County election official calls activists "spammers" and "Luddites"

[Kelvin Mace]

http://greensboro.rhinotimes.com/story.html?id=1107

Jim Pfaff, a member of the Guilford County Board of Elections, said that, overwhelmingly, election officials across the state are against the changes, which require a massive overhaul of voting machinery.

Pfaff also said the main reason state legislators adopted the new law was because of a widespread “spam” email campaign instigated by an advocacy group consisting of only about 25 people. He said the election experts and election officials, for the most part, did not see the legislation as a good idea.

Pfaff said that, even with the paper verification, it would be impossible to be certain that the vote displayed on the printout is the same as the one that registers electronically.

A representative of Diebold, a company displaying its machines, said the voting machines had internal logic checks and other safety measures to assure consistency in that respect.

Pfaff said there was currently a lot of misleading information in the air.

Yeah, but we aren\t the folks doing the "misleading".

The gall of this jackass to dismiss computer professionals as "Luddites" and to accuse us "spamming".

These arrogant tools have got to go.

I encourage readers in NC to contact this person and politely, but firmly express your displeasure at his insulting comments.

[e-mail]

[Trillo]

1. Redefining "paper ballots" as 'paper trail'

"Guilford County is going to have to get all new voting machines to comply with a recent state law – one that says all voting machines have to provide voter verified paper ballots.

With the new machines, after the voter has cast his or her vote, the voter can view a paper readout that lists the candidates that voter selected."

Since when is a "paper readout" of the voter's vote a "paper ballot"?

[TechBear_Seattle]

2. "Paper trail" is toilet paper

They are meaningless when the machines record something other than what was printed out. "Paper trail" receipts have no use in a recount, where the very same incorrect electronic data is used.

[Kelvin Mace]

10. Actually, not true

We have language in the law which recognizes the paper ballots as ballots and they are the ballot of record if the digital count is different.

George Gilbert is trying to diminish their importance.

[In Truth We Trust]

3. Consider it DONE!

btw, I am back from the holiday madness and I will contact you in a day or two to see when we can make some headway on your projects.

[GuvWurld]

4. The Resignation Frame

There are lots of problems with our election conditions. The only acceptable attitude in the elections department is a pro-active determination to improve these conditions. Instead we see denial of problems and defense of the conditions. Those resigned to the status quo should resign their position and make way for people committed to improving election conditions and restoring a basis for confidence in the results reported.

See: A Campaign To Unite California Election Reformers.

Also see: The Resignation Frame.

[GuvWurld]

5. 3rd graf, Pfaff makes the NO BASIS FOR CONFIDENCE argument

"Pfaff said that, even with the paper verification, it would be impossible to be certain that the vote displayed on the printout is the same as the one that registers electronically."


Pfaff is saying that we can't possibly know the true outcome of elections because we can't genuinely account for the accuracy of how any individual vote was counted. He is saying this is true with or without paper verification. He is arguing that there is no BASIS for confidence in the results reported.

See: Voter Confidence Resolution.

[In Truth We Trust]

6. My response :

"I, sir, am not a spammer nor a Luddite. I am an educated patriot who is hell bent on living in a democracy. You may prefer corporate control of our elections and by default our government but I for one will not tolerate it.

I suggest you either reconsider your position or resign and let true patriots tender to our sacred rite to a fair and TRANSPARENT election process.

Btw, your stated position that a verifiable paper ballot does not insure the integrity of the vote is correct and only serves to confirm the need for paper ballots and hand counts ONLY!

[Kelvin Mace]

11. I intend to ask that he resign or be fired.

We are meeting tonight to plan the next move.

[diva77]

7. Similar talking points from largest county in US

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/la-me-
voting3jan03,1,278536.story


THE STATE
Voting System Results Still Out
Questions about the reliability of electronic ballots combine with
changing regulations to fuel confusion and debate over technology.
By Noam N. Levey
Times Staff Writer

January 3, 2006

<snip>

Many California counties, including Los Angeles, are in open revolt
against the secretary of state's office, which they charge is
arbitrarily setting and resetting standards to appease a few outspoken
activists.

"This all started with paranoia over technology, even though we trust
it in our banking and we trust it to fly airplanes," said Los Angeles
County Registrar-Recorder Conny McCormack, one of the nation's leading
local elections officials. "This is about change management, and people
are not managing."

Los Angeles County uses some Diebold touch-screen machines for early
voting...

<snip>

[nicknameless]

22. CA activists' primary objection to the maneuvers of POS SoS McPherson

concerns his relentless attempts to skirt CA election laws.
This line is utter bull:

"... arbitrarily setting and resetting standards to appease a few outspoken activists."

McPherson keeps violating (or trying to) CA laws and he keeps getting called on it.

[diva77]

23. what is "POS" ? thanks

[nicknameless]

25. POS: piece of shit

[Steve A Play]

24. Could you give me an example please?

Can you be a little more specific. What laws did he 'try to violate' and exactly who 'called him on it'?

I live here and don't know what you're talking about. :shrug:

Steven P.

[nicknameless]

26. For one: He is currently in violation of a formal 19202 Request by BBV,

which was filed in June 2005. They applied to examine components of Diebold systems, pursuant to that Section of the CA Election Code. It is stated that CA's SoS will comply "without undue delay", it is now 2006, and he has yet to comply. Voters in last November's election should have been able to benefit from the results of a timely examination. McPherson prevented that. When BBV's attorney notified him that he was in violation of the 19202 request, rather than complying, he passed the decision of certification on to the Feds. (That would put the voting machine vendor-hired ITAs in charge of making the decision for California.)

You can read about more McPherson's machinations at this link:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x402426

[Einsteinia]

8. Better than what we call them, I suppose.

[Kurovski]

9. At least the monikers we have for them are based in reality...

:-)"Luddites"? Luddites on the internet? Luddites versed in computer technology?

By definition, it would take an idiot to make such a statement.

[Kelvin Mace]

12. Right up there with calling liberals "fascists"

You cannot be liberal and a fascist. You cannot be a Luddite and a computer scientist/engineer/programmer.

I intend to get "Zell Miller" on his ass.

[Kurovski]

13. Maybe we should send these folks a dictionary?

But who has the time to teach them to read, comprehend, and use logic?

But the confusion they spread is all part of their process. It's always been the con-man's friend.

More elements of the process: "Baffle them with bullshit", send out Red Herrings, and try to put your target on the defensive.

[BeFree]

14. 25 people?

See, see how important it is for any one of us to do something? Just 25 people have chased Diebold out of NC and forced laws to change. You could be one in your state that gets rid of e-voting crap, all it takes is 25.... just 24 more than you! Gang up!

We will get our votes counted correctly, and we will make history! Be a part of this history in your hometown!.

[Kelvin Mace]

17. Well, it was more than 25

NCVoter.net has 181 members.

[BeFree]

18. More than that, probably

But your boy in the OP has probably been counting the emailers and he came up with 25. 25 sounds about right. In any activist group, if you can get more than 10 percent to be really active, you can move mountains, or, as NCVoter.net has done, moved the law.

Congrats are in order. Celebrate, then get back to the fight, all 25 of ya. I'll be there in Spirit!

[Kelvin Mace]

20. Already back in the brawl

http://blackboxvoting.com/s9/index.php?/archives/66-Election-official-calls-activists-spammers-and-Luddites.html

[Steve A Play]

15. Wouldn't it be better to

raise public awareness in that county and let the locals know what a fool they have in office? }(

I don't think asking a bunch of out of state people to e-mail someone who claims that they are being 'spammed' is a good idea. You just prove his point that way.

I would hit every local forum I could find and send letters to the editor of every paper in the area instead and let the locals give him a piece of their minds. It can take a while to write a well constructed letter and only a second for him to hit delete without reading it. If you post your concerns on local forums you're more likely to get the action you desire. Just my opinion.

Start here. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=%22Guilford+County%22%2C+web+forum

[Kelvin Mace]

16. Uh, I didn't ask out of staters

to write, I asked readers in NC.

I encourage readers in NC to contact this person and politely, but firmly express your displeasure at his insulting comments.

[Steve A Play]

19. I see

Sorry, I just noticed In Truth's post above and the Red Sox avatar and, well, sorry.

My main point still stands. FWIW

[Kelvin Mace]

21. You are correct

and we are already rounding up folks.

[In Truth We Trust]

28. Red Sox Nation is international!! There are many of us here in NC

[stickdog]

27. What a moran!!!1111!!11!!!!