Firm Accused Of Tampering With Data Left Some Unofficial Results

[IAMREALITY]

On Public Webserver


Not sure if we've seen this yet.


http://www.bluelemur.com/index.php?p=496

(snip)

The firm left the unofficial results of at least two counties – Lorain and Madison – available as text files on their corporate website. Both counties show “unofficial cumulative results” from the eleven p.m. to one a.m. hour on Election Day and Nov. 3.

The votes at those times closely correlate with the final reported results.

When told of the results, a Triad spokesman paused for several seconds before responding. The spokesman declined to give his name.

“Generally the only purpose of that on election night is that counties used to get inundated with calls,” he said. If someone calls, he said, “they say just look at the website and you’ll see what the unofficial count is.”

But the spokesman declined to answer why the unofficial results was posted on the firm’s website. When pressed, he hung up, saying, “have a nice day.”

[IndyOp]

1. Wow --

Sounds like Triad was posting the results they wanted to have happen on their website election night?! Why in the world would ANY results be posted on the TRIAD company website?

"Triad... left some unofficial results publicly available on their website.

The firm left the unofficial results of at least two counties – Lorain and Madison – available as text files on their corporate website. Both counties show “unofficial cumulative results” from the eleven p.m. to one a.m. hour on Election Day and Nov. 3.

The votes at those times closely correlate with the final reported results.

When told of the results, a Triad spokesman paused for several seconds before responding. The spokesman declined to give his name.

“Generally the only purpose of that on election night is that counties used to get inundated with calls,” he said. If someone calls, he said, “they say just look at the website and you’ll see what the unofficial count is.”

:bounce:

[electropop]

2. I hope somebody has a screen shot! n/t

[momzno1]

12. not only does blue lemur have a screen shot

you can go to the shot and type in the address yourself and the pages are still there--- so far....

[ihelpu2see]

13. is there a Triad web site, I have been trying to see if Triad gave

$$ to political parties and I can only find Triad Systems of Calif. which is now Activant and does not sound like that co. does voting machienes???

[rockedthevoteinMA]

21. here i helpu - plan9_pub found one in another thread!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x161964

[roseBudd]

46. Triad founder Tod Rapp gave to the GOP, this was discussed last week on DU

[drm604]

3. I'm startting to wonder about this whole tampering business...

From the article:

"A Triad employee was accused Tuesday of inappropriate and likely illegal election tampering by Rep. John Conyers (D-Mich) in the New York Times. After the alleged tampering took place, the state decided to recount another county for the Ohio recount, the Times reported."

Could it be that this was what they wanted? Maybe the whole thing was a setup so that this particular county wouldn't be recounted! The whole business about posting the exact numbers so that the recount would match didn't make sense to me. Why would the Green or Democratic counters agree to that?

[jamboi]

32. Is that supposed to read "decided to recount another precinct" instead of

county? Please check the quote and correct if so.

[drm604]

44. I copied and pasted. It said "county". n/t

[KoKo]

4. Why is this important? I didn't understand why it mattered that they left

"unofficial results" up on their web page. :shrug: I went to the link and read the article, but I still don't understand why it's significant..

[IAMREALITY]

5. The Results Weren't On A County's Website

They were on the TRIAD website.

[crispini]

7. EXACTEMENT.

No way, no HOW that TRIAD should have had that stuff.

[KoKo]

16. Okay.....I got it. Who were they getting the results from when only the

Elections Officials should have had those results. Who was calling them into TRIAD....That's the Point of it. Sorry...was a little slow on the uptake there.

Perhaps we have a whistle blower in there at TRIAD if these results were left up..then it's an admission that they were being "informed" while folks were voting what the vote totals were.

Very suspicious...very odd.. And, why should folks be calling into TRIAD on election day anyway asking for results? One of the articles said the owner said people call in and so they decided to place the results on their website....:eyes:

[momzno1]

18. right............

who the fuck is calling the maker of the machines to get the voting totals?
citizens????
election officials????
Katherine Blackhole????

Puh-leeeeeeeeeeze

[life_long_dem]

27. RoveTurd possibly?

[KoKo]

30. Remember the article posted on DU about Rove entering numbers in

to his laptop on election night? It was written by a BBC reporter and the DU poster was wondering if they should e-mail the reporter to ask more about what she observed that night?

[rockedthevoteinMA]

31. Rachel Clarke at the BBC

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3987237.stm

By the time election night came around, Mr Rove was in the White House, where, unusually for a political adviser, he has an office.

He set up computers in the Old Family Dining Room and started tabulating results. He had set up a massive network of contacts, not just in state capitals, but individual districts and precincts to monitor turnout and support.


Mr Rove may spin the news, but the media still wants to hear him
Early exit polls quoted by media seemed to give Mr Kerry the edge, but colleagues said Mr Rove indicated right away that they did not tally with his information.

He used his own data to put Ohio and Florida in the Bush column - bringing cheers from the president and his family when he went into the Roosevelt Room and told them.

And when the TV networks gave either Ohio or Nevada to Mr Bush but not both - which would have led him to be declared as the winner - Mr Rove was one of the president's aides who got on the phone to news chiefs to try to pressure them to change their minds.

more...

By Rachel Clarke
BBC News, Washington

[Garbo 2004]

53. I see the story of Rove's activities on that night frequently

and I wonder if it's now one of those almost mythic stories in the media lore regarding election night 2004. The story and variations of it went forth in the mainstream media and I speculate this "inside look" was/is intended to create and reinforce in readers' minds the myth of the "inevitability" of Bush's re-election. So people don't question the results. (I'm not saying that's the intent of this specific writer, but the intent of those on the inside that provided the tale to her and others.) So the story is the great Rove had his finger on the pulse of the nation, and although the naysaying exit polls had Kerry ahead, his brilliant strategy had succeeded and the White House royals cheered when he announced the news.

"Kerry voters may have been motivated by the war or the economy, but it seems that in this election, not enough of them felt strongly enough to go and stand in line to vote."

So it was the religious RWingers Republicans who were standing in lines for hours to vote in Ohio?

Of course much of the "moral issues" majority stuff and other such conclusions has since been debunked, but like corrections after the fact in the press, the bell can't be unrung.

I bring this up because every time I see this story or others like it I keep wondering what happened to that press report where Karen Hughes solemnly broke the news to the President that he was going to lose. That story appears to be gone from White House/media lore.

Because there is to be no suggestion that the vote results were ever really seriously in question so that there could be no legitimate doubt about the results? And so those who question the results or the "irregularities" and voter disenfranchisement could be more readily dismissed?

Just musing...

[jamboi]

33. I didn't get it right away either. The other thing I wonder about is wheth

er it is saying that the final results matched these early in process results a little too closely.

[IAMREALITY]

36. I agree

The article is definitely sketchy on details of reasons of importance from the author. I hope we see more come from it to explain its real significance.

[corky44]

37. wouldn't the final numbers be impossible

to ascertain by 11:00pm 11/02/04?

[godel escher bach]

8. The point ?

The article states that Ohio also posted these partial numbers on election day. So, anyone, including Triad, could have posted these numbers on their personal website. Could be something. Could be nothing.

I fail to see a scenario where Triad having these publicly available numbers on their website could contribute fraud.

[IAMREALITY]

10. You Fail To See, But MOST Don't

Here's a quote to help ya out ok?

"This is the only known incident of a private firm publishing unofficial Ohio results on their own site."

[Straight Shooter]

6. "Have a nice day."

Well, that kind of says it all, doesn't it? Sounds like he got ambushed by the truth.


edit: the screen shots or web pages of their results should be in their server archives, right? That isn't "proprietary information." It's accessible, isn't it, for investigation? Any IT people who can answer this?

[Brundle_Fly]

9. here they are....

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohmadison/results.txt

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohlorainl/results.txt

[IAMREALITY]

11. Is that From the County Or Triad? n/t

[Broken Acorn]

14. From Triad

In the article you posted Triad also posted official election results in their root IP domain 66.241.236.181 dated in various days in November and December for the Ohio counties of Ashtabula, Brown, Clinton, Darke, Greene, Preble and Union.

[IAMREALITY]

15. Yeah, I saw that Afterwards, but that says the official results

Not the same as the ones they had that night correct?

[Broken Acorn]

20. Well, yes and no

The pages:

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohmadison/results.txt

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohlorainl/results.txt

are the ones from that night (11/2). But the others have been updated as official.

How easy would it be for these hackers to 'fix' the data at each tabulator by getting fake counts from their company's webserver.

OMG, we are either looking at stuff that just isn't really there, or looking at a massive fraud conspiracy with these companies themselves, with many employees involved.

[momzno1]

17. "unofficial cummulative report" - 11 pm? why do they have this??

[woodsprite]

19. Could it be a plant? n/t

[momzno1]

22. does it sound like the official spoken with was ready for the

question?

I don't think so....

[shraby]

23. Take the address

<http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohmadison/results.txt>

Where it says /ohmadison/

change it to ohgreene and you will find that page with Greene co. on it. I'll try other counties.

[s-cubed]

25. GET SCREEN SHOTS

[ReneB]

55. look here for county Union, Summit, Preble, Green, ,Madison, Darke & more

Union:
http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohUnion/results.txt

This says recount on SEPTEMBER 7, 2004
Summit:
http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohSummit/results.txt

Preble:
http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohPreble/results.txt

Green:
http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohGreene/results.txt

Darke:
http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohDarke/results.txt

Cliton:
http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohClinton/results.txt

Brown:
http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohBrown/results.txt

Ashtabula:
http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohAshtabula/results.txt

Madison:
http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohMadison/results.txt

[FULL_METAL_HAT]

24. Interesting links to examine

Direct links to the pages on their server right now (found them by manually typing in the counties .../ohXXXXXX/results.txt):

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohmadison/results.txt

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohunion/results.txt

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohpreble/results.txt

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohdarke/results.txt

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohgreene/results.txt

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohclinton/results.txt

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohashtabula/results.txt

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohbrown/results.txt

A google search to divine other pages with triad and "results.txt"
http://www.google.com/search?num=50&hl=en&lr=&safe=off&q=triad+results.txt+election

Google search for all pages within the site "66.241.236.181" (which incidentally resolves to "triadgsi.com" so its not any kind of "hidden site") -- there is only one result "TGSI Customer Login"
http://www.google.com/search?q=site%3A66.241.236.181

"Wayback machine" (from the Internet Archive) with pages from the past (there is a single page captured in 2003 and 2004)
http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://66.241.236.181

http://web.archive.org/web/20040225095119/http://66.241.236.181/

Interesting page that answers a question I've had about WHERE do the absentee ballots get mailed ... on this page it says the county BOE receives the absentee ballots, not a central place as I had heard -- this may have changed for Nov 2 -- anyone know offhand?
http://web.archive.org/web/20030804055000/www.electionohio.com/cuyahoga/absentee.htm

[Dolphyn]

43. Google is fast -- and is watching us! :-)

Check out this link now:
http://www.google.com/search?q=site%3A66.241.236.181
It's already updated with links from this thread.

More fun with Google:
http://www.google.com/search?q=%22official+cumulative+report%22+november+2004+%22general+election%22
http://www.google.com/search?q=%22unofficial+cumulative+report%22+november+2004+%22general+election%22
Many of these reports use a similar format to the ones on Triad's site, so they may come from a similar source.

[sabra]

26. Not sure if this explains things, or just makes it more suspicious...

Triad also hosts the site http://www.electionsonthe.net, which they describe it as '"one-stop" place for election information?'.

If you go to: http://www.electionsonthe.net/oh/ , you get a list to the various OH counties. Some counties have their own election sites some don't. The interesting thing is, some appear to use Triad as the facilitator of their site.

For example...

Franklin County: http://www.co.franklin.oh.us/boe/ , has it's own custom website.

But...

Clinton: http://www.electionsonthe.net/oh/clinton/
Darke: http://www.electionsonthe.net/oh/darke/

Clinton, Darke, and others use Triad to host their counties election website.

It appears that this explains why Triad had the election result text files on their server for certain counties? However what I am curious is, how did Triad get the information to update the hosted websites? In addition, are there any issues for the election machine providers to be hosting the counties election websites?

What do you think?

[KoKo]

28. Does Ohio Law allow the makers of voting machines to get the results

from the county officials AND does this mean the county has a link in place from the macines to the Voting Machine Makers or do the Elections Officials call the results into the Voting Machine Companies.

I think this is big and if Arnebeck and Conyers/Bonifaz and the rest don't already know this...they SHOULD. If this is being allowed all over the US then this should be illegal if it isn't already.

I was an outside poll monitor and my husband was inside monitoring the vote on election day. I called in one of the voting tallies downtown to my Democratic Party officials...as to the number of votes matching the polling books. BUT...no one thought to ask if our Opti-Scans were connected to ES&S and that THEY might be getting results from the machines about which candidates the votes were being cast for. My husband didn't see any hook up from the machine to a phone line but could it have been "wireless?" I never thought to look to see if ES&S had results up on their website...How would any of us have thought that the Voting Machine makers would have access to what should be STATE INFORMATION?

Weren't Ohioans voting until 2:00 a.m. on election night because of the long lines? Why have "unofficial tallies posted" when they had to get them from "officials."

I may be offbase here, but it still seems questionable.

[sabra]

34. I hear you...

That's what I was intending with my post. If it's OK for Triad to host some of the counties election web sites, then how does it work with gathering the results? Is it called in, do they have a direct connection to the tabulator, etc... ? I think some investigation is warranted.

[Visiongirl]

29. if only this had been posted Nov. 1st...

wouldn't that have been wonderful? the unofficial results posted before the election! ah, to dream....

[Must_B_Free]

35. *** - the relevance of this is:

in order to fix the election, it would be necessary to know the unofficial results in order to calculate how many votes to skim when the fraud is committed.

[Dolphyn]

40. The weird thing is ...

They really don't have much of anything on their website.
Take a look: http://www.triadgsi.com/

Does that website inspire confidence?

This one isn't very impressive either:
http://www.electionsonthe.net/

[sabra]

38. Triad Website Login

Also noticed this link http://66.241.236.181/elect/login.htm , I am curious what this represents, and who are these clients logging in?

[Terre]

39. They've apparently been doing this for some time

Because from the Elections on the Net site, they still have UNOFFICIAL RESULTS in Ohio on a local election that was on the 6th of November 2001:

http://www.electionsonthe.net/oh/brown/elecres/20011106.htm

[Terre]

41. Some more. . .

And on further investigation here's one for the 2000 General Election:
http://www.electionsonthe.net/oh/brown/elecres/20001107.htm

I'd assume there's probably one for each Ohio County if you just change the county name in the web address. Maybe you can even get other states they service by simply changing the state name and county? I'd try FL but I'm not familiar with all the counties.

[Alizaryn]

42. Will a computer person check this out for me please?

I may be nothing but I wanted someone who knows what they are looking at to check it out.

First go to this site:

http://www.touchgraph.com/TGGoogleBrowser.html

Then graph out this address:

http://66.241.236.181/elect/ohmadison/results.txt

[drm604]

48. Alizaryn, it doesn't explain very well what the graph is illustrating.

At first I thought that it might be graphing links to or from other sites but that doesn't appear to be the case. Apparently it's showing the degree of "relatedness" or "similarity" (according to Google) between different websites starting with the input URL. I don't know what Google is measuring when it refers to "relatedness" or "similarity" so it's hard to know what to make of it. Do you see something in particular that you're curious about?

[Alizaryn]

50. Thanks for looking, I was wondering what the relationship

was between the linked sites. I can't imagine some of the results on the graph showing up on a regular google search. I guess, I just did not understand what I was looking at. I need to stop wandering! :)

[drm604]

52. Alizaryn, I don't think you'll find any clues about vote fraud in those

relationships if that's what you're looking for, at least not in this case. But it might be an interesting tool to use to browse for possible relationships between various people or organizations etc.

[lonestarnot]

45. This deliciously juicy evidence of a CRIME!

:kick: hehehehe

[Al-CIAda]

47. Election Official Thwarts Recount Using Phony Vote Totals

Election Official Thwarts Recount Using Phony Vote Totals
December 14,2004 -Venice, FL. 
by Daniel Hopsicker

A “mistake” made in the office of a seriously-compromised Supervisor of Election in Pinellas County whose husband is a top executive of the country’s largest election services company has almost unnoticed spiked the best hope for a election recount in Florida that might have thrown a spotlight on the dark corners of the Florida election process concealing widespread systemic and system-wide vote fraud.

The office of Supervisor of Elections in Pinellas County, Deborah Clark, provided inflated totals on the YES side of the gambling initiative which were then used by state officials in the official state tally of the hotly-contested gambling initiative known as Amendment 4.

The initiative would allow casino slot machine gambling in South Florida, an outcome devoutly to be wished by owners of the spanking new $700 million Hard Rock Café Casino in Hollywood, Florida, a facility all dressed up but with currently nowhere to go.

Pinellas County voters defeated the gambling initiative by more than 17,000 votes. But the official state record says the exact opposite, the result of a “mistake” by the office of Pinellas Elections Supervisor which would have gone unnoticed, said local reports, had it not been caught by outside observers.
 

Advantage Hard Rock

A recount of Florida’s votes on the state gambling initiative offered an opportunity to correlate what was found with what are so far just “theories” of how the Presidential election in Florida might have been stolen. 

Deborah Clark provided an extra 34,000 votes on the YES side of the gambling initiative, sufficient to legally preclude what would have otherwise been a mandated recount.

Ms. Clark’s performance had been questioned in press accounts before, most recently after the 2002 primary contest, when newspaper headlines read “Clark's election flubs draw fire.”

Strangely, no one can said to have benefited more from the inadvertent mistake than Clark’s own husband.  As a longtime top executive with E S & S, the company which counts more than half the U.S. vote, Richard Clark probably had more to lose from a recount than almost anyone alive…

Should rumored anomalies surface in the recount, the fortunes of any elections firms involved would no doubt suffer.  
(continued below)
 
 http://www.madcowprod.com/12142004.html
 

 

[lonestarnot]

56. Thank you for this enlightening connect the dots.

Waiting for word on some prosecutions. Governors should be insisting that their states be purged of these actors, but I don't see it happening. Have you seen any clean-up efforts underway in ANY state by law enforcement? Nope, not a peep? Disgusting.

[RaulVB]

49. They are soo screwed (n/t)

[lawladyprof]

51. Maybe they tampered with a precinct they didn't want recounted-eom

[shraby]

54. The Gems tabulators have pages online too

some link to a county page but most are stand-alones. Type into google, GEMS election results 2004
I picked up a lot of pages that way.