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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 09:35 AM
Original message
Boxer/Dems - Condi Rice debate/vote - RIGHT NOW on C-Span2
Edited on Wed Jan-26-05 09:53 AM by Peace Patriot
I think it starts at 10:30 am (7:30 am Pacific), with vote at 11:30 am.

Maybe we'll find out why Democratic debate was cut off yesterday, an hour early. Biden is supposed to make some sort of statement.

http://www.c-span.org/watch/cspan2_rm.asp?Cat=TV&Code=CS2

Go here for yesterday's reports and discussion:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1528855&mesg_id=1528855
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GetTheRightVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 09:38 AM
Response to Original message
1. I must have missed it, B. Frist is on, I could puke
:kick:
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. It's coming up.
Edited on Wed Jan-26-05 09:45 AM by Peace Patriot
An hour of debate, divided between Dems & Repubs. Then vote. Frist may be speaking to the point here, or just using his Majority Leader privilege to set the context by talking about Iraqi "elections" Jan. 30.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 09:41 AM
Response to Original message
2. Bill Frist talking about IRAQI elections! Now Patti Murray...
Edited on Wed Jan-26-05 09:49 AM by Peace Patriot
Nauseating scene at media interview with Frist yesterday, after speeches against Rice. Frist brought out Andy Young and C. Dolores Tucker, Afr. Amer. establishment, saying, essentially, the Dems should support Rice because she's a black woman. I was shocked!

Could this explain Dems cutting off debate yesterday?

Patty Murray (D-WA) talking about Vet benefits, not sure if this is part of debate on Condi Rice.

I think Condi Rice debate begins at 10:30 am Eastern (7:30 Pacific), then vote at 11:30 am.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 10:03 AM
Response to Original message
4. I was amazed at Democratic speeches yesterday. It was so...
...refreshing and astonishing to see/hear REAL INFORMATION and REAL PRINCIPLES being presented. Fabulous speeches! Especially Kennedy, Byrd, Dayton and Boxer.

Ted Kennedy
Robert Byrd
Carl Levin
Evan Bayh
Barbara Boxer
Mark Dayton
Richard Durbin
Jack Reed

----

John McCain now speaking on Condi Rice: "...lingering bitterness at the 2004 election"!!! They're all talking about the race issue. She should be allowed to slaughter more ragheads because she's a black woman!
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
5. Moment of silence by the mass murderer BushCons...
Edited on Wed Jan-26-05 10:21 AM by Peace Patriot
...31 Marines killed in helicopter crash in Iraq...Brownback (R-Tex)...our hearts go out...democracy, liberty & freedom...fighting for freedom for 200 years...anti-abortion, forcing BushCon information, "The Unborn Child Pain Awareness Act" on women...kill the born in Iraq, propagandize women and take away their rights over their bodies at home...Christian jihad...these are the same guys who pushed women's heads under water, in the Middle Ages, and if they survived, they were "witches," and if they didn't, they were "saved"--or just torched them to death for being "witches," no "trial." He's showing pix of D&C.

Imagine if Dems got up today and showed photos of US torture and killing of Iraqi prisoners--the photos the public weren't allowed to see! Or the shattered heads and limbs and bodies of the 100,000-plus innocent Iraqi men, women and children blown to bits by US bombs (according to the British doctors' report that came out just before the election).

The hypocrisy is unbelievable!
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 10:27 AM
Response to Original message
6. Speaker order to come...
Edited on Wed Jan-26-05 10:32 AM by Peace Patriot
What the hell is going on here?

Dems speaker order

Biden - 20 mins
Boxer - 5 mins
Lieberman - 5 mins (originally allotted to BYRD!) (what the hell?)

Geo. Allen (R-Tex) speaking for Rice, it's all about the election!, they "won" so everybody should shut up, criticizing Rice or Iraq policy hurts our troops. They're bringing up the Dem FUNDRAISING letter again. This is such crap. "Deplorable, dangerous, disgusting" to raise funds for Dem Senators with Dem action in Senate on Rice.

Boy, they're really reaching.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. New speaker order...
Edited on Wed Jan-26-05 10:37 AM by Peace Patriot
Lugar (on now)
Biden
Boxer
Lieberman
Reed (gave a fine speech against Rice yesterday)
Frist
--
Lugar

---

Go here for ALL Senate tel, fax, email contact info. (the list at the bottom of the page is the most complete - includes Dem state office info.):

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=296466
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
8. Biden...
--voting for Rice, not as enthusiastic about Rice as he was for that OTHER liar, Colin Powell

--blah, blah, blah about nominations and qualifications (time waster)

--voted against Gonzales because he was "SO WRONG" about torture (--and Rice was not wrong?)

--but AG is different than Sec of State

--his reservations, a second term is a second chance, Rich won't acknowl. mistake, mentions Rice accusing Boxer of "impugning her integrity," wishes Rice had acknowl. mistake of lying about WMDs, removing Saddam was NOT the justification for war, why Rice wouldn't acknowl. this is "beyond me," speech after speech, TV appearance after TV appearance, Rice & Co. said Saddam had WMDs and link to 9/11 & Al Q. 'We've got to level with the American people," not just to convince them but to SUSTAIN their support (Note: that nearly 60% of Americans who still oppose Iraq war is really stinging to warmongers on both sides of the aisle)...

--Rice & Co. implied "there was no dissent" on Iraq WMDs within gov't, not true!

--our most valuable asset: "our credibility" - after Iraq, v. hard to rally world support for a real threat

--Rice lies about 120,000 fully trained Iraqi police/military, not true!
--now he's on about Catholic education: going to Confession, confesses stealing a gold chain, but failing to say a gold watch attached to it - at a minimum, misleading. This is re: trained Iraqis. (Truth: 4,000 to 18,000) Rice should have admitted mistake. We should focus on standards not numbers.

--this isn't about revisiting the past, it's how Rice will handle herself in the future

--Rice & Co. admitting mistakes would be a way to coalesce support now (*NOTE below)

--Biden: 2 great challenges, 1) Islamic fundamentalism; 2) prolif. of WMDs.

--Biden: We're more alone in the world than ever before (--and who's fault is that???)

--(this hopeless hope of Dems like Biden that Rice is sincere when she says, "Now is the time for diplomacy" --will they never learn?)

--Iran nuke program - Biden asked Rice why aren't we joining with Euro on agreement? She said, "Well, we have other problems with Iran." (--some diplomacy!)

--compares now to WWII (he seems to equate Islamic fundamentalism with Naziism--criminy!)

--Sam Johnson, second marriages are "the triumph of hope over experience," -he's HOPING! but voting FOR.





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Catamount Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #8
17. Hi Peace patriot!
Do you know when/if the Gonzales vote comes to the Senate?
I was pleasantly surprised about Biden's comment on that.
Also is there any word on Kerry speaking today?
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #8
62. *NOTE on Biden
from my post on Biden, above:

--Rice & Co. admitting mistakes would be a way to coalesce support now (*NOTE below)

-----

I think this is utter dreaming on the part of pro-war Dems, that the BushCons wish to "coalesce."

These are fascists. They are in power because of several fraudulent elections. They are on a rightwing jihad. There will be no compromise.

The fact that Rice & Co. will admit no mistakes is CRITICAL. It is an insulting rejection of any kind of cooperation or "coalescing." It is a rejection of democracy!

And we are going to see the worst results of that attitude in the four years ahead of us.

That is why Boxer is fighting this. I think she knows just how bad this all is, and that DEMOCRATS MUST OPPOSE IT.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
9. Boxer...
--thanks for fair debate; knows such votes always go overwhelming for nominee; I know that what I'm doing is not about winning the vote

--it's about telling the truth as I see it

--Biden has anxieties, but hopeful; he gave Rice opportunity after opportunity to level with the committee, literally begging her to be candid (while Negroponte on news saying yeah, not enough trained Iraqis). No honesty from Rice.

--WH Chief of Staff Card called Boxer & Co. "petty" and "small" - shows such disrespect to the Amer. people; going around the world trying to spread democracy, how do we do that if we ignore our Consitution

--NO VOTE. I asked Rice series of questions, gave her every opportunity to set the record straight; on "mushroom" cloud--she refused to budge; on Al Q/Saddam - what she'd said was NOT TRUE, no connection at all--she refused to budge. The issue is the LACK OF CANDOR from Rice. Wanted to strip anti-torture provision. When I asked her, she denied she opposed it (though she'd opposed it in writing). Were Rice's misstatements because of faulty intel? No, she still refuses to clear all this up.

--This debate very important. ML King: "Our lives begin to end the day we stop talking about things that matter."

--Rice record full of misstatements she has refused to correct or explain.

--I don't know how vote will go. This isn't the point. What's important: Holding people accountable. This war matters. So we don't send our young people into another war based on hype.

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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
10. Lieberman...
--considered the arguments of those against, but these did not change his conclusion that Rice is qualified

--he agrees that she lied about Saddam

--issue isn't going over everything she's done, but is she qualified?, and does she have the confidence of Bush? (--the confidence of Bush? --the confidence of BUSH!?!)

--weak argument: past history not relevant

--majority of the Senate supports Iraq policy TODAY (--he's ignoring the fact that nearly 60% of Americans hate this war!)

--he says the only thing they should consider is her qualifications--but that's NOT WHAT the Constitution says! --"advice and consent" means VETO over appointments on POLICY

--"Give the President the benefit of the doubt" - UN-FRIGGING-BELIEVABLE!

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
NationalEnquirer Donating Member (571 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
11. This wont change anything.
Condosleeza will be confirmed.
Is it just me, or are these confirmation threads out of topic here?
I dont mind them, I just dont see what they have to do with the election, fraud, or reform.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. How many times do I have to repeat this?
Barbara Boxer, the hero of the ELECTION CHALLENGE on Jan.6, specifically asked for our help on this matter of Condi Rice nomination.

If there is to be ANY action, or EVEN DISCUSSION, of the the 2004 election or election reform in Congress, Boxer is the key. We MUST support her when she asks for it. She's trying to create a progressive agenda and coalition for the Dems in the Senate. That is critical to the success of the election reform issue.
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NationalEnquirer Donating Member (571 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #15
28. I am ALL FOR Boxer.
Dont get me wrong, I just didnt think it was appropriate for this forum.
We should rename the Democratic Party, the BOXER party, heh.
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Karenca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #28
39. Read Skinner's post. It belongs here......EOM
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NationalEnquirer Donating Member (571 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #39
44. I Read his post, and he agrees with me.
He just said that it was not his problem so to leave it.
Hey, in that thread, I agreed, it was no big deal.
I just wondered what it had to do with election reform, thats all.
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Karenca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #44
48. well, If you read Skinner's ENTIRE thread...
it is clear what this has to do with election reform.
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NationalEnquirer Donating Member (571 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-27-05 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #48
69. I got no problem with it really.
I just did'nt know what was up in the first place.
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Helga Scow Stern Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #44
58. Our watching and interacting with any Senator
who shows integrity and backbone has EVERYTHING to do with election reform.

Who else is going to help us?

By watching and developing an understanding of their issues, style, and courage, we gather information we use in communications with them, PLUS we are developing a relationship of empowerment.

AND our actions on all these other issues let everyone know that we are watching.

Plus, for me personally, and I suspect for many other multitaskers as well, focusing on one issue in a vacuum just doesn't work--we get bored.

We need to do whatever it takes to keep the passion going.

So there. :hi:
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:21 AM
Response to Original message
13. Pete Domenici (R-NM)
--attacking those who are saying Iraq war based on intentionally false info, who are saying Rice and Bush are LIARS - "what would they say about Colin Powell?"

--'Was he lying?" (--yeah, I believe he was.)

--So, Domenici is saying Powell, Bush, Rice, etc. all got info from same source, from Intel agencies (oh, boy...this is such utter baloney)

--now he's on the partisanship issue. No evidence whatsoever that Powell lied, or that Rice and Bush were intentionally misleading Amer. people.

--he is not answering Boxer's question: IF THEY WERE NOT INTENTIONALLY MISLEADING THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, WHO DON'T THEY CORRECT THE RECORD *NOW*?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. France, Germany, Russia, China, and everybody else in the world...
...said, "DON'T INVADE! The UN weapons inspectors are DOING THEIR JOB SUCCESSFULLY."
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
tex-wyo-dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. If they were so bent on us not invading because of...
oil-for-food corruption, then why would they tell us Iraq had WMDs?

Seems counter-intuitive.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #21
23. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #23
38. Just as Cheney lobbied in the late '90s to end sanctions on Iraq. (nt)




TBO;24/7
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PA Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:01 PM
Response to Reply #23
40. Oh really? Which of those countries were lobbying to "lift sanctions"?
This is from May 2001:

"Russia and China reacted cautiously to a U.S.-backed British proposal to ease U.N. trade sanctions on Iraq but tighten an arms embargo, signaling supporters of the plan are in for tough negotiations.

Pressed to allow more trade with Iraq and criticized for contributing to its people's suffering in their quest to punish Saddam Hussein, Britain and the United States want to end sanctions on civilian goods while toughening enforcement of the arms ban. The British plan would ban military-related items and require approval for items with potential military use. If approved by the U.N. Security Council, it the would mark the first significant easing of sanctions in place since Iraq invaded Kuwait in 1990.

Britain said Wednesday it had a positive initial response from France, Russia and China -- Iraq's main supporters on the 15-member Security Council, where their approval is critical to any overhaul of sanctions because each has veto power. But the Russians and Chinese were far more cautious in public comments on Thursday, signaling that lengthy negotiations are likely before any resolution is adopted.


http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/sanction/iraq1/turnpoint/2001/0518reac.htm

Word of advice: Rush and Hannity are not reliable sources of information.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #19
27. Sorry for yelling. It's just that it's such DISINFORMATION...
...that BushCo did not cherry-pick intelligence and deliberately misinform and propagandize the American people and everyone else.
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tex-wyo-dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #14
20. So who is the "rest of the world"?
Russia?...severe doubts about their "intelligence."

Who else?

Yeah, it seems Washington has one big case of group think mentality...

Amazing how everyone, including "the rest of the world" was wrong.

Complete BS...
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
18. Lugar..."We did not dwell on race."
They did, too. They've used it shamelessly!
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:38 AM
Response to Original message
22. Harry Reid (D-Nev, min. leader): YEAH, REID!
He says most of BushCon remarks yesterday attacked the Dems for even having this debate.

Quotes Voltaire: "I may disagree with what you have to say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."

Reid: "Shut up and vote" is not democracy!

Go, Reid!

Reid: It's the Senate's duty to discuss these matters. American people have questions about Iraq. Those questions deserve answers. We're asking those questions on behalf of all Americans. BushCons are criticizing Boxer for asking those questions.

Reid: Dems have had four hours of debate on this matter. Can anyone say that four hours of debate is too much for the most important appointment? Americans spend more time buying a car!

(Wow! That was great!)
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Helga Scow Stern Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #22
26. Yes! Go Reid!
He seems to be a stand up guy, so far!

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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #26
32. That was what Senator Boxer said about him, as well, on 6 or 7 Jan. (nt)




TBO;24/7
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
24. Frist: AFRICAN-AMERICAN WOMAN, AFRICAN-AMERICAN WOMAN...
AFRICAN-AMERICAN WOMAN...
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Karenca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #24
25. concert pianist yoyo ma african american woman
concert pianist yoyo ma african american woman
:puke:
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tex-wyo-dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #25
29. Un-fricking believable...
Cons accuse Dems of using the race card all the time...

Yet they do it with impunity...

What a bunch of hypocrites!
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mirrera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #24
31. If I were Condi I would be insulted
African American Woman? How bout dumb f*ck caucasion American men? Sorry....
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #31
35. Indeed. She will forever be documented in the Congressional Record...
....and on C-span archives (and more) as a liar (at best) who a bunch of staunchly partisan, white males supported for apparently four reasons: black, female, musician, cold-warrior.

Wow; that's some amazing creds for being approved as SoS of the USofA.



BE THE BUSH OPPOSITION;24/7
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:52 AM
Original message
Me: "African-American sellout, African-American sellout."
I remember a pejorative label for people like Kindasleezy Rice, which was used when the Civil Rights movement really began to take wings. It referred to people who are "brown" or "black" on the outside, but white on the inside. These sellout African-Americans were known as coconuts, sometimes called Oreos.

I can just see a young African-American mother admonishing her daughter, "Get rid of your morals and your compassion for your own kind, don't you want to succeed like Ms. Rice and be famous?"
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meganmonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
30. NAY VOTES - HOLY SHIT!
Edited on Wed Jan-26-05 12:05 PM by meganmonkey
Boxer
Kennedy
Levin
Byrd
Kerry
Jeffords
Reed (RI)
Durbin
Dayton
Akaka
Bayh
Laudenberg
Harkin

SHE'S A BIGGER LOSER THAN KISSINGER _ HOLY SHIT!!!
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NickiWitch Donating Member (303 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #30
41. Thanks for keeping track!! n/t
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mirrera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
33. This is what the Dem Lites get!
They think by being bi-partisan they will get scraps from the table. All they get is used against the brave progressive Dems. If they would STICK together at times like this when we need to send the world a seriously sane message. This is crazy. WE NEED RUN OFF BALLOTS!!
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Karenca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
34. Do ANY of the REPIGS EVER vote against their
party..Do we ever have a chance, being that we're so outnumbered??
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mirrera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #34
36. Have any Republicans voted no?...n/t
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mirrera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 11:58 AM
Response to Original message
37. The Republicans purged the bi out of partisan in 2000! n/t
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JoMama49 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #37
42. Dems think that by voting with the Rethugs, they will get
some kind of compromise later on. What they don't understand is THESE REPUBS WILL NEVER COMPROMISE! WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE, DEMS!!
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JoMama49 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. I can't believe Chuck Schummer voted Aye!
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Karenca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. I'm disappointed in him. nt
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Karenca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #43
46. Obama just "ayed".........
;(
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #43
47. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
MadLinguist Donating Member (167 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #43
63. You know, he and Clinton are going to have to be HOUNDED
about how they vote, constantly. And reminded of the views of the people who put them into office. I'm sending them both a FAX today, asking what exactly they hope to gain by co-operating with the NeoCons, on this and other issues. As a last resort, after insistent messages of this kind, I'd say when they start receiving packets of shit on their doorsteps, they'll realize that people won't take shit anymore. Now they are sending it back!
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Laura PourMeADrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #42
52. You can not compromise on the truth ! You never win that way.
Sad day for all the Democratic Ayes !!! You've got to stand up -- when will they figure that out??
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Laura PourMeADrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:09 PM
Response to Original message
49. The Nays are the Only Senators I will ever support in the future
unless they are voting against Hitler himself. They are enablers. This is clear-cut simple idea. They lied about the war and if you voting Aye, you are Just as guilty.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:10 PM
Response to Original message
50. Votes against Rice...THIRTEEN VOTES AGAINST! WOW!
Boxer
Kennedy
Levin
Byrd
Kerry!!! (--didn't speak)
Reed (RI)
Durbin
Dayton (--great speech yesterday)
Akaka!!! (D-Hawaii)
Bayh!!!
Lautenberg!!!
Harkin!!!
I missed one. Who?

This is an amazing vote against Rice and the Iraq war! I expected two or three votes against (because Senate usually just rolls over for Prez nominees--despite speeches).

Sad, sad, sad about Obama--going with the Establishment.

---

Some probable reasons that some Dems are voting yes to more Oil Cartel dominion in the Middle East, 100,000+ Iraqi dead, torture of prisoners, invasion of Iran (in my opinion), and other horrors:

1. They think that, despite Rice continuing lies and disinformation, her participation in long questioning in committee (and they did get her agreement, I believe) indicates some willingness to listen, be more forthcoming, and maybe engage in some diplomacy this term. (A couple of people mentioned Israel/Palestine peace effort yesterday.), or

2. Since the vote won't deny Rice the nomination (there was never any hope of that with Diebold-elected Congress), why annoy BushCons unnecessarily?, or

3. They are hand in glove with the Oil Cartel and the mil/industr complex.

4. They want US military dominating the ME to protect and defend Israel.

...or some combo of these.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #50
54. JEFFORDS! Thanks, meganmonkey!
A truly independent man!
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meganmonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #54
56. That was fun!
:D

Wow!
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Helga Scow Stern Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #50
57. You missed JEFFORDS.....
Yay!

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meganmonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
51. FINAL LIST OF NAYS!!! SHE BROKE THE RECORD!
Boxer
Kennedy
Levin
Byrd
Kerry
Jeffords
Reed (RI)
Durbin
Dayton
Akaka
Bayh
Laudenberg
Harkin

SHE'S A BIGGER LOSER THAN KISSINGER - He had 7 nays. S
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Laura PourMeADrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #51
53. Hooray. This gives me some hope - the others have made a
GIANT mistake today. I also think Kerry was bright enough to figure that out, huh
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feelthebreeze Donating Member (570 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #51
61. So you know what to do...
Write to every single voting Dem. The contacts are easily found on past threads. Write glowing accolades to the brave ones who have the moral fortitude and can see the writing on the wall, to continue their efforts. We will remember their actions and give them future support for our final goal of election reform. However those Democratic Senators who have perpetuated this abomination of lies today, you must, MUST write and voice your outrage and displeasure, in no uncertain terms, remind them of their observance by We the People and how today's actions will be remembered and not forgiven. Go to your listservs and encourage all to do the same. Supply the contact info for all the voting Dems and remind those on your emailings that this is our moral imperative to act and act now.

The winds of change are blowing...do you feel the breeze?
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SueZhope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
55. yes she is an African American Women
Edited on Wed Jan-26-05 12:16 PM by SueZhope
thats a good thing

....however
that does not make her honest nor
competent.

I feel very disgusted with these
people :puke: there delusional
(except for 13 Dem's who
were not afraid to vote for truth )
:cry:
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
59. Go here for ALL Senate TEL, FAX, EMAIL...
Edited on Wed Jan-26-05 12:38 PM by Peace Patriot
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=302077#305195

Special thanks to (lucky number!) 13 nay votes!

(revised list with more info. down that thread--added local state offices of Dems)
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Pendulum Donating Member (29 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
60. I'm happy about the number of nay votes.
I'm not going to automatically condemn any of the Dem yea votes. (Well maybe LiebRepub.)

As discussed yesterday in the Senate, the Constitution is purposefully vague about the criteria by which Senators should vote in a confirmation hearing. See for example Byrd's speech, I think.

Many of them believe that they are voting only on the qualifications of the candidate. This view is based on the assumption that a President has the right to be advised by whomever they wish. This assumption is Constitutionally neither true nor false. It's up to each Senator.

Also, I think that condemnation of the "Yea" Senators seriously undervalues the stand made by many Dem Senators. Remember, the Repubs thought they were going to rush this through in time for last Thursdays "festivities".

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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #60
64. Byrd spoke of this yesterday...
"Remember, the Repubs thought they were going to rush this through in time for last Thursdays 'festivities'."--Pendulum

...that the "advice and consent" duty of the Senate is very important, and is NOT a ceremonial function, nor intended to enhance the President's inauguration festivities. Very pointed remarks by Byrd.

And that great old Consitutional scholar--our modern day Thomas Jefferson--VOTED AGAINST THIS HEINOUS APPOINTMENT on the CONSITUTIONAL GROUNDS that the President DOES NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO DECLARE WAR, and Rice devised the "doctrine" that he does.

What a great speech Byrd gave!
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Helga Scow Stern Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #60
65. I agree. I respect the remarks made by many Senators
who voted aye. And I trust their judgement in this matter--I mean what they need to do politically to work within the current power structure. As long as they don't lie and say disgusting things like Zell Lieberman.

I am very proud of Reid, for instance. And Biden stated his reasons for voting yes, while he did not cover over any of the lies.

Even Salazar showed some integrity in his remarks yesterday, raising strong objections to how the "war" is being conducted. He just seemed to be blind to what a sleaze Condoleezza is, but he wasn't praising her to high heaven like Lieberman and Feinstein.

I also appreciate it when Dems who voted yes stick up for the ones who vote no, as Reid and Biden did.

We need all the good Dems we can get.
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icehenge Donating Member (411 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
66. Offical list of who voted NAY - Senate website
http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=1&vote=00002

Voted 85/13


NAYs ---13

Akaka (D-HI)
Bayh (D-IN)
Boxer (D-CA)
Byrd (D-WV)
Dayton (D-MN)
Durbin (D-IL)
Harkin (D-IA)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Kerry (D-MA)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Levin (D-MI)
Reed (D-RI)
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #66
67. Their contact info for THANK YOU's:
Daniel Akaka D-HI
141 HART SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-6361
E-mail: senator@akaka.senate.gov


Evan Bayh D-IN
463 RUSSELL SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-5623
Web Form: bayh.senate.gov/WebMail1.htm

Barbara Boxer D-CA
112 HART SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-3553
Web Form: boxer.senate.gov/contact

Robert Byrd D-WV
311 HART SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-3954
Web Form: byrd.senate.gov/byrd_email.html

Mark Dayton D-MN
346 RUSSELL SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-3244
Web Form: dayton.senate.gov/contact/email.cfm

Richard Durbin D-IL
332 DIRKSEN SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-2152
Web Form: durbin.senate.gov/sitepages/contact.htm

Tom Harkin D-IA
731 HART SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-3254
Web Form: harkin.senate.gov/contact/contact.cfm

James Jeffords I-VT
413 DIRKSEN SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-5141
Web Form: jeffords.senate.gov/contact-form.html

Edward Kennedy D-MA
317 RUSSELL SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-4543
Web Form: kennedy.senate.gov/contact.html

John Kerry PRESIDENT sorry...I had to do it.
304 RUSSELL SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-2742
Web Form: kerry.senate.gov/bandwidth/contact/email.html

Frank Lautenberg D-NJ
324 HART SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-3224
Web Form: lautenberg.senate.gov/webform.html

Carl Levin D-MI
269 RUSSELL SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-6221
Web Form: levin.senate.gov/contact/index.cfm

Jack Reed D-RI
728 HART SENATE OFFICE BUILDING WASHINGTON DC 20510
(202) 224-4642
Web Form: reed.senate.gov/form-opinion.htm
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GetTheRightVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-26-05 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #67
68. I love you all !!!!
:kick:

I called them this morning.
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