Kerry in Iraq :perfect timing

[zapped 1]

...assuming the premise layed out in the invisible teflon thread is true.
A real war hero looking very presidential over there while MSM beams back the photos here as the election is being contested...

[Shalom]

1. You Have a Point, Since Bushitler Genocide in Iraq will bring him down...

[Goldeneye]

2. I hope the teflon thread is right

And I'm gonna go with it, until Jan. 6. There's gotta be a senator who honestly cares about the constitution\us\democracy more than they care about power. I gotta add...they won't be in power long if there is fraud anyway, so what do they have to lose?

[mbee]

3. My dream is that it will be John McCain! I know it's over the top

to think such a thing could happen, but I'm dreaming of a miracle!

[Goldeneye]

4. dreams are fine by me.

I want every dem to stand up...and a few decent republicans...

[whalerider55]

5. Well, don't expect Kennedy...

He's my Senator, I supported his run for president in 1980, and I have lived in MA since 1982.

I have written to him twice since early December, asking him to sponsor the House petition to toss the election results, and I have yet to hear back from his office. That is very unusual; previous contacts with his office have always gotten immediate responses.

If not Kennedy, who has absolutely nothing to lose (his legislative legacy is profound) who, then?

Feingold dodged my written request; I haven't heard back from Boxer, Leahy, Schumer...

I want all 45 Dems to stand up. Not for Kerry; for the potentially millions of votes that were suppressed, intimidated, and not counted as they were cast.

If the Dems can't find that a principle worth standing up for...

whalerider55

[yojon]

8. Maybe Byrd??

He is nearing retirement anyway, he is principled and grumpy enought just to do it.

[whalerider55]

15. yeah, Byrd is the guy n/t

[GetTheRightVote]

9. whalerider55, if the normal does not happen then think that the un-normal

could happen in its place, perhaps he is one who is thinking of defending the election with us ???

:kick:

[whalerider55]

17. your point is well-taken

i guess part of my problem is that I have just don't have the faith in the party leadership (on the congressional, gubernatorial, or inrastructure level) that others are willing to have; some of this is based on a lifetime of reading people as a professional, nearly 40 years of political activism, expereince as an elected progressive offical; some of this is based on a series of very distrurbing conversations with party apparatchniks on the local and national level and within the Kerry camp here in MA.

I just think that the stakes are so high, that we are in a constitutional crisis more serious than watergate- and that if no one stands up for enranchisement, if no one can frame that as THE issue at stake here, we will literally lose a generation at the polls.

whalerider55

[buddysmellgood]

14. None will tip their hand before the event. It gives the pukes too much

time to cry fowl and apply pressure. Pukes can't do anything beforehand without looking nuts.

[bunny planet]

20. Write to Senator Frank Lautenberg from NJ. He is 82 years old, was

retired, and only came back to his Senate seat because another Democrat in NJ went down in scandalous flames. Lautenberg is a great guy, has a set, hates *, and is not running again for office. He doesn't appear to have anything to lose. I've written him a couple of times. I'm writing again tomorrow, and calling. But if lots of people write from out of state too, I bet he just might do it.

[BlueStateBlue]

27. I'll write to him - I'm from NJ, too!! n/t

[bunny planet]

35. go for it

[zann725]

40. Thanks for the tip! Sounds good! Will do!

n/t

[merh]

21. Are they dodging you or are they just not going public with their

plans? All dems, with the exception of Conyers, have been too quiet. The quiet of Gore, Clinton, Dean, Clark, Kerry, Edwards, etc. speaks volumes to me. There are things in the works and they don't want to tip their hand. Maybe I am being too hopeful, but that is my gut feeling.

[whalerider55]

22. i agree they've been quiet

but i also see that as possibly consistent with the general fecklessness and cowardice i've seen in the dems in the senate since wellstone was murdered.

and don't forget, the kerry lawyers have made it a point of saying most recently that they are not contesting that Bush won.

what confuses me is that Jesse Jackson, who was kept completely under wraps by the Kerry Campaign (and the Gore Campaign) in a lurch towards the middle is out there now, along with Al SHarpton, whose Dem Campaign was funded by pugs...

well, January 6th will separate the men and women from the sheep.

whalerider55

[liberalla]

42. God, I hope you're right !

It's what I've been hoping for, and thinking myself. That there really IS a plan and we don't know about it...

[whometense]

38. The silence is deafening,

to be sure, but I don't take that as a no.

I'm a MA resident as well, and whatever plan is in place I'm sure Kennedy is in on. He may just be not wanting to tip his hand - he certainly has nothing to fear politically. The entire state would rise as one and cheer him on.

[Senator]

41. We can ALL do more than write...

We are Recruiting - for Jan 3rd, 4th, and 5th.

If you can be in DC on any of those days and are willing to try to meet with Senators (or more likely staff), please contact us:

[e-mail]

We are trying to get citizen-lobbyists to have face-to-face meetings in as many Senate offices as possible.

We will provide talking points, materials, and any other assistance we can. Also, no one will be expected to "go it alone."

You can also visit local Senate offices if you can't get to DC. Just contact us and we can advise you on how to get a meeting and what to say once there.
____
www.thedeanpeople.org
[e-mail]

[tngledwebb]

46. Shocking.

Not even a form letter to placate their electorate?

They may as well be complicit in the theft. Or are, in actuality.
Or merely frightened...

[Viva_La_Revolution]

10. My secret theory....

McCain is really on our side. He's undercover and reporting everything to K/E! Wouldn't that be DOOSIE! of a sting operation!:headbang:

[bunny planet]

37. don't hold your breath on that one.

I'd be shocked if that happened.

[formernaderite]

45. even if that happened....

the results would end up the same. The house and senate would elect Bush. Where do you see a different scenario?

[EFerrari]

6. No one hopes you're right more than I do. But, but, but

this whole argument about how smartly Kerry is waging the post-campaign doesn't sort with how he did during the REAL campaign.

My effort is not the guesstimated "behind the scenes" one. It's simply,
our votes count or we'll have your @ss.

Leave it there. Beth

[Viva_La_Revolution]

7. A real war hero looking very presidential over there while

MSM beams back the photos here as the election is being contested...

AND the troops are cheering him and smiling, unlike those videos of * visiting.:bounce:

[zapped 1]

11. yes...

cheering for someone who knows what if feels like to actually fight in a war.

[bunny planet]

39. and no fake plastic turkey either

[nmoliver]

12. I see it as a way ...

... for him to avoid being accountable for accepting or rejecting the electors on Jan 6. He is abstaining out of a conflict of interest. He may, however, quietly give his permission to other Senators to contest the election on his behalf.

(assuming the Teflon theory, of course ...)

[whalerider55]

16. ollie

welcome to DU

i was out of the country for a week, so i missed the origin of the Teflon theory- any willing to take a moment to share it?

whalerider55

[seito]

25. Here ya go

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=206056&mesg_id=206056

[whalerider55]

29. seito... thanks

but it just doesn't add up to me.
I ran a nationwide association of attorneys for 5 years. you can't keep 17,000 lawyers all working on the same thing quiet.

and if there are thousands of people on the ground in ohio doing their own investigations and being their own media, the lowliest of pugs would have been screaming their piggish heads off by now. they'd have been calling limbaugh and hannity about subversive harrassment.

i'd like to believe it. but Kerry, who i think will make a wonderful, rooseveltian even president, has also been my senator for 20 years here in MA. i kinda know his MO, and what this article proposes just doesn't really fit it.

i guess the ship sails on a kerry presidency on Jan 6th.
but if that's the basket we're putting all our eggs in, then what also follows in the wake of that ship is the constitutional issue of enfranchisement. three consecutive federal elections tampered with; a skill set prefected by pugs and thugs, and a generation before the damage will be undone. i can't shake the feeling that we should be much more militant about that as the issue at stake here.

whalerider55

[Darknyte7]

36. I share your concern...

I wonder whether enough people, even here in the DU community understand the crushing gravity of this situation. If we should be militant about anything, we should be militant about our franchise.

[Peace Patriot]

31. The Teflon (or what I called the Rattlesnake) theory

Essentially, it's that everything Kerry has done and said is part of a well thought out strategy--what I call The Rattlesnake strategy--starting with his concession on 11/3, to keep Kerry out of the way of the BushCon character assassination squad (& their lapdog media), while quietly gathering evidence and putting a case together to spring on Jan. 6, in a serious challenge of the election.

One thing that lends credence to this theory, in my view, is how truly dangerous the BushCons are, a very evil, criminal cabal, capable of anything. They cannot afford to yield power because they would soon be in Gitmo in orange suits. They are war criminals, and they are terrorists themselves--not to mention their looting of the federal government.

So...Kerry must have a slamdunk case against them, and all his ducks in a row. He also needs public support, and this is the part I don't get. The public is largely ignorant of what happened in this election. They would be very angry (and, I think, relieved) if they knew, and, of course, a majority voted for Kerry, in a determined effort to oust these criminals. They would rally to Kerry in a minute. They want the BushCons out! But Kerry has done absolutely nothing to inform them, or rouse them up.

Kerry's actions and words could also be interpreted in an entirely different way: ambivlalence, ambiguity, unwillingness to fight for priniciple (our right to vote, our democracy), and willing to be president if someone ELSE's investigative work gets him there.

Also, one wonders about the "10,000" lawyers Kerry supposedly had assembled, his frequent promises to insure that "every vote is counted," and the tons of money he and the Dems collected for their legal fund, some of it on Election night (I know--I contributed).

The above facts could support either theory.

Does Kerry believe there was widespread fraud sufficient to deny him victory? Hard to say. But both the K/E internal polls, and the Exit Polls, must tell him that something's very wrong--not to mention the horrendous vote suppression in Ohio and Florida.

The public statements of his lawyers, and of K/E themselves, are contradictory--which could also be part of the Teflon (or Rattlesnake) strategy.

I've compared all this to reading entrails. It sure is.

I'm tending today to believe that compromise, ambivalence, lack of principle--or lack of willingness to fight for it, and inability to even see it--so characteristic of the Democratic Party leadership, and to some degree, typical of Kerry (look at his votes on the war!) has the preponderance of the evidence on its side. He may be planning a long term takedown of the BushCons (a la Watergate), or is possibly just angling for the '08 nomination, and keeping his head down in the meantime (I guess that doesn't square with his going to Iraq--that's not keeping your head down, exactly--but it does place him far from the fray on Jan 6).

I am personally disturbed by the Dems' cluelessness--if that's what it was--on BushCon owned electronic voting machines, their silence about it now, and our loss of our democracy, which doesn't seem to concern the Dems. How does Kerry think he's going to get elected in '08? Does he think the BushCons are going to give him a break four years from now? --and give the rest of us a break, from their looting and pillaging? Maybe there will be nothing left by then, and we can all become Depression-era Democrats in a ruined country.

But I grow morose. (Most days I'm optimistic. Really.)



http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=206056&mesg_id=206056

[whalerider55]

43. PP

i'm with you. this pretty fairly represents my thinking on it- based on conversations I've had and previously alluded to, it is inconceivable to me that Team Kerry could be so astonishgly on point with the message- "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain, move alongh folks, nothing to see here". Coupled with my pretty extensive working expereince running a nation-wide association of consumer attornies (17,000 lawyers working on the same project and not a peep) it justs begs the imagination that somewhere out there below the radar screen is an attack submarine ready for the moment to surface, guns blazing.

indications from a conversation I had with a national DNC folk and folks I know inside the Kerry campaign (and the pretty extensive outside Kerry contacts here in the Poeple's Free Republic of Massachusetts) indicate that Kerry is moving minimally to ensure a bid for 2008, and he hasn't been greeted with exactly open arms for this strategy.

we'll see on Jan 6th what "leadership" means.
and know that there won't be anything like a bi-partisan look at election fraud until at least 2006, when we have the opportunity to take back the house and possibly the senate... but then again, if they have perfected the art of stealing elections (2000, 2002 and 2004) and no democrats other than Jackson, SHarpton, and Dean have stood up to this tsunami of constitutional degradation, then the elections in 2006 are already lost....

whalerider55

[Patsy Stone]

13. Perfect Timing

Big smile, large sigh. It's goooood. :)

[tritsofme]

18. This is a fact finding mission, correct?

Relatively routine for a senator, I'm sure he will be there with a few others.

I don't know what people are expecting out of the trip, its probably not going to be like the president speaking to troops where he gets a large military crowd all to himself.

The trip will probably draw some media attention, but it won't be big news.

[jasmeel]

19. When will this happen?

[Viva_La_Revolution]

23. During the electors vote being opened apparently....

Isn't it a frickin requirement to there on the day they open the envelope? :wtf:

[whalerider55]

30. kerry can take his trip

i'm just hoping a single democrat with cujones shows up.
i'd even take a republican with a single cujone.

whalerider55

[IndyOp]

32. Aren't you hoping for a Dem with "cahones"? (n/t)

[whalerider55]

44. i knew i shoulda just said stones

everybody is a critic

whalerider55

[MsConduct]

47. Sorry, but I think all the stones have been tossed in the proverbial

pond, and those ripples will be felt for a long time to come.

[madison2000]

24. I just hope they keep him safe, I don't trust Rumsfeld as far as I could

shove him. :grr: :grr: :grr:

[TexasChick]

28. I don't trust Dumbsfeld as far as I can throw a stick. n/t

[seito]

26. John Kerry visiting the troops in Iraq

...A place no little shrub would dare to tread.

Very Presidential Indeed.

[fooj]

33. makes sense to me!!

I bet he doesn't even have to play dress-up! Just JK being JK! What a simply delicious idea!!!!!

WHAT ARE THEY HIDING????

[NVMojo]

34. Kerry has walked in the same combat boots of our troops, he knows

what they are going through ...Bush doesn't, Bush only knows about his own primitive needs ...

Kerry is the man....

[libertypirate]

48. Poor repuks, all that ground work on...

and the best thing they could do is call us crazy.

Guess what that is our favor... Are we crazy no fucking way. We have proof and the truth...

I tell people I might be wrong but I would rather be crazy wrong, then silent right in this case. I also ask them if I can have the opportunity to show them some things I can't possibly imagine why the media; who is supposed to be on the "liberal" side won't report.

I usually ask them to be honest about the information I give them...

We the people have the power, open your mouth and use it people!

[SharonRB]

49. What makes you think...

...the media will even cover JK in Iraq? They'll keep ignoring him as they have since the election. No one but us will even know he's there.

[bush_is_wacko]

50. I wonder about his timing

It seems to me that Kerry is planning to be in Iraq at or around the time of their elections. Maybe this is an attempt to witness first hand the ways in which an election can be stolen or handed over to one party or the other. Still, I gotta wonder just how safe it is for him to be over there at a time when our troops will be busy "protecting" the voters.

[DemonFighterLives]

51. I just hope he's safe

Amazing how the IED's have tended to take out important people.
I don't even want to think about it, but if elections are not safe there, how is Kerry or any american for that matter?

[Not a Sheep]

52. Sorry but the "Teflon Thread" premise is ridiculous...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=206056&mesg_id=206709