush than anyone else with Fahrenheit 9/11. They are attacking, and desperately trying to distance themselves from him.

Well fuck Michael Moore's critics. And fuck the DLC AND the DNC. I have been a Democrat all my life. I am 45. I have always voted for Democrats, and I will continue to pursue the defeat of the BFEE.

But what I will NOT do is be abused by this pathetic excuse for a political party for one more second. I am done. I have no idea right this minute what party I am going to register with, maybe Independent, maybe I'll start the Michael Moore Fuck Them Party, it doesn't really matter. The only thing that matters is that these COWARD FUCKS do NOT represent me, nor will I have them speaking for me. I'm OUT. The Democrats have turned into what used to be the Republican Party, and the modern republicans are too blinded by the Bush Cult to see their party has also abandoned them. Or maybe they do see it, and are happy to be the Psycho Bully Thug Party. I have hung on as long as I can, believing in some pathetic fantasy that they'd wake up and fight, especially against a THIRD RIGGED STOLEN ELECTION, but instead, they act like scared little wimps who don't want to get continually raped by their abusive captors, and cower in the corner, and think of ways to make their captors like them better in some misguided belief that they'll stop being abused. But that doesn't work. Abusers just change what they want, to keep the thrill going.

The Democratic Party has abandoned me. I have no desire to become more like the right. I DO NOT share the same values as these sadistic, bigoted freaks. I don’t believe mainstream America wants to slip back to the mindset and values of the fucking fifties, and I don’t care what the media and our WHORE government says. Either the democrats in DC are on the Bush payroll or they’ve gotten lazy, and either way, they should be fired. It should be a FELONY for any person in Congress who does not read the entirety of a piece of legislation before voting on it, LIKE THE PATRIOT ACT. They should not only be fired, but criminally prosecuted. I don’t know if that means there is a TEST before things of this import come to a vote, or what – but they should be held accountable. And if no one has the TIME to read 1500 pages, them the author needs to make it shorter, or take parts out, so it’s more cut and dried. I am sick to death of how lazy our government has become, and the way it now works.

I believe in FAIR HONEST ELECTIONS. And unfortunately, that has become such a quaint idea of the past. I believe there is a clear CONFLICT OF INTEREST with any company that makes voting machines and those same companies making donations to any political party, person, or committee. It’s also a clear conflict of interest for any Secretary of State, who certifies votes to be working for ANY candidate. Both of these scenarios should be ILLEGAL.

I believe lobbyists are criminals. I believe it is wrong for the lumber lobby to criminalize hemp just because there is more profit in making paper out of wood. FACT: marriage IS a civil union in this country. You can get married in a church all you want, but until you sign the legal documents in the county clerks office, or city hall, IT IS NOT A LEGAL UNION IN THE EYES OF THE STATE. I believe NO ONE should have the legal authority to tell me (while I am of sound mind), what I can and can’t do with my own body – and it shouldn’t matter what sex I am – you can’t tell me: who I can sleep with (as long as they are of legal age), who I choose to live with or become legally bound with, what I can consume, what I can buy, what I can read, where I can travel, what I can watch or what I can listen to. If I don’t like it, I’ll change the fucking channel. And most of all, if I am terminally ill, living with mind-blowing pain, choose to end my life, and I can get anyone –especially a doctor to help me – that is MY fucking BUSINESS. I believe if my state says it’s fine to easy someone’s discomfort by using a drug that the big pharmaceutical companies don’t make a dime off of, well, then it’s FINE. FUCK the pharmaceutical companies who are behind this pathetic charade.

The Democratic Party has abandoned the democrats. They’ve abandoned ME. I REFUSE to become more like the right. I DO NOT share these twisted values. I believe in LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL, not just the Christian White Folk in the backwater red states.

I'm also sick to death of Red State Welfare. We here in CA give $58 BILLION a year MORE in Federal Taxes than we get back in services, while our trauma centers, and libraries are closing, and our police and fire departments are being cut - FUCK THAT. That $58 BILLION a year alone would take care of our state budget problems several times over. That’s on top of what those goons at Enron owe us.

Oh yeah, and we’re still paying more than two dollars a gallon for gas here, while opec is seeing it’s highest production in 26 years.

FUCK THEM I SAY!!!! I am sick of the Democrats blaming the wrong people. Karl Rove stole this thing. We WON BIG TIME. They just operate better and make the fucking Mafia look like amateurs. And until someone actually grows a set, and goes after them, proves it, and throws them all in prison, we're screwed. Honest elections here are a thing of the past.

[zeemike]

23. Wow , what a rant

There were times I felt just like that, but I have tempered it somewhat now to just a slow steady burn that wants to work in a steady but persistent way.
The reason for that is I know that it is the only way to keep at it without burning out. At least for me anyway.

[Cookie wookie]

55. Thanks for that

A proportionate rant

[Revillusion1]

58. Amen

Give 'em Hell...Live Free or Die.

[myschkin]

10. kick

[jamboi]

16. Done. n/t

[Gyre]

11. Hee hee, I just gave 'em a piece of my mind all right.

Damn that felt good!!! :) Now I feel like a smoke.

Gyre

[ClintCooper2003]

12. I already replied (very nastily)

[Doremus]

14. My response was almost the same. Doubt they care.

I wrote an email to the head of the Ohio Democratic party last week. Today I got the weirdest response:

If you're concerned with the recount effort.. please rsvp for the Blackwell directive

John B. Kenney
DRE County Coordinator
Ohio Democratic Party

My reply:

What kind of a cryptic email is this? You say to ask Blackwell for some sort of a directive, yet you don't provide any of his contact information or even any details about this "recount directive" you suggest we somehow get ahold of.

You're from the Democratic party? No wonder the Republicans control everything. They probably know better than to speak to their own membership in such dismissive overtones.

Good luck holding onto the millions of new Dems for 2006. If this is how the party's going to go about it, they may as well give up right now.

[zeemike]

21. Dam

A callous blow off
Just who are they whoring for?

[McCamy Taylor]

15. Thanks! I feel much better having vented a little steam!

[coreystone]

17. Walk the talk, and get off the "stool" is what I said!!! .....

And, other words of wisdom!

[JunkYardDogg]

18. Rigged Elections are Rigged Elections

Is the only criteria that a rigged election changes the outcome??
That means the Gutless DNC says it is Ok to Rig American Elections and they won't say a God Dam thing
They have become totally irrelavent!!!

[GetTheRightVote]

19. Thank you for this forum, and yes, I emailed them too, big kick

ditto

"I personally felt betrayed after the election with a rush to concede the election when there was so much evidence that there was fraud.
And to then here from the party leadership that they wanted to investigate the fraud but were sure “it would not affect the outcome of the election” All of that just seem to confirm the conspiracy theorist that told us that it was all fixed from the start by the “stop Dean” movement in the party leadership.
So what Am I to think now? Will this party move to the right and leave the rest of us to either not vote at all or to find another party like the Greens to support?"

thank you, I borrowed it for only a moment

[JunkYardDogg]

20. Told 'em what I think

DNC is now Irrelevant
We should flood them
Everybody who reads this should reply
The DNC is DEAD

[alittlelark]

22. I told them. I answered all the questions

McAuliffe will not like the answers.

[rdmccur]

24. Here's the letter I just sent them

"I supported John Kerry for president and I worked for the campagn here in Albuquerque, NM.
I am angry at the democratic party because it has still not acknowledged that there is enough evidence for widespread election fraud in our 2004 national election to have a full-scale investigation. (And there is!) I believe some people should probably be going to prison for what may have been perpetrated and you guys are apparently not doing anything. It really disturbs me.
I've been a life-long democrat, now I'm thinking of being an independent or supporting the Green party--at least they were part of the effort to fund the recount in Ohio and New Mexico.

Sincerely, "

my name

----- Original Message -----

[myschkin]

25. kick

[WritersBlock]

26. Here's what I sent them over a month ago...haven't heard a word back.

(I got that e-mail right after the election, too, and spent a long time forming my response. I saved what I sent them. Please keep in mind that I wrote this on the 7th of November):

------------
Concerning going forward, in my view absolutely nothing that the Democratic Party does in the future will make one bit of difference unless you do these two things first and foremost:

1) You need to understand your base. We want our country back, and we want our democracy back. We need you to help us fight for it. We need you to take it to court and force them to count the votes if you have to, and we believed you when you said you would do it this time.

So in the future, please don't concede any election while there are still reasonable questions about the vote count -and- its legality. Don't concede while there are reports that electronic machines in Ohio and elsewhere recorded votes for Bush when they were cast for Kerry (or whatever the names may be in the future - you know it's going to happen again). When minority voters are challenged at the polls because they're considered likely to vote Democratic, so they have to cast provisional ballots, don't concede before those provisional ballots are counted, and don't let them become "spoilage" if they are legal votes. Don't concede when 58,000 absentee ballots go missing in Florida and are only re-mailed the Saturday before the election. Don't concede when the published vote counts in counties with optical scanning machines miraculously appear as almost mirror images of the exit polls. That means there's something wrong that needs to be looked into.

The early concession was the biggest mistake it was possible to make in this election. How do you think this has made all of us Kerry supporters feel? How do you think the voters in Ohio who stood in line for 5 hours feel? Does the word "betrayed" come to mind? It should. I've already seen several posts by people saying they'll never vote Democratic again because of this early concession. (I keep telling myself that Senator Kerry only made the speech to save the country from a media frenzy over the prospect of drawn-out legal battles, but that in reality legal action has been going on behind the silence since Wednesday. My hope faded a bit when I got the e-mail asking for this feedback. Please, please tell me I was not wrong to hope.)

2) The major aim of the Democratic Party, starting right now, must be to fight for an auditable vote trail. We'll never win another major election again if we don't.

I truly believe that the above two points are absolutely crucial. Other things I think we need to work on in the future are these:

Work for electoral college reform. Our country is in grave danger now because of 140,000-some-odd votes in Ohio. (I'm not naive enough to think we can do away with it altogether; it's working too much in favor of the Republicans just now.)

Tell people what the Democratic platform is - what our values are - and don't try to sugarcoat anything or fail to take a stand for fear of offending undecided voters. They are only undecided because while they don't like what the other party is doing/saying, at the same time they're not getting a clear message from us.

Fight back. When they smear our candidate, come back immediately and forcefully with the truth. And don't hesitate to pound on what the other side is doing wrong. When they lie, we need to say so - loudly and repeatedly. The country can't afford for us to be nice anymore, because it's quite obvious that the other side isn't going to be.

Don't let the media get away with its partisanship. Demand that our candidates get equal and unbiased coverage. (Lots of luck with this one; wish I knew how to accomplish it. Maybe independent media could be an avenue to explore in greater depth?)

That's all I can think of tonight. Thanks for asking.
--------------

[zeemike]

30. If the asked this a month ago

Then they did probably read it and wondered just how many felt like you and decided to ask more people.
Just maybe they do get it.

[eridani]

27. My two cents

From your latest email--

"In the past four years, the DNC expanded its small donor base seven fold, from 400,000 in 2000 to 2.7 million in 2004.
<snip>
We also mobilized 233,000 volunteers, knocking on 11 million doors, and making 38 million volunteer phone calls. "

I'd like to point out that these things were largely the result of self organized volunteers, largely from the primary campaigns of Dean, Kucinich and Clark, whose supporters then transferred their efforts to the national campaign.

If you expect this level of interest to be maintained, you will have to pay attention to this base. If you don't choose Dean (or someone else with that same agressive attitude toward grassroots growth), I see no reason to contribute further to the national party. My time and money in that case will be going only to my LD and county Democratic organizations, the Progressive Democrats of America, and Democracy for America, and individual candidates who share my views.

[Carolab]

28. Whew!

CATHARSIS!!!!!!!!!

[Peace Patriot]

29. I woke up really, really angry this morning...

...so here's what I said to the DNC, on their questionnaire:

(How did you participate in this election?)

Donations to many groups and candidates; Sinclair Broadcasting campaign and other blog campaigns in support of Kerry and to improve public awareness; numerous letters, blogs, e-mailings on the issues--motivating people to vote; voter registration and GOTV work (canvassing and phonebanking).


(Is this the first time you have participated in election activism?)

44 years of political activism. 1st campaign for JFK in 1960 when I was 16.


(How would you like to continue staying involved? (volunteering, phonebanking, fundraising, local organizing, etc.))

Never again!


(Do you feel the actions you took were effective?)

Yes. We won, by a landslide. But you had failed us catastrophically, by allowing rightwing Republican Bush "Pioneers" to gain control of our election system through highly insecure electronic voting machines with SECRET, proprietary source code and no paper trail. You did almost nothing to stop this disastrous privatization of our voting system. You then failed to warn voters how easily the election could be stolen. Now you are failing us AGAIN by not investigating and challenging this fraudulent election.


(Was it a good experience for you?)

Up until Kerry's concession, it was the best political event in my lifetime.


(How would you make it better?)

I'm working on the recounts and challenging this fraudulent election as best I can, while you Fat Cats eat your Fat Cat lunches in DC. I'm so sick of the Democratic Party. Compromisers! Liars! You repeatedly promised, "Every vote would be counted." Over and over and over again. Where are you now?

And the worst thing--the worst thing of all--is your failure to fight for the right of black citizens to vote. The absence of DNC and Congressional leadership at the Conyers hearing was utterly disgraceful.

How can I make it better? If this situation continues--if you fail to investigate and challenge this election, and fail to oppose Congressional certification of this election--I will join the Greens, or help form a new coalition party.

If you fail to challenge this election, there is no way that YOU can "make it better."

If you fail to challenge this election, there is no way *I* can "make it better" except by helping to destroy this sick and useless farce, the Democratic Party.


(Please share other thoughts and comments you have about the 2004 election and what Democrats and the Democratic Party should do going forward.)

What should the Democratic Party do going forward? Nothing. Get out of the way!

You have compromised yourselves into irrelevancy. On the Iraq war. On the Patriot Act. On "no paper trail" voting and secret electronic source code privately owned by Bush "Pioneers." And before that on globalization and job outsourcing. Why should we--the loyal grass roots, the poor, the minorities, the workers, the environmentalists, the humanitarians--support you any longer?

You won't even fight for our right to vote.

__________

DUers, please note: The smarmy language of this DNC questionnaire. “How did you…”, “How would you like to…”, “How do you feel…”, How to “make it better…”. This pandering attitude tells you just what they’re going to do with this information--glean it for donors and slaves, and completely ignore righteous criticism.

__________

To tell you the truth, it pains me not to be able to say anything positive--to feel that there is no avenue of appeal to their better selves, to feel that there is no way to inspire them to be courageous and principled, and to be the Party that they could be--the Party that supported civil rights for black citizens (at great political cost!); the Party that fought for labor unions, and a minimum wage and that CREATED Social Security; the only one of the two parties that has supported women's rights; the "big tent" Party that welcomed people of all kinds, the "rainbow" party, the party that I was a member of when I was young, and that I've been a member of and have loyally supported for 44 years.

Where has that Party gone? They can't even protect our right to vote--and they won't even try!

This is an unusually downer moment for me. Please don't let it get YOU down. Democracy is a long, long road. We're never really finished walking that road. And I know this to be true: With human beings, there is ALWAYS a chance that they will redeem themselves. Always.

But, just as when you're dealing with an alcoholic, say, in your personal life--or an abusive spouse--there comes a moment when your support of them is no longer the best thing to do, for their sake or your own.

And that's the point I've reached with the Democratic Party. It's not a downer, really. It's a turning point. If democracy is to be reborn in this venerable land--our country, once the heart and the home of freedom--we will likely have to create a new political vehicle for it. If the Democratic Party does not come forward on this fraudulent election--and they still have the chance to do so, through Jan. 6 and certification of the election by Congress--then we must find another way.

That is my date for cancelling my 44 year membership in the Democratic Party and re-registering as a Green. Jan. 6, 2005.

Perhaps we should make that THE date and THE action--a massive defection from the Democratic Party.

(I will think about this, as a proposal, and give it a main post for comment, in the next day or so.)

[BeFree]

31. Thanks Peace Patriot

You laid out the case for the counter movement as well as any I have ever read.

It will be because of dems like you that we are able to fight the collapse of our freedoms. Be not too discouraged, but be encouraged with your newfound alliance here, as we all pledge to move forward against our assembled enemies with renewed vigor and gathering strength.

Peace.

[zeemike]

32. I would not call that angry

I would call it assertive.

[Sydnie]

35. I think I woke up in the same mood you did!

I was re-watching the little DNC/DLC meeting on C-SPAN this morning. After that little whiff of a fart (can't remember his name -- was too angry) made the statement that "Kerry wasn't the best candidate" my head exploded!

Why is it that we pick a candidate that we back, as a party, only to turn around and say "He wasn't the best choice" if they don't win? Why? We try to convince the public to support a candidate that they will throw on the trash heap themselves if they don't win. How can they expect the population to accept and vote for a candidate that they aren't willing to stand behind -- win, lose or draw?

I believe that Kerry was a great candidate and I still do. I believe that he would make a great candidate in 2008 IF (and that's a big IF) he ran a campaign on HIS beliefs rather than what they feed him. If he was allowed to form the basis of his campaign on the things that HE feels are important and allowed to carry the message from beginning to end, rather than become "Republican Lite". He would be a great candidate if THEY would get on HIS bandwagon instead of the other way around.

They made Kerry the whore, not the other way around. I will not forgive them for that. Nor, will I forget.

And that little whiff of a fart that made that statement in public can kiss my rosey red ass in Macy's window!

[Niche]

48. I just posted to them again about their complete disconnect from...

their support base. And a lot about Kerry being a great candidate.

[brindis_desala]

36. Well said!

If the Democrats are still hiding in the weeds on Jan 6th it's time to campaign for the Black Caucus to mend fences with Nader and join the Greens.

[insane_cratic_gal]

39. hehe nice

I basically said they needed to stand up and fight with us, no more piddling around or slouching about morale vales crap that was only 20 percent of issue.

I expressed my ideas and told them their slavation is with the grass roots not the DCL

[Niche]

47. I've replied 3 times now. Even after I said "you can move on...

without me. I'm going GREEN." but if they're going to keep asking what they should do :dunce: I'll just keep saying it. STAND UP TO THE REPS! I will join with you and register on the 6th as Green. This is a great idea. I'm done. Been a Dem for 20 years and they do not represent me. I'm tired begging my Representaves to stop the madness. They're complicit. I'm with you Peace Patriot. Let's go green on the 6th. Make a huge statement. I'm appauled at how hard we all worked to get the vote for Kerry and then this stupid letter over and over and over in my mail box. Maybe they didn't hear us the first time?

[Cookie wookie]

56. Great letter

particularly: "Why should we--the loyal grass roots, the poor, the minorities, the workers, the environmentalists, the humanitarians--support you any longer?

You won't even fight for our right to vote."

[Revillusion1]

33. Here is the reply I sent them...

Please share other thoughts and comments you have about the 2004 election and what Democrats and the Democratic Party should do going forward.

First of all...we need Howard Dean as DNC Chairman. In an email from the DNC that I received today, Terry McAuliffe is attempting to take all of the credit for the grass roots movement that occurred in the 2004 election, but that is most certainly Howard Dean's thunder that is being stolen. Shame on Terry McAuliffe! Howard Dean was the candidate who kickstarted the Dem's with a grass roots movement through the Internet, and inspired and mobilized young people like no one else, since Bill Clinton. NOT Terry McAulliffe. This watered down, 'Republican Lite' direction that our party seems to be going in, is going to be our party's damnation. The religious right/hard core Bush supporters are not going to be swayed. In my Parish alone, the numbers speak for themselves. As of the week of 12/04/04, there were 44,410 registered Democrats, and 20,961 Republicans. Yet, Bush carried Rapides Parish. Inspire and mobilize those already in our camp with the passions and beliefs of the majority, that is, the grass roots supporters, and push for, and put support behind candidates who reflect those passions and beliefs. Instead of trying to distance the party from liberals and progressives, embrace them. They are the future and salvation of the Democrats, not the shameful stepchildren, as they are so treated. Further, and most importantly, stop ignoring, and begin to make every attempt to bring to light, the fact that the 2004 election was RIGGED. We all know that fraud occurred, and those responsible should be held accountable. Those who ignore it and try to sweep it under the rug, out of whatever fears, or hidden agendas they may have, are just as responsible as those who committed the act. I keep waiting for my party to stop taking these ruffian, thuggish, illegal tactics from the Republicans as if it is our due medicine. It is well past time for the Democrats to align ourselves with the Greens, the Libertarian's, and everyone else who is fed up and infuriated, with the Bush Administration and what they are doing to our country.

[marions ghost]

44. Whew...

welcome to DU revillusion
maybe that blast can get through the fog...

:toast:

[Revillusion1]

57. Thanks...

:toast: Right back at ya! :smoke:

[rdmccur]

59. Right on!

[Chasing Dreams]

34. My email: Democratic Party calculus is wrong

I just sent this:

The Democratic Party's acquiescence in the 2004 election fraud is appalling. Where are Kerry, Edwards, and other leaders? Why aren't they actively screaming FRAUD? Why aren't they out there campaigning for media coverage of the MOUNTAINS of statistical and on-the-ground evidence of widespread voter suppression, exit poll deviations from the count, the fact that nearly all "errors" found so far favor Republicans. Our leaders, with few exceptions, have no backbone.

At this point I don't plan on voting Democratic in the next Presidential Election. Why Bother? The election machinery is rigged; even if we win, the count will say we lost.

I'll tell you this: when the facts are finally out there, about 1/3 of Democratic voters just won't believe that a new fascist political/corporate/media order has arisen in the US. They'll believe that Bush won fair and square no matter what. One-third will believe that the election was fixed, but will meekly go on with their lives and probably continue to vote Democratic. But the last third is going to go Ape Shit and will no longer vote for Democrats at the top of the ticket. Some of us may leave the country to save our kids' freedom and lives, or our own.

I don't envy the Democratic Party's position. If you challenge and aren't viewed sympathetically, it will hurt you with swing voters. If you do nothing, the educated and aware will leave the Party in droves. Yeah, it seems like you're "damned if you do and damned if you don't". But that calculus is wrong: you're certainly damned if you continue to wring your hands about what "we did wrong" and tell the faithful to "get over it", but just might come out smelling like roses if you GO FOR IT. NOW!!!

[ElsewheresDaughter]

37. done and singing Joplin's, Piece of my Heart

[zeemike]

42. I love that button, Draft Young Republicans n/t

[Yuugal]

38. I'm always happy to tell "my" party how I feel.....

"Please share your thoughts and comments, blah blah blah"

My reply:

I'll just direct you to Democraticunderground.com, moveon.org, and commondreams.org. At these sites you dem leaders can learn what we the underlings really think of you. You have deserted the American worker, played a losing game of appeasement with the republicans, and sold your souls for corporate money. You are also spineless and have no clue what "opposition party" means. I'll give you a hint, it has something to do with the word oppose.

[keepthemhonest]

40. replied n/t

[renaissanceguy]

41. Replied

[Bill Bored]

43. We should bombard the DNC with this

A friend of mine sent me this (about that). I like it but if anyone has anything better, send that too:

"A full investigation into the anomalous results of the 2004 election should be undertaken immediately, with or without the support of the GOP. What happened in Ohio is a national disgrace and it may only be the tip of the iceberg.

The whole party needs to support the efforts of the Democrats on the House Judiciary Comm. and more importantly, the grassroots efforts currently underway by voting rights groups and the Greens and Libertarian parties to determine the truth.

Our party will have NO future if we don't get to the bottom of this, and you can forget about getting participation at the grass roots level in the future. Winning hearts and minds is difficult enough without having to worry about the possibility of election fraud. We need to fight for our rights as Democrats in all 50 states and in DC.

Finally, we need members of the Senate to stand with the Congressional Black Caucus, and/or other House members to challenge the certification of electors on Jan. 6, 2005, unless by that time, it can be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, through full disclosure and forensic analysis of all voting tabulation hardware, software, and any other vote counting methodologies employed, that election fraud did not take place in 2004 in Ohio or anywhere else in our republic.

I await your usual computer-generated form letter response, but I do hope someone actually reads this and takes some action before January 6."

[pacalo]

61. Great letter, Bill Bored.

I just sent mine in, too, & I included the information in your 4th paragraph:

...we need members of the Senate to stand with the Congressional Black Caucus, and/or other House members to challenge the certification of electors on Jan. 6, 2005, unless by that time, it can be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, through full disclosure and forensic analysis of all voting tabulation hardware, software, and any other vote counting methodologies employed, that election fraud did not take place in 2004 in Ohio or anywhere else in our republic.

All of the thoughts expressed in this thread are born of common sense & I'm glad to see that the DNC will be receiving so many like-minded comments. It's very galling to receive e-mails from the DNC asking for support at a time when we're convinced that the election was stolen & their attitude is "life goes on" & "what can we do better?"

I told them that I will not be contributing any more money to the Democratic party until our leadership shows some backbone regarding this second stolen presidential election from the same man.

[Time for change]

45. I think you're being too hard on them

I share your concern that the DNC and Kerry campaign should be more aggressive about this (although I don't know what they're doing behind the scenes). But I think that accusing them of being in on the conspiracy is over the top. I'm sure that they wanted to win as much as we wanted them to. They just have a different way, perhaps, of dealing with the loss.

[4democracy]

46. There is a huge difference between losing something and having it stolen

[Niche]

51. My thoughts exactly. If they stood up the first time it was stolen...

Imagine. :bounce: :bounce:

[BamaBecky]

49. Done

[StephanieMarie]

50. Here's mine:

The Democrats should be real and true to their values. Stop trying to act like the Republican assholes. Care about the poor and disenfranchised. Care about the earth. Care about education. Fight corruption. Fight hate. Fight this stolen election. Never give up. There was systematic fraud in all 50 states to pad the popular vote for Bush, and Ohio was stolen. YOU MUST PURSUE THE FRAUD AND OVERTURN THE ELECTION! 2006 will be too late. Bush&Co are putting us back into the dark ages in every aspect of government. They must be stopped now! I'm switching to the Green party if you all don't step up to the plate NOW!!!

[rodeodance]

52. Done --and send to otheres I know for them to fill out

[lonestarnot]

53. YOU FREAKS KEEP OUT OF THE BEO THAT'S HOW WE FEEL

Now they want to theive away with the vote cards so they can't be counted!

[Melissa G]

54. I just gave them my three cents

Thanks for the link!

[Cookie wookie]

60. Here's what I sent:

1. How did you participate in this election?
I worked as an activist to stop further deregulation of the media (no one can win without an objective media); as an activist and pushed for legislation in my state for voter verified paper ballots for our Diebold vote stealing machines (which failed); I worked hard on the Dean campaign; I joined political actions and progressive organizations, wrote emails, sent faxes, phoned, and donated money to groups in an effort to defeat Bush; when Kerry became the candidate, I attended Dem county meetings, donated money to the Kerry campaign, continued to fight for fair elections and having our votes counted, and finally worked as a poll watcher for Common Cause/Votewatch. After Nov. 2, I've fought with money and time to look for evidence of vote fraud and to have the election audited because it was quickly obvious that Kerry won and that there was massive vote fraud.

2. Is this the first time you participated in election activism?
I've worked on elections in the past, but I've spend more time and money on this election than ever before, in spite of the fact that I was unhappy at the way the Democrats in Congress had been working so well "across the aisles" with the Republicans that it appeared we only had one party instead of two, and that was a fascist party.

3. How would you like to continue to stay involved? (Volunteering, phonebanking, fundraising, local organizing, etc.)
I am considering leaving the Democratic Party, of which I've been a member of all my life. I will continue activism, but it won't be for the Democratic Party unless the party makes a big U turn and gets back to it's roots. I suspect that is no longer possible, but hey, astonish me.

4. Did you feel the actions you took were effective?
I feel like together, those of us who were working -- independently from the Democratic leadership, which was poor by the way -- through organizations like MoveOn, TrueMajority, and Democracy for America to win this election for Kerry/Edwards succeeded. They won.

5. Was it a good experience for you?
I thought Kerry was a great candidate as was Edwards, and I ended up supporting them wholeheartedly. I was crushed when they conceded.

But, the fact that the Democratic leadership hasn't cared enough to fight for our votes has been one of the most devastating and enlightening political experiences of my life.

First Kerry concedes before the votes are even counted, then as evidence mounts that the election was riddled with fraud all across the country, all the DNC can say is that they will investigate it (and get back to us next year) and the fraud wasn't enough to change the outcome. Really? How do you know until the votes are counted and audited?

6. How would you make it better?
As I said, I'll go looking for another political party or work for Democracy for America and Howard Dean to clean the Democratic Party from the ground up. If things get much worse, maybe I'll look for another country.

The party has lost almost all of its credibility as the formerly great Democratic Party of Roosevelt and Kennedy. Now Democratic Party leadership appears to be just a bunch of out-of-touch, self-satisfied, corporate-owned sellouts.

7. Please share other thoughts and comments you have about the 2004 election and what Democrats and the Democratic Party should do going forward.
If the Democratic Party has any connection to real values and ethics, to preserving and protecting the Constitution of the US, and to fighting for the civil rights of Americans, they will show up in droves at the Judiciary Hearing and support Rep Conyers in seeing that the 2004 election is thoroughly recounted, no electors are certified until an independent audit of Ohio is completed, and everyone from top to bottom who participated in election fraud is brought to justice.

The next few weeks will demonstrate which side you're on -- democracy or fascism. We the People will be watching.

[senegal1]

62. I feel GREEN

For the first time ever I sent money to the DNC and I can tell you I will think twice before doing it again. I called the Washington Dc number when the Washington recount was down to the wire for funding and left a message that I expected them to fund the recount or I would vote Green next time.

[magellan]

63. Geez, I got this e-mail too

Pissed me off so bad to see the same damn form I filled out a month ago that I put this in every field:

"Already responded to this feedback. How many times do you need to be told? Join the reality-based community, start fighting for democracy, or get the hell out of the way!!"

[Pooka Fey]

64. I hate to split the progressive vote, but I'm feeling mighty GREEN.

[fearnobush]

65. I told them exactly how I feel.

I told them they are weak and spineless and that if they continue the current course, the DNC would go the way of the Wigs - a foot note in history. I for one believe that the real Democrats like Dean will prevail because they are the most passionate and truly believe in the core values of the Democratic party.

[fshrink]

66. Done.