TV and Radio coverage of E-voting Scandal

[garybeck]

Used to be the media was ignoring us. Not anymore.

If you got a few minutes, check out the new (and growing) archive of radio and TV shows you can watch/listen to, all focusing on the electronic voting machine scandal. No more need to strain your eyes reading lenghthy articles about election problems (although that is still encouraged). Now you can click a link, sit back in your easy chair, and watch/listen to the sad truth, and what some courageous people are doing about it!

http://www.solarbus.org/election/multimedia.shtml

help spread the word about this new site... many more people will wake up when they see it is being covered on NPR, CNN, CourtTV, etc... And that is exactly what is happening.

and if you know of any shows that need to be added to this page please contact me.

-gary

------------------------------------
the solar bus
ELECTION JUSTICE CENTER
your home for updated information on the fight for democracy in America
http://election.solarbus.org
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[Peace Patriot]

1. We have a huge problem for Nov.: voter cynicism--which I think is

exacerbated by the way election fraud info has seeped out from the real news media (the underground)--a phenomenon that couldn't be helped, given the "Iron Curtain" over this news--and also, now, by the new but spotty coverage in the war profiteering corporate news monopolies. Probably there is a plan somewhere to handle it this way. They figured it would seep out, and by black-holing it for a long while, and now semi-blackholing it, covering it a bit but not treating it as the scandal of the ages (which it is), they can actually use it to suppress turnout (the only hope we have of beating the machine advantage to Bushites).

And I have a solution. A citizen rebellion via Absentee Ballot voting. Bear with me, as I argue for this as an immediate, emergency election reform strategy. I've got very good reasons for suggesting it. Trust me, I know all the arguments about the lack of safety of an AB vote. They are true enough. But I am NOT talking about being able to secure an accurate count this time. I think that is impossible. Nor am I proposing AB voting as any kind of answer for rigged electronics or other Bushite election theft tactics. I am proposing it as a PROTEST against the rigged machines--one that ordinary citizens and voters are already engaging in.

--AB voting is up to 50% in Los Angeles; it is ALREADY an indigenous protest; this rise in AB voting is an expression of distrust in the rigged machines (Los Angeles has one of the worst elections heads in the country, Diebold shill Connie McCormack); AB voting used to be a Repub thing--no more! Now it's the majority voters who smell rigged elections.

--If this phenomenon goes nationwide, and gets up to 60% or 70%, what we have then is a huge "vote of no confidence" in the election system, by the people; this would be a major rebellion, and pave the way for election reform, and other reforms. (Remember, the Montgomery bus boycott did not end segregation, in and of itself--it SPARKED a much bigger movement; nor did Gandhi's salt tax protest achieve Indian independence, in and of itself--it simply pointed the way.)

--In both cases cited above (the bus boycott, the salt tax protest--not to mention the Boston Tea Party), the rebels hit 'em in their MONEY; in this case, we will have $4 billion in boondoggle electronic voting equipment sitting idle!; it is a BOYCOTT, not of voting, but of the corrupt voting machines, and all the damnable corrupt money that brought them about.

--It's EASY! Anybody can do it! You don't have to fly to Washington DC or New York for a big protest (which most Americans cannot do); you don't have to make it to meetings or do other things that might not be possible for you; you can fight the Bush junta by Absentee Ballot voting--if this is given a bit of leadership as a PROTEST. Americans want and need to protest--I am sure of that. I think most would also like to AFFIRM democracy, rather than get into protest mode. This is more of an affirmation ("yes, by damn, I'll vote--but not on those rigged machines!")

--NOW we have an ANSWER for those who say, "It's all rigged--why vote?" Voting (by Absentee Ballot) will be a form of PROTEST, aimed at UN-rigging the election system.

--If nothing else, AB voting on a large scale throws a big monkey wrench into this rigged system; they'll have to hire hundreds of word processors to deal with the AB votes; this will create more interest and more scrutiny of AB and other vote counting; and it will indicate widespread consciousness about the rigged machines.

-----

Bumper sticker: "Bust the Machines--Vote Absentee!"

-----

Garybeck, I would very much like your opinion on this. Some people at DU (Wilms in particular) are very opposed. The objections they raise all have to do with how AB votes are handled, and that they are not secure. (Most are just scanned right into the rigged electronic system.) But what I am impressed with is that this is ALREADY an indigenous protest. People are saying: I want a paper ballot, hand-counted. And they are saying: I don't trust how these machines are counting the votes. They aren't really getting any more security than optiscans give (which is near to zilch--given lax auditing/recount provisions). But this is THEIR statement about what they WANT. It's the only way they can think of to get their vote counted. I'm saying: Go with the people! This is THEIR statement. Encourage it. Make it huge! It has the potential to bring the rigged system down. And I don't know what else we can do by November, do you? We can encourage and join election monitoring efforts, gather evidence, challenge suspicious results where possible, and keep educating people. But we are facing ANOTHER rigged election with no clear plan! THIS gives us a plan--and one with VOTER INVOLVEMENT!

I attended a family gathering last week, and the subject of election fraud came up in casual conversation. One of my relatives said, "Well, we don't have that problem in California. Our Secretary of State banned Diebold."

Granted, this relative is not very political, and had been out of California for a while. Still, I think it points to the LAG TIME in election fraud news. He'd caught up with the story of Kevin Shelley and Diebold, but didn't know the rest of the story. So what we have in the population is a very lagged time knowledge of what's going on. They know it's being rigged. They don't have all the details. There is no way to remedy this between now and November. But people like him--and I think he's typical--are ripe for doing something like AB voting to protest the rigged machines. He's not likely to ever go to a protest. But he IS concerned about how our votes are being counted. Give him some way to REGISTER that concern (by AB voting), and even give him an additional task--say writing a letter to his registrar about having no confidence in the voting machines--and I'm pretty sure he'd do it.

Something like this also can snowball very fast. It is ALREADY in-progress. Just needs a bit of a push--a leader saying, 'Hey, do this'--and someone with media savvy to FOCUS public attention on WHY so many people are requesting Absentee Ballots. (I'll betcha that local election officials are trying to keep a lid on those numbers, too--it's probably already even bigger than we know.)

What do you think? And if you don't like this idea, I'm going to ask you what I asked Wilms: You got a better idea? We cannot prevent Stolen Election III. How do we protest it--in a way that leads to reform? And how do we prevent cynical non-voting and suppression of turnout, with some people thinking, "it's all rigged--why bother?"--and the corporate media no doubt trying to reinforce this disempowerment and disenfranchisement?

[garybeck]

2. Voting absentee

I don't know. I have read several articles citing problems with absentee voting, some suggesting that it is less secure than opscans... One thing I can say, it is certainly not a panacea. Unless you are looking at how the ballots are handled and counted after they are sent in, the real issues are not being addressed. I think it also depends on what you are comparing it to. Here in vermont we have all opscans, so I think the differences are slight. But if you are in an area with DREs, you may be correct in suggesting that absentee is better because at least there is a paper ballot somewhere, so if we ever get a candidate with enough guts to call for a recount, your vote might be counted. DREs, forget it. so I think I understand your point but I don't think it is a solution that will instantaneously fix the real problems.

IMHO, if we are going to have a fair election this fall, it will have to take something like what we're seeing in Mexico and San Diego right now. There must be an uprising after the election - calling for a full recount - and then we start to pick up the pieces.

sorry I don't have a more clear opinion on it. with some issues I take a strong stand, on others I am more of a reporter than a commentator. as you know, it's a very complicated issue.

one thing I will say in regards to voter cynicism. I DISAGREE with the idea that raising awareness about the e-voting problems will cause more cynicism and less voting. we MUST raise awareness as much as possible, through all forms of media. awareness is always the precursor to change. I get tired of people saying we should keep all this quiet because people won't vote if they don't think they can trust the machines. I don't trust the machines, but I'm still going to vote. In fact I think there's an argument to be made that more people will vote, the less trust they have in the system.

[Peace Patriot]

8. Garybeck, everybody responds to the AB voting protest idea the same way--

they misunderstand what I'm saying. I am NOT saying it's more secure (except with DREs). I am NOT saying that it will result in an accurate count. I am NOT saying it is even close to a panacea. I'm saying that it's an ALREADY HAPPENING, INDIGENOUS PROTEST of voters who don't trust the machines, and are trying to register their suspicion and find some way to get their vote counted--and that, with a bit of push, it could become a major protest and statement by the public!

Okay, look, let me explain it this way. Say we called a protest for everyone to send a brick in the mail to the White House, say, to "rebuild Iraq" in lieu of Halliburton not having done so. We don't mean the brick to be literally sent to Iraq. We are MAKING A POINT.

In the case of voting Absentee, you are MAKING THE POINT that you don't trust the machines, and if it's big enough--if enough people do it--it becomes a public "Vote of No Confidence" in the rigged election system, and, what is more, a rebellion that could LEAD TO election reform.

Those who vote on optiscans are BUYING INTO and SUPPORTING a machine that contains TRADE SECRET, PROPRIETARY programming code! When you vote Absentee YOU YOURSELF do not cooperate with this rigged system. You can't help what the registrar does with your AB vote (scans it in). But YOU DON'T cooperate with it! It's a protest against the riggability--the secret code--and, in the case of DRE's, the lack of a paper ballot backup.

How can you cooperate with this system, by voting on Diebold, ES&S or other optiscans, when you have a choice not to? You can vote Absentee to protest them.

It's not THE ANSWER! Neither was the Montgomery bus boycott. It's a REFUSAL to use segregated busses. It's a act of NON-COOPERATION (in which you still get to vote!). It's a BOYCOTT of the machines.

Please do not misunderstand me. And please do respond on what you think of this AS A PROTEST, not as the ultimate solution.

---------

Also, PLEASE, Gary, I am NOT saying that election fraud info should be suppressed! Good God! Don't you know that I've been devoting most of my time for the last year and a half to disseminating election fraud info? Of course I approve of this! That's my MANTRA! We must base our strategy on truth and reality. This country is sick unto death from lies! We MUST speak the truth about election fraud. And the truth-telling we have done here at DU, and you have done at your site, and many others have done, on election fraud, is finally bearing fruit in public consciousness. I was talking about HOW THE CORPORATE MEDIA is handling it--leaking in out a few stories here and there--the biggest political story of all time!

I think this is deliberate--and I think it is intended to suppress voter turnout. They will NEVER treat this story with the gravity it deserves. They will never cry the alarm, as they should be doing. They are frigging conspirators in these stolen elections! And we have to be realistic as to how this might be affecting people. They hear pieces of the story. They get vague nudges from Common Cause that something might be wrong, in a few places. Or they think they are safe because their state rejected touchscreens. And those inclined not to vote will say, "what's the use? --it's all rigged!"

But we can COUNTER this by making AB voting into an active, conscious PROTEST. THEN they have reason to vote, rigged or not. They are joining a movement. They are HELPING.

We would NOT be trying to fool people that AB voting is safe. God no! In fact, election reformists participating in the AB voting movement--and leading it--is essential to people learning how insecure their AB vote is. They need to know this. But they ALSO need to PROTEST the rigged electronics. And that's what this is about. HOW TO GET A HUGE VOTE OF NO CONFIDENCE FROM THE PUBLIC ON THE NEW, RIGGED ELECTRONICS--the touchscreens, the optiscans, the central tabulators, all run on secret code.

Don't you think, if, say 70% of the American people were REFUSING TO VOTE ON THESE MACHINES, that would cause a major stir?

[garybeck]

18. I do hear ya...

I do hear what you are saying. I'm just not sure that even if it did happen that it would register as a protest. I beleive that very high numbers of people voted absentee in Florida 2004 and it barely registered a blip on the radar. I remember, my 80 year old grandmother down there telling me on the phone that she heard the best thing to do is vote absentee so she did, as did many others. I really don't mean to squash your idea. I think it is a good one. I guess I've just become skeptical and jaded about protests. Some of these people will just laugh at our protests, all the way to the proverbial bank. Even if the media is reporting it this time, the election will still go down. I'm particularly interested in direct action that has a potential to have direct results and affect change. I favor recounts, audits, lawsuits, legislation, massive protests in the streets, and anything that raises awareness because all these things can have direct results that can be seen. Your idea is good for one main reason in my mind - it raises awareness. I'm not sure the protest element will have an effect, but the fact is that if something like that took place, it would raise awareness. People would talk it up, and people would ask, "why is everyone voting absentee?" and people would answer to them "because the machines are proven untrustworthy and this is one way we can avoid using them." For that reason alone I like your idea.

I also want to say that I VERY STRONGLY recognize the good work that you have been doing and the time you have spent on this issue. When I was responding to a couple issues, like the idea that we shouldn't discuss election security problems because it discourages voting, I wasn't addressing anything you said or did. I was just commenting on a point that you made, that other people are saying it, and I wanted to give my opinion that I disagree with the idea in general, not to imply that you support it.

i'm sorry if i didn't state my case more clearly and if I came off as putting your ideas down. you are a valuable person to have on our side.

peace

[robinlynne]

21. Here in california we vote 50% absentee.

And, unfortunately I have seen where the absentee votes go in my county. It actually makes it more dangerous to lose our votes. Because there is NO accountability for those votes at all. At least when you vote in the precinct there is a record that you were there and which party you were from.

[petgoat]

27. I've communicated with someone who has observed the vote

count in Santa Clara County. They use Sequoia Systems machines there. The absentee ballots
are counted on opscan machines. These are not simple appliances. They are as big as the
largest copy machines, and they have monitors and keyboards. About ten of these scanners
are networked to an accumulator computer, and the results are then networked to the master
accumulator mainframe in the next room.

So even if you vote absentee, it still gets counted by a very hackable set of computers.
He said there were three Sequoia Systems techs actually running the count--the registrar's
office in what has to be the most computer-literate county in the world is not competent to
count the votes themselves!

[robinlynne]

28. That's IF the absentees are counted. In LA county tehy are thrown into a

room on a different floor together with the spoiled ballots and provisionals. theya re not a part of the regular counting process. (which, itself is done on hackable machines.)

[rumpel]

3. If I may make 2 points

The media blackout has resulted in the apathy of the general public on these electronic voting machine and at best - people were told and accepted "as fact" that the 2004 and 2000 election problems are "just problems" and any other claim is a conspiracy theory of the lunatic fringe of the left.

1) So, now that we have a small opening, all activists and groups could technically get together and compile a very short facts list -not dwelling on the past - but what is happening now -based on information we already have, and do our own ad campaign blitz? and actually buy time on the majors programming slot - right before local evening news and in the am before work commute time slot. Hell, if it has to be pounded into people - we have to.

2) On the protest absentee ballots. I would consider, if it was not for McCormack at the San Fernando Valley event:

What I want to ask was this: you seem to have made policy regarding that in deciding that absentee and early voting would not be included in that one percent recount. Is this an example of where you can make policy ornot? CONNY: Well, there’s no legal requirement. It’s so hard to try to figure out how to do a one percent manualtally of absentees when you have about a half a million of them. And that’s a tremendous number, if you call ita precinct, to go in and say, well, we going to look at one percent of those. There’s been no legal requirement to do so and we just haven’t done it.
later
MICHAEL: But I’m confused about that. The election code that I just read demands that recount—CONNY: At the precincts. That’s the way we’ve interpreted it. MICHAEL: But that’s an interpretation, I guess—CONNY: It is, it’s an interpretation.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=409746

She is the registrar of my county. With Inkavote, at least I get a receipt. My main worry is the tabulation in our county, as well as the voter registration database.

So if a protest could have even a remote chance of my ballot vanishing - I may have made a protest statement -but may have lost my voice afterall.
Which defies the purpose.

So, in some areas it may work and in others it could end up being more damaging.
:)

[rumpel]

4. PS

and how reliable is the USPS?

We have had problems in our little neck of the woods that Waxman had to step in.

but aside from that, I remember in 2004 - one of the reports on verifiedvoting was that "bags of votes" were sitting at the post office sorting center.

[garybeck]

5. oregon...

oregon is virtually all vote by mail. they have a way for voters to confirm that their vote was received. I think they can call in and punch in a number to confirm.

[rumpel]

6. Yes, I understand Oregon has a good established system there

the other registrars & SOS's around the country - I would not know - if they provide or are willing to provide any such verification.


edit: "a", duh

[BeFree]

10. Yes.... buy an ad

Lets start right here on DU. How much is one of those boxes on the left?

Content: Short and hard hitting, Picture background, bold text

Link: VTUSA? BBV? Who?

Would that site page up the content that we consent too?
We would all have input into the content via a thread here.
We refine, we wordsmith, and we vote.

Money: Donation from choicepoint? :rofl:


Seriously.... we can do this, Rumpel, it was your idea.


Can you find someone to volunteer? :rofl:

[kster]

7. The Crooks in the Contest, the "politicians" (for post no#2)

don't seem to care how the vote's get counted, this shows with their SILENCE about the secret vote counting machines, so how does it matter if we go in and scan our ballots in to their machines, or if we send them a message, by having them scan all the "absentee" ballots by their self?

Either way, by their SILENCE in this scam, does it really make that big a difference? Do we really think we are going to somehow beat their secret vote counting machines by using them machines?

My thought is VOTE! VOTE! VOTE! But send them a message while your doing it.

My two cents...........

[Peace Patriot]

9. I think I understand your point, kster! Don't vote on the machines!

And send them a message about your distrust of the machines by Absentee Ballot voting. Am I right (that that's your point)?

I would just say that AB voting has the POTENTIAL of being more than a mere "message." It has the potential of being a major monkey wrench in the rigged election system. They will have to hire hundreds of word processors to handle these ballots. We'll be forcing them to HANDLE our votes. They are all set up to utilize the machines, and are luring and enticing people to vote on them. They've spent billions of OUR money on these crapass, insecure, riggable, corporate-controlled voting machines, and have luxuriated in all the lavish lobbying perks that Diebold, ES&S and Sequoia can provide. They are also reveling in the secrecy and power--some of them. They have it all over the voters now--who don't have clue how their votes are "counted." Only "the experts" know.

Now, what if we throw a big boycott of the machines into this mix? A BOYCOTT of these machines, by AB voting, also has the potential to END this rigged system. Not just monkey-wrench it. End it. Because, if, say, 70% of Americans (all who despise Bush) refuse to vote on these machines, THAT'S NEWS, and that will raise consciousness in a major way.

So, I wouldn't say, "Send them a message." I would say, "Join the voter rebellion against rigged election machines!" (A "message" is passive. A "voter rebellion" is active.)

[BeFree]

12. Tell you what

In order to accomplish the twin goals, we need people.

Whomever is fortunate enough to have some form of paper ballot needs to vote AB paper.

Then, each of them lets the BoE know they want to be present to watch the count. To be notified. Time and place. Then publicize it. Buy an ad. Post flyers, demand the BoE publicize the time and place.

If they know, or even think, ten new people will be looking over their shoulders, they just may try to do the right thing.

If they think 20 people will show up......?

Just imagine... what they would do if one hundred people showed up to watch the Counting of the Vote...

[EFerrari]

11. Peter B Collins does an election integrity segment every Friday

with Brad as I learned today.

He should be there. I just talked to him today. He's completely up to speed and he's one hell of an interviewer and beloved in these parts.

http://krxa540.com/?q=Peter_B_Collins

[garybeck]

16. yes, I need archives. I'll see what I can find.

thanks for the reminder.

[EFerrari]

19. Gary, they are at Ben's site. Fyi. n/t

[flyingobject]

13. thank you

very much.

:thumbsup:

[garybeck]

17. my pleasure!

[kster]

14. K&R......nt

[Kurovski]

15. Can't someone cough up one more measly vote?

This is a great site for folks to send to their "non-reading" Friends and family.

Really, garybeck has the right idea--"spread the word!"

Thanks!

[EFerrari]

20. Cr2P! I only have one. . . . Never mind.

:smoke:

[Kurovski]

24. One spliff?

What's this ct2p? Is it talk to throw off agent Mike? Pm me if you must, or meet me at our usual spot: where the horizon falls upon the mongoose.

[Kurovski]

26. "Can't recommend post twice."(?)

It only took me 5 hours to come up with something.

That's pretty fast for me.

[Peace Patriot]

22. "Spread the word!" I totally agree. But to what end? Or rather, to what

STRATEGIC end? I understand the value of educating the public--that IS an end in itself. And I think that that alone can LEAD TO solutions. However, here we have an in-progress protest, devised by ordinary people, addressing their concern--their desire for a COUNTABLE ballot, and their distrust of the machines. This in-progress protest has occurred BECAUSE OF our educational efforts. Should we not GO with that? The people are giving the direction. We may have superior knowledge, and our experienced, jaded view of things, but here we've got a fresh, simple desire by voters for a PAPER BALLOT, HAND COUNTED. It's like Rosa Parks sitting down in the front of the bus. She refused to participate in segregation any more. And this had to be followed by the bus boycott, to reinforce the point. WE WILL NOT PARTICIPATE ANY MORE. Now, in this case, we MUST participate (vote)--turnout is our only hope of overcoming the Diebold advantage to Bushites in this election. But the one way that we can REFUSE TO PARTICIPATE is to NOT TOUCH the goddamned machines. Refuse to vote on them.

This is the protest that will involve the most people--and will draw in non-voters as well.

Regarding this protest, I am mostly thinking of "all the lovely people" (of the Beatles song): All the people who would never go watch a vote count, or go to a meeting, and show up at a protest. (--the other way the Beatles sang it, was, "all the lonely people".) All the people who despise Bush and want this junta out, but who are too shy, or too disempowered, or too beset with life's difficulties, to protest in other ways. It's THEM I want to hook in, with a BIG protest action.

What is happening in Mexico may not be possible here. They have a strong, vibrant Left that is resonating all the way up from Chile, Argentina, Brazil, Uruguay, Venezuela and Bolivia and other Latin American countries into Mexico. It is tied together by the indigenous and the vast poor brown population, who have their own methods of communication. (They just ignore the insane corporatist news media.) And all of these countries have been working on TRANSPARENT elections for a lot longer than we have. Really, our movement pretty much dates from the 2004 Diebold/ES&S coup. A year and a half. I don't think it's possible to put a million people in the streets on that short of a history. There has not been enough time. We, too, are reduced to word of mouth communication (and our "committees of correspondence," the internet). And we are NOT used to it. I can't tell how many times I've heard the cry here at DU: What's wrong with the MSM? Why aren't they covering this? When is the MSM going to wake up? Etc., etc.

Well, the answer is never. And we're not used to it. We still think they're going to wake up. We ALSO think that if we put a million people in the streets, they will cover it. One photo maybe, for one day, and the estimate will be half the real crowd. Then back to WW III.

One other big difference from Mexico: The political life of the country is concentrated in Mexico City, and the current events pertain to a PRESIDENTIAL election. Our country is twice as big--with major centers of political power in DC, New York City, L.A., Chicago, Atlanta, and other major fulcrums--and these are by-elections, LOCAL elections. How do you concentrate the protest power in these circumstances--in a way that cannot be ignored. I can imagine such a protest (say, a million people sitting down in front of the White House or Congress and refusing to be moved), but I cannot imagine getting that organized in this short time frame, with much of the population still ignorant of the details of election theft.

So, what can we do to materially affect this rigged election system? --aside from civil disobedience, which they quickly take care of with arrests, and which the corporate news monopolies barely covers, if at all, and aside from civil disorder, which they will dispatch equally quickly and even more brutally (and I'm sure they would LIKE to do it, too!).

What can we do to materially affect them? NOT USING THEIR EXPENSIVE, SHINY NEW ELECTION THEFT MACHINES! And boycotting the machines on a massive scale.

Make fools of them! Make their purchases of this crapass technology look corrupt (as it is)! Let the shiny new election theft machines gather dust! Boycott the machines! Massively boycott them! Totally boycott them! Only vote Absentee!

Making this a conscious PROTEST will generate interest from the citizenry (and will turn non-voters into voters). It will help recruit the vote counting monitors that are needed, and may help recruit people for any planned protests. The point is to involve EVERYONE--whether they can protest or not.

Flood the Registrars' offices with Absentee Ballots. Give them a mountain of paper to deal with, from the outraged public. We can also push sending a letter, giving the reasons for "no confidence" in the machines--and demanding handcounts of the AB votes.

Garybeck, some people are old. Some people are sick. Some people have small children and the elderly to take care of. Some people are hand to mouth, and can't risk their jobs. Most people cannot fly to DC. Where are you imagining that a million peope will assemble--given the dispersed nature of Congressional elections? How can they be counting votes in Ohio and Texas and California, and be in DC at the same time? And what good is 500 people, or 10,000 people, in small protests dispersed among the states? It will be ignored. But if 50 million people vote Absentee, and election activists make clear why they are doing so, THAT cannot be ignored. At that point, it makes the election theft machines nearly obsolete. And at that point, you have Registrars all over the country in a panic. It will cause a scramble on the part of the election thieves--and scrambling the enemy creates opportunities. It also creates more scrutiny of what they are doing.

I think the idea of an "uprising" is too vague. Where? When? Led by whom? If you want an uprising, you have to lay the groundwork by getting people INVOLVED. Not just informed. Not just pissed off. But ACTIVELY INVOLVED in some way. And I can think of no better way to get big masses of people INVOLVED than to apprise them of AB voting as a PROTEST.

I keep asking people: Do you have a better idea--for turning the election into a protest and into an election reform moment, and for involving all the discontented voters (the vast majority)?

And no one has come up with an answer yet. We activists will be monitoring, and challenging, and filing lawsuits and so on. And the mass of citizens will be obediently pushing the buttons on these election theft machines, and passively standing by, hoping for the best?

AB voting will help them OWN their vote again. They can do it as individuals, but if they do it with everybody else doing it, too--as a boycott, a protest--it becomes much more meaningful.

I've talked to people about AB voting, and that's exactly how they view it: To them it means they OWN their vote. Frankly, I hate to tell them of the perils of AB voting, because they are so proud of finding a way to thwart the election theft machinery. (But I do tell them.) It's that pride I want to stir up. That pride in being part of a democracy. That pride in being a voter. That pride in being informed and aware, as citizens--and in seeking ways, even wily ways, of making democracy work.

People need action. Let's suggest an action all can do: Absentee Ballot voting. And focus and center the uprising that we all desire on that action--a pervasive, massive rebellion against the machines.

Bumper sticker: "Bust the Machines--Vote Absentee!"

[Kurovski]

23. As always, thank you Peace Patriot.

Just two days ago I spoke with neighbors who had no idea there is an election crisis in this nation. and that's not the first time I've run into folks I wrongly assumed knew about the state of voting in America. They won't be rebelling until they know what's going on. I directed them to RFK Jr's rolling Stone article http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/10432334/was_the_2004_election_stolen/1

Since they have little time for searching and gathering info, this clearing house of media info on the crisis will also be valuable to them.

The site garybeck mentions may not be such a big deal for those already informed, but for many, it will be an eye-opener as the majority would seem to still see these media outlets as worth paying attention to. (and they may yet again!) Conversely, online sources are still considered "iffy", or strictly partisan for the sake of being partisan.

Unfortunately, it often takes hardship and awareness of the realities rarely reported upon in corporate media in order to breed activism. Being unaware, satisfied and reassured that it will all be worked out without citizen effort will not create the kind of protest on the scale of that which we see in glorious Mexico.

I think garybeck's link is valuable for newbies and folks who put great importance upon what they see and hear in the more "traditional" media.

However, I do think we have enough people to create a week(s) long protest in Washington if it can be worked out by activists who are expert in the physical logistics, and partly funded by wealthy activists (and also by not-so-wealthy folks' contributions for that purpose.) There are many folks who would participate in such an action but for the funding.

Even if we don't have the numbers in Mexico, it will be more difficult for the press to ignore an ongoing protest by rotating numbers in the thousands. Much more difficult than it is to ignore a one-day million person march. More information can also be disseminated in such an action.

Edit: There doesn't seem to be enough consensus on the absentee ballot protest, but certainly it is an action that can be taken as each individual sees fit. I vote by mail.

[autorank]

25. Thank you gary. SolarBus.Org is synonymous with integrity...

Reliable, comprehensive, consistent. and pro democracy all day seven days a week...what more could anyone ask...