daily kos...vote fraud insider talking

[kerry2win]

http://www.dailykos.com/section/Diary/2 scroll down sorry if dupe

[genieroze]

1. WoW

Vote Fraud Insider is talking
by mikepridmore
Mon Nov 15th, 2004 at 20:32:18 PST

Senator Bob Graham has been participating in Jeff Fisher's investigation. First, in a letter to Erskine Bowles, Senator Graham reveals what is happening. Here are some who are looking at this besides Keith Olbermann and Bev Harris:

investigation, which is now under review by the FBI, Cam Kerry's DNC Legal Team in DC, Ralph Nader, 60 Minutes, Michael Moore

[Spiffarino]

4. Graham could lend much-needed credibility

He seems possessed of thoroughness and level-headedness that this whole vote-hacking movement needs to get rolling. It's time for more to come on board. I just hope they can find a smoking gun or two and make this a little easier.

[Jersey Devil]

37. Oh for God's sakes, it's not Sen Bob Graham

"RG" from Raleigh NC and all of a sudden it is Bob Graham?

[Spiffarino]

55. Mm-hmm...

After I read it, it became pretty obvious it wasn't Bob Graham. Looks like the guy's in a bit of a panic. Bob Graham isn't that kind of person.

I've read "Intelligence Matters" and it sure didn't match the post. False alarm.

[chomskysright]

5. where's the info?

[e-mail] thanks.

[Matariki]

6. Don't get too excited

Very unlikely from Senator Bob Graham.

read the comments on DailyKos

[Eloriel]

31. Further, this is the Jeff Fisher case -- again

and frankly, I don't think anyone will touch it. Just my feeling.

[rodeodance]

2. about time a Democrat gets involved!!---Bob Grahm FL

[mirandapriestly]

7. OMG n/t

[noamnety]

3. before you all get so excited

read the comments to the story - I don't think it's from Senator Graham.

[txindy]

9. They debunked the letter supposedly from Graham

There is serious doubt as to its authenticity.

I wouldn't get excited about this letter, right now. If ever.

[mirandapriestly]

10. Darn, I feel like a fool.

It looks like a joke upon closer inspection.

[shraby]

16. Put the phone number into google.

561 865 9548

A lot of stuff comes up about Jeff Fisher.

[Woo]

28. Well...

I have to agree -- that's probably not Bob Graham, but who knows. I think Fisher has some credible people behind him -- unfortunately the only one NOT being tight lipped about this Jeff Fisher story is um, Jeff FIsher, his website postings are kind of strange...

But honestly, I read his full story for the first time a couple of days ago and I'm beginning to believe it's quite possible.

Why not?

The vast majority of people posting on this board think there was fraud -- and it occured through black box voting machines -- many have offered possible ways in which these machines were hacked -- but to believe those machines were hacked you also have to realise that to do that it was a huge undertaking -- an organized network of hackers-- some say a room full of hackers and even with a room full of hackers I don't think they would be able to attack hundreds of machines all over this country -- so you're telling me a room full of hackers were able to change election results from all over the country -- and from what I remember the numbers changed all at once around 7:30pm EST ... -- that's quite a scenario, quite a story.

So why doesn't Fisher's story have any credibility.

I personally think all the machines were hacked simultaneously from one remote location -- Fisher claims the same thing..
The technology to do such a thing was developed by the CIA wouldn't that be available to the Bush family with pappa Bush's CIA connections --

So why doesn't this wacky tale hold any more water with folks?

[txindy]

30. An uncontrollable group of teenagers, for one thing

They don't want a lot of witnesses to what they are doing, so why in the world would they depend on hormonal kids in a juvenile detention center to keep their mouths forever shut about this election? It makes absolutely no sense. Anyone involved in such a scheme would have to be incredibly stupid.

[bluetrain]

33. The states were called one by one

and slowed down strangely as the night progressed. I find it likely that one person made the changes, not that there was only one person in on it but that it would only take one person to actually alter the data.

[txindy]

38. Right

If you attack the central tabulators, you aren't talking about hundreds and hundreds of machines. Also, many of the machines might have been programmed to alter the numbers internally. No external hacking required.

[burn the bush]

47. maybe juvies coz their records would not be available

and maybe they were counting on most of these kids to become felons and not be able to vote, Ir maybe the kids never knew of the company diebold and the machines, the only knew of the programming exercise?

[txindy]

48. None of that matters

It would only take one kid to tell this tale to one person in the course of his entire life and everything would start to unravel. A group of kids taught how to hack in a detention facility? Someone would love to run with a story like that if one of the 'trainees' came forward. It wouldn't matter how many years from now he talked. They'd cover the story and it would all hit the fan.

It makes no sense. Too much risk. If they'd use anyone, it would probably be the Diebold (and other elec. machine cos.) programmers themselves. They know the code better than anyone. Those machines weren't coded so poorly by accident.

[mzmolly]

8. Sounds like it's a "different" Bob Graham guys.

;)

[Viva_La_Revolution]

11. This is not confirmed!

The link looks ok, and if you go back to the root (erase everything but the site name) it takes you to the legit site - BUT there are no links on the page to get to those letters.

Also the bad writing, I don't think he would write "anyways" even if he would say it

x(

[jsamuel]

12. FULL LETTER HERE!

I don't know how they know it is from Bob Graham... maybe it is somewhere else, maybe not...

http://www.jefffisherforcongress.com/Campaign2006/harrrisletter.htm


Attn Beverly Harris Sunday 11-14 2:30 AM
BlackBoxVoting.org
HelpAmericaRecount.org

Re Epicenter of Vote Fraud Scandal, Florida "The Smoking Gun " you've been looking for.

Beverly,

WE BELIEVE WE HAVE THE SMOKING GUN OF THIS VOTER FRAUD SCANDAL AND IT ALL POINTS BACK TO FLORIDA 2000 AND NOW 2004 . WE KNOW WHO DID IT, HOW THEY DID IT AND WHERE IT WAS STARTED FROM.

I IMPLORE YOU WHILE IN FLORIDA TO MEET WITH JEFF FISHER.

SEE www.JeffFisherforCongress.com

You can reach Jeff at 561 889 2165 cell or 561 865 9548.

His assistants are Al Rogers and Ben Roth.

Here's a brief outline

Jeff has specific evidence of a widespread vote fraud perpetrated through a Juvenile Detention / Rehab facility called Bay Point Schools In South Miami, with connections to Mel Sembler and possibly Joe Klock atty to Katherine Harris.

These connections lead directly to Jeb Bush and of course the White House. By using Juvenile Detention & Drug Rehab facilities and under the guise of criminal computer retraining, we believe Sembler has financed a well tested vote fraud scheme to assure his cronies Jeb & George Bush, among others, guaranteed elections.

Specific evidence includes copies of internal memo's and emails as well as testimony of the MIS Director of one Florida facility where much of the hacking was perpetrated. The work was replicated and limited to one location to avoid easy detection.

The MIS Director is currently in hiding. Jeff can reach him.

By internally tampering with Diebold Optical Scanners as well as Diebold Electronic E voting machines, the hacking, ( done from remote locations under the control of Mel Stembler's facilities ( see below ) , votes were altered, switched , deleted or detroyed in numerous Florida, Ohio and New Mexico counties and then switched from John Kerry to George Bush.

It is very likely that other races have been effected as well such as Georgia, Nevada, North Carolina , etc.
WHERE POLL DIVERGENCES WERE NOTED IN RECENT POST ELECTION STUDIES.

Mel Sembler's Drug Rehab and Juvenile Detention Center's are under investigation and are and have been sued for a huge laundry list of extremely abusive behaviors ( see www.thestraights.com or search under www.melsembler.com ) .

The vote fraud system was first tested in 1999. Used in the Florida Presidential Election in 2000. Tested again successfully in Jeb Bush's race against Janet Reno and then Bill Mc Bride and finally in the 2004 Presidential Election. Also Georgia.

The second part of this scheme seems to be that they also cover their tracks by using the names of Felons and others purged falsely onto the Felon voter roles. This I believe allows them to seem to use legitimate numbers by first inflating the roles and them flipping or using them in some places with out drawing to much attention. This also may be why we saw so many overvotes in places where there weren't enough felon votes. This last sentence is my speculation.

The scheme used computers at their facilities, an MIS director who trained juvenile delinquents under custody as well as others to hack into Diebold systems around the country and place software kernels that would raise votes for one candidate while deleting the others.

This would explain both the erratic polls discrepancies reported in especially swing states but also here in North Carolina.

These software fixes are supposed to leave no audit trail. This also would explain the seemingly random gltiches of people voting Kerry and getting Bush on review or the strrange over vote errors. I believe by the seizing of evidence under your FOIA we will be able with the help of experts to discover the audit trail and other evidence of tampering.

Our specific evidence centers around Bay Point School in So Miami as the epicenter facility.

Mel Sembler made his money, hundreds of millions, building Shopping malls. This was not enough as he wants much more power and influence and has been willing to donate millions to the Republican Party over almost 20 years to buy his access and influence.

And now due to his complete disregard for basic civil and human rights ( his abusive facilities are legendary ) he is willing to exploit drug addicted juveniles and others under his companies custody to do his dirty work under threat and penalty of death or semi permanent incarceration. After all who would believe a junkie right ?

Mel has been awarded for his Ranger level contributions to the Republicans and other misdeeds a prime cherry,
the Ambassadorship to Italy by George Bush.

He and his wife have been on Anti Drug Boards going back to the Reagans despite their appaling reputation in the recovery field.

Information being gathered through the investigation launched by 16th Congressional Candidate Jeff Fisher of Florida currently has the attention of the FBI, DNC under Cam Kerry, Ralph Nader, Dennis Kucinich, Al Sharpton, 60 minutes, The Nation & others.

Please contact us as soon as possible

You can reach Jeff at 561 889 2165 cell or 561 865 9548.


Beverly, Bless you and your family for 100 generations. May you travel safe surrounded by light. Thank you for being such a strong warrior and seeker of truth. You will always be remembered in our hearts and dreams.


r.g.

[EndElectoral]

15. I dunno...If in fact these "delinquents" hacked in, it would seem Fisher

would have a hecuva lot of whistleblowers and witnesses to that action. I have not heard of one of these "delinquents" coming forward. Let's hope this is not another setup like the CBS letter fiasco.

[Woo]

35. I don't believe..

Fisher said anything about delinquents hacking into anything in his more detailed explanation -- Although he might have inferred that mistakenly because the guy can't put together a concise sentence to save his life. He said the technology to do this was developed at the Bay Point School --

(My addendum) Possibly the kids were used to test this technology in a lab type scenario.

[lynintenn]

53. Never underestimate the young

about 10 years ago in my little burg, one of the smoothest cases of extortion was perputrated by a 14 year old. The FBI and law officers could not believe such a complex crime could have been carried off by by two high school freshmen.
Remember Columbine, it went undetected.
I would think that a bunch of rich kids in a juvenile detention center could dream up this kind of scam and think it was very cute.

[Dancing_Dave]

13. Senator Graham!

One of the guys who did the Congressional report on 9/11 "intelligence failures" which the Bush Administration had to censor.

Graham is a major player, and he wouldn't be going with this unless he saw some charges that might stick!

The one strange thing is why would he be talking to Bev Harris instead of some powerful insider he knows...well, maybe he's looking to Bev to be an "expert witness"...and to help assess how the activities of these exploited juveniles might account for patterns of fraud that Bev is investigating.

There is certainly a significant story here!

[RagingInMiami]

14. It would be a significant story

if it were really bob graham. Too bad, cause I really like the old cracker.

EDIT: I've been a Bob Graham fan for years, considering he was born in my hometown and he never goes by Robert.

[txindy]

19. Unfortunately, nowhere does it state that it's from Bob Graham

This letter is signed "r.g." Do we really believe someone would write a formal letter (note the top of the letter) and then sign it with only his initials? Also, over on dKos, people who are familiar with Graham claim that he signs his letters with 'Bob Graham' not 'Robert'.

I think this is bogus. I hope I'm wrong, but it doesn't appear that way at the moment.

Fisher put this on his website, but with no identifiers. This story gets stranger all the time. Let's let the FBI handle things. We need to keep a serious distance from Fisher and his charges. My opinion, anyway.

[Spera]

39. Fisher has the link titled "Bob G. letter to Bev Harris" on his main page

(www.jefffisherforcongress.com).

That's where the attribution of these letters to Bob Graham is coming from. That said, I agree; the letter lacks professionalism and does not sound like the work of a Senator, much less one who graduated from Harvard with a law degree. I want nothing more than to believe Jeff Fisher's claims, and I'm encouraged by the fact that Nader & Bev Harris are supposedly working with him, but something is not quite right about all this. I'm not discrediting Fisher, but I think the way he's going about this, namely cryptically posting letters to his site, is perhaps not in the best interest of his efforts.

[txindy]

52. That's what it says, though, "Bob G." It never says that "G" is Graham.

It's implied, but never stated. I wonder what response, if any, Senator Graham's office will have to this implication.

The FBI needs to handle this.

[floridadem30]

17. I wonder if the 50 emails I wrote helped him come forward.

[loudsue]

18. Proceed ....but with CAUTION: I smell a Rove / Dan Rather stink all over

this. Rove, I'm sure, is just ITCHING to get some fruit loop out there screaming "FRAUD!!!", who can easily be debunked by his rightwing fundies waiting by their trusty computers. That's how this monster covers up his crimes.

I am not a bit worried about Bev & her crew proceeding carefully. They check things out thoroughly, and when they're speculating, they SAY they are speculating. And when they have proof, they've GOT IT!!

It sounds like this Jeff Fisher guy is too flashy to pass up...which is why I'm skeptical about this one. I hope someone DOES come forward who knows about the OBVIOUS vote hacking that took place on 11/2 p.m. and 11/3 early a.m.. We need a true patriot to step up to the plate and spill the beans.

:kick::kick::kick:

[bluetrain]

22. My B.S. Detector is ringing so loudly I'm going deaf

Strange so many on this site will slam the sheeple for buying the Corporate Media's party line without evidence but are leaping to accept this which is a letter ANYONE could have written along with the Fisher/Blaas weirdness as Gospel with absolutely NO PROOF whatsoever to the validity of any of it. Just because a lot of shady characters we hold in disdain are mentioned does not make it true even though it's easy to BELIEVE the worst of them. Clever, too, to tie them all up in one neat little package.

[ParanoidPat]

41. Yes, much like Warren County Ohio.......

.......a very obvious misdirection to distract from what? :evilgrin:

It wasn't a conspiracy, it was an agenda! :)

The fraud was spread out to every facet of the electoral system in such a way that record numbers of voters were disenfranchised with statistically improbable numbers all favoring the same party. :(

The actual numbers of votes involved in any given "glitch", "typo" or "administrative action" were kept low enough to keep the impression that they were insignificant to the operation of the system as a whole.

[glitch]

44. Classic disinfo - sole purpose to give MSM a wacky conspiracy theory to

point at - thus discrediting all fraud "theories".

Encouraging that they think it's necessary. :evilgrin:

[Bonescrat]

20. This also on Jeff Fisher's website...

"Kevin Zeese, Ralph Nader's media spokesman, officially announced that Presidential Candidate Ralph Nader will be consulting with Jeff Fisher and Jan Schneider regarding the investigation of voter fraud and a statewide recount for the state of Florida. Jan Schneider was the Democratic candidate for Florida's 13th Congressional District in 2002 and 2004 vs former Florida Secretary of State, Katherine Harris. "

http://www.JeffFisherforCongress.com/Campaign2006/indexletterRalphNader111504.htm

[Viva_La_Revolution]

27. The link is on Grahams website....I was wrong

I was wrong to say there was no link, I didn't scroll down far enough. Maybe it is real? Well, I'm going to hope anyway, but I won't be sharing it until we find out.

[mdb]

21. Not only on Fisher's site but

an identical letter from Fisher to Bev on dailykos
http://www.dailykos.com/user/DerekLarsson

[jsamuel]

24. THAT ISN'T FROM JEFF FISHER - SEE THE THIRD PERSON?!

[mdb]

32. Don't know but your right it is signed by the same person "rg"

[EST]

23. Is this supposed to be a direct copy of something important?

Hold tightly to your foil hat. I have read a lot of items published by senator Graham and listened, critically, to him speak on many occasions. There is no way a man of his professional stature and capability with the language would allow anything with such an amateurish slant and such preposterous grammar and typography to go out under his name. Is the information contained therein accurate? I Dunno, but judging by the other shortcomings, I would have to be extremely suspicious. Your underwear is about to get stolen, with you in it!


On Edit: Freeper Joke!

[shraby]

25. self deleted..already posted it.

[kerry2win]

34. point taken

[jsamuel]

36. Agreed, I see no evidence WHATSOEVER that it came from Bob Graham

[Straight Shooter]

51. Agreed. This quote is not something Senator Graham would say

May you travel safe surrounded by light. Thank you for being such a strong warrior and seeker of truth. You will always be remembered in our hearts and dreams.

Honestly. :eyes:

[Garbo 2004]

26. The source of these letters is Fisher's site and nothing connects

them with Senator Bob Graham.

http://www.jefffisherforcongress.com/Campaign2006/bowelsletter.htm
http://www.jefffisherforcongress.com/Campaign2006/harrrisletter.htm

Furthermore, I rather doubt the Senator's prose style is so breathlessly dramatic, even when prospectively addressing the famous Bev Harris. ;)

This is the sort of thing that can sink credibility if people jump without checking.

Note: The Daily Kos blog entry on this subject linked to above has been modified at the request of the posters there who pointed out that the likelihood these letters have any connection to the Senator is slim to none.

[jsamuel]

29. Rudy Guliani!!!

He has switched sides!

:headbang: :headbang:

[genieroze]

50. Huh?

[Woo]

40. Jumping to conclusions...

I'm trying to figure out how anyone came to even think this was from Bob Graham -- they saw the letters on Fisher's website -- looked at the r.g. initials and derived it was from Bob Graham??? Fisher doesn't say who they're from -- someone just came up with it out of the thin air.

Like Olbermann said... someone took a dollop of truth and ran with it...

[Chili]

42. is that really the congressional candidate's official site?

Is there any way to prove that it is or isn't? Because it could be that it's a fake site.

I would definitely be cautious about this; it's just the "crazy-talk" bait that they'd love to pin on the "internet conspiracy theorists" to completely taint the recount process - and there's an aspect of the media that would just love to pile on and mock us all. I'd sooner slit my wrist than vindicate that pompous twit Peter Jennings.

If someone knows of a private source who could quietly investigate the legitimacy of these claims, the site, and the involvement of those people mentioned... it would really help. An ambitious young journalist, preferably, LOL. Or even a private investigator. I'm just as eager to expose bullshit as I am to expose fraud. With no disrespect intended towards the candidate, I've never seen a more amateur site representing someone running for public office. Funds could've been low, true, but that really doesn't look like a professional website. Danger, Will Robinson.

And I'll apologize for that last comment if I'm wrong, LOL.

[jsamuel]

43. A reporter did an interview with him, it's him alright, BUT IS HE CREDIBLE

That we don't know...

[Chili]

45. yikes!

[jsamuel]

46. The thing is that it doesn't matter if we don't run with this story

because the FBI and others are involved. WE DON'T NEED TO INVOLVE OURSELVES IN THIS, UNLESS PROOF COMES TO OUR ATTENTION OR SOMEONE LIKE BEV SAYS IT IS GOSPEL. But I don't see any harm in looking this over as it progresses either.

[truehawk]

49. He tried to warn us BEFORE the election

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=54266&mesg_id=54352&page=

[Broken Acorn]

54. Website Verified

I'll have to say, this story is either the craziest truth or lie I have ever heard. In addtition, Fisher's website is so basic and simple it looks fraudulent in itself.

Nevertheless, I researched the domain name and found that it's a completely legitimate website registered to Jeff Fisher. Only time will tell if the info posted on it is accurate.

Website Domain Registration Info (sorry about the long post).

Registrant:
The Committee to Elect Jeff Fisher for Congress
11924 Forrest Hill Blvd
Suite 22-222
Wellington, Florida 33414
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com
Domain Name: JEFFFISHERFORCONGRESS.COM
Created on: 06-Mar-03
Expires on: 06-Mar-05
Last Updated on: 07-Mar-03

Administrative Contact:
Fisher, Jeff [e-mail]
The Committee to Elect Jeff Fisher for Congress
11924 Forrest Hill Blvd
Suite 22-222
Wellington, Florida 33414
United States
561-792-3521 Fax --
Technical Contact:
Fisher, Jeff [e-mail]
The Committee to Elect Jeff Fisher for Congress
11924 Forrest Hill Blvd
Suite 22-222
Wellington, Florida 33414
United States
561-792-3521 Fax --

Domain servers in listed order:
NS1.DN.NET
NS2.DN.NET