|
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend Bookmark this thread |
This topic is archived. |
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Election Reform |
garybeck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 01:44 AM Original message |
HR550 and Secret Software Code |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 02:29 AM Response to Original message |
1. This hands vendors big fat lawsuits for constitutional "takings" |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Bill Bored (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 03:33 AM Response to Reply #1 |
2. Two questions: |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 09:31 AM Response to Reply #2 |
6. "Why can't we do both?" |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 12:38 PM Response to Reply #6 |
11. sure, it's possible to do both, the question is one of strategy and |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 01:52 PM Response to Reply #11 |
14. Well, it's back to the metaphor problem.... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 03:07 PM Response to Reply #14 |
18. the only problem with metaphor is that you don't like them |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 04:43 PM Response to Reply #18 |
24. No, the problem with metaphor |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Bill Bored (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:35 AM Response to Reply #24 |
36. And isn't litigation being on bended knee to the courts? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:48 AM Response to Reply #36 |
38. Sometimes that word is used, but nobody "prays" they DEMAND |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
WillYourVoteBCounted (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 06:45 PM Response to Reply #6 |
30. we did both in NC, a state law and we had to go to court |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 01:55 PM Response to Reply #1 |
15. But it also mandates |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kelvin Mace (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:17 PM Response to Reply #15 |
50. Exactly |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
HysteryDiagnosis (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 05:37 AM Response to Original message |
3. Isn't it interesting that it must be private companies that produce |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kip Humphrey (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 06:23 AM Response to Reply #3 |
4. What government do you trust "to keep elections a GOVERNMENT RUN OPERATION |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Warren Stupidity (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 07:02 AM Response to Reply #4 |
5. My local jurisdiction has been doing a fine job |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 12:44 PM Response to Reply #5 |
12. it's not about trust, it's about checks and balances |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 02:17 PM Response to Reply #12 |
17. So if elected bodies should not run elections |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 03:11 PM Response to Reply #17 |
19. Not a very bright answer, Febble (or very bright question) |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 04:19 PM Response to Reply #19 |
21. Well, one of us was being dim, said Rabbit, |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 04:37 PM Response to Reply #21 |
22. big brained bear, please pay heed |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 04:39 PM Response to Reply #22 |
23. Febble, you should start an OP reconciling these two things |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 05:15 PM Response to Reply #23 |
27. It won't require much length, so here it is: |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 04:05 AM Response to Reply #27 |
41. I have no idea |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 04:49 PM Response to Reply #22 |
26. Exactly |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kip Humphrey (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 06:32 PM Response to Reply #26 |
29. So, in your view, Blackwell has and continues to act on his own? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:57 AM Response to Reply #29 |
39. Huh? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:25 AM Response to Reply #26 |
34. The Congress is also among the class of govt servants |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 02:14 AM Response to Reply #34 |
40. And that is why |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:02 PM Response to Reply #40 |
58. False statement by Febble: HR 550 requires "paper ballot" |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 02:14 PM Response to Reply #58 |
71. Not false, IMO, and I think this is an important point |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 03:42 PM Response to Reply #71 |
75. You are pointing to the critical provision of the audits that's a problem |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 05:10 PM Response to Reply #75 |
79. What you are describing is a recount |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
eomer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-09-06 06:41 AM Response to Reply #75 |
83. A partial recount is not unconstitutional under Gore v Bush. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
eomer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-09-06 08:08 AM Response to Reply #83 |
84. California law currently includes a mandatory hand audit. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 08:54 AM Response to Reply #34 |
44. OMG! election laws are enacted by legislators! |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:08 PM Response to Reply #44 |
59. People often forget, in their respect for the law, this conflict Interest |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:37 PM Response to Reply #59 |
64. you seem to be changing directions in mid-air |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:48 PM Response to Reply #64 |
67. what it means is the following: |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 02:18 PM Response to Reply #67 |
72. an audit can't be independent if its scope is defined by statute? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 03:48 PM Response to Reply #72 |
76. They're already convinced: nobody can specify how they themselves |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 05:00 PM Response to Reply #76 |
78. because.... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 05:33 PM Response to Reply #76 |
80. sigh |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Warren Stupidity (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 06:55 PM Response to Reply #12 |
31. My local jurisdiction is us. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:29 AM Response to Reply #31 |
35. trust as an end result of an observed process = OK, trust that substitutes |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Warren Stupidity (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 06:47 AM Response to Reply #35 |
43. As that asshole reagan said: trust, but verify. nt. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
kster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 09:56 AM Response to Original message |
7. You can't let CROOKS make the rules, |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
garybeck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 11:42 AM Response to Reply #7 |
9. if you only accept the perfect bill, you will never get there |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Febble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 12:28 PM Response to Reply #9 |
10. Le mieux est l'ennemi du bien |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 12:50 PM Response to Reply #9 |
13. it's not at all a question of a perfect bill vs a few steps forward |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
garybeck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 06:24 PM Response to Reply #13 |
28. I'm not ignoring what you have said, I just disagree with it |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:36 AM Response to Reply #28 |
37. Well, thanks for the partial response / The future is right here in CA |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 09:47 AM Response to Reply #37 |
46. you don't find the paper trail useful in CA? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:26 PM Response to Reply #46 |
61. I'm glad you acknowledge the risk here OTOH, that 's big of you |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:56 PM Response to Reply #61 |
68. no, they don't |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 02:01 PM Response to Reply #68 |
70. That's fine. You're entitled to your opinion as to legal matters |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
garybeck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 10:15 AM Response to Reply #37 |
47. in CA, there is a paper trail to recount, in GA, there isn't. Am I wrong? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:29 PM Response to Reply #47 |
62. you're missing it. Recounting a stuffed ballot box=stuffed recount too! |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kelvin Mace (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:24 PM Response to Reply #37 |
53. If what you say is true |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:27 PM Response to Reply #53 |
54. something I don't know about the NC law |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kelvin Mace (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:33 PM Response to Reply #54 |
55. Here you go: |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:38 PM Response to Reply #55 |
56. OK, so in fairness or in caution... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kelvin Mace (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:43 PM Response to Reply #56 |
57. 550 goes much further than 223 |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:36 PM Response to Reply #56 |
63. The time commitment you've made to attempting to discredit me is |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:46 PM Response to Reply #63 |
66. oh, golly, do you really want to go down this road? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:57 PM Response to Reply #66 |
69. OK, then in the context of your critique here, your statement that |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 02:23 PM Response to Reply #69 |
73. why do you think this is about "praise" and "support"? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 03:35 PM Response to Reply #73 |
74. it relates to whether one should respond in debate, or not. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 04:46 PM Response to Reply #74 |
77. these questions seem poor |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:39 PM Response to Reply #56 |
65. otoh's first paragraph is basically correct |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kelvin Mace (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:22 PM Response to Reply #9 |
52. Wasting your breath with this crowd, Gary |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
WillYourVoteBCounted (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 02:05 PM Response to Reply #7 |
16. Rep Conyers cosponsors bill you say was MADE BY CROOKS |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
kster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 04:08 PM Response to Reply #16 |
20. I used to support it, but once you read it, and |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 04:43 PM Response to Reply #16 |
25. lots of people "of integrity" support misguided things |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
garybeck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 08:25 PM Response to Reply #7 |
32. how is Rush Holt a crook? n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
kster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 11:19 PM Response to Reply #32 |
33. Garybeck, These people are not ON YOUR SIDE |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
garybeck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 10:17 AM Response to Reply #33 |
48. who are "These people" |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
kster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 06:46 PM Response to Reply #48 |
81. I have an autographed copy of Conyers book |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kelvin Mace (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 12:21 PM Response to Reply #7 |
51. Excuse me? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
kster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 09:28 PM Response to Reply #51 |
82. Your excused........nt |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Stevepol (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Aug-07-06 10:09 AM Response to Original message |
8. Totally agree garybeck. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
eomer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 06:21 AM Response to Original message |
42. garybeck, I support HR550 because of the VVPT and audit... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
OnTheOtherHand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 08:58 AM Response to Reply #42 |
45. you meant "I'm NOT so sure about the open source part," right? n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
eomer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 11:11 AM Response to Reply #45 |
49. Yes, thanks. NOT so sure. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Land Shark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Aug-08-06 01:19 PM Response to Reply #42 |
60. Linus Torvalds, another famous Finnlander somewhat relevant to elections |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) | Sat Apr 20th 2024, 12:48 AM Response to Original message |
Advertisements [?] |
Top |
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Election Reform |
Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators
Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.
Home | Discussion Forums | Journals | Store | Donate
About DU | Contact Us | Privacy Policy
Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.
© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC