Baypoint debunked

[badc0der]

I have been a bit sceptical of the Bay Point connection from the beginning however I am now convinced beyond a doubt (in my mind anyway) that it is fake. The whole basis, as far as my understanding of it anyway, is that the Bay Point thing stems entirely from Jeff Fisher's "unnamed source" at Bay Point schools. However I think I can prove that the story is being fabricated either by Mr. Fisher or his source.

Mr. Fisher has apparently not revealed his source because that source has fear that his may be killed if his identity were made public. However, not being made public is not enough to protect the life of his source. In addition to not going public with the source's identity Mr. Fisher must not make enough information public so that an insider would know the identity of the source.

consider the following two passages from the Fisher web site:

"Mr. xxxxxx informed me that he was hired to secure their Internet and Intranet system."
"In August, Dr. Blass informed me that he knew that xxxxx had knowledge of how the coding was being distributed throughout the United States due to xxxx being the MIS Director at Baypoint School."

From these two passages alone any insider who cared could easily piece together the informant's identity. Given that this information has already been revealed there is no purpose in maintaining secrecy, and indeed if there was a legitimate threat doing so would increase the danger for Mr. Fisher's informant.

Since the informant is still, presumably, alive we can reasonably conclude that there is no legitimate threat to his life. This is most likely because a) he doesn't exist b)he doesn't have any information worth killing over.

Of course if this source comes forward and reveals some information that actually corroborates the allegations I may have to revise my position.

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Demit]

3. well, actually it's just common sense, what the poster is saying.

And Woodward/Bernstein didn't drop identifying hints about DT, as I recall. The Jeff Fisher story has a very cloak-and-dagger feel to it. I'm curious about how it shakes out.

--higher post count person

[badc0der]

4. post count is all you got?

Which part is far fetched?
The part about the baypoint school being able to figure out who their MIS director is or the part about people willing to fix the presidential election not being willing to plug leaks?

[sam sarrha]

2. what is bay point..we are sort of isolated back here..??

[badc0der]

5. a school in FL that supposedly hacked the election -nt-

[MrUnderhill]

6. The SCHOOL hacked the election?

Can you give more information?

[dmac]

7. go to www.jefffisherforcongress.com and read, then you will

understand. I agree with the original poster even though his post is now gone. I had been curious about the same thing and definitely the MIS director would be easy enough to determine so why xxxx his name?

One more thing bothers me about the whole Jeffrey Fisher conspiracy - and that is he contacted the FBI 2 years ago? And nothing has been done and the MSM has done nothing with it? And the FBI would have no problem with him posting all of this? Doesn't it seem more reasonable if they were truly investigating a case like this, that Fisher would be gagged? I am not saying there is no story here at all but I think it more likely that there may some overlap of players and facilities (perhaps the Bush brothers?) but proving that any of them are connected with anything illegal seems somehow unlikely.

[Woo]

8. Uh huh...

Um... I don't think what the original poster wrote could be classified as debunking -- um, don't you have to actually PROVE something is not true to debunk something --

So, what's the name of the Bay Point MIS Director, since it's so easy to find out?
What I see is a lot of opinion -- and speculation which adds up to-- you don't believe Jeff Fisher(unfortunate for you this opinion is not new or original) -- so I ask just don't post something that's misleading when you have no evidence to the contrary.

I don't know if ALL of Fisher's story is true -- but I think a good bit of it is true... at least the important points.

[badc0der]

10. Sean Lennon

http://www.baypointschools.com/management%20contents.htm

[Woo]

11. Ahem...

I don't recall Mr. Fisher saying he was talking about the current MIS Director -- who was the MIS Director a year ago? two years ago?-- Have you spoken to the Mr. Lennon? -- is he at work today? YOU DON'T KNOW DO YOU?

Sheeesh... thank you for your *opinion*, my point still stands, thank you very much.

I really don't think Fisher all of a sudden turned into a paranoid schizophrenic.. you really think that Fisher picked some poor slob from Bay Point that he doesn't know -- and decided to make all of this up with this guy as the centerpiece -- Why haven't we heard from Blass? Wouldn't he openly refute it? IIIII KNOW, he knows what's going on -- albiet Fisher tells a wild story... but I haven't seen anything that goes against what he has said as it pertains to fraud and this has been flying back and forth for over two weeks, seems to me the fact that no one has come out and refuted these serious charges is just as suspicious as Fisher dropping clues-- Anyone can see the guy isn't the most articulate or gracious swan in the pond... so the fact that he inadvertantly leaks a clue to his name, shouldn't be much of a surprise. Then again, maybe he didn't want to keep it a secret --

I just want the fraud to be proven -- I don't care who or how they do it -- that's all I want and I'm not closing any doors.

[geo]

21. debunk(ed)

Hi all,

Debunk is a transitive verb meaning, "To expose or ridicule the falseness, sham, or exaggerated claims of: debunk a supposed miracle drug.," according to American Heritage Dictionary (www.dictionary.com).

Let's not get ourselves to worked up over this, because in reality, the original post did expose a major weakness in the argument that Baypoint Schools had a role to play in the election results. The weakness is the inherent credibility issue with regards to the level of disclosure, and the overall lack of tangible evidence made in the claim.

This doesn't mean the claim is false; it just exposes a major weakness in the argument presented. Also, it is a "misplaced burden of proof" fallacy to dismiss this post because it doesn't provide evidence that Jeff Fisher's claim is false.

Like many of you I have been waiting with baited breathe for something to substantiate the claims made on the Jeff Fisher site. I would recommend to any of you to be vigilant in sifting through the data, and don't make any conclusions that cannot be backed up with reason, logic and cold, hard facts. It is very important to our cause to maintain our credibility, as others (especially the mainstream media) is very quick to dismiss our claims based on the personal attack that is the "tin-foil" cap allegation.

Consider the Baypoint issue officially debunked, but not proven "false." The "official" comeback to the debunking present in the main post of this thread would be some evidence that would directly add to the credibility of the messaged on the Jeff Fisher site, and increase the overall justification for the claims it makes. For all we know folks, Jeff Fisher's website is just one huge red herring... don't get taken off the scent of the real issue is my advice for the day.

BTW, I love all this debate! When something does break on this, you can bet that all this debate, analysis and fact exchange will likely be the catalyst. We are the new brand of freedom fighter... stay vigilant folks!

Warmly,

George

[tbuddha]

9. My problem is this

Going public in a situation where your life is threatened is safer then keeping your identity secret.

[IAMREALITY]

12. You Call That a Debunking???????

I call it a waste of my clicking on a thread......

[pointsoflight]

13. Why do people insist on proof *before* looking into it?

There's a claim made by Fisher. It may or may not be true. But given the claim has been made, shouldn't it be looked into? Even if you do think it was a fake, there's no way to know for sure, so isn't it prudent to have the claims investigated?

We're not trying to *prove* anything here, so the data gathered need not reach the level of "beyond a reasonable doubt." It's all about whether a claim has been been that warrants examination. Simple as that.

[Woo]

14. Elementary...

The original poster should get on the horn and call the Bay Point School ask for Mr. Lennon and assuming he's around ask him nicely about Fisher's story(I'm positive some keen blogger has already done this and we would have heard about it, if they found out anything to the contrary, but go ahead anyway)... see, now you can be your own investigative journalist.

Then come back here with his/her proof -- a simple task.

[Wiley50]

15. Maybe this thread could stand a little humor

What if we call and ask for Sean Lennon and they say he's in New York visiting his mom, Yoko?
I know it's really listed at the Baypoint website but I've thought it strange since this name first came up at BBV several days ago.
There can't be several Sean Lennons in this world and I think his mom would disinherit him if he got caught it this mess. And,BTW, I don't think she broke up the Beatles. But I digress ( 30 yrs. or so )

May the cooler heads prevail

Wiley

[Woo]

16. By lookin...

At a picture of Mr. Lennon -- he's obviously Yoko's love child or something went terribly wrong.

[newyawker99]

20. Hi Wiley50!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[merh]

17. This is your opinion - this is not proof or successful debunking

You know what they say about opinions, they are like belly buttons, we all have them!

[masshole1979]

18. The poster made a very good point...

...and he's not the first one on this forum to advise treading lightly with this Fischer guy. And yes, I know you will probably not take me seriously because i only have a few posts and haven't donated yet (i will, i promise!). But just remember it's this kind of insider-ism that's strangling what's supposed to be a democratic Left.

If you want to argue with his logic, argue with it, but to me, it makes a great deal of sense. Either Fischer has very loose lips or his "source" isn't credible.

I just don't see why Mr. Fischer can't disclose his source and information to a reputable third party, such as a journalist who is known for protecting source confidentiality. God, there's a guy up here in Providence who's going to jail for six months precisely for that reason. Call him with the story! (well, if he's not in jail already...)

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but don't just cite post counts.

[Woo]

19. Nobody...

In this thread has cited a low post count -- My simple point is... this is an opinion -- this same point has already been brought up many times -- and there are like 10 Jeff Fisher threads already active -- if *someone* would take the time to read just one, you'll probably find that this is not a new opinion, there is nothing enlightening about it.

So again, what really was the point of creating a thread about something that has already been stated many times-- then claiming in the thread title that they have uncovered *new* information?

For some reason -- it's not the skepticism about Fisher that rubs me the wrong way about this thread, I can definitely understand that... even though I'm open to believing the allegations by Fisher -- this thread is a complete waste of space when you get down to it because someone wanted their spot in the sun -- I apologise for kicking it to the top again by posting, I'll try to restrain myself...